Dealing with Islamic Awakening Intentions Options

[tangawizi]

High School Girl Threatened With Violence By Christian Classmates After Suing School To Remove A Prayer Mural
January 17, 2012
By Stephen D. Foster Jr.


Separation of church and state is an American tradition that goes back to our nation’s founding. The Constitution prohibits any one religion from being put before another, and gives everyone religious freedom. It does not allow a publicly funded institution to force religious beliefs on people. But that is exactly what Cranston High School West in Rhode Island did when they decided to place a Christian prayer mural on the premises. One girl, 16 year old Jessica Ahlquist, fought in court to have the clear violation of religious freedom removed. She won. And now her ‘Christian’ schoolmates are violently threatening her in a clearly un-Christian manner that would make Jesus weep.

When U.S. District Court Judge Ronald R. Lagueux issued his decision to rule in favor of Ahlquist, he went out of his way to praise her for her brave stand for constitutional values.

“The Court refrains from second-guessing the expressed motives of the Committee members, but nonetheless must point out that tradition is a murky and dangerous bog. While all agree that some traditions should be honored, others must be put to rest as our national values and notions of tolerance and diversity evolve. At any rate, no amount of history and tradition can cure a constitutional infraction. The Court concludes that Cranston’s purposes in installing and, more recently, voting to retain the Prayer Mural are not clearly secular. Plaintiff is clearly an articulate and courageous young woman, who took a brave stand, particularly in light of the hostile response she has received from her community.”

But the ruling of the court hasn’t stopped relentless threats of violence and ridicule from her classmates, who have taken to using social media to vent their hate and rage. Here is a but a small sample of the kinds of things these “Christians” are saying courtesy of JesusFetusFajitaFishsticks:

“May that little, evil athiest teenage girl and that judge BURN IN HELL!”

“yeah, well i want the immediate removal of all atheists from the school, how about that?”

“Jessica Ahlquist may have won her case, but she’s going straight to hell. #Godovereverything”

“I hope there’s lots of banners in hell when your rotting in there you atheist fu-k #TeamJesus”

“If this banner comes down, hell i hope the school burns down with it!”

“U little brainless idiot, hope u will be punished, you have not win sh..t! Stupid little brainless skunk!”

“fu-k Jessica alquist I’ll drop anchor on her face”

“definetly laying it down on this athiest tommorow anyone else?”

“Nothing bad better happen tomorrow #justsaying #fridaythe13th”

“Let’s all jump that girl who did the banner #fu-kthatho”

“literally that b!tch is insane. and the best part is she already transferred schools because shes knows someone will jump her #ahaha”

“”But for real somebody should jump this girl” lmao let’s do it!”

“Hmm jess is in my bio class, she’s gonna get some $hit thrown at her”

“hail Mary full of grace @jessicaahlquist is gonna get punched in the face”

“When I take over the world I’m going to do a holocaust to all the atheists”

“gods going to fu-k your @$$ with that banner you scumbag”

“if I wasn’t 18 and wouldn’t go to jail I’d beat the $hit out of her idk how she got away with not getting beat up yet”

“nail her to a cross”

“We can make so many jokes about this dumb b!tch, but who cares #thatb!tchisgointohell and Satan is gonna rape her.”

From the comments, it’s clear these whiny little teenagers have learned little during their education. First, they need to go back to English class and learn how to spell, capitalize, and punctuate. Second, they need to re-take every American history and government course offered at their school because it’s clear that they know nothing about either. The government can not elevate one religion over another and no religion can force itself upon those of that do not observe it. Schools that are publicly funded by states and the federal government cannot endorse a religion, including Christianity. To do so violates religious freedom as protected by the Constitution. Even Thomas Jefferson and James Madison agreed that separation of Church and State is in the Constitution:

“I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibit the free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of separation between church and state.”
~Thomas Jefferson, as President, in a letter to the Baptists of Danbury, Connecticut, 1802

“The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe with blood for centuries.”
~James Madison

Jessica Ahlquist was simply following the example of the Founding Fathers.

These whiny brats also need to go back to Sunday school and learn real Christian values as practiced by Jesus himself. Hate is not a Christian value and threatening violence on someone is not something Jesus would ever have done. This just goes to show how many Christians, particularly conservative ones that insist there is no separation, have forsaken the Bible and the word of Jesus to teach their kids to hate. Police are already investigating each of them. It’s just too bad they can’t arrest them for ignorance and stupidity.


--------------

Do I hate Christianity because I post articles that show christian high school kids are as capable of intimidation and violence against a fellow non-believer as the Boko Haram in Nigeria?

If it means that I hate Christianity then surely those who post similar shade articles must hate Islam to the core?

In fact, what we are all secretly hoping is that WE CAN SECURE AN "AWAKENING" AMONGST ALL RELIGIOUS FOLKS to recognise that all abrahamaic scriptures contain violent teachings and that these violence can affect us in big and small ways, from the burning cities of Cairo to the high school yard in inner America.

There is no need for us to engage in VERBAL VIOLENCE on Asia Finest if we were all truly awakened as to islamic violence. Violence of any form can creep up on you even when you are crusading against islamic violence.

This post has been edited by tangawizi: Jan 19 2012, 02:13 AM

[avisitor]

The difference between today's young Christians and today's young Muslims ...
Today's young's Christians are bringing their hatred from inside themselves to the surface
While today's young Muslims are taught from their elders how to hate their enemies
Yes, very similar to the Nazis in the southern United States .. teaching their young how to hate
Years of violence and fighting with Israel, has made many Muslims teach the hatred of Hebrews.

I don't condone what Chutzpah and elleXO say about all Muslims or Islam
But, they also don't mention the twisted hatred that is taught from generation to generation from the fighting

Our lives shouldn't be about blame. It should be about spreading peace and love.
The cats in the sixties had it right. And still, the hatred comes out.
Chutzpah and elleXO are part of the spreading of hatred.
What good comes from it? You can't get rid of hate with more hate.
You can't warn people of the hate that spreads like a cancer.
It doesn't make any sense.

[tangawizi]

Coming from a multicultural country (Singapore) where there has been stable and good relationships between the different religious groups, I was appalled to see non-muslim forummers from my own country and neighboring country (Malaysia) spout anti-islamic rhetoric backed up by arguments from US based websites run by folks like Robert Spencer. These sites run propaganda against islam in a way that is calculated not for muslim readership but non-muslims. Their aim is to "arm" non-muslims with arguments to attack the underlying faith of muslims.

Since last year, there have been a spate of asian forummers from Singapore and Malaysia who are spreading anti-islamic sentiments amongst its readers in AF's Indo and Msia chats etc. The intent appears to be to cause an "islamic awakening" amongst muslims and non-muslims alike about the violence at the heart of islamic teachings.

This seems to be a serious campaign and i find it uncomfortable and abhorrent to say the least. I am sure there are many islamic websites that spout propaganda that are just as uncomfortable and abhorrent.

Whilst I do feel a support for the islamic awakening cause, I feel compelled, however, to voice my concern and opposition to the anti-islamic sentiments this cause engenders because it seems to come at the expense of honest and apolitical muslims who follow the Koran and hadiths in a peaceful path.

What would be a balanced way of responding to this?

I do realise however, the power of information technology on the web. Particularly now that it's evident that websites such as Jihadwatch run by writers with the political mission in checking the balance of power in the Middle East vis-a-vis ensuring the continuity of Israel's existence can manage to convince non-muslims in the Far East to believe and accept that it's proper behavior to disrespect the Prophet Mohamed who is revered by their muslim neighbours, classmates, colleagues and friends, this group of people can easily turn the power of misinformation to defile the profile of anyone. It doesn't have to be just the Prophet Mohamed, everyone is fair game. Siddarta Gotama, Jesus Christ, Joseph Smith, Obama etc.. and no one can stop them because it's freedom of speech. What kinda speech? Hate speech.


If non-muslims wanna see a movement to clean up violence in Islam, to remove the outdated ideals, to modernise them where appropriate and to take away unnecessary hints or directions of violence, i have no problem with that.

But its all in the presentation isn't it? You can put forward an evenly argued point about modernisation and gain respect and thoughtful contemplation from others, or you can launch yourself on a foaming at the mouth rant over it and get the favor of other zealots and make everyone else turn off entirely.

Ultimately though, such a movement to clean up religion cannot come from external arguments gleaned from websites like JihadWatch or DhimmiWatch, but rather from an internal change.

My replies to these anti-islam rants which are aimed entirely at non-muslims is to encourage these posters to explore self-contemplation practices within their religion, be it Christianity, Islam or Buddhism.

Because if a seed of peace is planted within their mind, I am sure their actions and words will bring peace. But if a seed of fear and hatred is planted within their mind, their actions and words will inevitably bring destruction.


If it's their intention to awaken muslim readers, Islamic awakening surely can't come from reading and accepting speculative statements about who Mohamed really was or giving up the wrongful hadiths.

It has to be about encouraging a contemplative way to practise their faith instead of dogma and blind faith. What is the true nature of a prophet? True and lasting change can only come from self-reflection in a quietest moment of your mind. You make up your mind to change. It's not about hectoring someone to change.

There have been violent passages in all abrahamaic scriptures and the violent nature of Yahweh is evident. Let the peaceful and contemplative aspects of the Prophets like Moses, Jesus and Mohamed be the basis of your faith, that influences your words and actions in life and the forums.

[chutzpah]

These whiny brats also need to go back to Sunday school and learn real Christian values as practiced by Jesus himself. Hate is not a Christian value and threatening violence on someone is not something Jesus would ever have done. This just goes to show how many Christians, particularly conservative ones that insist there is no separation, have forsaken the Bible and the word of Jesus to teach their kids to hate. Police are already investigating each of them. It’s just too bad they can’t arrest them for ignorance and stupidity.


--------------

Do I hate Christianity because I post articles that show christian high school kids are as capable of intimidation and violence against a fellow non-believer as the Boko Haram in Nigeria?

If it means that I hate Christianity then surely those who post similar shade articles must hate Islam to the core?

In fact, what we are all secretly hoping is that WE CAN SECURE AN "AWAKENING" AMONGST ALL RELIGIOUS FOLKS to recognise that all abrahamaic scriptures contain violent teachings and that these violence can affect us in big and small ways, from the burning cities of Cairo to the high school yard in inner America.

There is no need for us to engage in VERBAL VIOLENCE on Asia Finest if we were all truly awakened as to islamic violence. Violence of any form can creep up on you even when you are crusading against islamic violence.

I do share Stephen D. Foster Jr disgust for the 'un-Christian' behaviour of these school children towards poor little Miss self-righteous Jessica Ahlquist who obviously has zero tolerance for anything religious. One wonders what Miss Ahlquist reaction would be if it is an Islamic prayer mural or any other faiths for that matter. Never mind about the fact that the majority wanted the mural and their collective right was trampled on, so long little Miss Ahlquist got her way in the name of freedom and secularism.

But let's not speculate, let's look at the last paragraph of Mr Foster's article which I highlighted in red and bold. Even Foster had to admit that the reactions from Ahlquist schoolmates ARE NOT in keeping with the teaching of Christianity.

Sadly the same can not be said for Islam and it's founder. What Boko Haram is doing is totally inline with the teaching of Islam. In fact several topics in this forum highlight the teaching of Islam. For example read here:
http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=330369 and here:
http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=330421 and here:
http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=330374 and many more posted by others as well.

The comparison Tangawizi made between the school girls' nasty comments and the endless butchering of innocents who happened to be Christian by Islamists in Nigeria is appalling to say the least. I don't know about Tanga, perhaps in her endless new age mambo jumbo contemplative way and posturing, she comes to quite a nauseating "AWAKENING" that silly school girls' nasty threats and comments are the same and are as evil as murder. It is a rather ugly and disgusting comparison. It speaks volume about her.

Then there is her insistence that all Abrahamic faiths teach violence. She has done this ad nauseum without ever provide any SOLID evidence, apart from quoting certain verses from the Old Testament, which incidentally I have refuted in the past and won't be discussing it again here. She also self contradicts because Foster's last paragraph highlighted above refutes her claim.

They say action speaks louder than words. Then the violent actions of countless Muslims around the world from Saudi Arabia to Pakistan to Indonesia are testament to their cult plain and simple. And Tangawizi says she doesn't hate Christians or Christianity.. well readers, you be the judge!

On VERBAL VIOLENCE on Asia Finest. By calling the holy father Pope Benedict XVI

a (presumably) celibate c@ck in a frock

'presumably' qualifies? Read here: http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=329446

When she couldn't spew more lies she regurgitated the same stale and toxic vomit full of self righteous indignation as in her last response above. Her cohort avisitor is even more pathetic, he elevates himself to the lala land .....

This post has been edited by chutzpah: Jan 19 2012, 09:47 PM

[tangawizi]

Hate is not a Christian value and threatening violence on someone is not something Jesus would ever have done.

So if that is so right by you, why don't you practise the same by refraining from preaching hate against Islam in your bid to create an Islamic Awakening?

Calling the pope a **** in a frock was violent indeed, but it pales when compared to your incessant name callings and tiresome rants.

[avisitor]

Chutzpah's twisting of the words to suit her needs was very telling of her lack of understanding or compassion.
I hold no ill feelings towards Chutzpah ... but I have ill feelings after I read her posts ... it makes me sick

Why don't you listen to the words of John Lennon ... "Give peace a chance"

[chutzpah]

How amusing! Both twiddle dee and twiddle dumb exhorting the virtues of peace, understanding and compassion. Preaching hatred? Oooooh so posting the factual events are considered as preaching hate. Mmmm... we got it, these two are Islamofacist. Need I say more?

[elleX0]

How amusing! Both twiddle dee and twiddle dumb exhorting the virtues of peace, understanding and compassion. Preaching hatred? Oooooh so posting the factual events are considered as preaching hate. Mmmm... we got it, these two are Islamofacist. Need I say more?

These two act like an OLD MARRIED COUPLE. One with start the sentence and the other will finish it. How more married can they be?

[tangawizi]

Chutzpah, what's your intention to post all the factual articles about extremist muslims and connecting these incidents to the Koran's verses on violence?

I'ts plain and clear that you want us all to see Christianity in stark contrast to Islam, as a religion of goodness and virtue. But on Islam, you are clearly revulsed by the religion and some of its extreme followers.

What are you going to do about Islam and its followers?

What do you want to see others like ourselves do about Islam?

What is your contribution to Islamic Awakening?

[DEL]

@all of you,

Tell me one nation and one religion that is close to perfect according to you.

I am not asking about their teachings or their policies, but about their practices.

We all complain about what and who is wrong, but what and who is right?

Because our opinions all differ, driven by emotions that aren't even permitted by our own believes.
So let's work together and tell what is the perfect way? You can like it or not, but Islam, anti-Islam, zionism, pedophilia and racism in christianity, it's all gonna stay in this world. Removing or eradicating a group of people is an un-christian or un-islamic way. Some that believes in god will understand that god doesn't demand us to kill others that don't follow the same religion. Only the corrupted believers, by money,greed or power, will resort to that kind of talk. Those corrupted, need to be removed.

The anti-Islam people probably know that there are hadiths that are intolerant and violent. But they also know there are hadiths and verses that teach peace and tolerance. They know that there are verses, like the one of the sword, that supposed to abbrogate bad over good. But if they are real expert, they know there are hadiths that tell to ignore false fabrications like that of the sword. So there are hadiths that nullify the good verses and there are hadiths that nullify the bad verses. Does sound to me people have a choice. So what choice will feel natural to you and any other human? What choice is profitable for organisations, institutions and governments?

The Bible or the Torah don't have verses that directly tells you to be intolerant or violent to others and give you directions how to be good. Still there are verses that tell about stories where god's people were commanded to kill entire infidel races, like the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites, and Jebusites. Nowadays, Christian and Jewish religious institutions know how to twist words and lead their own people to violent war, deny people hygienity (forbidden use of condoms) and cover the bad activities of their own members to avoid bad media.

This post has been edited by DEL: Jan 20 2012, 01:25 PM

[chutzpah]

These two act like an OLD MARRIED COUPLE. One with start the sentence and the other will finish it. How more married can they be?

Hi elleXO, your take is spot on and very funny.

Isn't it odd that my motive is questioned then the answer is supplied, and still she missed it by a mile. Just for the record, I never discussed Christianity UNTIL it was attacked by the self loathing Chinese broad. Then again there is no surprise there. Instead of addressing the topic she went on the offensive with zero understanding about Islam, a trollish behaviour just as you said.

Do you think the OWC is also an Islamic Awakening, this started in Islamic Malaysia which now has spread to most Islamic countries and there is even a chapter in the UK.

'Obedient Wife Club' urges women to be 'whores in bed'
June 6, 2011
http://www.smh.com.au/world/obedient-wife-...0606-1fntv.html

A group of Malaysian women launched an "Obedient Wife Club" on Saturday, urging members to be "whores in bed" and obey their husbands to curb social ills such as divorce and domestic violence.

Islamic group Global Ikhwan held the club's inaugural meeting in Kuala Lumpur, giving women tips on how to keep their men satisfied and prevent them from straying.

"A good wife is perceived to be prim and proper - you just take care of the children - but not much is emphasised on fulfilling sexual needs of the husband. If he needs sex, obey him," Rohaya Mohamad, the club's vice-president
Dr Rohaya, 46, said 30 per cent of the club members were in polygamous marriages while the rest were in monogamous relationships and that the club was open to non-Muslims.

"You must satisfy your husband. A good wife should be a whore in bed," said Dr Rohaya, whose husband has three other wives.

Sexism is alive and kicking in Islam.

This post has been edited by chutzpah: Jan 20 2012, 04:34 PM

[tangawizi]

Married couple? The only married people on this board are elleXO and chutzpah, both are married to :

* Hatred against people who do not agree with their anti-islamic views
* Ugly Speech against people who do not agree with their anti-islamic views
* Fostering Bigotry against Bigotry instead of Reconciliation and Dialogue
* Propagating Unoriginal anti-islamic ideas by cutting and pasting from right-wing websites like jihadwatch etc
* No real solution to islamic awakening movement, only fostering hatred and revulsion against muslims amongst non-muslims like ourselves

Since you are so obsessed and hung up about The Obedient Wives Club and their sex drive, Chutzpah, you should consider joining them and relax instead of being the uptight anal hoe that you are.

Ok, just joking.... u are not a hoe, just an uptight anal mommy trying to work out a better and safer future of her kids ....

Isn't it odd that my motive is questioned then the answer is supplied, and still she missed it by a mile. Just for the record, I never discussed Christianity UNTIL it was attacked by the self loathing Chinese broad. Then again there is no surprise there. Instead of addressing the topic she went on the offensive with zero understanding about Islam, a trollish behaviour just as you said.

You post articles that present your phobia about Islam and criticize some of its adherents like the Obedient Wives Club. While we agree that organizations like the OWC is abhorrent, we don't agree with your aggressive tearing apart of Islam.

I basically questioned your ulterior motive only to find out that you are a Catholic christian who dabbled in Buddhism and then reverted back to your christianity. And everytime I post a negative article about the Papacy, you behave like you suffer a pavlov dog syndrome and go on a rabid rant against me.

So you wanna discuss the nature of Islam ONLY ON YOUR TERMS.

And what is that?

Aggressively tearing apart the Islamic faith while fueling an unhealthy uncritical love of your own Church


Do I need to prove that? No, it's plain to see.

You can say baldly that the Church is good but it's the bad apples who eff up and that its nothing to do with the christian teachings.

Why can't we conclude the same about the militant muslims?

You persist in connecting their actions to the Koran, and yet when it comes to baby snatching Catholic nuns in Spain or gay Catholic fathers molesting and sodomising boarding school kids, or Irish single mothers locked up and enslaved for decades by the Catholic owned laundrettes.... you find a total disconnect between the actions of the offending clergymen and the teachings of the bible.

Why the double standard? Why this hypocrisy if not for the fact that this is a debate that is entirely ON YOUR OWN TERMS? Meaning...again....


Aggressively tearing apart the Islamic faith while fueling an unhealthy uncritical love of your own Church


This post has been edited by tangawizi: Jan 23 2012, 04:56 AM

[chutzpah]

* Hatred against people who do not agree with their anti-islamic views
* Ugly Speech against people who do not agree with their anti-islamic views
* Fostering Bigotry against Bigotry instead of Reconciliation and Dialogue
* Propagating Unoriginal anti-islamic ideas by cutting and pasting from right-wing websites like jihadwatch etc
* No real solution to islamic awakening movement, only fostering hatred and revulsion against muslims amongst non-muslims like ourselves

Dear readers, let me address only the above accusations, while ignoring the rest of her dribbles.

To Tangawizi posting the truth whether they be violence and butchering of non Muslims by Muslims, or the quoted verses from the Quran are hate speech. As elleXO has rightly pointed out, Tangawizi is blaspheming Islam by insisting that the Quranic verses quoted are hate speech. There ought to be a fatwa out against her!

Violent event perpetrated by Muslims against non Muslims are not hate nor ugly speech. These event actually took place and were reported by both electronic and printed media. Tangawizi would have us silenced, she is against free speech. If anyone fostering hatred and bigotry is Tangawizi and her ilk. I just post what is happening to non Muslims living in Islamic countries.

-Is posting the killing of Christians in Nigeria constitute hate and ugly speech?
-Is posting the rape, forced conversion and butchering of Coptic Christians in Egypt, Iraq and other parts of Mid East constitute hate and ugly speech?
-Is posting the imposition of Sharia laws in non Muslim majority countries such as the US, Australia and Europe constitute hate and ugly speech?
-Is posting about the countless butchering of Christian minorities in country like Pakistan constitute hate and ugly speech?
-Is posting what non Muslims must endure living in Islamic countries from Saudi Arabia to Indonesia constitute hate and ugly speech?

I leave the decision to you gentle readers. One glaring fact though is that Tangawizi and her ilk never ever come up with any refutations. All they ever do is to attack the Christian faith, with half truth and lies or attack the head of the Catholic Church. I am a proud and devout Catholic you see, so instead of addressing the issue at hand, Tangawizi and her ilk make personal attacks on my faith, my Church and my bretherens. Speaks volume about them doesn't it? When I addressed and refuted the many lies and half truths posted by Tangawizi and her ilk about the Christian faith, they accuse me of proselytizing.

She speaks about revulsion. Well then, is it not an extreme revulsion for Tangawizi to often brush aside the atrocities and even try to defend the action of the perpetrators? Her extreme self righteous indignation is truly nauseating.

This is never about Christianity and Islam. It is only about what is happening around us on a daily basis. The rape, the murder, the imposition of Sharia laws on non Muslims which has also been partly adopted by the UN under pressure from the OIC.

Each of us is responsible for our future. I am not here to convince anyone about anything as Tangawizi keeps insisting. I just present the fact and hopefully you can draw your own conclusion. Your decision is your business and I hope it will keep you well informed on the very issues facing us today.

Below is another example of how Tangawizi will use anything to attack the Catholic Church

You persist in connecting their actions to the Koran, and yet when it comes to baby snatching Catholic nuns in Spain or gay Catholic fathers molesting and sodomising boarding school kids, or Irish single mothers locked up and enslaved for decades by the Catholic owned laundrettes.... you find a total disconnect between the actions of the offending clergymen and the teachings of the bible.

I like to see how Tangawizi connect baby snatching, child sexual abuse and enslaved mothers to the teachings from the Bible. No doubt she will come up with more lies and half truths as usual. We will wait and see how she can prove these offenses are in fact derived from the teaching from Bible and not due to human weakness and sin.

This post has been edited by chutzpah: Feb 7 2012, 04:52 AM

[tangawizi]

Dear readers, let me address only the above accusations, while ignoring the rest of her dribbles.

To Tangawizi posting the truth whether they be violence and butchering of non Muslims by Muslims, or the quoted verses from the Quran are hate speech. As elleXO has rightly pointed out, Tangawizi is blaspheming Islam by insisting that the Quranic verses quoted are hate speech. There ought to be a fatwa out against her!

It takes a mind that is seeded in violence and hatred to come up with what you have written above, Chutzpah.

I do hope in the deepest of your prayers, you come to some realization that your words and speech are rooted in a dark violence and hatred from your heart.

ElleX0 on the other hand, isn't a prayerful nor spiritual man. He is a drunk addicted to his Henessy XO brandies. He could never change that seed of violence and hatred in his mind because he still considers all muslims and islam as a 'cancer' to be dealt with.

So kindly refrain from making fatuous and intellectually dishonest accusations of blasphemy and the violent calling for fatwas to be issued against forummers who criticize your askewed views of Islam. Do examine your own 'cancer' instead that's growing in your mind:

See elleXO's personal statement of Islam and its followers here:

I like to see how Tangawizi connect baby snatching, child sexual abuse and enslaved mothers to the teachings from the Bible. No doubt she will come up with more lies and half truths as usual. We will wait and see how she can prove these offenses are in fact derived from the teaching from Bible and not due to human weakness and sin.

Chutzpah, u are capable of divorcing the actions of :

- Catholic nuns baby snatching,
- Catholic priests child sexual abuse,
- Catholic institutional enslavement of single mothers

from the masses of Good Catholics and the teachings of the Bible.


May you develop the capability of doing the same for the peoples of other faiths.

[chutzpah]

Below is another example of how Tangawizi will use anything to attack the Catholic Church

You persist in connecting their actions to the Koran, and yet when it comes to baby snatching Catholic nuns in Spain or gay Catholic fathers molesting and sodomising boarding school kids, or Irish single mothers locked up and enslaved for decades by the Catholic owned laundrettes.... you find a total disconnect between the actions of the offending clergymen and the teachings of the bible.

I like to see how Tangawizi connect baby snatching, child sexual abuse and enslaved mothers to the teachings from the Bible. No doubt she will come up with more lies and half truths as usual. We will wait and see how she can prove these offenses are in fact derived from the teaching from Bible and not due to human weakness and sin.

Isn't it shamless of Tangawizi? She said in black and white that the evil done by some Catholics clergies are related to the teaching from the Bible. Well then, let's see how she 'connects' her brain and comes up with the evidence. But can she? Talk about pathological!!

[tangawizi]

Chutzpah, come on... the only person here connecting the evil done by religious freaks to their scripture is you and ElleXO.

[chutzpah]

Chutzpah, come on... the only person here connecting the evil done by religious freaks to their scripture is you and ElleXO.

Come on... why doesn't she substantiate her lies about the teaching from the Bible!

[tangawizi]

Because it wasn't my intention to draw that conclusion, but rather to see how you are capable of making that disconnect for Christian bad apples, but simply unable to do the same for Muslim bad apples.

You exercise a double standard as far as we can tell for Abrahamaic sinners.

[chutzpah]

Because it wasn't my intention to draw that conclusion, but rather to see how you are capable of making that disconnect for Christian bad apples, but simply unable to do the same for Muslim bad apples.

You exercise a double standard as far as we can tell for Abrahamaic sinners.

And you are not able to substantiate your lie. You insisted that the evils were derived from the Bible. Where is your evidence and proof? Come on prove your lie!

Double standard? Let's see who is practicing double standard here.

You keep harassing elleXO and I by insisting that we spread hatred and untruth about Islam even though we don't. We merely present the fact with EVIDENCE either based on the Quran or what was done in the name of Islam. Unlike you, we always provide link and evidence. You try very hard to silence us while you have absolutely no knowledge about Islam. You accused elleXO of hate speech even though all he did was quoting verses from the Quran. You are effectively saying those Quranic verses are hate speech. You insult the Quran!

And you always use half truth or lies. The above is such an example. Where is your evidence that the Bible teaches baby snatching, forced labour and child sexual abuse?

Double standard? You really have no shame! Don't try to twist and wriggle yourself out of this one!

[tangawizi]

Chutzpah, don't you fu-ken get it thru your thick skull?

It's too banal to even try and link the koran bible to the evil acts that men have over the history of time committed against one another.

Let me just ask you one question, the same question that I ask of all christians, muslims and jews ---

How can you believe that there is an all-powerful and all-loving God that is watching all over the Arab muslim terrorists as they hijacked the planes and who shout Allah is Great as their planes ploughed into the twin towers?

How can you believe that there is an all-powerful and all-loving God that is watching all over the women who are stoned to death for adultery or out of marital rape in Afghanistan?

How can you believe that there is an all-powerful and all-loving God that is watching all over the soldier who shoots at Palestinians invading the Israeli jewish settlements while the evicted Palestinians throw petrol bombs at their Jewish evictors?

How can you believe that there is an all-powerful and all-loving God that is watching all over New Orleans as Hurricane Katrina drowns infants in their cribs.

How can you believe that there is an all-powerful and all-loving God that is watching all over the babies who have been snatched by Catholic nuns in Spain for over 50 years under the knowing eyes of the church honchos?

How can you believe that there is an all-powerful and all-loving God that is watching all over the Irish women who were forced into servitude and the board school boys who have been sodomised by the Catholic priests?

Isn't it time we realise that everyday there are examples of God's failures to protect humanity everywhere on this planet?

Isn't it time we realise the boundless narcissism and self-deceit of christian faithfuls like you, muslim faithfuls and jewish faithfuls who believe that there is an all-powerful and all-loving God, Allah and Yahweh that would only save them on Judgment day and send the others of false gods to hell, children, women, men the whole lot?

Chutzpah, once you stop to swaddle the world's suffering in religious fantasies, you will feel it in your bones just how precious life is. And indeed, how unfortunate it is that millions of human beings suffer the most harrowing abridgements of their happiness for no good reason at all.

One wonders just how vast and gratuitous a catastrophe would have to be to shake the world's faith. The Holocaust did not do it. Neither did the genocide in Rwanda, even with machete wielding priests among the perpetrators. Five hundred million people died of smallpox in the 20th century, many of them infants. God's ways, Allah's way, Yahweh's way are indeed inscrutable! It seems that any fact, no matter how tragic, can be rendered compatible with religious faith.

Don't tell me that God, Allah nor Yahweh is not responsible for human suffering and sins. For how else can we understand the claim that God is both omniscient and omnipotent? This is the age-old problem of theodicy isn't it? We should already consider it solved.

If God or Allah or Yahweh exists, either He can do nothing to stop the most outrageous calamities, or He does not care to. God, Allah or Yahweh, therefore, is either impotent or evil.


So Chutzpah, please take a step back from the religious crusade and look at the whole picture of today's scourge on this planet. It's not their scripture and their Allah that is source of the problem. It is the very concept of GOD in all permutations that is the problem.

Yes, now you can rightfully accuse me of blasphemy all you like. For that, I am willing to be issued your fatwa or excommunication order.