Be Proud To Be Call MIAO ^^;;;, OR NOT..? Options

[華夏無產]

Cool, nice find....Haha...but you won't be so happy when a Lao person calls you MEO!

From what I know, only Chinese Hmong are called Miao, because we don't have a character from "Hmong" or "Hmoob" as Miao/Hmong call themselves. In Vn, they're called mẹo or mông; in Thailand, ม้ง mong แม้ว maew . However, as far as I know, Ghao Xong, Gha Ne (Ka Nao), Hmao, also are considered to be Hmong tribes, although they don't use that name.

Historically, I believe that Chinese expeditioners and invaders gave to the Hmong the appelation "Miao", which was a generalized term for all peoples in that area. The reason why it's sometimes considered an insult is because it sounds similar to "Cat" in Chinese.

how come Miao sounds like Cat in chinese???
苗。。猫
Miao..Mao...

Miao=Hmong..
Hmong in China called themself Miao too.. only some Miao call themself Hmong

Well, some Hmong/Miao think that the two words are similar in pronounciation.

BTW, does Hmong have it's own alphabet, or is it always with Latin characters?

This post has been edited by 華夏無產: Jan 15 2005, 11:19 PM

[MING-LOYALIST]

The word 'Miao'<苗> is a Chinese term meaning Seeding or Young plant. The reason being the Miao were living around yellow river area about 4500 years ago and had developed agriculture when the tribe of the Yellow emperor who were hunter gatherers migrated to the yellow river they settle there and learnt agriculture from the miao people. Then the Miao attacked and were defeated then were driven south.
It has nothing to do with cats!

[華夏無產]

The word 'Miao'<苗> is a Chinese term meaning Seeding or Young plant. The reason being the Miao were living around yellow river area about 4500 years ago and had developed agriculture when the tribe of the Yellow emperor who were hunter gatherers migrated to the yellow river they settle there and learnt agriculture from the miao people. Then the Miao attacked and were defeated then were driven south.
It has nothing to do with cats!

Yes, I know. But still, some people do find it offensive for some reason.

BTW, did you know that some jews took offense to 猶太 because of the radical in the character "猶"?

[atypicalHmoobGir...]

BTW, does Hmong have it's own alphabet, or is it always with Latin characters?

According to legend, Hmong people had their own writing system but the Chinese destroyed all traces of it many centuries ago and forbid all those who had acknowledge of it to spread it. It was then that Hmong women started stitching the Hmong writing into their paj ntaub (flower cloth). But over time the writing on the clothes became nothing more than pretty shapes.

[User1]

The word 'Miao'<苗> is a Chinese term meaning Seeding or Young plant. The reason being the Miao were living around yellow river area about 4500 years ago and had developed agriculture when the tribe of the Yellow emperor who were hunter gatherers migrated to the yellow river they settle there and learnt agriculture from the miao people. Then the Miao attacked and were defeated then were driven south.
It has nothing to do with cats!

We Chinese are not really Sino-Tibetan people but Sinicized Miao/Hmong and Daic/Tai-Kadai people. That's what the latest Y-chromosome findings are implying. So, might not be that we learned agriculture from the Miao/Hmong and Tai but that we are Miao/Hmong and Tai who learned to speak Chinese under the rule of proto-Chinese nomads.

[MING-LOYALIST]

The word 'Miao'<苗> is a Chinese term meaning Seeding or Young plant. The reason being the Miao were living around yellow river area about 4500 years ago and had developed agriculture when the tribe of the Yellow emperor who were hunter gatherers migrated to the yellow river they settle there and learnt agriculture from the miao people. Then the Miao attacked and were defeated then were driven south.
It has nothing to do with cats!

We Chinese are not really Sino-Tibetan people but Sinicized Miao/Hmong and Daic/Tai-Kadai people. That's what the latest Y-chromosome findings are implying. So, might not be that we learned agriculture from the Miao/Hmong and Tai but that we are Miao/Hmong and Tai who learned to speak Chinese under the rule of proto-Chinese nomads.

We? you mean southerners<南人>
I'm from far north former nomadic lands.

[User1]

No, I don't mean southerners.

[InstantKarma]

We Chinese are not really Sino-Tibetan people but Sinicized Miao/Hmong and Daic/Tai-Kadai people. That's what the latest Y-chromosome findings are implying. So, might not be that we learned agriculture from the Miao/Hmong and Tai but that we are Miao/Hmong and Tai who learned to speak Chinese under the rule of proto-Chinese nomads.

Where can I find information about the latest findings? Sounds interesting, I would like to read more about it.

[User1]

We Chinese are not really Sino-Tibetan people but Sinicized Miao/Hmong and Daic/Tai-Kadai people. That's what the latest Y-chromosome findings are implying. So, might not be that we learned agriculture from the Miao/Hmong and Tai but that we are Miao/Hmong and Tai who learned to speak Chinese under the rule of proto-Chinese nomads.

Where can I find information about the latest findings? Sounds interesting, I would like to read more about it.

The link is dead today for some reason. It was working fine just a few days ago.
http://library.ibp.ac.cn/html/slwj/000222645600001.pdf
Try it. If it doesn't work I can PM or post the PDF for you. I doubt you'll be able to make much sense of the PDF without a basic understanding of genetics tho.. Those PDF's are basically all in "technical" language without "getting to the point".. just go to the summaries if that happens.

Ok, it's working now. Lemme explain it to you anyway. Basically, M175/Haplogroup O and Haplogroup N are the quintessential Asian lineages. They just found the ancestral type of this lineage, M214 in the Tibeto-Burman speakers who've "recently" moved into the SW of China, and in the people of Xinjiang, as well as in Mongolia. Chances are likely they will find more in Siberia.

The CURIOUS thing is that while most Chinese and SE Asians are descended from this ancestral lineage through M214--->M175, M214 itself is not found in even north Chinese. So, basically, the Chinese are lineage-wise different from the Tibeto Burmans. The Chinese are in fact more similar to Hmong, Tai, and Mon-Khmer, and Austronesians on the father's side than they are to Tibeto-Burmans.

Thus, it implies that the Sino-Tibetan nomads conquered the agricultural people of north China and imposed their language on them. There is also increasingly archeological evidence for this.

This post has been edited by User1: Jan 19 2005, 02:58 PM

[mIna]

very nice... o__0

[InstantKarma]

The link is dead today for some reason. It was working fine just a few days ago.
http://library.ibp.ac.cn/html/slwj/000222645600001.pdf
Try it. If it doesn't work I can PM or post the PDF for you. I doubt you'll be able to make much sense of the PDF without a basic understanding of genetics tho.. Those PDF's are basically all in "technical" language without "getting to the point".. just go to the summaries if that happens.

Ok, it's working now. Lemme explain it to you anyway. Basically, M175/Haplogroup O and Haplogroup N are the quintessential Asian lineages. They just found the ancestral type of this lineage, M214 in the Tibeto-Burman speakers who've "recently" moved into the SW of China, and in the people of Xinjiang, as well as in Mongolia. Chances are likely they will find more in Siberia.

The CURIOUS thing is that while most Chinese and SE Asians are descended from this ancestral lineage through M214--->M175, M214 itself is not found in even north Chinese. So, basically, the Chinese are lineage-wise different from the Tibeto Burmans. The Chinese are in fact more similar to Hmong, Tai, and Mon-Khmer, and Austronesians on the father's side than they are to Tibeto-Burmans.

Thus, it implies that the Sino-Tibetan nomads conquered the agricultural people of north China and imposed their language on them. There is also increasingly archeological evidence for this.

Thanks User! I'll read it when I get home from school today.

[InstantKarma]

After reading the research, it reminded me of a story my parents used to tell me when I was a child and which was told to them by their parents. It says that a long, long time ago Hmong and Chinese were two brothers, but for some reason or another they went their separate ways and one became the progenitor of the Hmong people and the other became the progenitor of the Chinese people. The Hmong people in China have a saying "the Hmong have Chinese bones and the Chinese have Hmong blood." Anyhow, that's another story in itself.

Where can I find more research on this subject?

This post has been edited by InstantKarma: Jan 20 2005, 08:06 PM

[一眉道人]

After reading the research, it reminded me of a story my parents used to tell me when I was a child and which was told to them by their parents. It says that a long, long time ago Hmong and Chinese were two brothers, but for some reason or another they went their separate ways and one became the progenitor of the Hmong people and the other became the progenitor of the Chinese people. The Hmong people in China have a saying "the Hmong have Chinese bones and the Chinese have Hmong blood." Anyhow, that's another story in itself.

Where can I find more research on this subject?

northen chinese were deeply mixed with,xiongnu,turk,jurchen,khitan,tieling,huihe,manchu,mongols................

northen chinese are quite differ from those southerners

[JB_Xyooj]

Hmm, Gotta Jot this down in my NoteBook

[AiNi]

I don't think that any of us should be ashamed of calling ourselves "Miao." Many Hmong mistaken the term Miao. There are many defintions to the term Miao. What the Chinese use to call us is totally different than what the rest of Southeast Asia calls us. Southeast Asia mainly teases us by calling us Cats, but the Chinese calls us "Miao" or "苗" which means "Sprout" or "Sprouting Seed." There should be no shame when you really know what it means. Don't take it too seriously, especially if you don't know what it means. Always make sure you know the facts first.
I'm sure that our Chinese brothers wouldn't delibrately make fun of us like that. "Cat" is just a way that others have found a way to make fun of us, but we shouldn't let it get to ourselves. We have a proud and strong history to hold up high for others to see.

[lilasiankid]

HEY! Have you guys ever seen any of the Trailers for Tsui Hark's new movie called "Seven Swords"??? Is this Miao? The Headdress looks Miao.





This post has been edited by lilasiankid: Jul 13 2005, 05:53 AM

[CYCLO]

look at the headdress on these "HAKKA" women of China [mountain people]

[mIna]

I don't think that any of us should be ashamed of calling ourselves "Miao." Many Hmong mistaken the term Miao. There are many defintions to the term Miao. What the Chinese use to call us is totally different than what the rest of Southeast Asia calls us. Southeast Asia mainly teases us by calling us Cats, but the Chinese calls us "Miao" or "苗" which means "Sprout" or "Sprouting Seed." There should be no shame when you really know what it means. Don't take it too seriously, especially if you don't know what it means. Always make sure you know the facts first.
I'm sure that our Chinese brothers wouldn't delibrately make fun of us like that. "Cat" is just a way that others have found a way to make fun of us, but we shouldn't let it get to ourselves. We have a proud and strong history to hold up high for others to see.

well said.. ^^ miao = sprouting seed.. i like that.. =]

[ooh-la-la]

aww... thats nice i guess... ^_____^...<i'm a miao... haha

[bABiedoLL]

I personally perfer being call Hmong. The word "Miao" is an unapporaite name which i feel that others used to insult the Hmong Culture.