Islamist al-Shabab and Famine in Somalia Options

[chutzpah]

Do you think the famine is caused by the Islamist al-Shabab who controls the Somalia?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-14222584

[elleX0]

Do you think the famine is caused by the Islamist al-Shabab who controls the Somalia?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-14222584

Allah provides, suffices, and makes a Way out of Every Hardship for Those Who have Taqwa

Allah said,

[وَمَن يَتَّقِ اللَّهَ يَجْعَل لَّهُ مَخْرَجاًوَيَرْزُقْهُ مِنْ حَيْثُ لاَ يَحْتَسِبُ]
(And whosoever has Taqwa of Allah, He will make a way for him to get out. And He will provide him from where he never could imagine.) meaning, whoever has Taqwa of Allah in what He has commanded and avoids what He has forbidden, then Allah will make a way out for him from every difficulty and will provide for him from resources he never anticipated or thought about. Ibn Abi Hatim recorded that `Abdullah bin Mas`ud said, "The most comprehensive Ayah in the Qur'an is,

[إِنَّ اللَّهَ يَأْمُرُ بِالْعَدْلِ وَالإْحْسَانِ]
(Verily, Allah enjoins Al-`Adl (justice) and Al-Ihsan (doing good) (16:90). The greatest Ayah in the Qur'an that contains relief is,
[وَمَن يَتَّقِ اللَّهَ يَجْعَل لَّهُ مَخْرَجاً]
(And whosoever has Taqwa of Allah, He will make a way for him to get out.)'' `Ikrimah also commented on the Ayah, "Whoever divorces as Allah commanded him, then Allah will make a way out for him.'' Similar was reported from Ibn `Abbas and Ad-Dahhak.`Abdullah bin Mas`ud and Masruq commented on the Ayah,
[وَمَن يَتَّقِ اللَّهَ يَجْعَل لَّهُ مَخْرَجاً]
(And whosoever has Taqwa of Allah, He will make a way for him to get out.) "It pertains to when one knows that if Allah wills He gives, and if He wills He deprives,
[مِنْ حَيْثُ لاَ يَحْتَسِبُ]
(from where he never could imagine.) from resources he did not anticipate'' Qatadah said,
[وَمَن يَتَّقِ اللَّهَ يَجْعَل لَّهُ مَخْرَجاً]
(And whosoever has Taqwa of Allah, He will make a way for him to get out.) "meaning, from every doubt and the horrors experienced at the time of death,
[وَيَرْزُقْهُ مِنْ حَيْثُ لاَ يَحْتَسِبُ]
(And He will provide him from where he never could imagine) from where he never thought of or anticipated.'' Allah said,
[وَمَن يَتَوَكَّلْ عَلَى اللَّهِ فَهُوَ حَسْبُهُ]
(And whosoever puts his trust in Allah, then He will suffice him.) Imam Ahmad recorded that Ibn `Abbas said that he rode the Prophet's camel while sitting behind the Prophet , and the Messenger of Allah said to him,
Allah provides, suffices, and makes a Way out of Every Hardship for Those Who have Taqwa

Allah said,

[وَمَن يَتَّقِ اللَّهَ يَجْعَل لَّهُ مَخْرَجاًوَيَرْزُقْهُ مِنْ حَيْثُ لاَ يَحْتَسِبُ]
(And whosoever has Taqwa of Allah, He will make a way for him to get out. And He will provide him from where he never could imagine.) meaning, whoever has Taqwa of Allah in what He has commanded and avoids what He has forbidden, then Allah will make a way out for him from every difficulty and will provide for him from resources he never anticipated or thought about. Ibn Abi Hatim recorded that `Abdullah bin Mas`ud said, "The most comprehensive Ayah in the Qur'an is,
[إِنَّ اللَّهَ يَأْمُرُ بِالْعَدْلِ وَالإْحْسَانِ]
(Verily, Allah enjoins Al-`Adl (justice) and Al-Ihsan (doing good) (16:90). The greatest Ayah in the Qur'an that contains relief is,
[وَمَن يَتَّقِ اللَّهَ يَجْعَل لَّهُ مَخْرَجاً]
(And whosoever has Taqwa of Allah, He will make a way for him to get out.)'' `Ikrimah also commented on the Ayah, "Whoever divorces as Allah commanded him, then Allah will make a way out for him.'' Similar was reported from Ibn `Abbas and Ad-Dahhak.`Abdullah bin Mas`ud and Masruq commented on the Ayah,
[وَمَن يَتَّقِ اللَّهَ يَجْعَل لَّهُ مَخْرَجاً]
(And whosoever has Taqwa of Allah, He will make a way for him to get out.) "It pertains to when one knows that if Allah wills He gives, and if He wills He deprives,
[مِنْ حَيْثُ لاَ يَحْتَسِبُ]
(from where he never could imagine.) from resources he did not anticipate'' Qatadah said,
[وَمَن يَتَّقِ اللَّهَ يَجْعَل لَّهُ مَخْرَجاً]
(And whosoever has Taqwa of Allah, He will make a way for him to get out.) "meaning, from every doubt and the horrors experienced at the time of death,
[وَيَرْزُقْهُ مِنْ حَيْثُ لاَ يَحْتَسِبُ]
(And He will provide him from where he never could imagine) from where he never thought of or anticipated.'' Allah said,
[وَمَن يَتَوَكَّلْ عَلَى اللَّهِ فَهُوَ حَسْبُهُ]
(And whosoever puts his trust in Allah, then He will suffice him.) Imam Ahmad recorded that Ibn `Abbas said that he rode the Prophet's camel while sitting behind the Prophet , and the Messenger of Allah said to him,



This post has been edited by elleX0: Jul 24 2011, 01:14 PM

[chutzpah]

The lovely logic of Islamist even facing countless deaths, just blame the Christians, may be Jews...

Source: http://jihadwatch.terrorismawareness.org/?...WkuaHRtbA%3D%3D

Somali jihadists say famine declaration is a hoax to make Muslims flee toward "Christian" influences in neighboring countries

Al-Shabaab is acting ever more like the Saudi religious police who beat schoolgirls back into a burning building, lest they go outdoors without their veils. This report further explains why the jihadists threatened Somalis in aid camps with attacks -- people who had traveled for days and risked death -- unless they turned around and went home.

But there is in all likelihood a military dimension to al-Shabaab's decision: starving people cannot fight back now, and those lost to the famine leave fewer who can travel back from the aid camps to resist later, when the food crisis eases. "Somali rebels allege famine claim an infidel hoax," from Radio Netherlands Worldwide, July 30 (thanks to Weasel Zippers):

For Somalia's Al-Qaeda-linked rebels, the drought devastating parts of the country is being exploited by external enemies, claiming that local Muslims were adequately addressing the crisis.

The Al-Shebab insurgents have expelled several foreign aid groups from regions under their control since 2009 and reiterated recently that the ban was still in force after the United Nations declared famine in two regions they rule.

Shebab spokesman Sheikh Ali Mohamud Rage denied there was famine in the southern Somalia regions of Bakool and Lower Shabelle as declared by the UN, but admitted that there was drought.

In a speech to the rebel radio, Rage said local traders and other residents have been the main providers of help to the drought-hit population and that "God did not make them need an outside enemy or non-Muslims, the people in the country fed them very well."

"We need Muslim people to be aware that the external enemy especially non-Muslims have been thinking of a new strategy.

"The new strategy is to transport them abroad, especially in Christian countries like Ethiopia and Kenya, so that their faith can be destroyed and that they could be staff and soldiers for the Christians," Rage charged.

Thousands of Somalis have fled to neighbouring Ethiopia and Kenya to seek relief from the harsh drought that has affected some 12 million people across the Horn of Africa region.

Somalia is the worst hit country by the drought, with malnutrition rates in some regions reaching 50 percent, according to the UN, while nearly half of its 10 million people are in need of humanitarian aid.

The aid restriction by the hardline rebels, who control much of southern and central Somalia, has been singled out as having worsened the effects of the drought.

However, a handful of foreign aid groups were spared the ban and can operate in the militia-controlled regions but with limited scope.

"For the Shebab it means that if the bulk of aid comes from Somali communities, foreign aid cannot be rejected," according to Support Programme (NSP), an organisation which advises aid groups on the Somalia operation.

But the NSP warned that the authority granted by the Shebab to the few foreign aid groups can suddenly be reversed, so the UN and other relief organisations should be cautious about their public pronouncements.

Whether to accept or reject external help has also deepened traditional divisions between moderate and extremist Shebab elements, a Western observer told AFP.

Hardliners led by Shebab chief Ahmed Abdi Godane reject any kind of foreign aid, while the moderates who have strong clan links are more open to outside help.

After initially appealing in early July for help and pledging to allow aid in -- even from non-Muslims -- the Shebab later clarified that the previous ban on some foreign aid groups was still in place.

"It is possibly an illustration of internal dissension among the (Shebab) leadership," the NSP said.

"The announcement of a famine and the massive media reporting over the subject further raised internal discontent and prompted a rapid response," it added.

Forced to pull out of the Shebab-ruled regions in early 2010, the UN's World Food Programme has been distributing aid in Mogadishu and this week began airlifting supplies to feed malnourished children....

[elleX0]

It is Muslim philosophy that INSHALLAH Allah will provide. That is all they need, INSHALLAH.

[chutzpah]

More of the horror that is perpetrated by Al Shabaab:

Source: http://news.scotsman.com/news/Islamists-tr...g-of.6811904.jp

THE al-Shabaab Islamist insurgent group, which controls much of southern Somalia, is blocking starving refugees fleeing the country by setting up a camp where those trying to escape its territory are imprisoned.
The group is widely blamed for causing a famine in Somalia by forcing out many western aid organisations, depriving drought victims of desperately needed food. The situation is growing bleaker by the day, with tens of thousands of Somalis already dea
ADVERTISEMENTd and more than 500,000 children on the brink of starvation.

[tangawizi]

Where is Ayaan Hirsi Ali when you need her to right the wrongs in her countrymen?

[chutzpah]

Where is Ayaan Hirsi Ali when you need her to right the wrongs in her countrymen?

Well in case you forget, Hirsi left Islam long ago she is no longer a Muslima... Why? Because according to Hirsi, Islam is violent, Islam is intolerant and abuse our kind, and there are several permanent fatwas to kill her, issued by your peace loving moderate Muslim clerics, and 99% of Muslims want her dead. Read for yourself:
http://ayaanhirsiali.org/

And here is one of your heroes writing about Hirsi:
http://www.slate.com/id/2141276/

The Caged Virgin
Holland's shameful treatment of Ayaan Hirsi Ali.
By Christopher Hitchens

Hopefully some of the truth get into your muddled thick head. Just because highlighting the ills and evils of Islam doesn't make one a hater or anti Muslims.

[tangawizi]

Hirsi grew up in a dysfunctional family and hails from a war-torn ex-socialist tribal country like Somalia. Her experiences which led her to become an atheist is uniquely her own. There are no doubt many like her who suffered the same fate, and who became refugees in the West. She describes the roots of her muslim family's dysfunction under sex, money and violence, being sanctioned by verses in the Quran. She seems to have realised recently that this is not only found in muslim families with tribal backgrounds, but also in first world countries like Utah in offshoots of christian sects like the Mormons. (See Jeff Warren's recent indictment as pedophile. In case you didn't know it, he's the Latter Day Saints' ex-religious leader.)

Hirsi should be your type of Heroine cuz she advocates the conversion of Muslims to Christianity as a way to counter the battle for the hearts and minds of jihadists in the dustbowls of her native country Somalia, the kindergartens of Palestine, the souks of Egypt and madrassahs of Pakistan. This is laughable, almost child-like in her zeal to bring upon enlightenment on her countrymen and fellow muslims around the world. Reminds me of your own zeal. Instead of advocating the contemplative traditions of Islam such as Sufism where the floodgates of inquiry and reason can be reopened, she's talking about getting muslims to shop for Prophets.

As an atheist, she's a total sell-out! Even though atheist thinkers like Hitchens have applauded her boldness in revealing the roots of muslim fundamentalism, they have distanced themselves from her prescription of replacing one cancer (islam) with another cancer (christianity) that she advocates.

She's now working for a right-wing policy think-tank called American Enterprise Institute. I can see how her hawkish views on how to deal with radical islamism really goes right up your street as a new christian convert that you are.


You really must try and go find some quiet space and meditate on your visceral reactions to opposite opinions. Otherwise, you risk turning your convert zeal into angry lunacy.

This post has been edited by tangawizi: Aug 6 2011, 07:36 AM

[chutzpah]

As an atheist, she's a total sell-out! Even though atheist thinkers like Hitchens have applauded her boldness in revealing the roots of muslim fundamentalism, they have distanced themselves from her prescription of replacing one cancer (islam) with another cancer (christianity) that she advocates.

What has Christianity ever done to you? But more to the point, what have you ever done to help others while you continue to pontificate like a lunatic? I can easily post a very long list of what Christianity and Christian groups have done for the betterment of mankind through the ages, yes even you can enjoy the fruits of their labours. And what's more you don't even have to be a Christian to enjoy Christian charity. The wonderful work done by the Catholic charity International CARITAS is well known. And yes they were the first few who entered Banda Aceh immediately after the tsunami even though it is a strictly Islamic province with sharia laws. Then there are numerous Christian charities that do great and wonderful work all around the world for the infirm, the poor, the children, the destitute etc. What have you or your 'religious' group ever done? Ever heard of Mother Theresa of Calcutta? There have been countless Catholic men and women, clergies and faithfuls alike, who have done what blessed Mother Theresa had done.

Cancer? Go and dip your dirty and nasty little fingers in the acid for typing such rubbish and the next time you gaze at your putrid festering naval, think of why you are such a pathological liar.

[tangawizi]

There's another example again....

Caritas.... i met folks who work for Caritas... they are Lords of Poverty compared with the impoverished and starving victims they serve! hahahaha!

I met folks who work for muslims charities too.. yep. Muslim Brotherhood types.

All's fair in the game of winning souls, chutzy.

I have nothing against christianity, I just have something against the zealous types like you.

[chutzpah]

There's another example again....

Caritas.... i met folks who work for Caritas... they are Lords of Poverty compared with the impoverished and starving victims they serve! hahahaha!

I met folks who work for muslims charities too.. yep. Muslim Brotherhood types.

All's fair in the game of winning souls, chutzy.

I have nothing against christianity, I just have something against the zealous types like you.

How pathetic, as usual you can NEVER provide evidence to support your lie. As you are known to lie just about everything how can what you said about Caritas members be believed? Is being better than the folks you help wrong? Again if the Caritas members are as destitute how can they help others in the 1st place? What stupid brainless logic do you use? Did you expel that out of your festering and putrid rectal passage as usual?

I can say the Dalai Lama is a money grabbing conniving political figure parading as a religious leader, but then I have backed up my claim with evidence (in another thread) and anyone who have ever attended his 'SHOW' will quickly realize how staged and phony his jokes are!

Posting evils done in the name of Islam and refuting and correcting your lies about Christianity make me a zealot ? Do you know how pathetic and Unreasonable you sound? Is that what you get out of your esoteric brand of heretical Buddhism?

You never fails to post lies about Christianity only to be ripped apart and you deny that you have nothing against it?

I ask you again, what have you ever done for the betterment of others apart of your constant pontification and lectures?

[tangawizi]

http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/index.php?...t&p=4839354

You are a zealous convert cuz you provoke quarrels everytime you talk about religion on this forum, you post news reports on islamic violence and just zero in on the religious texts rather than explain the socio-economic political factors behind the violence. When data is presented to show that violence is not just the purview of Islamists, you say that those data is irrelevant! Why? Just cuz it shows that people of other faiths (particularly latinos of the Catholic faith) are just as capable of violence? You lash out at those who present differing views or opinions.

That's Your Zealotry.

Caritas International is a casualty of the ongoing wave of Christianization that this Papacy is championing. At least eighty percent of Caritas workers are lay people. And many of their programmes have had an outward looking purpose that goes against the pro-life, anti-abortion views of the church. You can read all about the issue with Caritas from their recent firing of their female Secretary-General here:

http://www.ncronline.org/blogs/ncr-today/e...-two-way-street

Much as you criticise how some tenets of Islam are being exploited by jihadists to further their notion of a death cult, we can see how the present Papacy under Pope Benedict is aiming to bring the secularizing world back into the catholic fold. It's not Islam that is a problem in western countries but the Papacy is using Islam as a scapegoat.

Instead, its the secularizing and atheistic ethos that's scaring the $hit out of the Papacy and their relevance in European societies.

Where is this most evident? The empty churches and the dusty pulpits.

If you have a chance go and get your sticky hands on the documentary titled "Into Great Silence" by a german film maker on an examination of life inside the Grande Chartreuse, the head monastery of the reclusive Carthusian Order in France. You could see how the very few recruits to this order of reclusive hermit monks are blacks or asians, from the third world so-to-speak.

The great houses of christian faith are having serious problems renewing their stock and they have to rely on pathetic zealots like You now to champion their cause and extend their livelihoods!

This post has been edited by tangawizi: Aug 11 2011, 04:41 AM

[chutzpah]

Source: http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/vatican-o...cretary-general

Vatican official criticizes outgoing Caritas secretary-general

BY PATRICK B. CRAINE

MON MAR 07, 2011 19:09 EST

ROME, Italy, March 7, 2011 (LifeSiteNews.com) – A Vatican official has publicly criticized the outgoing head of Caritas Internationalis after she accused the Vatican of a top-down communication style and suggested it was out of touch with Caritas.

Caritas Secretary-General Lesley-Anne Knight, whose four-year term ends in May, was denied a nihil obstat (“nothing obstructs”) from the Vatican earlier this year, which is required for her to continue in the position. The Vatican has said a new direction is needed to strengthen the organization’s Catholic identity and its evangelization efforts.

But in a March 1st interview with the National Catholic Reporter, Knight said that with the new emphasis, some Caritas members “might become disillusioned with the confederation, might want to distance themselves from Caritas.”

“Does the Holy See actually know what Caritas is doing?” she asked.

On Monday, Msgr. Giampietro Dal Toso, secretary of the Pontifical Council “Cor Unum,” which oversees the Vatican’s charitable efforts, told Catholic News Agency that Knight’s comments could threaten Caritas’ effectiveness. “Her declarations on the lack of communion with the Holy See might seriously damage the prestige of Caritas Internationalis, especially among the faithful,” he said.

He also criticized Knight for using the media to air concerns about Caritas’ governance, saying this “does not seem to me the best way to treat the various positions.”

While Knight had complained about the little contact Caritas had with Vatican officials, saying that dialogue is “actually a two-way street,” Msgr. Dal Toso retorted that Knight’s use of the media “is one-way communication – not dialogue.”

Caritas Internationalis is a confederation of 165 country-based Catholic aid organizations worldwide, including the U.S.’s Catholic Relief Services and the Canadian Catholic Organization for Development and Peace (CCODP).

Msgr. Dal Toso explained that the Vatican’s Secretariat of State and the Pontifical Council “Cor Unum” envision a “new profile” for Caritas in coming years. “The next four years envisage Caritas Internationalis engaged in important themes concerning its mission, including the revision of its statutes and internal reform,” he said.

In the NCR interview, Knight had suggested that the millions of dollars the organization receives from Western governments could be jeopardized if they become too explicitly Catholic. “If the British government, or Sweden or Germany or Canada, is donating millions to Caritas, it’s because they know and trust the value of the work we do with the poor,” she said. “It’s not because they want to be seen to be supporting a Catholic organization.”
The change in the Vatican’s approach to international aid appears to be part of the general reform project outlined in Pope Benedict’s recent encyclical letter Caritas in Veritate (Charity in Truth). The encyclical insisted that human development and foreign aid cannot be separated from the demands of truth, and criticized the fact that many international aid organizations are promoting abortion, contraception, sterilization, and euthanasia.

The CCODP, a Caritas member organization, has come under fire from pro-life groups for supporting organizations that advocate the legalization of abortion, distribute contraceptives, and support homosexualist policies. Knight vigorously defended CCODP after such policies were exposed by LifeSiteNews in early 2009 in a letter sent to donors and obtained by LSN.

In addition, anonymous Vatican officials told LifeSiteNews last November in Rome that similar problems exist with Catholic international aid organizations sponsored by other national bishops’ conferences and that this was a disturbing and unacceptable trend. LifeSiteNews was told that these bishops’ conferences were not conducting proper oversight over their international development and aid organizations resulting in the funding of groups whose objectives are in serious conflict with Catholic teaching.

Note: Tanga's half truths or outright lies about Caritas and the Vatican is again exposed. The nihil obstat is a guarantee that there nothing contrary to faith and morals. The refusal to grant this to Dr Knight speaks volumes.

Dr Knight is not "being fired". Her four year term has come to an end. HE Tarcisio Card. Bertone has decided he will not provide the nihil obstat to allow her a further four year term. Crudely put, her contract has ended and it's not being renewed.

[chutzpah]

Tangawizi just can't help herself because she is a pathological liar. I do not call her a liar, dishonest and without integrity lightly. This opinion is derived from her many posting in AF.

Case in point; first she made accusation against the member of Caritas in this thread, see post #10 then she went on to commend them with half truths and more lies in post #12. She can't make up her mind whether to loath or to praise them. This happens when your facts are no more then half truths and lies, you become confused and forgot what lies you told! The truth and facts are never important to Tanga so long she gets her message across. She never cares much for credibility. This is a typical symptom common to all trolls in every internet chat site. The anonymity and the zero accountability for what is said in the cyber space have spawned many irresponsible trolls such as Tanga. At least her side-kick DELirium has half heartedly attempted to use some facts and evidence in his infantile posting. Though he tries, his arguments are weak and incoherent at best, still we can’t blame what little Mother Nature has bestowed upon him in the intellect department, which is precious little.

Tanga's hates anyone who post about Islam/Muslims, even though the posts are ALL based on Islamic scriptures and factual events. As an Islamist apologist, she also hates me for posting factual account about Islam and Muslims. Her hatred towards elleXO is no different.

What is amazing is that because of her hatred of me and what I post, lately, she has started to attack Catholicism, Protestantism, and the Pope. In fact she indiscriminately attacks Christianity, by posting half truths and lies about the Church and everything to do with Christianity.

By attacking Christianity Tanga also insults the good men and women of the Church who have done so much and still do to help the defenseless, the poor, yes even the lepers. The Little Sisters of the Poor, a French order of Catholic Nuns, were the first pioneers who cared for the HIV-AIDS victims back in the 80s when nobody else would care for them, not even their own family and many hospitals and doctors shunned them. The nuns pioneered research in the field of HIV-AIDS is well known, particularly in Australia. These same nuns also run an old folks home for not only Catholics, but for everyone. In Kuala Lumpur these selfless nuns, work hard to care for the sick and bedridden old folks whose family no longer want them or want to care for them. Would Tanga clean and care for an old man who no longer has control of his bowel? Yes I have witnessed such selfless charitable acts from the men and women of the Church around the world.

What has Tanag ever done to help others that she has the audacity to make fun and throw dirt at a religion whose charity even she benefited from?

When I use evidence and facts to pull down and refuted each and every one of her half truths and lies about the Church and Christianity, she labeled me a Christian zealot. She even accused me of trying to proselytise AF members. This is how sick and how low Tanga is willing to sink just to win any unwinnable arguments.

If she has any threads of credibility, integrity and honesty, she will at least try to refute my posting with EVIDENCE and FACTS. Name calling and attacking Christianity with lies and half truth just won’t do. It only re enforces every thing that I have said about Tanga.

[tangawizi]

So you feel sore when someone brings up something negative about your religion huh? And you have to deny it or else go on a herculean effort to carry out a character assassination attempt?

Every post of yours these days seem to about just one thing only -- that I am anti-christian or the Vatican and I am lying about them...

You reap what u sow. What do you think the first reaction is when muslims read your anti-Islam posts and articles about tribal conflicts and mores?

The only person who's cooking up her version of facts to fit her own storyline is you my dear...




As to Caritas' political winds of change at the helm, let me just say that secular friends of mine worked in Caritas' projects in eastern africa and they have the scoop on the change in direction within the organization. The Vatican wants to re-assert control over what they see as an increasingly secular direction that Caritas was taking with the old CEO. Of course they would not grant Lesley Ann Knight a nihil obstat which would air all their dirty laundry in the public. And your bald assertion that her contract came to an end and was not renewed is just crap cuz she was going to be renewed, but she obviously was NOT trusted by the men at the Vatican to toe the line with regards to the Vatican's political aims.

If u need articles to back up facts.. you can do a search yourself but here's a link for those of you who's interested in the political manoevring of the Vatican to take back control of their charity arm which has millions of dollars of aid monies coming from european states who have increasingly taken on secular humanitarian aims instead of religious ones :

http://www.cathnewsusa.com/tag/caritas-international/





Some critics have viewed this move by the Vatican to be sexist :

Lesley-Anne Knight dismissed? Bad news...
Thursday, March 3, 2011
By Bryan Cones
ShareThis
Comments (5)

UPDATE: It's worth reading the reflections of Lesley-Anne Knight's predecessor, Duncan MacLaren, on the situation. He provides lots of useful context and makes one wonder why the Vatican has made this move..

We constantly hear rumblings that the church treats women with the same respect it treats men, we just don't ordain them. Then comes news that that the Holy See has refused the nihil obstat--essentially permission--for Lesley-Anne Knight to continue as head of Caritas Internationalis for another term. Knight was the first woman to run the organization, and its board fully endorsed her for another term.

Head over to NCRonline and read John Allen's interview with Knight, the first since the announcement. Then read US Catholic's own interview with her just after she was elected. Then tell me why we wouldn't want this woman coordinating the international charitable operations of the churches throughout the world.

Here's the thing: Some see the church's proclamation of the equality of women as pretty hollow because women can't be ordained in the Roman Catholic Church. That message is hollower still when a woman of the integrity, dedication, and obvious faith of a woman such as Lesley-Anne Knight is dismissed so perfunctorily by the Holy See, in this case, the Vatican Secretary of State, Tarcisio Bertone. Quite frankly, I'd like to see him or any other Vatican bureaucrat do better.

Like it or not, the way this plays is that the Vatican is uncomfortable with lay women in positions of real authority and influence in the church. Knight's appointment to Caritas was a great leap forward; her dismissal is a collossal mistake.

http://www.uscatholic.org/blog/2011/03/les...smissed-bad-new

You see, the Board of Caritas wanted Ms Knight for a second term, but the Cardinals at the Vatican vetoed it and issued the nihil obstat to sack her.

But of course, how can these dear Cardinals be sexist?? After all, they are all men in the good service of the Lord. And women can't join them in the ranks ...

You can kiss their rings, now dear..

This post has been edited by tangawizi: Aug 20 2011, 01:32 AM

[chutzpah]

So you feel sore when someone brings up something negative about your religion huh? And you have to deny it or else go on a herculean effort to carry out a character assassination attempt?

Every post of yours these days seem to about just one thing only -- that I am anti-christian or the Vatican and I am lying about them...

You reap what u sow. What do you think the first reaction is when muslims read your anti-Islam posts and articles about tribal conflicts and mores?

The only person who's cooking up her version of facts to fit her own storyline is you my dear...

As to Caritas' political winds of change at the helm, let me just say that secular friends of mine worked in Caritas' projects in eastern africa and they have the scoop on the change in direction within the organization. The Vatican wants to re-assert control over what they see as an increasingly secular direction that Caritas was taking with the old CEO. Of course they would not grant Lesley Ann Knight a nihil obstat which would air all their dirty laundry in the public. And your bald assertion that her contract came to an end and was not renewed is just crap cuz she was going to be renewed, but she obviously was NOT trusted by the men at the Vatican to toe the line with regards to the Vatican's political aims.

If u need articles to back up facts.. you can do a search yourself but here's a link for those of you who's interested in the political manoevring of the Vatican to take back control of their charity arm which has millions of dollars of aid monies coming from european states who have increasingly taken on secular humanitarian aims instead of religious ones :

http://www.cathnewsusa.com/tag/caritas-international/

Some critics have viewed this move by the Vatican to be sexist :

You see, the Board of Caritas wanted Ms Knight for a second term, but the Cardinals at the Vatican vetoed it and issued the nihil obstat to sack her.

But of course, how can these dear Cardinals be sexist?? After all, they are all men in the good service of the Lord. And women can't join them in the ranks ...

You can kiss their rings, now dear..

Character assassination?? My reply post #95:

http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/index.php?...p;#entry4851888

This post has been edited by chutzpah: Aug 21 2011, 02:32 AM

[chutzpah]

Here's the thing: Some see the church's proclamation of the equality of women as pretty hollow because women can't be ordained in the Roman Catholic Church. That message is hollower still when a woman of the integrity, dedication, and obvious faith of a woman such as Lesley-Anne Knight is dismissed so perfunctorily by the Holy See, in this case, the Vatican Secretary of State, Tarcisio Bertone. Quite frankly, I'd like to see him or any other Vatican bureaucrat do better.

Sexism has nothing to do with the decision!

Note: Tanga's half truths or outright lies about Caritas and the Vatican is again exposed. The nihil obstat is a guarantee that there nothing contrary to faith and morals. The refusal to grant this to Dr Knight speaks volumes.

Dr Knight is not "being fired". Her four year term has come to an end. HE Tarcisio Card. Bertone has decided he will not provide the nihil obstat to allow her a further four year term. Crudely put, her contract has ended and it's not being renewed.

[golder]

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[chutzpah]

When the only help for the Sundanese in Egypt comes from the Catholic Church and Caritas the Catholic charity which Tangawizi despised.

Source: http://weekly.ahram.org.eg/2002/592/fe2.htm

Moustafa, a taxi driver who admits that his own two children 'play these games', has lived in Arba'a-wi-noss for the past eight years. He said: "The Sudanese come here for three, sometimes four months. They receive aid from the US government and the church, then they get sent to America" -- an inaccurate understanding of the process of refugee resettlement.

While few social services exist for Arba'a-wi-noss's Egyptian residents, perhaps even fewer exist for Sudanese families. According to Sister Ira of CARITAS, her organisation caters to an almost wholly Egyptian clientele in Arba'a-wi-noss -- though there is nothing in its charter that prohibits them from serving Sudanese as they do elsewhere. Proper employment for the Sudanese is virtually non-existent. Work permits are impossible to obtain. What little work exists is often informal in nature and only short-term. Eligible men, both Egyptian and Sudanese, collect at Ezbet Al-Haggana in the mornings to offer themselves as cheap -- always manual -- labour. They work for as little as 10 piastres per half hour. Given the dangers of working without a permit, however, it is more often the women who become the primary bread winners, cleaning homes in Nasr City and Heliopolis for equally meagre pay.

Until a year ago, there was no school for Sudanese children and registering refugee children in Egyptian schools is practically impossible since a residence permit, which nobody seems to have, is required. There was no church, save the sole orthodox church some kilometres away, and then, it only served Christians. In November 2000, Abbassiya's Sacred Heart Church launched an initiative to build a school for Sudanese children in Arba'a-wi-noss. Today, the school serves 360 children and has recently been moved to a larger location that also serves as a church. Here there are seven brightly coloured classrooms and one room that serves as a make- shift clinic and meeting room for a community women's group.

According to Father Claudius of the Sacred Heart, change is taking hold: "If you look at the fact that absolutely none of these children were in school before last year and now many of them are reading, you can see that much progress has been made." But, he added: "That does not mean we do not have incredible amounts left to do in this community."

Medical care is nearly non-existent for members of the Sudanese community. Most have no choice but to make the long journey to Zamalek's All Saints Cathedral to receive attention, and even that is not free. There are clinics in Arba'a- wi-noss, at CARITAS and the orthodox church, but these are small and have few resources. Diarrhoea, chronic coughs and rampant malnutrition -- all preventable -- seem the most common ailments.

The Sudanese community in Arba'a-wi-noss is not the monolithic entity it is often portrayed to be. The racial, cultural, religious and political differences that have fuelled the country's civil war between the northern and southern populations do not disappear once Sudanese are in Egypt.

Mohamed, a 53-year-old father of four, fled conscription into the Sudan People's Defence Forces (PDF). Originally from Khartoum, he, his wife, who was pregnant at the time, and their three children, embarked on the arduous journey to Egypt by land via Shalatin. Arba'a-wi-noss has been their home since 1997, they struggle to pay the 30 pounds a month they need for a single large room since Mohamed lost his job at a confectionery factory in Doqqi in November.

Mohamed complained of discrimination against him and his family because they hail from northern Sudan. Most Sudanese in Arba'a-wi-noss are southerners and Christian. He explained: "They think of us as Arab. The churches distribute blankets and food to the doorsteps of all Sudanese but they skip our home. Our children suffer, and we never have enough to eat."

Mohamed's wife, Mona, said that the mosques, a traditional source of aid, are anything but welcoming. She and her husband shook their heads vehemently when asked if they made use of the mosque facilities: "We don't feel the Egyptians or the Sudanese welcome us. What are we to do?"