How to permanently secure Tibet Options

[paul2272]

The importance of Tibet to China cannot be underestimated. First, it is where most vital rivers in Asia originate, such as the Mekong, Yellow and Yangtze. Second, it occupies a commanding geography that overlooks China, Central Asia, and South Asia. Third, it contains significant natural resources that are essential to China’s continued economic development.

The only real threat to China’s hold on Tibet comes from political activism for self-government by the native Tibetans. China already has a strong military contingent on the Tibetan plateau. Plus, with the new railway to Llasa built, China can mobilize lots of soldiers quickly. But it will be very difficult if the native Tibetans become politically awakened for aspiration to self-determination.

If Tibetans stage a Tiananmen style protest, and China cracks down just as harshly, the political movement will be stopped; but it will be at a huge cost to China’s image (at a time when China is growing ever closer to the world). That is why China must prevent the situation in Tibet from ever deteriorating into that degree of mass movement.

China must do several things. First, it must never allow the Dalai Lama to return to Tibet. He may not push for independence or autonomy, but his very presence becomes a symbol and a rallying point for any mass movement to coalesce around.

Second, it must never grant the Dalai Lama’s wish for autonomy. What the Dalai Lama wants is for the Han Chinese population to be removed from Tibet. This is immoral in and of itself: if Tibet is truly an integral part of China (as the Lama “claims” to support), then a Chinese, whether Han or otherwise, should be free to travel to Tibet as he is free to travel to any other part of China. But more than that, leaving Tibet ethnically majority Tibet is very dangerous and insecure.

The ONLY truly safe means of securing Tibet by China is to continue to encourage mass Han Chinese migration to Tibet so that the ethnic Tibetans become a small minority. History shows that this is the best way to secure a territory long term.

Does cultural assimilation of ethnic Tibetans into Chinese language, culture, etc., work to secure Tibet? No. Even if the ethnic Tibetans speak Chinese, practice Chinese custom, and feel that they are a citizen of China, they will choose self-determination and independence if given the chance. A good illustration is the Kazakhs in Kazakhstan. The Russian empire ruled Kazakhstan for more than a hundred years to the point where the Kazakhs spoke Russian, were intimately familiar with the Russian culture, custom, and ways of doing things. But when given the chance for political independence, they grabbed it. And now, Kazakhstan is an independent nation.

Today, the only legitimate means for determining the political status of a territory is by vote through a referendum. Therefore, if Tibet is ever to become independent, it must be through the vote of the residents of Tibet. That is why it is so important for the Han Chinese to be the majority in Tibet so that electoral channel for Tibetan independence is quashed.

The West will continue to support the Dalai Lama. It is stupid for China to get riled up and angry every time the Dalai Lama is welcomed at a European capital. It should, instead, focus on moving as many Chinese into Tibet as possible. Only when there is a significant Han Chinese majority in Tibet will the West realize that supporting the Dalai Lama is futile.

Tibet has significant natural resources that can serve as a base for economic development there. The only problem is the altitude: the Han Chinese are not adept at living so high, suffering shortness of breath, headache, etc. The Chinese government should spend as much money as possible researching ways to allow for the Han Chinese to live in Tibet long-term. This is the only way to permanently secure Tibet for China.

[Titanium]

China is already implementing such policies, it will take time of course.

[BurdenOfAges]

One is reminded of a hypothetical conversation between Chairman Mao and the Dalai Lama:

Mao: The historical problem with China is that we have too many people. The historical problem with Tibet is that you have too little. Bringing Tibet into China will solve both our problems.
Dalai Lama: I must respectfully decline.
Mao: I don't think you understand. It was not a request.

This post has been edited by BurdenOfAges: Aug 18 2009, 03:13 PM

[smithkx]

The dalai lama is the only one the tibetans might listen to, you need to convince the dalai to go against support for independence and let him return and tell the tibetans to stay a part of china. Also they don't care about modern living standards, just leave them with their traditional culture, not everybody needs to modernize.

[CharlesDarwin]

First, it is where most vital rivers in Asia originate, such as the Mekong, Yellow and Yangtze.

That rivers originate in Qinghai province, where Han(54%) +Hui(16%)+Mongol(1.8%)+Tu(4%)+Salar(1.8%) are more than 75%.


I think that China should create Sikang province again( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:ROC_Admi..._and_Claims.png ) , and then kick out Tibet because China doesn't need that wasteland.

Also China should kick out southwestern Xinjiang where 80% of Uyghurs lives(12, 13, 15, 17 on this map: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:XinjiangMap.png ) .

This post has been edited by CharlesDarwin: Aug 19 2009, 08:44 AM

[baybal]

Wow, where did you get this : "Besides, Tibet holds the largest reserve of uranium in the world. Dalai back in tibet means he's controlling how to use that resource. That's another NO NO. " ?

[smithkx]

Wow, where did you get this : "Besides, Tibet holds the largest reserve of uranium in the world. Dalai back in tibet means he's controlling how to use that resource. That's another NO NO. " ?

Shouldn't you be back in Mongol chat and talk about creating a second empire by horses??

[Titanium]

Heavy demographic pressure is pretty much the main solution. It will take time of course but it's been a success thus far. It's ironic because the more China's opponents (US, EU, Japan, Korea- basically all regions that are hostile to China's rise in power) continue to press China on the matter of Tibet, Xinjiang, etc. the harder the PRC government is working to integrate those regions. Keep it coming.

[WoahZtong]

It's good for China to hold on to what it can I guess.

[House]

The dalai lama is the only one the tibetans might listen to, you need to convince the dalai to go against support for independence and let him return and tell the tibetans to stay a part of china. Also they don't care about modern living standards, just leave them with their traditional culture, not everybody needs to modernize.

I respectfully disagree.
The tail never wags the dog. Religion doens't drive politics, rather politics use religion to reign in the masses. Constantine became Christian to gain political control of the Roman Empire. European kings used the Catholic Church to maintain their power and when the Pope balked, Henry VIII created the Church of England which still "rules" the English. Likewise, the moment the Dalai Lama turns away from Tibetan independence, he will be replace by a "New" Dalai Lama.

Likewise, almost no one chooses a traditional pastoral life style when urbanization is available. How many Tree Huggers actually lives in the farms vs San Francisco, Seattle, and yes even New York City. There are more Tree Huggers in NYC than the entire State of Montana. Name me one country, any country in the entire world where there is a Urban fligt where too many people flee the urban cities to the countryside. Every country I know try to discourage the huge migration into the cities (including the US with the disappearance of the"Family Farm"). The vast majority of "enviromentalists" encourage others to live in rural areas while sitting in their downtown or suburban condos.

On a separate note, all the talk about Han culture eclispsing traditonal Tibetan culture. The biggest threat to traditional Tibetan culture is not Han (which in comparison to Western) is very close to Tibetan culture, but rather Western influences such as Hollywood, Rock Music/Hip Hop and of course the MOST distructive to traditional culture, The Intenet. If you want to preserve Tibetan Culture, ban the Internet and Hollywood.

This post has been edited by Tenjikuronin: Jun 9 2011, 12:07 PM

[retaxis]

the way you kids talk is exactly why Americans hate Chinese. You may think we real Chinese who grew up in China are a bunch of maniacs who care not for human lives. Its completely the opposite and Tibetans are an integral part of China. This thing is not about Han or Mongol or Hui or Tibetan as even the Han were once thousands of different ethnicities, its about China and we Chinese people are not a bunch of mongrels who kill other people and wipe them out over land.

And house, there is no such thing as Han culture. There in fact is no such thing as Han as you can see there are hundreds of different dialects and the food we eat, the language we speak, the way we dress, the way we look and etc are all different even within "hans". And even if there was culture, the cultural revolution ended all culture and further destruction of culture is not done by hans or non hans its done by the communist ideology.

[TruthDoesntHurt]

Yup, demographic assimilation.
More arrivals, and also more dispersal of Tibetans into other areas.
It's good also to rapidly bring modernization and urbanization and limit monasteries, because they can be academies of legionnaires of supporters of Religious Monarch.

[BigBenChow]

the way you kids talk is exactly why Americans hate Chinese. You may think we real Chinese who grew up in China are a bunch of maniacs who care not for human lives. Its completely the opposite and Tibetans are an integral part of China. This thing is not about Han or Mongol or Hui or Tibetan as even the Han were once thousands of different ethnicities, its about China and we Chinese people are not a bunch of mongrels who kill other people and wipe them out over land.

And house, there is no such thing as Han culture. There in fact is no such thing as Han as you can see there are hundreds of different dialects and the food we eat, the language we speak, the way we dress, the way we look and etc are all different even within "hans". And even if there was culture, the cultural revolution ended all culture and further destruction of culture is not done by hans or non hans its done by the communist ideology.

Why do you care what Americans thinks of China?

[Made in China]

Set Tibet up to be a Special Administrative Region (S.A.R.) like Hong Kong and Macau.

It's the same model that Beijing advocates for the reunification of the Taiwan problem.

Tibet will have retain a high degree of autonomy under the SAR model AND be under the rightful legitimacy of the PRC rule just like in HK and Macau.

Tibetans want to rule Tibetans, not by Chinese ppl (which is completely understandable)

Tibetans would MOST LIKELY accept SAR model over "unilateral declaration of independence" (which is not at all feasible at this point. Think of Taiwan!)

This post has been edited by Made in China: Sep 20 2009, 10:24 PM

[Suzuka00]

If tibet wants to be free then it's territories in india and those in china and bhutan must unite,as for now tibetans must support a SAR rule.

Bhutanese and Lhasans I heard are not in good terms.

This post has been edited by Suzuka00: Sep 21 2009, 08:24 AM

[cyberchina]

[size=3][size=2]The importance of Tibet to China cannot be underestimated. First, it is where most vital rivers in Asia

Does cultural assimilation of ethnic Tibetans into Chinese language, culture, etc., work to secure Tibet? No. Even if the ethnic Tibetans speak Chinese, practice Chinese custom, and feel that they are a citizen of China, they will choose self-determination and independence if given the chance.

Tibetans and Han chinese culture and religion are very similar. They're mostly based on Mahayana Buddhism.

Furthermore, they are both from the same ancestors in the Kunlun Mountains before they separated.
That's why their languages have similarities and belong to the Sino-tibetan language family.

Assimilation will be even easier than the assimilation of the Manchu in North-east China.

It's the wrong policies of the communist China that promote multi-ethnicities instead of assimilation that will break China apart .

[iamtwytia]

So, do you think the reason China does not want Tibet to become separate is because of the natural resources?

And can you guys explain to me why there's more publicity about Tibet, but not a lot about Xinjiang? One would think that the Uighurs were more different to Han Chinese, in comparison to Tibetans, considering they are Muslim.

[PKRussel]

There is more publicity cuz monks has more sympathy than muslims in Hollywood.