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[samsparky]

alHamdu lillaah in Indonesia there are many proofs and great scholars who form part of the link in the chain back to what the Prophet taught. There is also a strong opposition to extremists like wahhabis.

In Australia where I am, wahhabis are active but alHamdu lillaah there are people working against them and against other extremists who do not only kill non-Muslim civilian women and children but they also kill MUSLIMS.

Even a mufti from Malaysia came to visit us and talked about this topic.

See this: http://darulfatwa.org.au/content/view/816/142/

[samsparky]

Welcome, brother in Islam.

For more guidance of Islam online, I suggest you go to Islamonline.net. Arguably, its one of the best Islamic reference site for you. Besides, the famed ulema Sheikh Yusof Al-Qadharawi is the consultant for the site.

A simple search would show you that alqaradawi is being considered by scholars of Islam around the world as a heretic. Check this out:

http://amislam.com/qaradawi.htm

[samsparky]

Also,
I want to ask you all a question. How do you think that historians gather proofs about some of the past events they speak about such as wars etc.

Have you ever heard of primary sources being from the narration of a person who was there, who has been tested to be trustworthy and accurate, their story fits the puzzle and matches other people's narrations??

Or do you not believe anything any historian says?

[Protoculture]

A simple search would show you that alqaradawi is being considered by scholars of Islam around the world as a heretic.

A simple search will also shows you that Dr. Yusud Al-Qadharawi is highly respected & admired around the world, including by that MY Mufti, Datok Noh Gadot.

Dr Yusuf Al-Qadharawi is moderate Salaf, unlike the other Saudis Salaf ulemas. In fact, most Saudi ulemas considers Qadharawi with contempt bcos Qadharawi's views tend to favor 4 Sunni Schools, rather than conservative Salafist ideology (aka Saudi-Wahhabi brand).

Islamic religious authorities in Malaysia, Indonesia, Jordan, Egypt, UAE, Qatar, Kuwait, Morocco, Algeria, European Union, United States, Canada & even Australia consulted with Qadharawi. His ISLAMONLINE site is important for Islamic da'wah on the Net. He is one of the most progressive Ulema in this Age, most often compared to the late As-Shahidul Sheikh Hasan Al-Banna, another reformist ulema from Egypt.

The problem with some hardcore Sunnis is that they believed all Wahhabi aka Salafis are bad. Samsparky, that kind of opinion also led Sunnis labled Shia as unbelievers, much like Shiites accusing Sunnis as kufr. Or much the same when hardcore Saudist Wahhabi labled all Sunnis schools as wrong & committed unnecessay bid'ah (bid'ah hasanah notwisthstanding).

Remember, many Western reverts are moderate Salafs, still part of Sunnis, although refused to be affliated with any 4 Sunni schools of thought (aka madhab). Salafi movement are credited with da'wah all over Western world, which is a unifying factor to new reverts ummah there.

Just bcos some Salafs spoiled up, we put up blanket accusation to them all.

[Voyage]

Can I join.

Thanks.

[unattractiveguy]

I want to bomb this thread!!!!

[Jagger]

A simple search would show you that alqaradawi is being considered by scholars of Islam around the world as a heretic. Check this out:

http://amislam.com/qaradawi.htm

But why exactly does Al-Ash'ari label Al-Qadharawi as a kufr? The article hasn't even given any evidence to justify it. I thought it was haram to slander someone without evidence?

Also,
I want to ask you all a question. How do you think that historians gather proofs about some of the past events they speak about such as wars etc.

Have you ever heard of primary sources being from the narration of a person who was there, who has been tested to be trustworthy and accurate, their story fits the puzzle and matches other people's narrations??

Or do you not believe anything any historian says?

You're referring to the hadiths, right? The hadiths, or at least the sahih ones, are certainly far more reliable than most other ancient historical documents, but that doesn't necessarily make them infallible. If a hadith is mutawatir with multiple isnads, then there is no doubt that it extremely reliable. However, if a hadith, even if it's sahih, is not mutawatir, then there is a small possibility that it might not be true. In that case, I don't think there's anything wrong in having a little doubt, although it would be best to still follow them to be on the safe side. I'm not an expert on Islam, but that's just my opinion. If I've said anything wrong, maybe you could educate me a little more about it?

[samsparky]

A simple search will also shows you that Dr. Yusud Al-Qadharawi is highly respected & admired around the world, including by that MY Mufti, Datok Noh Gadot.

Dr Yusuf Al-Qadharawi is moderate Salaf, unlike the other Saudis Salaf ulemas. In fact, most Saudi ulemas considers Qadharawi with contempt bcos Qadharawi's views tend to favor 4 Sunni Schools, rather than conservative Salafist ideology (aka Saudi-Wahhabi brand).

Islamic religious authorities in Malaysia, Indonesia, Jordan, Egypt, UAE, Qatar, Kuwait, Morocco, Algeria, European Union, United States, Canada & even Australia consulted with Qadharawi. His ISLAMONLINE site is important for Islamic da'wah on the Net. He is one of the most progressive Ulema in this Age, most often compared to the late As-Shahidul Sheikh Hasan Al-Banna, another reformist ulema from Egypt.

The problem with some hardcore Sunnis is that they believed all Wahhabi aka Salafis are bad. Samsparky, that kind of opinion also led Sunnis labled Shia as unbelievers, much like Shiites accusing Sunnis as kufr. Or much the same when hardcore Saudist Wahhabi labled all Sunnis schools as wrong & committed unnecessay bid'ah (bid'ah hasanah notwisthstanding).

Remember, many Western reverts are moderate Salafs, still part of Sunnis, although refused to be affliated with any 4 Sunni schools of thought (aka madhab). Salafi movement are credited with da'wah all over Western world, which is a unifying factor to new reverts ummah there.

Just bcos some Salafs spoiled up, we put up blanket accusation to them all.

Look,

When I speak about a radical person or radical group, I speak about their core teachings.

Those who claim to be salafis and those who are wahhabis are taught by people who believe that God has a shape, form and place. Anyone who believes that is not only non-sunniyy but also not Muslim.

One of the basic beliefs of Muslims is that God does not resemble the creations. (Surat ash-shura, Verse 11).

God exists and His Existence is unlike the existence of the creations. He Existed before all creations existed (including place) and after creating them He does not change. The imagination does not conceive Him because he is not attributed with attributes of the creations like size, shape, colour, and place.

When I accuse wahhabis of being not Muslim, I am accusing about 2 million people because they went astray. But when they accuse the whole Muslim nation of being non-Muslim, they are accusing hundreds of millions of Muslims of having gone astray. There is a big difference between my accusation and their accusation.

As for al-qaradaawi, he is considered as radical because of his radical fatwas. For example, he says that it is halal to eat a choked chicken and that is clearly against the Qur'aan. He also comes up with sayings that are against the ijmaa^ (scholarly consensus) which categorises him as radical.

[samsparky]

But why exactly does Al-Ash'ari label Al-Qadharawi as a kufr? The article hasn't even given any evidence to justify it. I thought it was haram to slander someone without evidence?
You're referring to the hadiths, right? The hadiths, or at least the sahih ones, are certainly far more reliable than most other ancient historical documents, but that doesn't necessarily make them infallible. If a hadith is mutawatir with multiple isnads, then there is no doubt that it extremely reliable. However, if a hadith, even if it's sahih, is not mutawatir, then there is a small possibility that it might not be true. In that case, I don't think there's anything wrong in having a little doubt, although it would be best to still follow them to be on the safe side. I'm not an expert on Islam, but that's just my opinion. If I've said anything wrong, maybe you could educate me a little more about it?

Al-Qaradawi was scrutinized after he wrote his books in which he clarified his views. He also has recordings.

If you know Arabic, this contains his voice:

http://www.shiyat.com/play.php?vid=1972

It is proof that he has said that the Prophet makes mistakes in matters of Islamic rulings.

In Islam, it is an obligation to warn against those who misguide people.

Be Warned from the following Devious Misguided Sects/People

Bismillaah, praise be to Allah the lord of the worlds, the most-powerful, the creator of all the creations, the one who is not a body or form and has no beginning and the one who exists without a place, I ask Allah to raise the rank of our beloved prophet and leader, Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him.

Know that the prophet peace be upon him said what means “whomever amongst you sees a Munkar let him change it by his hand, if he was unable, then by his tongue, if he was unable then by his heart and that is the least that one can do”. Related by Muslim.

Many individuals emerged with extreme misconceptions and decided to form groups of their own, in which they started to oppose the religion of Islam. We are obligated in Islam to warn against such groups for opposing Islam. Among those extreme groups:

1. The Wahabis (followers of Ahmad Ibn Taymiah and Muhammad bin Abdul-Wahhab). They liken Allaah to His creations, they believe that Allaah is a physical body with physical organs, and they consider visiting the Prophet and seeking blessings from his traces as shirk.

2. Hizbul-Ikhwan, a group who deviated from its founder Sheikh Hassan al-Banna and followed the extremist Sayid Qutub. They believe that anyone who deals with the government even in the slightest matter is a blasphemer mushrik and should be killed. One must be warned also from fatwas of:

Al-Qaradawi: He claims that the Prophet makes mistakes in Islamic teachings. He follows Wahhabis in some issues, and is in love with Sayid qutub and his extreme beliefs. He has many fatwas that breached the Ijma^ of Ahlus-Sunnah.

3. Hizbut-Tahreer (Followers of Taqiyud-Deen an-Nabahaniy). They deem anyone that commits any large sin as a blasphemer, and they claim that the people are creators on their own; that they create whatever they do.

One must be warned from those who claim to be sufis and oppose the true sufi fundamentals. Those who oppose the explicit text of al-Qur’an and the teachings of the Prophet peace be upon him such as al-Hululiyah and al-Qadariyah and others such as:

Hassan Qatirjiy: Follows Sayid Qutub in his extreme beliefs. Claims that no matter how many times one curses Allah, he is still a Muslim as long as he does not choose another religion. He claims that Women must cover their faces otherwise they are enormous sinners. Calls for extreme beliefs that permits the killing of Muslims for following the local governments even in the smallest maters.

Khaled al-Jundiy: He says that there’s no harm in choosing any religion, and the one who wants to apostate is most welcome. He claims that there’s not such thing as al-Qur’an is a cure. He claims that a non pious Muslim does not benefit from the Qur’an. He claimed that Allah dwells in things, and that Allah resides in a direction. He accused Prophet Ibrahim with shirk (associating partner to Allah) and other blasphemous beliefs.

Muhammad al-Buti: claims Allah dwells in things, and that Allah is a body and that souls are attached to Allah, and accuses the Prophet with doubt in his prophethood, and that it’s permissible to watch pornography.

And one must be warned from those called Munirah Qubaysi and Muhammad Ameen Sheikho and Ahmad Hassoon and Muhammad Rajab Deeb as they collect money by the name of Islam and issue fatwas that oppose the Ijma^ of Ahlus-Sunnah.

Nazim al-Qubrusliy: Claims to be the head of sufis and sultan of 'Awliya' today. He has many sayings that oppose al-Qur'an and the hadith. He opposes the true meaning of Sufism. He and his misguided sheikh ad-Daghistaniy claims that his people could be better than the Prophets. They believe that Allah dwells in the creations (wal-^iadhubillah) which is kufur to belief. He claimed that it's permissible for him to look at the nakedness of the woman. This is not Islam nor sufism.

The Yashrutiyah Shadhiliyah: It’s said that they claim to follow Sheikh Aliy Noorud-Deen al-Yashrutiy from Tunisia who lived in ^akka, Palestine. He had followers, some of them deviated during his life and so he disowned them. They claim that Allah dwells in everyone, male or female. They claim Allah is in everything, in fact one said to other you are Allah, this wall is Allah.. this is severe blasphemy. Allah is clear of dwelling in things, and from things dwelling in him, Allaah has no shape or limit or body, Allaah exists without a place. Sheikh Ali Noorud-Deen, Allah guided by him some people. But the others misguided, those Yashrutiyah when they gather men and women they shake hands of the marrigable woman and they say: We are the sufi people of Tariqah, they deemed a haram matter as halal wal^iyathubillah. A women among them said: I move my hand because Allah is in it. They are disbelievers.

The Tijaniyah: It was said that Abul-^abbas at-Tijani during the occupation of morocco, his Tariqah was changed and perverted between his followers. it’s possible that he is not like them, it’s possible that they are like the Yashrutiyah. They have a statement they say “O Allah raise the rank of the prophet the one who is really You” they claim that Muhammad is Allah Himself wal^iyathubillah. They claim they are sufies, they claim that anyone who takes their Tariqah becomes better then the Qutub Waliy. They sit in a circle and recite their Wird and claim that the prophet sits with them. They have other strange false beliefs.

The Dandrawiyah: The origin of it is correct, but those who follow it now they have perverted ideas. Abul-^abbas ad-Dandrawiy was Egyptian, he was not like the Dandrawiyah today. Those are lost, they don’t know Islam, they say: “O Allah raise the rank of every creation and their creations” this is blasphemy, they claim that creations create. Al-Qur’an says what means: “Allah is the creator of everything”. So there’s no creator other than Allah. Strange, these people read al-Qur’an and oppose it.

The Burhaniyah: Their sheikh is Ibrahim al-Burhaniy, was a bank agent, and then claimed to follow the Sufi Tariqah. He shakes hands of marriageable women, and women kiss his hand. Both matters are forbidden in Islam. They have a book called: “Awrad of al-Burhani Tariqah” on page 30/31 they say: “Allah inhabits the creations, and it’s possible for the slave to dwell in Allah” we seek refuge by Allah from this kufur. This Tariqah is not from the Tariqahs of the true sufies, in fact true sufies warn people against it.


There are other sufi claimers who have false beliefs. Like those who claim that the prophet knows everything that Allah knows, or the ones who say that Prophet Muhammad is inhuman, and that he is physical light. This belies the Qur’an and the teachings of the Prophet. The Prophet peace be upon him said: “I only know what Allah conveys onto me”. Beware from those who claim to be sufis and oppose the Qur’an and the Sunnah of the prophet peace be upon him.

We ask Allah to protect us from misguidance and keep us stead fast on Islam.


As for the Sahih Hadeeth, every person who is in the chain of narration is described. The people who narrated the Prophet's sayings were even classified according to their reliability, forgetfulness, etc.

So no one has an excuse to declare a Sahih Hadeeth as weak. There are weak Hadeeths where one of the narrators for example might have been forgetful.

Get what I'm trying to say?

[Protoculture]

Get what I'm trying to say?

You only show differentiation & opinionated views of current ulemas. Even Al-Albani & Al-Qadharawi, despite both being of Salafs, strongly disagree with each other.

But differing views has always been the facets of Sunnis since Islam grew, post Khulafak ur Rashiddeen era. Before Saudi Arabia was even a nation, the Muslims on Hajj once prayed to Kaaba according to their own Imams - which means eg, Zuhur prayer was conducted 4 times to cater to 4 different madhabs (Shafie / Hanbali / Maliki / Hanafi).

The Wahhabis (aka the Saudi Salafists) is still considered as part of Sunnis, as they cleverly claimed theirs of Maliki madhab. But learned Muslims know better.

As for moderate Salafists, well, they're on the rise now. As most Muslims becoming knowledgeable, some of them feel that why must they blindly follow a particular Sunni madhab. This current thinking is a driving factor in garnering new reverts & credited with blossoming of Muslim da'wa in Western world. In Asia, moderate Salafs are a little bit different from their Western counterpart, they still cling to their respective madhabs, but ditching unnecessary traditions (bidaah hasanah). For eg, in Malaysia, one can still be a proud Muslim whose taqleed is Shafie, but still clings to Salafist ideals.

[samsparky]

al-Qaradawi and al-Albani are far from being classed as from the Salaf. The Salaf are those who lived in the first 300 years after the Prophet's migration.

If you read Arabic, here is a book that has been published about alQaradaawi: http://www.sunna.info/qardawi/

and al albani is a wahhabi so of course alqaradawi and al albani would differ.

By the way, the wahhabis claim to follow Imaam ahmad ibn Hanbal despite the fact that Imaam ahmad ibn Hanbal said what means: "Whoever claims that Allaah is a body (even if he adds) not like other bodies is a blasphemer" as related about him in the famous Hanbaliyy book "al-KhiSaal".

Wahhabis as well as those who claim to be salafis are classed as mujassimah and takfeeris. That is, they consider God to be a body and they also consider all those Muslims who do not follow them as blasphemers.

It is said that the one who does not have an Imaam, then the devil will be his imaam.

Those who claim to be salafis these days are not moderate. They are the ones suicide bombing Muslims and non-Muslims in both Islamic and non-Islamic countries because of their ideology that all those who do not follow them are blasphemers.

Check this out:

Sunnis against extremism: http://darulfatwa.org.au/content/view/81/142/

http://darulfatwa.org.au/content/view/85/140/

[Protoculture]

Samsparky, I beg to differ. It seems here we've different opinions regarding the Salafists movement.

We can always agree to disagree regarding Al-Qadharawi, because he is a respected figure in Malaysia within Islamic establishments, especially in academic circles.

I consider myself as a staunch Sunni whose taqleed is Shafie, but with Salafi ideals.

[samsparky]

Samsparky, I beg to differ. It seems here we've different opinions regarding the Salafists movement.

We can always agree to disagree regarding Al-Qadharawi, because he is a respected figure in Malaysia within Islamic establishments, especially in academic circles.

I consider myself as a staunch Sunni whose taqleed is Shafie, but with Salafi ideals.

If you want to know about the opinion of Malaysians in general about al-Qaradawi then do yourself a favour and step out of the outlets of the group who call themselves jama^ah islaamiyyah or JI and find out what true scholars say about al-qaradawi, the ones who don't really go on tv much.

The people who call themselves salafi today are not sunniyy, they are wahhabi mujassima (they think God is a body).

I would like to share an article with you.

[samsparky]

The Verses of the Qur'aan

Surat Al-^Imran, Verse 7 means:



[Allah is the One Who has sent down to the Prophet the Book that contains muhkam Verses, which are the foundation of the Book, and other Verses which are mutashabih. Those who have perversity in their hearts, follow the mutashabih Verses, seeking discord and searching for unbefitting meanings based on their delusions. No one knows their true meanings except Allah and those who are firmly rooted in the knowledge of the Religion. The latter {i.e, those firmly rooted in the knowledge} say: "We believe in it, all of it is from our Lord" and none will understand the message, except the men of comprehension.]




So, know firmly that whoever says God is a seated body with hands, face and shin is for sure not interpreting the Qur'aan correctly and has perversity in their heart.







The Qur'an contains two types of Verses:


1. Muhkam Verses: These are the ayahs (verses) that, according to the rules of the Arabic language, have only one meaning or are those with a clear meaning. Examples of this type of Verse are:





Surat ash-Shura, Verse 11 which means: [There is absolutely nothing like Allah],





Surat al-Ikhlas, Verse 4 which means: [Nothing is equal to Him], and





Surat Maryam Verse 65 which means: [Do you know of anything which is similar to Him? There is none.]


2. Mutashabih Verses: These are the Verses that, according to the rules of the Arabic language, can have many meanings. Assigning acceptable meanings to these Verses requires proper Knowledge of the Arabic Language and thorough thinking. Examples of this type of Verse are:
Surat Taha, Verse 5 and Surat Fatir, Verse 10. According to the rules of the Arabic language, these Verses are mutashabih; so they can have many meanings. Assigning meanings to them must be done in a manner which complies with the Arabic language and the Religion. The assigned meanings must not contradict the Verses that are muhkam. Surely, the Verses of the Qur'an do not contradict one another! Likewise, the hadiths (sayings of the Prophet, sallallahu ^alayhi wa sallam,) neither contradict one another, nor the Verses of the Qur'an.




There are two methodologies for explaining the mutashabih Verses of the Qur'an, and both of them are valid. They are:









1. The Methodology of the Salaf: The Salaf were the scholars who lived during the first three centuries after the Hijrah (Immigration) of the Prophet, sallallahu ^alayhi wa sallam. Most often, this methodology consisted of giving general explanations, since the scholars of the Salaf believed that these Verses have meanings befitting to the perfection of Allah. Rather than saying what these meanings are, they referred these mutashabih Verses to the muhkam Verses. A good example is the saying of Imam ash-Shafi^iyy which means:



"I believe in what Allah revealed according to the meaning that Allah willed, and in what the Messenger of Allah conveyed according to the meaning that the Messenger of Allah willed."

In other words, the proper befitting meanings are not according to the sensuous and physical meanings that delusions would lead to, such as places, shapes, limbs, movements, sitting, colors, directions, smiling, laughing, or any other meanings which are not permissible to be attributed to Allah.

Furthermore, the Arabs during the first three Hijriyy centuries spoke the Arabic language with a natural disposition and great eloquence. Their understanding of its meanings was so sharp that they did not need to attribute specific meanings to the mutashabih Verses. Instead, they understood that these Verses have meanings that befit Allah, and that it is impossible that they would have sensuous and physical meanings which do not befit Allah.

Nevertheless, it is well known that some of the scholars of the Salaf did attribute specific meanings to mutashabih Verses. In his Sahih, in the chapter Tafsirul- Qur'an (Explanation of the Qur'an,) Imam al-Bukhariyy attributed a specific meaning to the term "illa wajhahu" in Surat al-Qasas, Verse 88. He said: "illa mulkahu," i.e., he said that word "wajh", which is an attribute of Allah, means "Mulk" or "Dominion." Note that he did not say that it means Allah has a face as those with perversity in their hearts say.






2. The Methodology of the Khalaf: The Khalaf were the scholars who lived after the first three centuries after the Hijrah. For the most part, this methodology consisted of giving specific meanings to the mutashabih Verses. The scholars of the Khalaf lived at a time when the people started to lose their natural disposition for the Arabic language. Seeing that the people had become weaker in the language, the scholars of the Khalaf feared that those with perversity in their hearts would read meanings into the mutashabih Verses which do not befit Allah. They feared what is mentioned in Surat Al-^Imran, Verse 7 above. In order to protect the creed of Islam, the scholars of the Khalaf followed the example of the scholars of the Salaf who gave specific meanings to the mutashabih Verses. Referring them to the muhkam Verses, they gave specific meanings to the mutashabih Verses in compliance with the language and with the Religion. They gave correct, acceptable meanings to the mutashabih Verses.


Among those who have perversity in their hearts are the mushabbihah, those who liken Allah to His creation. The followers of Ibn Taymiyah and Muhammad Ibn ^Abdil-Wahhab are among the group of the mushabbihah. They falsely claim that it is prohibited to assign specific meanings to the mutashabih Verses and especially to those that pertain to the attributes of God. Moreover, they innovated a devilish rule which states that assigning specific meanings to the Verses would lead to cancelling these attributes of God. Their claim leads to interpretations of the Verses of the Qur'an that contradict one another. It leads to interpretations of the hadiths of the Prophet that contradict one another and contradict the Verses of the Qur'an. Furthermore, their claim accuses the Islamic scholars of the Salaf and the Khalaf of denying the attributes of God. Such scholars include: Ibn ^Abbas, Sufyan ath-Thawriyy, Mujahid, Sa^id Ibn Jubayr, Malik, Ahmad, al-Bukhariyy, an-Nawawiyy, Ibn Rajab al-Hanbaliyy, Ibn-ul-Jawziyy, Ibn Hajar al-^Asqalaniyy, al-Bayhaqiyy, Abul-Fadl at-Tamimiyy, ^Abdul-Qahir al-Baghdadiyy, the linguist and scholar of Hadith Murtada az-Zabidiyy, and others.



If one were to interpret the mutashabih Verses and hadiths literally, one would be claiming that Allah moves up and down through the skies while sitting on the ^Arsh and encircling the creations. This is clearly unbefitting of Allah, the One Who does not resemble the creations in any way and is not contained by directions or place .


Rest assured that the methodologies of both the Salaf and the Khalaf are correct and neither attribute anything to Allah that does not befit Him.

In simple terms, the first correct way of explaining the mutashabih Verses in the Qur'an is to say that one believes in them according to the meaning that Allah willed without saying what that meaning is; and without a ‘how,' i.e., without attributing to Allah sitting, standing, occupying places, sensuous attributes, or any of the meanings that apply to humans and other creations. Following this method, one would say: "Allah has an istiwa' which befits Him, which is not sitting, and Allah has a yad which befits Him, which is not a hand, and a wajh that befits Him, which is not a face." One cannot interpret the word saq as shin. Not one meaning for the word shin in the English language is appropiate to attribute to Allah.

The second correct way of explaining the mutashabih Verses in the Qur'an is to give to them specific meanings, which are in
accordance with the Religion and the language. Following this method, one would say: "Allah's istiwa' means 'He preserves the throne,' Allah's yad means ‘Allah's Care,' and Allah's wajh means ‘Allah's Self,' ‘Allah's Dominion,' or ‘Allah's Qiblah.'"

May Allah protect us from falling into the trap of likening Allah to His creation. Imam Abu Ja^far at-Tahawiyy, in his book Al-^Aqidatut-Tahawiyyah, said what means:


"Whoever attributes to Allah a human characteristic commits blasphemy."




Beware of books that are claimed to be interpretations of the Qur'aan, or translations of its meanings and in which Allah, the Exalted, is likened to His creation, by attributing to Him light, hands, eyes, shins, faces, sitting, directions, places, and the like. Allah is clear of all imperfection and of any resemblance to the creation.


Praise be to Allah the Lord of the Worlds, the One Who is clear of resembling the creation, all non-befitting attributes, and all which the blasphemers unrightfully say about Him.

[Nefer]

Asalama Alaikum waramatulahi wabarakatuhu.

When I first saw this thread I thought mashallah I would really like to join but it seems that you guys are very anti-salafi?

Why is this?

Also what is this myth surrounding 'Wahabism'?

Alhamduliah I follow the Salafi dawah and I'd be happy to clear the misconceptions.

Also please note that we do not follow Shiekh ul Islam ibn Abdul Wahab Rahemahu'Allah nor Ibn Taymiyya rather we follow that on which they are right in e.g. Quran and Sunnah and we reject that in which they erred, we follow the Sunnnah of the Messenger or Allah sallahu alyewasalam literally upon the Interpretations of the Salafus Saleh meaning the The Messenger and his Companions May Allah be pleased with them.

This post has been edited by Nefer: Mar 5 2009, 07:57 AM

[Nefer]

Ibn Taymiyya likening Allah to his creation...acudubillah indeed you utter a great lie akhii Ibn Taymiyya have refuted the likes of you hundreds of years ago, inshallah bring me proof where he is likening Allah to his creation, He is merely acknowleding the third category of Tawheed which is Asma was siffat (names and attributes of Allah) and whoever rejects this then he/she has become a disbeliever.

[samsparky]

Believing in the Attributes of God such as Yad means believing that Allaah is Attributed with Yad without a how. It is NOT believing that Allaah is Attributed with a physical hand, as the wahhabis of today claim. The word Yad which was used in the Qur'aan has many many meanings - ONE of which is a physical hand. True Muslims choose the correct meaning of Yad when speaking about Allaah, so they do not choose to attribute a body or body parts to Allaah.

wa 3alaikum assalaam wa RaHmatullaahi wa Barakaatuh

The wahhabis of today call themselves salafis and try to say that wahabism is a myth. They follow the teachings of muhammad ibn abdulwahhaab and ahmad ibn taymiyah despite the rejection of these 2 figures by the authorities of the Muslim nation of their times.

This post has been edited by samsparky: Mar 7 2009, 04:35 AM

[samsparky]

In the chapter, Tafsirul-Qur'an, (Explanation of the Qur'an), Imam al-Bukhariyy says that the term wajhahu in Surat al-Qasas, ayah 88, means "His Dominion." However, the mushabbihah who liken Allah to His creation say: "We do not interpret, but rather we go by the literal meaning," and hence (they say) wajhahu means "His face."

That is just one example out of many that I can give you.

And Allaah Knows best

This post has been edited by samsparky: Mar 7 2009, 04:37 AM

[Nefer]

In the chapter, Tafsirul-Qur'an, (Explanation of the Qur'an), Imam al-Bukhariyy says that the term wajhahu in Surat al-Qasas, ayah 88, means "His Dominion." However, the mushabbihah who liken Allah to His creation say: "We do not interpret, but rather we go by the literal meaning," and hence (they say) wajhahu means "His face."

That is just one example out of many that I can give you.

And Allaah Knows best

You are wrong akhii I follow the salafi manhaj and I do not say this neither does Ibn Taymiyya or any other scholar who follows the correct and saved sect.

Where is the proof that Ibn Taymiyya or any salafi's claim this?

We affirm the names and attributes but without likening it to the creation so we say yes Allah subhana'wataala has a hand, a face etc but nothing like the human form we accept these attributes without likening them to the creation.

This lie about the Dawah us Sallafiyya has existed many centuries and funny enough no one has actually asked the salafi's themselves in regards to this matter but lie and claim things we do not do.

Inshallah Sam if you can provide me with the daleel that actually says that the saved sect likens Allah to his creation then I would like to see it as you know in Islam everything is judged by daleel rather than assumption.

And please refrain from using the term Wahabi as that is offensive and as salafi's are the only ones who follow the sunnah according to the Messenger sallahu aleywasalam and the 3 pious generations which were the best.

For more info please do not hesistate to ask

[samsparky]

You said it yourself. People like you (1 million or so compared to the hundreds of millions of Muslims who do not follow your way) say that Allaah has a hand instead of saying Allaah is Attributed with Yad.

Yad in Arabic has more than just 1 meaning. It can mean care, power and many other meanings.

People like you say Yad means hand when talking about Allaah. Why? Because people like you believe that God is a body - in contrast to the hundreds of millions of Muslims who say Allaah is not a body.

The hundreds of millions of Muslims are the saved ones - not some group that consists of 1 or 2 million and believes that all who do not follow them are not saved.