Tale of two Mongolias: Chinese occupied Inner Mongolia versus Democrat, this is an interesting article about Mongolia versus Inner Mongolia Options

[newties21]

I do not mind if Mongolian nationalists have a special attention towards their southern flank or even always trashing their southern neighbours in order to emphasize their own sovereignty, independence, and superiority.

I do not mind it.

Just I dont understand one thing.

How can they be so deluded to think that Mongolia Republic is indeed sovereign, independent, and superior, when the evidence says that even today Putin is controlling it ?

I just dont understand this contradiction.

Maybe it is too difficult to grasp and tackle, and thus this topic is totally bypassed ?

[baasiddeghuja]

We-Mongolians never ever sold our souls to the Russians! On the contrary, we allied with the Russians to fend off the Chinese aggression! The enemy of your enemy is your friend! We used the Russian military might to defend our country against Chinese and Japanese aggressions! Remember, Mongolia was the ally of the Soviet Union from the first day of the Great Patriotic war - June 22, 1941! And Mongolian Army together with the Soviet Red Army defeated the mighty Japanese Kwantong Army and liberated Manchuria, Inner Mongolia, and Northern China from Japanese occupation! The Chinese owe their lives and country to Soviet and Mongolians armies that liberated them from Japanese genocide!

Mongolia is a successful democracy. Therefore, different people and politicians have slightly different approaches in public policy. Most importantly, Mongolian politicians are under very heavy media and electoral pressure to perform. But all-Mongolian people and politicians are united in our foreign policy: The main threat to Mongolia is China but not Russia. Therefore, most Mongolians are happy to work with the Russians who built the entire Mongolian infrastructure in the 1950-80s, and left Mongolia when Mongolia became democratic. In contrast, look at what is going on in Tibet, Inner Mongolia, and Xinjaing - millions of and millions of Chinese immigrants move into these regions and settle there FOREVER unless they are kicked out!

What is wrong to enjoy Dostoevsky, Tolstoi, or Turgenev writings? What is wrong to listen to Tsaikovsky, Prokop'ev, and Shostakovich music? These are world cultural heritage created by talented Russians!

Sure, Mongolia is building another railway line to connect Southern Gobi with Russian regions to access the Russian ports. Through this Mongolia wants to export copper, gold, coal, rare earht, and so on to Japan, Korea, and US market! The Chinese have proven to be unreliable! Therefore, Mongolian public supports this government plan although it is much more expensive than sending coal to Japan through China-Tianjin.


Another advantage Mongolia enjoys over China is our leaders' education, experience, and youthful energy. For example, our President Tsahia Elbegdorj (48 years old), who is an oirat Mongolian from Hovd, is a graduate of the Military Academy in L'vov, now Ukrains, and Harvard University's Kennedy school of Government (completed Master's in public and development economics). He is fluent in three foreign languages: English, Russian, and Ukrainian. In contrast, Chinese Hu or Xi studied water engineering and marxism, mao philosophy at Tsinghua University. Both do not speak any foreign languages.

The list can go on and on! Our prime-minister is a graduate of London Business School, our Speaker is a graduate of Humboltd University in Berlin, our top female politician earned PhD in nuclear physics from the University of Cambridge in England!

Thus, we-Mongolians have very global approach to everything.Therefore, we do not kow tow to any one including Russians. But we-Mongolians in general like and trust Russians because it is the Russians who helped us most when we had hard time. In contrast, Uighurs and Inner Mongolians did not ask Russia to help, but relied on the Chinese, and ended up losing their country, culture, resources, and women to the millions of Chinese immigrants!

Who was right here - The Mongolians who relied upon the Russians, or Tibetans, Uighurs, and Inner Mongolians who relied upon the Chinese?

The nationalists kill people every where including Russia, or China, or Mongolia! But they are tiny minority!

But isnt Republic Mongolia is even worse in terms of protecting Mongolian people's true interests ?
Because why have the leadership willingly sold their souls to Moscow, ever since the day they got independent, until today ?
Isnt it worse because they are supposed to be independent and supposed to control their own affairs, but they not only failed to do so, but they have willingly bowed down in front of the Russians ?

I think they even adopt Russian letters, Russian-style buildings and architectures, and even Russian music.
Even now when I visit YouTube and I click to listen to Serebro (which is a nice group) and Dima Bilan, sometimes I see Mongolian clip on the side thumbnails and I click them, and I am shocked because I can see they just follow Russian style contemporary pop.

That makes me suspicious whether Mongolia Republic is really an independent country or actually they are just like those Ukraine, Bellarusia, Kazakhstan, those types.

Even makes me sadder is that the news that sometimes Russian nationalists stab Mongolian students.

Makes me sad.

I believe before you channel your energy and focus on the southern area, try to focus on the internal domestic problem first.
Didnt you read the news recently that Mongolian Railways made a renewal deal with Russian Railways, if I am not wrong Russian Railways control lands and the machines and the operations of Mongolian trains.
I often see these types of news, about railways, power supply, etc, which make me have the impression that Mongolia Republic even until today is still under the control of Moscow and still bow down to Putin.

Sad.

[RheeSan21]

And Mongolian Army together with the Soviet Red Army defeated the mighty Japanese Kwantong Army and liberated Manchuria, Inner Mongolia, and Northern China from Japanese occupation! The Chinese owe their lives and country to Soviet and Mongolians armies that liberated them from Japanese genocide!

Excuse me, but is you really know how Mongols is being treated by Russian military?
We is subordinate. Even if Russia was make alliance with Mongolian military in WW2, guess who was command all the battles? Certainly not yellow people.
Russians only use you as foot soldier for their fighting. Is what they do for long history with all Asiatic people close to them. China has no debt to Mongolia for free them. It was RUSSIA who chase Japan from Manchuria. Mongols did not even having their own weapons. It was all from Soviets, and like I say, they was only play role of footsoldier. Russians can easily beat Japanese without your help. They is having enough of their own Altaic and Siberian troops to do this kind of dirty work.

This post has been edited by RheeSan21: Feb 22 2012, 09:43 AM

[CRYPT]

Lmao. This guy is full of $hit. The Russians and Mongolians did not even fight the Japanese at all during WWII. Why do you think the Russians DECLARED WAR on Japan AFTER Germany was defeated?

The Mongolians were collaborating with the Japanese under a puppet regime. Mongolians were also subordinate to the Soviets. Khorloogiin Choibalsan wanted to take Inner Mongolia and parts of China back, but Stalin would not let him. the Mongolians who did fight the Japanese fought under a Russian banner.

Chinese do not owe Mongolians anything since Mongolians collaborated with Japanese. Even China built Mongolia after WWII. They built apartment buildings and provided labor, like
the 120 myangat district. Russia on the other hand killed many buddhists and began political purges.

Who cares if your politicians speak multiple languages? That's what translators are for.

Mongolians are sore losers so they resort to sucking Russia's d!ck. Russia does not even care about them anymore.

This post has been edited by CRYPT: Feb 22 2012, 10:02 AM

[baasiddeghuja]

Russian politicians do not have direct influences on Mongolian politics. Sure, Mongolia is dependent on oil imports from Russia because Mongolian crude is inferior to Siberian crude. Moreover, it is for us cheaper to import than drilling and processing oil in Mongolia. Even here, Mongolia just started building oil and gas processing plant that can satisfy easily the needs of 2.8 million people.

However, many Mongolian politicians have very good personal relationships with many leading Russian politicians including Vladimir Putin and Medvedev! Would you believe that Mongolia's Minister for infrastructure, transport, and telecom three times wrestled with Putin in late 1970s when he was a member of the judo team of the Soviet KGB? Therefore, they are very good friends who know each other for more than 30 years!

Lastly, Mongolia has only two neighbors: Russia and China. Therefore, when China is a real threat to your country (Look at how Tibetans, Uighurs and Inner Mongolians are suffering under the Chinese control) you have no choice but to cooperate with the Russians. Both Mongolia and Russia make mutual consessions. This is normal in world diplmacy!

I do not mind if Mongolian nationalists have a special attention towards their southern flank or even always trashing their southern neighbours in order to emphasize their own sovereignty, independence, and superiority.

I do not mind it.

Just I dont understand one thing.

How can they be so deluded to think that Mongolia Republic is indeed sovereign, independent, and superior, when the evidence says that even today Putin is controlling it ?

I just dont understand this contradiction.

Maybe it is too difficult to grasp and tackle, and thus this topic is totally bypassed ?

[CRYPT]

Russian politicians do not have direct influences on Mongolian politics. Sure, Mongolia is dependent on oil imports from Russia because Mongolian crude is inferior to Siberian crude. Moreover, it is for us cheaper to import than drilling and processing oil in Mongolia. Even here, Mongolia just started building oil and gas processing plant that can satisfy easily the needs of 2.8 million people.

However, many Mongolian politicians have very good personal relationships with many leading Russian politicians including Vladimir Putin and Medvedev! Would you believe that Mongolia's Minister for infrastructure, transport, and telecom three times wrestled with Putin in late 1970s when he was a member of the judo team of the Soviet KGB? Therefore, they are very good friends who know each other for more than 30 years!

Lastly, Mongolia has only two neighbors: Russia and China. Therefore, when China is a real threat to your country (Look at how Tibetans, Uighurs and Inner Mongolians are suffering under the Chinese control) you have no choice but to cooperate with the Russians. Both Mongolia and Russia make mutual consessions. This is normal in world diplmacy!

I don't see how Tibetans, Uighurs, and Mongolians are suffering under China? Their population is increasing and they speak their own langauge and write their own language. In Mongolia, the older generation has forgotten how to write in traditional script. They write using the cyrillic alphabet now.

Mongolia has to choose to assimilate between Russia or China. It is inevitable. So I don't care if China is a threat to Mongolia.

[RheeSan21]

Mongolians are sore losers so they resort to sucking Russia's d!ck. Russia does not even care about them anymore.

Russia was never care about them. Like I say in last post, they is only use Mongol people like puppets.

[Flowerseed]

Whatever, in the end mongolians who hold chinese passport still outnumber "true" mongolians citizen of outer mongolia by far.

[baasiddeghuja]

You are right! Tibetans, Uighurs and Inner Mongolians in China are so "happy" that they protest against the Chinese rule often, and many Tibetan monks and nuns self-immolate because they live in "China-heaven"! The number of Tibetans who self-immolated is reaching 30, and counting!

Do you know that one-third of Inner Mongolians do not speak Mongolian? This is the result of forced assimilation. But Inner Mongolians like Tibetans and Uighurs started to fight back! The last summer's large demonstrations in Inner Mongolia is the just beginning!

We-Mongolians think that we have nothing to do with the Chinese who eat dog -domesticated brother of Wolf, the totem of Mongolians, and therefore, we will stay away from the Chinese! So far so good, we are succeeding.

Do you know that Ulan-Bator is the only capital city in Asia that does NOT have a China-town? Even Kazakhstan's Astana, Kyrgyz capital - Bishkek, and Dushanbe - Tadjik capital have China-towns. In the 1950-80s, many thousand Chinese were kicked out of Mongolia!

So, we-Mongolians are building a bright future based on democracy, human rights, and strong economy!

I don't see how Tibetans, Uighurs, and Mongolians are suffering under China? Their population is increasing and they speak their own langauge and write their own language. In Mongolia, the older generation has forgotten how to write in traditional script. They write using the cyrillic alphabet now.

Mongolia has to choose to assimilate between Russia or China. It is inevitable. So I don't care if China is a threat to Mongolia.

[oolong]

Mongolia is defacto Russia's vassal state.

[baasiddeghuja]

Mongolia was a member of the Soviet block together with Soviet Union, Hungary, Poland, East Germany, Czechoslavakia, Bulgaria, Romania, Vietnam, North Korea, Cuba, and a few others. Soviet Union and the Warsaw Pact defended Mongolia against China, and therefore, Mongolia was dependent on the security matters from the Soviet Union.

North Korea is the true vassal state of China: China keeps financing the North Korean elite that kills their own people through famine, disease, execution and torture! In this sense, China's support of the North Korean bankrupt regime is an evil act against the Korean people!

Mongolia is defacto Russia's vassal state.

[CRYPT]

Mongolia was a member of the Soviet block together with Soviet Union, Hungary, Poland, East Germany, Czechoslavakia, Bulgaria, Romania, Vietnam, North Korea, Cuba, and a few others. Soviet Union and the Warsaw Pact defended Mongolia against China, and therefore, Mongolia was dependent on the security matters from the Soviet Union.

North Korea is the true vassal state of China: China keeps financing the North Korean elite that kills their own people through famine, disease, execution and torture! In this sense, China's support of the North Korean bankrupt regime is an evil act against the Korean people!

You keep telling yourself that. If you love Russia so much, why did Mongolia declare independence after Russia went bankrupt? And read up on the Stalinist purges in Mongolia.

You are right! Tibetans, Uighurs and Inner Mongolians in China are so "happy" that they protest against the Chinese rule often, and many Tibetan monks and nuns self-immolate because they live in "China-heaven"! The number of Tibetans who self-immolated is reaching 30, and counting!

Do you know that one-third of Inner Mongolians do not speak Mongolian? This is the result of forced assimilation. But Inner Mongolians like Tibetans and Uighurs started to fight back! The last summer's large demonstrations in Inner Mongolia is the just beginning!

We-Mongolians think that we have nothing to do with the Chinese who eat dog -domesticated brother of Wolf, the totem of Mongolians, and therefore, we will stay away from the Chinese! So far so good, we are succeeding.

Do you know that Ulan-Bator is the only capital city in Asia that does NOT have a China-town? Even Kazakhstan's Astana, Kyrgyz capital - Bishkek, and Dushanbe - Tadjik capital have China-towns. In the 1950-80s, many thousand Chinese were kicked out of Mongolia!

So, we-Mongolians are building a bright future based on democracy, human rights, and strong economy!

Let me ask you, who participated in those demonstrations? They were ALL monks. It's a known fact that monks who are on welfare riot the most in Tibet.
Also, just because a country has riots doesn't mean the government should give them independence. Occupy Wall Street Protesters riot, there were riots in the UK last year, there were riots in Russia after Putin won reelection. I know its Mongolia's wet dream that China fails.

And China has been kind enough to give the Mongolians enough freedom to speak their own language and writing. In Outer Mongolia, the older generation forgot how to write in traditional Mongolian script. In Inner Mongolia, there are many bilingual signs. I think PRC has been TOO kind.

So you are proud that you kicked out Chinese? And you are complaining that Chinese took Mongolian land? Ha! Hypocrite. I bet you were cry even more if Chinese kicked Mongolians out of China and took more Mongolian land.

Mongolia is building bright future based on democracy, human rights, and strong economy? HA! Mongolia is parasite of the world. They rely on Russian and Chinese investment to sustain their economy. They only have 1 $hitty city- Ulaan Batoor, which was built with Chinese labor. HA! China is Mongolia's biggest trader. They may have democracy, but who cares? Most Mongolians come to China to become parasites, on welfare. They may have freedom of speech, but who cares? Most people are farmers and nomads. What are they going to talk about? How to suck goat d!ck? HA! Only hypocrite, delusional Mongolian would have the balls to $hit on China when their country is basically vassal state of China.

North Korea is the true vassal state of China: China keeps financing the North Korean elite that kills their own people through famine, disease, execution and torture! In this sense, China's support of the North Korean bankrupt regime is an evil act against the Korean people!

OH the hypocrisy! Mongolians committed genocide against Tibetans, Uighurs, Chinese, Russians, Arabs, etc..
China FEEDS the Korean people : http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/artic...5c76fda3dcc.191
China is the only country that does not want the North Korean people to starve. Other countries place sanctions on North Korea. This does not help at all because the North Korean government will take whatever little food the people have and feed it to high ranking government officials.

Also, Mongolians fear Chinese will take over Mongolia by aggressive immigration. Well, if North Korea collapses, then millions of North Koreans will flood China. I bet if Mongolia shares border with North Korea, they would prop up North Korea to stop immigration. I bet if China collapses(their wet dream), then Mongolia would close off border as well.

This post has been edited by CRYPT: Feb 22 2012, 11:40 AM

[Boron]

Thats what they did back in the 90's when for some reason the Outer Mongolian leadership suddenly got the great idea to invite the Dalai Lama over for an "official" visit. The CHinese side decided to close off their side of the border for "rail maintenece". Needless to say, the once uppity Monolians were litterally begging for mercy just after one week.

seriously? I never knew about this.

[baasiddeghuja]

Mongolia restored its independence in 1911 when the Manchu Qing (Not Chinese!) collapsed!

Stalin-Choibalsan purges in Mongolia was nothing compared to Mao's slaughtering and killing of 50 million Chinese!

Mao is the greatest butcher of his own Chinese people! No leader in history slaughtered his own people like Mao did!

You keep telling yourself that. If you love Russia so much, why did Mongolia declare independence after Russia went bankrupt? And read up on the Stalinist purges in Mongolia.

[CRYPT]

Mongolia restored its independence in 1911 when the Manchu Qing (Not Chinese!) collapsed!

Stalin-Choibalsan purges in Mongolia was nothing compared to Mao's slaughtering and killing of 50 million Chinese!

Mao is the greatest butcher of his own Chinese people! No leader in history slaughtered his own people like Mao did!

\
LMAO. You could not answer my question. So you try to change the subject. 50 million Chinese died because of sanctions and drought. Besides, 50 million out of 600 million people is not much. In fact, the Stalin-Choibalsan purges in proportion to the amount of people dead in China during Mao is greater.

[Boron]

All you do is bull$hit and exaggerate. Who do you think believes you? You just make these fantasies that try to insult the greatest country in Asia. Like someone said, go try to liberate Siberia. No one is impressed by you boasting about murder and rape you did 800 years ago.

[baasiddeghuja]

The whole Tibet, East Turkestan,and Inner (Southern) Mongolia independence movements have broad support among these people in China. However, these people can not express their views openly because China will execute them without fair trials.

Monks, nuns, ordinary people, young people, college educated people, high school students and many others participated in these Tibetan, Uighurs and Inner Mongolian anti-China demonstrations!

You-Chinese invaded Tibet, East Turkestan, and Inner Mongolia. They are you colonies!

I understand that you DO NOT CARE about DEMOCRACY, FREEDOM and HUMAN RIGHTS because many Chinese people do not know how to enjoy freedom and democracy. Jackie Chang was right when he said the Chinese people needed to controlled and tamed like zoo animals because the Chinese do not know how to enjoy freedom and democracy!

Well, at least Mongolian horsemen know how to enjoy freedom and democracy in contrast to the Chinese rice peasants who think that they must be tamed by the Chinese communist party because they do not know how to enjoy freedom, democracy, and human rights! In this sense, many Chinese DO deserve their communist government that kills millions of Chinese babies through forced abortions!

You keep telling yourself that. If you love Russia so much, why did Mongolia declare independence after Russia went bankrupt? And read up on the Stalinist purges in Mongolia.




Let me ask you, who participated in those demonstrations? They were ALL monks. It's a known fact that monks who are on welfare riot the most in Tibet.
Also, just because a country has riots doesn't mean the government should give them independence. Occupy Wall Street Protesters riot, there were riots in the UK last year, there were riots in Russia after Putin won reelection. I know its Mongolia's wet dream that China fails.

And China has been kind enough to give the Mongolians enough freedom to speak their own language and writing. In Outer Mongolia, the older generation forgot how to write in traditional Mongolian script. In Inner Mongolia, there are many bilingual signs. I think PRC has been TOO kind.

So you are proud that you kicked out Chinese? And you are complaining that Chinese took Mongolian land? Ha! Hypocrite. I bet you were cry even more if Chinese kicked Mongolians out of China and took more Mongolian land.

Mongolia is building bright future based on democracy, human rights, and strong economy? HA! Mongolia is parasite of the world. They rely on Russian and Chinese investment to sustain their economy. They only have 1 $hitty city- Ulaan Batoor, which was built with Chinese labor. HA! China is Mongolia's biggest trader. They may have democracy, but who cares? Most Mongolians come to China to become parasites, on welfare. They may have freedom of speech, but who cares? Most people are farmers and nomads. What are they going to talk about? How to suck goat d!ck? HA! Only hypocrite, delusional Mongolian would have the balls to $hit on China when their country is basically vassal state of China.

[CRYPT]

The whole Tibet, East Turkestan,and Inner (Southern) Mongolia independence movements have broad support among these people in China. However, these people can not express their views openly because China will execute them without fair trials.

Monks, nuns, ordinary people, young people, college educated people, high school students and many others participated in these Tibetan, Uighurs and Inner Mongolian anti-China demonstrations!

You-Chinese invaded Tibet, East Turkestan, and Inner Mongolia. They are you colonies!

I understand that you DO NOT CARE about DEMOCRACY, FREEDOM and HUMAN RIGHTS because many Chinese people do not know how to enjoy freedom and democracy. Jackie Chang was right when he said the Chinese people needed to controlled and tamed like zoo animals because the Chinese do not know how to enjoy freedom and democracy!

Well, at least Mongolian horsemen know how to enjoy freedom and democracy in contrast to the Chinese rice peasants who think that they must be tamed by the Chinese communist party because they do not know how to enjoy freedom, democracy, and human rights! In this sense, many Chinese DO deserve their communist government that kills millions of Chinese babies through forced abortions!

Did you even read what I wrote before? There are demonstrations all over the world. Not everyone get can get what they want.
You Mongolians invaded China and Tibet and Xinjiang. You butchered millions of people. Your people are savages.

It's spelled Jackie *Chan* by the way.
Again, this is the beggar analogy. A hobo tells a billionaire he has a better life because he does not have to worry about paying taxes, have responsibilities, etc..
It's also like a poor orphan telling a rich child that he has a better life because he has no adult to raise him.

Mongolian horsemen enjoy freedom because they are savages. All they think about is raping and killing. I guess its a good thing Inner Mongolia is part of China because they are more civilized than low-IQ Mongolains who cannot even write in their own language.

Let me ask you, what is democracy? What is freedom? What is human rights? You throw around these words as if somehow having them means something to a turd world country like Mongolia. Mongolia is just full of farmers and nomads. So what if they have them. Are they going to practice them?

And besides, China is becoming richer and richer while Mongolia is still a $hitty country that has to rely on China to keep its economy strong. Greater freedom will come later. I guess Mongolians are too stupid to realize you have to be rich and educated in order to have a functioning democracy. I guess that is why MOST MONGOLIANS GO OVERSEAS TO STUDY. And they still fail at helping their country.

And also, even with all the faults that China has, at least it has and is contributing to the world. Mongolia, for all of its existence, has only raped and killed millions without ever giving back. What great philosophers has it produced? What inventions has it produced? What culture? What art? What music? NOTHING.

[Boron]

I think he doesn't want to know about facts. He just wants to bash Chinese for his venting. He's like a bad child that only a good beating can calm him down.

[AsiaticGlory]

All you do is bull$hit and exaggerate. Who do you think believes you? You just make these fantasies that try to insult the greatest country in Asia. Like someone said, go try to liberate Siberia. No one is impressed by you boasting about murder and rape you did 800 years ago.

Taking Siberia is actually a better option for Mongolia due to the following reasons:
1. It is a bigger piece of land.
2. It is empty and filled with untapped resources.
3. The indigenous populations of Siberia are also Altaic.
4. Russia's influence in the region is weakening. Mongolia would have a better chance of taking Siberia than Inner Mongolia.
5. A lot of Mongolians in Inner Mongolia are probably already mixed with Han Chinese so I doubt Mongolia would actually accept them.
6. By owning Russia, Mongolia may end up inspiring their fellow Altaics in Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan to stop being Russified.

Yeah, Mongolia is better off taking Siberia than taking Inner Mongolia.