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Strongest and Most Modern Armed Forces in Southeast Asia at the time, Completed with Artillery and a Modern Fleet
SoCal
post Mar 14 2009, 03:31 PM
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Late 18th century and early 19th century


http://www.advite.com/APrinceAMissionary.htm#_edn56


Steps in Nation Building .

During that period when Pigneau was on his way back to Vietnam to join forces with Nguyễn Ánh, the youngest Tây Sơn brother Nguyễn Huệ was busy fighting in Northern Vietnam ( Tonkin ), chasing away the former King Lê and Lord Trinh. He then defeated the large Qing army led by the governor of Guangdong and Guangxi Sun Shiyi[54] who came to rescue the throne of Lê Chiêu Thống in February 1789, and then was recognized as “King of An Nam” (An Nam Quốc Vương) by the Chinese Emperor.

However, in the southern part of the country, Nguyễn Lữ, the brother responsible for Cochinchina, died. The eldest, Nguyễn Nhạc, consolidated his positions in Central Vietnam and built his fleet for the purpose of a Southward expedition against the Nguyen.

Nguyễn Ánh, under the military and political tutoring of Pigneau and with the help of his other French advisors, was fortifying and building Saigon into a modern, western style city. Pigneau studied the Encyclopedia among other sources of military knowledge and helped Nguyen Anh build a fortress a la Vauban[55] and the strongest and most modern armed forces in Southeast Asia at the time, completed with artillery and a modern fleet.

“Under the direction of Olivier de Puymanel,[56] a deserter fromLa Dryade and appointed ‘chef d’etat major’ (chief of staff), the Cochinchinese army was composed of foot soldiers and artillerymen maneuvering in the European way. Canons were fired ‘a la bricole.’ There were also engineering units (genie) and ‘aerostiers’ who operated a balloon. The cavalry of 24 squadrons was made of men riding buffaloes and 3200 elephants, forming a shock unit. Each pachyderm was served by a team of four cornacs.[57] Following Pigneau’s advice, Nguyen Anh had ‘the most formidable Navy that any power in the Indies ever had.’ A British diplomat in transit in Saigon in 1793 wrote that he had seen on the river leading to Cap Saint-Jacques ‘a colossal armada of 1200 sails, including three very modern vessels maneuvering in the most rigorous order.’ To fund for such a fleet, the King had to borrow 270000 piastres from French businessmen in the Indies ’.

Development of Saigon and a Vietnamese Pierre L’Enfant.

This post has been edited by SoCal: Mar 14 2009, 03:31 PM
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MyEmpireXPhome
post Mar 14 2009, 03:34 PM
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I think now Thailand and singapore have the strongest armies in SEA, althrough Vietnam still get more manpower kiss.gif
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SoCal
post Mar 14 2009, 03:34 PM
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nguyen_Phuc_Anh


Naval buildup under Nguyen Phuc Anh

The French Navy officer Jean-Baptiste Chaigneau served Emperor Gia Long.Nguyen Anh used his new base to improve his inferior navy, which was much smaller than the Tay Son fleet and hitherto unable to prevent their rice raids.[44] Nguyen Anh had first attempted to acquire modern naval vessels in 1781, when on the advice of Pigneau, he had chartered Portuguese vessels of European design, complete with crew and artillery. This initial experience proved to be disastrous. For reasons that remain unclear, two of the vessels fled in the midst of battle against the Tay Son, while angry Vietnamese soldiers killed the third crew.[44] In 1789, Pigneau returned to Vietnam from Pondicherry with two vessels, which stayed in the Nguyen service long-term. Over time, Vietnamese sailors replaced the original French and Indian crew under the command of French officers. These vessels became the foundation for an expanded military and merchant Nguyen naval force, with Nguyen Anh chartering and purchasing more European vessels to reinforce Vietnamese-built ships. However, traditional Vietnamese-style galleys and small sailing ships remained the majority of the fleet. By 1794, two European vessels were operating together with 200 Vietnamese boats against the Tay Son near Qui Nhon. In 1799, a British trader by the name of Berry reported that the Nguyen fleet had departed Saigon along the Saigon River with 100 galleys, 40 junks, 200 smaller boats and 800 carriers, accompanied by three European sloops.[44] In 1801, one naval division was reported to have included nine European vessels armed with 60 guns, five vessels with 50 guns, 40 with 16 guns, 100 junks, 119 galleys and 365 smaller boats.[44]

Most of the European-style vessels were built in the shipyard that Nguyen Anh had commissioned in Saigon. He took a deep personal interest in the naval program, directly supervising the work and spending several hours a day dockside. One witness noted "One principal tendency of his ambition is to naval science, as a proof of this he has been heard to say he would build ships of the line on the European plan."[45] By 1792, fifteen frigates were under construction, with a design that mixed Chinese and European specifications, equipped with 14 guns. The Vietnamese learned European naval architecture by dismantling an old European vessel into its components, so that Vietnamese shipbuilders could understand the separate facets of European shipbuilding, before reassembling it. They then applied their newfound knowledge to create replicas of the boats. Nguyen Anh studied naval carpentry techniques and was said to be adept at it, and learned navigational theory from the French books that Pigneau translated, particularly Diderot and d'Alembert's Encyclopédie. The Saigon shipyard was widely praised by European travelers.[45]

Despite his extensive reliance on French officers on matters of military technology, Nguyen Anh limited his inner military circle to Vietnamese. The Frenchmen decried his refusal to take their tactical advice. Chaigneau reported that the Europeans continually urged Nguyen Anh to take the initiative and launch bold attacks against Tay Son installations. Nguyen Anh refused, preferring to proceed slowly, consolidating his gains in one area and strengthening his economic and military base, before attacking another. Over time, Nguyen Anh gradually reduced the military role of his French allies on the battlefield.[33] In the naval battle at Thi Nai in 1792, Dayot led the Nguyen naval attack, but by 1801, a seaborne offensive in the same area was led by the Nguyen Van Truong, Vo Duy Nguy and Le Van Duyet, with Chaigneau, Vannier, and de Forsans in supporting positions. The infantry attack on Qui Nhon in 1793 was conducted, according to Nguyen historiography, in cooperation with "Western soldiers".[33] The same source recorded that by 1801, Nguyen operations in the same area were directed by Vietnamese generals, whereas Chaigneau and Vannier were responsible for organising supply lines.[33]

This post has been edited by SoCal: Mar 14 2009, 03:35 PM
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SoCal
post Mar 14 2009, 03:36 PM
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QUOTE(MyEmpireXPhome @ Mar 14 2009, 01:34 PM) [snapback]4165133[/snapback]
I think now Thailand and singapore have the strongest armies in SEA, althrough Vietnam still get more manpower kiss.gif




Live long and see... my friend...


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SoCal
post Mar 14 2009, 04:06 PM
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_assistance_to_Nguyen_Anh

Qui Nhon battle (1801)

Harbour of Qui Nhon by Jean-Marie Dayot (1795).The Tay Son suffered a major naval defeat at Qui Nhon in February 1801. The French took an active part in the battle.[45] Chaigneau described the battle in a letter to his friend Barizy:

”We have just burnt all the navy of the enemies, so that not even the smallest ship escaped. This was the bloodiest fight the Cochinchinese had ever seen. The enemies fought to the death. Our people behaved in a superior manner. We have many dead and wounded, but this is nothing compared to the advantages the king is receiving. Mr Vannier, Forsanz and myself were there, and came back safely. Before seeing the enemy navy, I used to despise it, but I assure you this was misconceived, they had vessels with 50 to 60 canons.

—Letter from Jean-Baptiste Chaigneau to Barizy, 2 March 1801.[46]
On June 5, 1801, Nguyen left with his fleet for the north, and ten days later succeeded in capturing Hue.[47] On 20 July 1802, Nguyen Anh captured Hanoi and thus completed his reconquest of Vietnam.[48]
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vietskyline88
post Mar 14 2009, 05:10 PM
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QUOTE(MyEmpireXPhome @ Mar 14 2009, 03:34 PM) [snapback]4165133[/snapback]
I think now Thailand and singapore have the strongest armies in SEA, althrough Vietnam still get more manpower kiss.gif

haha u gotta be kidding rite
actually Vietnam is a titan in Southeast Asia
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ltk
post Mar 15 2009, 08:10 PM
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QUOTE(SoCal @ Mar 14 2009, 04:06 PM) [snapback]4165155[/snapback]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_assistance_to_Nguyen_Anh

Qui Nhon battle (1801)

Harbour of Qui Nhon by Jean-Marie Dayot (1795).The Tay Son suffered a major naval defeat at Qui Nhon in February 1801. The French took an active part in the battle.[45] Chaigneau described the battle in a letter to his friend Barizy:

”We have just burnt all the navy of the enemies, so that not even the smallest ship escaped. This was the bloodiest fight the Cochinchinese had ever seen. The enemies fought to the death. Our people behaved in a superior manner. We have many dead and wounded, but this is nothing compared to the advantages the king is receiving. Mr Vannier, Forsanz and myself were there, and came back safely. Before seeing the enemy navy, I used to despise it, but I assure you this was misconceived, they had vessels with 50 to 60 canons.

—Letter from Jean-Baptiste Chaigneau to Barizy, 2 March 1801.[46]
On June 5, 1801, Nguyen left with his fleet for the north, and ten days later succeeded in capturing Hue.[47] On 20 July 1802, Nguyen Anh captured Hanoi and thus completed his reconquest of Vietnam.[48]

Tay Son naval vessels had over 1100 cannons in this battle, excluding the cannons on the grounds. Tay Son's biggest ships
had 66 cannons. kiss.gif

Vietnam should make a movie about this battle and I'll be the lead actor kiss.gif

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beefnoodle
post Mar 16 2009, 04:39 AM
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please stay with the reality
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hadoken
post Mar 16 2009, 05:51 AM
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everybody's military was the strongest...
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SoCal
post Mar 16 2009, 07:24 AM
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Gals/Guys,


Did you learn about the history of Vietnam in the late 18th and early 19th century. Please check this map out and don't be ignorant fools.


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SoCal
post Mar 16 2009, 02:38 PM
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QUOTE(ltk @ Mar 15 2009, 06:10 PM) [snapback]4166537[/snapback]
Tay Son naval vessels had over 1100 cannons in this battle, excluding the cannons on the grounds. Tay Son's biggest ships
had 66 cannons. kiss.gif

Vietnam should make a movie about this battle and I'll be the lead actor kiss.gif



For some narrow-minded reasons, Vietnam does not make any movies about the past. If they make an epic movie, they would make make a movie exaggerating the significance of the current governments of Viet Nam Cong San or Viet Nam Cong Hoa. That is very fortunate indeed. In a way, this is very ba^'t hie^'u to our ancestors.
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