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[XigonCongchua]

I'm only speaking what I think is right. The info that you and other Lao members are spreading regarding the Thai R is obviously wrong. At first I only made a short post, telling people about the consonant clusters and the R sound in Thai language. But some Lao members here got irritated with my post because I stated that Thai R didn't come from Lao H, and so the argument went on...You're getting insecure because why would I hate Lao? I have no reason to hate that country and the people in that country. I have no reason to compete with or degrading your country and your people. My posts here also have nothing against Lao language as I made no comment about how Lao language sounds.

You're using Ad Hominem attack which is the most frequently used fallacy in logic to attack people when the attacker cannot reasonably repute the argument of his or her opponent.

Changing and evolving technically mean the same thing in linguistics.

Languages are spoken by many millions of people and they can only be changed "consciously" if enforced by authority (in this case, the government). In other words, unless some authority figures come out and order for everyone to change H to R, all the change patterns happen in a language are subconscious and follow a mechanism.

The Chinese dialects around the Zhuang (Cantonese and other Southern dialects) don't have R. Saying Zhuang language contains R because of Chinese influence is the dumbest thing ever because Chinese language had gotten rid of all the R sound since the Tang Dynasty. Mandarin is the only one that has developed R from the N sound in the recent centuries, but Mandarin is thousands of miles away from the Zhuang.

Comparisons among Tai-Kadai languages have pointed out that the original consonant in the word to know is R, which is the same way as how Thai people pronounce them today.
You should drop the claim that Thai R came from Lao H because it isn't true. I found you ignored the data I provided which said the proto-Tai-Zhuang form for to know was Ru.

[Anouvong]

OK, look at the database of a professional linguist for yourself

http://starling.rinet.ru/cgi-bin/response....amp;root=config


Proto-Zhuang-Tai: *ru.C <---- See? The R sound existed in proto-Tai languages.

Meaning: know

Siamese: ru.C
Longzhou Zhuang: ɫu.4
Bouyei (Po-ai): lo.4
Wuming Zhuang: rö.4
References: LFK: 143.


The R sound is native in ancient Tai languages. Some Zhuang languages still preserve this R sound. Thai has R sounds not because it was Khmerized but because it preserves some features from the older Tai languages. Lao replaces the R/L sound with the H sound, so the H sound in Lao is less original than both L and R, yet some Lao members here always claimed that their H sound is the precedor of Thai R sound.

Thanks Xigon, sometimes we need a third party non-biased information. Your resource exactly shows that R sound do exist in other Tai language not only Thai. It proves that Thai R is not borrowed from Khmer/Indic .

----------

I got many R Thai words which written in Sukhothai stone inscription. I'd post here for reference.

ไร่ ไล่ ให้ - Rai Lai Hai - field chase give
รัก ลัก - Rak Lak - love steal
รบ Rob - fight,battle
อร่อย ARoi - delicious
เรือน - Reurn - house
ร้อย - Roi - hundred
รอย - Roi - mark
เรียง - Rieng - line up
ใคร - krai - who
ใคร่ - krai - passion
แรง - Rang - strong
ริม - Rim edge
ร้าย - Rai - bad

[Anouvong]

If u go to read Sukotai language and script it is more simular to Lao script and language then it is to Thai langauge. so the Lao language is more orginal then the Khmerized Thai language. We are comparing Thai langauge and Lao language, not Lao lanuage to Khmer language.

Anyone with common sense should be able to know this

KingCong is no different from Teenoi and these other Chinese ppl who live in Thailand and think they know more about Tai Culture and Tai customs then the actual Tai ppl themselves. Take my advice KingCong, shut up and listen.

Sukhothai script is nothing but Thai script, Lao script is mixed of our Sukhothai script and Lanna script. Thai script is direct successor from Sukhothai script.

I wonder you ever read Sukhothai stone inscription, the language is truly Thai. In the inscription there are many of R and Ch in Thai words which never exist in Lao and there are many words that are different to Lao. I remember some words in the inscription since every Thai students must learn in school, wua วัว and kwai ควาย. wua is cow, kwai is buffalo. Our Sukhothai ancestor and us use exactly same word and pronunciation but Lao dont, Lao use ngua งัว for cow and kuay ควย for buffalo. In Thai, ngua means sleepy and kuay means penis LOL. If King Ramkamhaeng was Lao as you always claim. There must be a sleepy penis in the inscription LOLzzzzzzz, got it? buc kuay ngao 5555555555555

This post has been edited by Anouvong: May 15 2009, 12:48 PM

[Anouvong]

THai are saying Bor instead of Mai, Ai instead of Pii, Sabaidee instead of Sawadee, Jao instead of Kup/ka. The opposite is happening, Lao langauge is starting to dominate Thai media.

Thai say Bor? lol
Thai say hello by say sabaidee? lol
Thai say Ai ? lol
Thai use Jao ?

stupid Lao Canadian

go check your brain, ok?

^So Anouvong dude, tell me again why you're so insecure with the fact that other Thai people love listening to the Lao language? We get that you're a proud Thai, but seriously "use your ears" and listen to the differences between Lao and Thai.

Alexandra knows how to speak the Thai language, because switching between Lao and Thai is not that hard once you understand how to speak both languages. They're very similar anyway. I know a Thai guy who is able to speak Lao with a nice Vientiane accent. The reason why Alexandra would usually only speak in the Lao language when on Thai TV is because that's what makes her interesting and fun to listen to. She's also representing Lao culture by speaking Lao on Thai TV. When she's backstage, she would speak Thai to the Thai staff. Of course when she's in Laos and when she's on Lao TV, she would only speak Lao to the Lao staff. However, in addition to speaking Lao, she would also use our Lao polite participles with the Lao staff because they deserved extra kindness from Alexandra. LOL! I guess the Thai hosts didn't deserve that same kind of special treatment that she would only give to Lao people. The only thing she was willing to use on the Thai hosts was "Man Laew". LOL! I guess that was all that they deserved from her.

On a different note, there was a Thai guy who had visited Luang Prabang and then when he came home to Thailand, he found himself using only "Sabaidee" (Lao) instead of "Sawatdee" (Thai) even though he was already back in Thailand because he said that "Sabaidee" as a greeting sounded very friendly. In time, he eventually went back to using the Thai greeting "Sawatdee".

Thai also use sabaidee, sabai is from Pali, sappaya, Thai and Lao borrow via Khmer. we use Sabaidee in sense of questioning, Sabaidee mai? Are you fine? If we say only sabaidee like Lao do that means we are answering "yes I'm fine" not say hello.
So when Thai ppl first heard Lao say hello by looking our face and saying short word sabaidee with no ending/question word, we automatically think Lao are crazy to say unexpectedly to anybody that "I am fine". LOL

For Alexandra, your Miss Man Laew, if she love to keep her politeness with only her own Lao ppl, that's fine. but how can Lao claim themselves that they are polite if nobody ever seen it?
It's not hard for us Thai ppl to show politeness to foreigners. All Thai use krap/kha to tourists even Lao tourists. We even WAI, pay respect by press our hand together to foreigner. You can see in international sport event, Olympics, Asian games etc, Thai athletes always WAI the non-Thai referees before and finish the match or when receiving the medal. I don't think Lao athlete do that. Thai ppl don't hesitate to show our politeness and sincere heart to anybody. What about Lao? What are you afraid of? Or your Lao communist gov make you to talk like a robot?
manlaew manlaew manlaew manlaew manlaew manlaew

[Manleow]

You're only in here because you despise Lao people and you will say anything to defend countries that aren't Laos. If Laotians and Khmers are arguing, you side with the Khmers. If Laotians and Thais are arguing, you side with the Thais. LOL! We already know how you operate, Ms. Xigon who thinks she's an expert on Lao language and culture. You keep yappin' about how one sound evolved into another. I NEVER said that the H "evolved" into an R. There was NO evolution involved. Someone in charge of the Thai language decided to change Huk to Ruk. Get that across your thick skull. You must have a problem with the English language. The Thai "R" came from the Khmers. They roll their R's like the Khmers do. Ancient "Tai" people did not trill their R's.

I said the word "Huk" was CHANGED to "Ruk"...not EVOLVED, but conciously changed. You are really a lost cause if you can't grasp that concept. I could take a word like "house" and change it to "Klouse" if I wanted to. It has nothing to do with evolution. The Siamese WERE the KHMERS/MONS. The Siamese did not come from southern China. Of course the Siamese had the trilled R sound because they were the Khmers/Mons. It was a native sound to them. No other "Tai" groups would ever trill their R's except if they were influenced by the Khmers. Stop thinking about evolution and focus on the fact that it was a conscious change.

There's no need to bring up the Zhuang because they're still currently living in China so of course they're going to be influenced by the Chinese language.

You need to learn more about the history of the Lao language before you open your mouth and make yourself look foolish again. The fact that Indian loan words are now spelled with H's instead of R's has nothing to do with evolution but a conscious change implemented by the Lao government about 30 years ago. They purposefully changed the spellings of those Indian loan words...so that had nothing to do with evolution. Those changes only involved Indian loan words, not native Lao words. The word "Huk" was NEVER "Ruk" prior to the communist take-over period, so don't tell us that we changed Ruk to Huk. You're clueless.

THis is how Stupid KingCong is, Siamese Say Ruk NOthern Thai who are the oldest Tai Kingdom in Thailand say Huk like Lao ppl from Laos. Chiangmai/Chaingsean is the orignal Tai speaking ppl before influence from Khmer in central Thailand. So if the ppl from Chiangmai say Huk, then when u move down south to the Siamese Tai, who say Ruk, that tells you that the progression of the Siamese Word Ruk came from the Lao or TaiYuan word Huk. Then again, i realize what an idiot KingCong is, which tells you she might not still get it. SO yes, Savan, Ruk came from Huk.

who said R does not exist in Tai language? I am saying the rolling "R" sound which THais use come from Khmer ppl, thats just pure fact. NOthern THai ppl nor Lao ppl dont roll there "R's", so it is not oringal Tai sound. Its a Khmer sound Thai ppl picked up from Khmer ppl.

Again just so Dumb KingCong dont get it, NOthern THai ppl say Huk like Lao ppl. NOthern Thai ppl say "Huk Jao" Lao ppl say "Huk Jao." Siamese ppl say "Ruk Khun"

Nothern Thai and Laos Dominates the Northern portion of SEA where we originated in SEA, how would a southern language of the of the same language group (Tai) be more original then the source from which the Tai ppl came from.

Like i said, someone should ban that dumb viet girl from talking, because she's stupid.
Its like KingCong trying to say that the American Language is more orignal then the language of the English. So keep on coming KingCOng, Im dont mind making you look like an idiot, just want to point it out to the rest of the ppl, but im sure the know already.

[Manleow]

You're only in here because you despise Lao people and you will say anything to defend countries that aren't Laos. If Laotians and Khmers are arguing, you side with the Khmers. If Laotians and Thais are arguing, you side with the Thais. LOL! We already know how you operate, Ms. Xigon who thinks she's an expert on Lao language and culture. You keep yappin' about how one sound evolved into another. I NEVER said that the H "evolved" into an R. There was NO evolution involved. Someone in charge of the Thai language decided to change Huk to Ruk. Get that across your thick skull. You must have a problem with the English language. The Thai "R" came from the Khmers. They roll their R's like the Khmers do. Ancient "Tai" people did not trill their R's.

I said the word "Huk" was CHANGED to "Ruk"...not EVOLVED, but conciously changed. You are really a lost cause if you can't grasp that concept. I could take a word like "house" and change it to "Klouse" if I wanted to. It has nothing to do with evolution. The Siamese WERE the KHMERS/MONS. The Siamese did not come from southern China. Of course the Siamese had the trilled R sound because they were the Khmers/Mons. It was a native sound to them. No other "Tai" groups would ever trill their R's except if they were influenced by the Khmers. Stop thinking about evolution and focus on the fact that it was a conscious change.

There's no need to bring up the Zhuang because they're still currently living in China so of course they're going to be influenced by the Chinese language.

You need to learn more about the history of the Lao language before you open your mouth and make yourself look foolish again. The fact that Indian loan words are now spelled with H's instead of R's has nothing to do with evolution but a conscious change implemented by the Lao government about 30 years ago. They purposefully changed the spellings of those Indian loan words...so that had nothing to do with evolution. Those changes only involved Indian loan words, not native Lao words. The word "Huk" was NEVER "Ruk" prior to the communist take-over period, so don't tell us that we changed Ruk to Huk. You're clueless.

THis is how Stupid KingCong is, Siamese Say Ruk NOthern Thai who are the oldest Tai Kingdom in Thailand say Huk like Lao ppl from Laos. Chiangmai/Chaingsean is the orignal Tai speaking ppl before influence from Khmer in central Thailand. So if the ppl from Chiangmai say Huk, then when u move down south to the Siamese Tai, who say Ruk, that tells you that the progression of the Siamese Word Ruk came from the Lao or TaiYuan word Huk. Then again, i realize what an idiot KingCong is, which tells you she might not still get it. SO yes, Savan, Ruk came from Huk.

who said R does not exist in Tai language? I am saying the rolling "R" sound which THais use come from Khmer ppl, thats just pure fact. NOthern THai ppl nor Lao ppl dont roll there "R's", so it is not oringal Tai sound. Its a Khmer sound Thai ppl picked up from Khmer ppl.

Again just so Dumb KingCong dont get it, NOthern THai ppl say Huk like Lao ppl. NOthern Thai ppl say "Huk Jao" Lao ppl say "Huk Jao." Siamese ppl say "Ruk Khun"

Nothern Thai and Laos Dominates the Northern portion of SEA where we originated in SEA, how would a southern language of the of the same language group (Tai) be more original then the source from which the Tai ppl came from.

Like i said, someone should ban that dumb viet girl from talking, because she's stupid.
Its like KingCong trying to say that the American Language is more orignal then the language of the English. So keep on coming KingCOng, Im dont mind making you look like an idiot, just want to point it out to the rest of the ppl, but im sure the know already.

[Manleow]

THis is how Stupid KingCong is, Siamese Say Ruk NOthern Thai who are the oldest Tai Kingdom in Thailand say Huk like Lao ppl from Laos. Chiangmai/Chaingsean is the orignal Tai speaking ppl before influence from Khmer in central Thailand. So if the ppl from Chiangmai say Huk, then when u move down south to the Siamese Tai, who say Ruk, that tells you that the progression of the Siamese Word Ruk came from the Lao or TaiYuan word Huk. Then again, i realize what an idiot KingCong is, which tells you she might not still get it. SO yes, Savan, Ruk came from Huk.

who said R does not exist in Tai language? I am saying the rolling "R" sound which THais use come from Khmer ppl, thats just pure fact. NOthern THai ppl nor Lao ppl dont roll there "R's", so it is not oringal Tai sound. Its a Khmer sound Thai ppl picked up from Khmer ppl.

Again just so Dumb KingCong dont get it, NOthern THai ppl say Huk like Lao ppl. NOthern Thai ppl say "Huk Jao" Lao ppl say "Huk Jao." Siamese ppl say "Ruk Khun"

Nothern Thai and Laos Dominates the Northern portion of SEA where we originated in SEA, how would a southern language of the of the same language group (Tai) be more original then the source from which the Tai ppl came from.

Like i said, someone should ban that dumb viet girl from talking, because she's stupid.
Its like KingCong trying to say that the American Language is more orignal then the language of the English. So keep on coming KingCOng, Im dont mind making you look like an idiot, just want to point it out to the rest of the ppl, but im sure the know already.

[sonofgunongjerai]

I'm neutral here and not in any side whether in Lao or Thai because Thai is also spoken in Malaysian border. But since I'm a Thai speaker, I would like to emphasize and share that "R" sound is significant in South Thai and formal Thai. I'm ignorant about North Thai but that "H" sounds seem coming from the North. However, people from Nakhon Sri Thammarath ancestry do have their own sound which is "KH" or ""GH" replacing "R" in the words like "Roo" or "Ruk." Those words in daily conversation will become "GHoo" or "KHoo", or "KHuk" or "GHuk." Yet the language inherited in Nakhorn Sri Thammarath is from Sukhothai period. I'm not sure whether those people in Nakhorn Sri Thammarath still utter the R sounds with "KH" or "GH" but in Malaysia it is still visible. Not all monosyllable words in Thai are Tai in origin, but these two words Roo and Ruk should be Tai in origin. I don't feel anything wrong with Mon words being integrated into Thai, I do realize my Mon root and never feel ashamed about it because our ancient kingdoms had been among the earliest kingdoms in SEA, yet Nakhorn Sri Thammarat had once attacked and conquered Sri Lanka for two years in 10th C before integrated into Sukhothai.

[xeemlauj]

I think the R in Zhuang is pronounce like L because when I listen to Zhuang language, they don't produce R at all, but whether L.

Examples
R in Hmong is pronounce Ch or like Xi in Chinese which is Sh.
R in Zhuang is L.


This post has been edited by xeemlauj: May 16 2009, 12:34 PM

[sonofgunongjerai]

^^^

Yeah nowadays, I heard from movies and dramas from Thailand with the "R" uttered as "L" too.

E.g

Ruk = Luk
Roo = Loo

[Manleow]

Sukhothai script is nothing but Thai script, Lao script is mixed of our Sukhothai script and Lanna script. Thai script is direct successor from Sukhothai script.

I wonder you ever read Sukhothai stone inscription, the language is truly Thai. In the inscription there are many of R and Ch in Thai words which never exist in Lao and there are many words that are different to Lao. I remember some words in the inscription since every Thai students must learn in school, wua วัว and kwai ควาย. wua is cow, kwai is buffalo. Our Sukhothai ancestor and us use exactly same word and pronunciation but Lao dont, Lao use ngua งัว for cow and kuay ควย for buffalo. In Thai, ngua means sleepy and kuay means penis LOL. If King Ramkamhaeng was Lao as you always claim. There must be a sleepy penis in the inscription LOLzzzzzzz, got it? buc kuay ngao 5555555555555

Sukotai language and script is more close to Lao languange and script then it is to Thai, pure fact.

Sukotai language they say "Bor" like Lao say Bor, thai say "Mai"

Sukotai language they say "Sang/Xang" like Lao language, Thai say "Chang"

Sukotai language they say "Ai" like Lao ppl say Ai, Thai say "Pii."

Khamhaeng are 2 Lao words put together Kham and Haeng. The thai word for "Kham" is "Thong" the THai word for "Haeng" is "Raeng." Ram Khamhaeng is a Lao name not a thai name, pure fact.

SO again, the Thai word "Raeng" came from the Lao word "Haeng." ANother example how the "H" sound was changed to the "R" sound by the siamese.

anymore questions, let me know Chinese person

[Savan]

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This post has been edited by Savan: Aug 22 2012, 09:03 PM

[Anouvong]

Sukotai language and script is more close to Lao languange and script then it is to Thai, pure fact.

Sukotai language they say "Bor" like Lao say Bor, thai say "Mai"

Sukotai language they say "Sang/Xang" like Lao language, Thai say "Chang"

Sukotai language they say "Ai" like Lao ppl say Ai, Thai say "Pii."

Khamhaeng are 2 Lao words put together Kham and Haeng. The thai word for "Kham" is "Thong" the THai word for "Haeng" is "Raeng." Ram Khamhaeng is a Lao name not a thai name, pure fact.

SO again, the Thai word "Raeng" came from the Lao word "Haeng." ANother example how the "H" sound was changed to the "R" sound by the siamese.

anymore questions, let me know Chinese person

Central Thai has used Bor since Sukhothai, we have many Ayudhaya and post-Ayudhaya poetry and literature that used Bor. In King Ramkhamhaeng stone inscription has both Bor and Mai (also has both Ai and Pi). Mai is only central Thai not Lao. Moreover Chang (elephant) was written by ช (Ch) not ซ (S/X) like you said. And there are many L/R clusters like Krai (who), Glua (afraid), which cannot be Lao cuz Lao have no cluster consonant. Like I said before, KWAI (buffalo) is Thai but Lao has no cluster so Lao change KW cluster to K+UA, then Thai KWAI become Lao KUAY (penis). lol I don't think our King Ramkhamhaeng the great of Sukhothai kingdom wrote KWAI in the stone if he speak Lao.

Anyway, He proudly named his new script as "Lai Sue Thai" (Thai alphabets) not "Lai Sue Lao" (Lao alphabets) be proud of your Lao kings, ok? King Ram khamhaeng is our Thai ancestor not yours.

PS, Khamhaeng คำแหง is not 2 Lao words but 1 Khmer word, also pronounced Kamhaeng (unaspirated Kh) กำแหง. In Lao, Kham is gold, Haeng is strength, but Haeng in Khamhaeng is not same tone with your Haeng (strength). So Kham+Haeng = gold+strength, it's not any meaning in Lao. There are many Khmer loan words in Thai which beginning with Kam,Tam,Dam eg Tam-ruet/Truet (police), Jam-reon/Jreon (prosper). Dam-nern/Dern(walk). Kampaeng (wall), Thailand has Kampaengpetch (dimond wall), a province which has joint border with Sukhothai province!. So Khamhaeng likely derived from Khmer.

King Ram Khamhaeng got his name from his bravery from save his father in battle. Khamhaeng/Kamhaeng means dare/mutiny. Ram is Rama (Mon ppl=Ram,Rama,Raman), His real name is Phor Khun Ram Khamhaeng, which is Thai+Mon+Khmer which reflects to 3 major ethnics in his kingdom.

This post has been edited by Anouvong: May 17 2009, 12:54 AM

[thewiseguy]

Ok to make things easy do we all agree that their are no true Thais? Thais is a mixture of Mon-Khmer, Lao-Tai, Chinese and Malays. Am I correct? I am not a Thai expert nor a Thailand expert but I assume the Thai language is a blend of mostly Lao-Tai & Mon-Khmer to an extent some Malay.

I also heard somewhere that some Khmers are so assimilated in Thailand they don't even know they have Khmer in them but consider themselves Thai instead. I know the ones in the Surin province know their Khmer heritage but the ones in Bangkok I am not too sure. If what I am saying is correct then Thailand is like the United States of Mainland Southeast Asia because just like America there is no true American when it comes to ethnicity besides the native americans.

This post has been edited by thewiseguy: May 17 2009, 01:23 AM

[sonofgunongjerai]

Po Khun Ramkhamhaeng wife is a Khmer. His son in law too is a Mon. Suphannaphum dynasty of Ayutthaya and Nakhorn Sri Thammarath (Tamraling) are both Mon dynasties and merged from ancient kingdoms in Thailand today. I doubt Nakhorn Sri Thammarat is Mon but rather ancient Khmer, however I would only love to say that it is Mon because Khmer is only in Cambodia. Thai is relevant to unify all the different ethnics which are Tai, Mon, and Khmer. Malays are foreigner from Srivichai (Sumatera) and Southern-most part which is now in Malaysia (Johore), they influenced Southern Thais (Mon) in culture and also language just like Tais influenced us. I'm proud to have relation with both Mon and Tai.

[Anouvong]

If talk about only language. The based core words, Thai and Lao are very close cuz Thai speak Tai, Lao speak Tai. They speak same family language. but every languages on earth is influenced by foreign/neighbors. Thai and Lao are mainly influenced by Sanskrit,Pali,Khmer due to Buddhism/Hiduism. So Lao and Thai sound similar but Thai pronounce foreign loan words closer to the original because of Thai has R/Ch and consonant clusters but Lao don't.

[Laotroll]

Ok to make things easy do we all agree that their are no true Thais? Thais is a mixture of Mon-Khmer, Lao-Tai, Chinese and Malays. Am I correct? I am not a Thai expert nor a Thailand expert but I assume the Thai language is a blend of mostly Lao-Tai & Mon-Khmer to an extent some Malay.

I also heard somewhere that some Khmers are so assimilated in Thailand they don't even know they have Khmer in them but consider themselves Thai instead. I know the ones in the Surin province know their Khmer heritage but the ones in Bangkok I am not too sure. If what I am saying is correct then Thailand is like the United States of Mainland Southeast Asia because just like America there is no true American when it comes to ethnicity besides the native americans.

Yeah exactly. No ethnic THAI exists. The concept of Ethnic Thai is the same concept with Ethnic american.

Thai's population consist of Lao 33%, Chinese 16%, Tai/Yuan, Mon, Khmer, Malay...etc.

It's the united state of Mainland with Lao and Chinese alone cover half of the population.

[Savan]

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This post has been edited by Savan: Aug 22 2012, 09:03 PM

[Anouvong]

Thanks for sharing that information with us. The northern Lao/Tai people, who are closest to our ancestors still say "Huk". The southern Thais in Nakhon Sri Thammarath say "KHuk" or "GHuk", not "KRuk" or "GRuk". The only ones who say "Ruk" and "Roo" are the central Siamese (Thais) because they made those two pronunciations the standard "Thai" way and thus those pronunciations got incorporated into formal Thai language. Formal Thai language was a made up language created by the rulers of Siam so that they would have a standard language in Thailand (Siam). In Laos and northern Thailand, the formal and proper way has always been "Huk" and "Hoo". Those two words, "Huk" and "Hoo" are definitely Lao/Tai in origin, which makes the Khmerized version "Ruk" and "Roo" in the Thai language also Tai in origin. It's obvious that "Ruk" and "Roo" originated in central Thailand (Siam), but based on the Lao/Tai words "Huk" and "Hoo" as spoken in the north. Lao/Tai people migrated down from the north. Lao/Tai people did not originate from central Thailand.

Lao - Thai - Eng

Hoo - Roo - know
Hoo - Hoo - ear

Hak - Rak - Love
Hak - Hak - broken

1 Lao word (H) = 2 Thai words (H, R)

If your theory was true, why Thai didn't convert all H to R. Why Thai ppl just select some H words and change to R? Why some H words still remain in Thai, like Hoo(ear) and Hak(broken).

In the other word, the easiest way, Lao convert ALL Thai native R to Lao H. There are no R words exist. Why? becuz ALL Thai R words become Lao H words and those H words have more than 2 meaning (1 homonym word but 2 meaning including Thai R).

[Anouvong]

"Tai" is not an actual language. Lao people don't speak "Tai" and neither do Thai people. "Tai" just means "people"/"people of"/"people from" etc..."Tai" can never be a language.

Thai pronunciations of Indian loanwords are closer to Khmer pronunciations, whereas Lao pronuncations have evolved into modern pronunciations of Indian loanwords.

lol, for linguist Tai is language. go wiki and search "Tai language"
and what I meant was the languages which Thai and Lao speak are in same family whatever its name.

----------

evolved to modern pronunciations of Indian loanwords?

I think it should called backward evolution

change R to L
change Ch to S
omit R/L cluster
that's very funny

Luang Phra bang > Luang Pha bang
King Chaichethathirat > King Saisethatilat
King Ramkhamhaeng > King LamKhamhaeng

Like I said, Lao speak Pali/Sanskrit like Thai children do.