North Korean army beginning to starve Options

[devils666]

ROFL. You done yet, little imperialist? With this kind of attitude, why would Koreans ever want to cooperate with China?



Because if Korean opinion actually mattered, Korea wouldn't be divided right now?

With this kind of attitude, why would Chinese ever want to cooperate with S. Korea to create a United Korea?

I think a united Korea would help with stability in the region. Also, it would benefit China economically.

Only without US "influence" that is.

[fireplant]

Agreed 100% That's a given. A matter of "when," not a matter of "if" U.S. will withdraw from East Asia. It should coincide with weak U.S. response to Chinese annexation of Taiwan and inability of U.S. to fulfill 1979 Taiwan relations act. That's when U.S. protectorates in the region (ie. Japan, S. Korea) will start re-militarization, and that's when China will de-recognize N. Korea in response of Japanese re-militarization, since United Korea serves China's interest as a buffer state and a balancing power against Japanese militarism.

Basically the Koreans will have to trust the deal with China and put their foot down and say, thank you Uncle Sam for your past help, let's remain as friends across the oceans. If the Koreans are adamant enough the US can't exactly say no, no matter how powerful they are.

2 divisions was just a rough sketch. Probably more important is some kind of joint air/naval command to control the seas. Korea will not need much army after reunification so they can go all out naval. In fact during Imjin wars Korean navy was very good.

[Chan-Ho]

ROFL. You done yet, little imperialist? With this kind of attitude, why would Koreans ever want to cooperate with China?



Because if Korean opinion actually mattered, Korea wouldn't be divided right now?

With this kind of attitude, why would Chinese ever want to cooperate with S. Korea to establish a United Korea?

Wow, with Chinese thinking like this, why wouldn't the world be alarmed by China's supposed "rise"?

[VJDay]

A United Korea will serve as a buffer state and a balancing force against a re-militarized Japan, which would serve China's interest once N. Korea (anti-US buffer state) becomes obsolete after U.S. leaves East Asia.

There is no free-lunch in international relations. A 50 year military alliance will ensure China's northeastern land frontier is safe and secure (both by re-militarized Japanese threat, and Unified Korean military threat), as well as ensure Unified Korea's allegiance to shared Sino-Korea mutual interest in balancing Japanese militarism, instead of China's rise.

There is no free-lunch in international relations.

This post has been edited by VJDay: Jun 28 2011, 01:04 AM

[devils666]

Wow, with Chinese thinking like this, why wouldn't the world be alarmed by China's supposed "rise"?

He was joking - obviously you can't tell the difference

How do you even know he's Chinese?

[Chan-Ho]

A United Korea will serve as a buffer state and a balancing force against a re-militarized Japan, which would serve China's interest once N. Korea (anti-US buffer state) becomes obsolete after U.S. leaves East Asia.

There is no free-lunch in international relations. A 50 year military alliance will ensure China's northeastern land frontier is safe and secure (both by re-militarized Japanese threat, and Unified Korean military threat), as well as ensure Unified Korea's allegiance to shared Sino-Korea mutual interest in balancing Japanese militarism, instead of China's rise.

There is no free-lunch in international relations.

Wow, I at least commend your brute honesty. Now try convincing qwerty 2010 of the geopolitical reality here. She'll say that China doesn't care about hegemony.

This post has been edited by Chan-Ho: Jun 28 2011, 01:09 AM

[fireplant]

I don't think Japan has to remilitarize for this to happen. If Japan stayed defensive, China is allied with united Korea, and USA got out, I think western pacific will have a lot less tension. Everyone can just pursue economy and innovation, and focus on long distance naval power projection, build up oversea resource supplies for East Asia. Without all this internal tension, we can finally be competitive with the west in middle east and africa.

[VJDay]

Of course China doesn't seek hegemony.

Are you kidding me?

Since ancient times, China possessed the manpower and technology (gunpowder) to colonize the entire world.

Do you equate us to Mongol, Spanish, or British barbarians that seek materialistic drive to have sex with non-European women abroad and to seek Gold from the minds of Peru?

We may have learned a lot from the Western way of doing business, but we aren't Japan, we don't Westernize to encompass global empire colonialism, that isn't in Chinese genetic history!

It's the fundamental fact, both historical legacy of colonial occupation by Japan that will unite Korean and Chinese people... Srry, that's just a simple fact For better or for worse.

This post has been edited by VJDay: Jun 28 2011, 01:18 AM

[Chan-Ho]

Of course China doesn't seek hegemony.

Are you kidding me?

Since ancient times, China possessed the manpower and technology (gunpowder) to colonize the entire world.

Do you equate us to Mongol, Spanish, or British barbarians that seek materialistic drive to have sex with non-European women abroad and to seek Gold from the minds of Peru?

We may have learned a lot from the Western way of doing business, but we aren't Japan, we don't Westernize to encompass global empire colonialism, that isn't in Chinese genetic history!

It's the fundamental fact, both historical legacy of colonial occupation by Japan that will unite Korean and Chinese people... Srry, that's just a simple fact For better or for worse.

LOL. Unite Korean and Chinese people? What does China have planned to accomplish this?

This post has been edited by Chan-Ho: Jun 28 2011, 01:25 AM

[YourMuDoIsWeak]

Better an Asian/Korean military than a US military....Korea should be allowed thair own soveriegn military

There is no way Korea would attack China unless they have a death wish. On the other hand, if the US is controlling Korean military they have someone else doing the dirty work. i.e. Mostly Korean and Chinese lives lost from an attack that cannot be directly traced to the US.

Personally, I think the Korean military has more transparancy VS a US-controlled Korean military.

I prefer a Sovereign Korean Military with elements of the 2nd ID deployed as a element of trust.
It is much better than China using two whole divisions to strong arm its will upon a Unified Korea.

It is common knowledge that the US Military does not interfere much with the Korean Military. Other than joint training excercises like Team Spirit. Also if the US did have a large control over the Military why did Korea only send the Zeytun brigade to Douchebagistan when they wanted grunts. Even now they only have Spec Ops running around.

[VJDay]

I don't think Japan has to remilitarize for this to happen. If Japan stayed defensive, China is allied with united Korea, and USA got out, I think western pacific will have a lot less tension. Everyone can just pursue economy and innovation, and focus on long distance naval power projection, build up oversea resource supplies for East Asia. Without all this internal tension, we can finally be competitive with the west in middle east and africa.

Japan is already on the defensive, it's just her military isn't commanded by Japanese people, more like United States is in command of JSDF.

Unlike a distracted U.S. that can't risk another debacle in a country far away, Japan doesn't have any overseas commitments, and if she retained command over her own defensive armed forces, even with the article 9 restriction on declaration of war for offensive purposes, the Japanese navy will interpret any hegemony over the sea lanes of Japan as tantamount to a declaration of war, and will be just as powerful as anything that U.S. can muster, since Japan is a very strong economy, just 1% of her GDP is more than twice Unified Korea's military defense budget...

Just the idea that castrated Japan will be off America's protective leash is enough to get Chinese nationalism rilled up... but I agree, full-scale official nullification of Article 9 in constitutions of Japan isn't necessary, just the air of confidence of a more "independent" Japanese military command is enough to exaggerate things and get the ball rolling. lol

This post has been edited by VJDay: Jun 28 2011, 01:27 AM

[VJDay]

LOL. Unite Korean and Chinese people? What does China have planned to accomplish this?

It's all about ego like you Korean nationalist say.

By cooperating with South Korea to establish a United Korea under Fireplant's plan, China hopes to accomplish a few things: repay Joseon for Qing's inability to fend off Imperial Japanese encroachment in the Battle of Pyongyang of the First Sino-Japanese War and subsequently annexation under the 1910 Eulsa Treaty, which was probably the epitome of China's 109 years worth of foreign humiliation as the "sick man of Asia."

We deeply regret unable to fulfill our suzerain obligation to aid Korea and resist Japanese aggression in 1895 just like we did in 663AD and 1592-1596. Our campaign to aid Korea and resist Amerian in 1950 was to partially repay this, however we Chinese are sorry for this, and hope that one day, we can aid your sovereignty, loan you money to rebuild, and make you more powerful than that dweeb known as Japan. :-P KO

China hopes that by investing money into United Korea, she can rectify 109 years worth of foreign humiliation as the 'Sick man of Asia.' by living vivaciously through a resurgent and powerful Korea that makes Japan look like a piece of $hit crap barbarian dwarf piece of crap

<end anti-Japanese rant for tonight...>

From the bottom of my heart, I hope a reunified Korea can kick Japan's butt (metaphorically, not literally), and I wish the Korean people a bright future.

This post has been edited by VJDay: Jun 28 2011, 01:36 AM

[Chan-Ho]

It's all about ego like you Korean nationalist say.

By cooperating with South Korea to establish a United Korea under Fireplant's plan, China hopes to accomplish a few things: repay Joseon for Qing's inability to fend off Imperial Japanese encroachment in the Battle of Pyongyang of the First Sino-Japanese War and subsequently annexation under the 1910 Eulsa Treaty, which was probably the epitome of China's 109 years worth of foreign humiliation as the "sick man of Asia."

We deeply regret unable to fulfill our suzerain obligation to aid Korea and resist Japanese aggression in 1895 just like we did in 663AD and 1592-1596. Our campaign to aid Korea and resist Amerian in 1950 was to partially repay this, however we Chinese are sorry for this, and hope that one day, we can aid your sovereignty, loan you money, and make you more powerful than that dweeb known as Japan. :-P KO

OK, if you say so, my Chinese emperor. rofl

Please begin your gift of prosperity in North-Korea... oh wait, you've already done that... cooperating with China has certainly helped the North Koreans, hasn't it?

This post has been edited by Chan-Ho: Jun 28 2011, 01:37 AM

[fireplant]

Japan is actually very dependent on US to arm their navy and air force. Their most important systems come straight from USA.

They have the least incentive to kick-out the Americans. 做贼心虚啊 They're also not likely to join a China-Korea alliance. The only thing China can tangle in front of Japan is a chance to remove foreign troops and carry an independent foreign policy. But I think mostly they're scared of China. In this matter they're not Koreans. Koreans will talk trash about China but they don't feel threatened by China like Japan does.

[devils666]

OK, if you say so, my Chinese emperor. rofl

Please begin your gift of prosperity in North-Korea... oh wait, you've already done that... cooperating with China has certainly helped the North Koreans, hasn't it?

This coming from the guy who said typical Korean guys "Eat Kimchi and play starcraft".

If you're really Korean why are you stereotyping your own people as Kimchi-eating Nerds?

Typical Korean guy eats Kimchi, plays starcraft, breakdances, and attends university. Did that help? lol

This post has been edited by devils666: Jun 28 2011, 01:41 AM

[fireplant]

It's all about ego like you Korean nationalist say.

By cooperating with South Korea to establish a United Korea under Fireplant's plan, China hopes to accomplish a few things: repay Joseon for Qing's inability to fend off Imperial Japanese encroachment in the Battle of Pyongyang of the First Sino-Japanese War and subsequently annexation under the 1910 Eulsa Treaty, which was probably the epitome of China's 109 years worth of foreign humiliation as the "sick man of Asia."

We deeply regret unable to fulfill our suzerain obligation to aid Korea and resist Japanese aggression in 1895 just like we did in 663AD and 1592-1596. Our campaign to aid Korea and resist Amerian in 1950 was to partially repay this, however we Chinese are sorry for this, and hope that one day, we can aid your sovereignty, loan you money to rebuild, and make you more powerful than that dweeb known as Japan. :-P KO

China hopes that by investing money into United Korea, she can rectify 109 years worth of foreign humiliation as the 'Sick man of Asia.' by living vivaciously through a resurgent and powerful Korea that makes Japan look like a piece of $hit crap barbarian dwarf piece of crap

<end anti-Japanese rant for tonight...>

From the bottom of my heart, I hope a reunified Korea can kick Japan's butt (metaphorically, not literally), and I wish the Korean people a bright future.

LOL! funny but kind of true

[VJDay]

I personally think if Kim Jong Il adopted experimental economic reforms, then his monopoly on power will fade, and it's his personal decision to keep the dynastic line intact. Plus, a permanent war-time economy against an imposing threat like ROK-US alliance requires dictatorial mobilization of resources, and to emulate South Korean free market enterprise would be tantamount to a declaration of suicide for all the obvious reasons...

Blame N. Korea elite leadership for their crazed obsession over preserving power to the family. China actually believes experimental market reforms will ease the debt burden for United Korean reconstruction post-reunification.

China can't dictate things, we aren't a colonial occupier,nor do we wish to be seen as a colonial occupier. In fact, we saw how Korean nationalism has been aimed towards Imperial Japanese colonialism, and Chinese do not want their image or name touching colonialism of Korea. We want to use anti-Japanese Korean nationalism to our own advantage remember. There is no free lunch in international relations my good Korean pal.

This post has been edited by VJDay: Jun 28 2011, 01:44 AM

[YourMuDoIsWeak]

It's all about ego like you Korean nationalist say.

By cooperating with South Korea to establish a United Korea under Fireplant's plan, China hopes to accomplish a few things: repay Joseon for Qing's inability to fend off Imperial Japanese encroachment in the Battle of Pyongyang of the First Sino-Japanese War and subsequently annexation under the 1910 Eulsa Treaty, which was probably the epitome of China's 109 years worth of foreign humiliation as the "sick man of Asia."

We deeply regret unable to fulfill our suzerain obligation to aid Korea and resist Japanese aggression in 1895 just like we did in 663AD and 1592-1596. Our campaign to aid Korea and resist Amerian in 1950 was to partially repay this, however we Chinese are sorry for this, and hope that one day, we can aid your sovereignty, loan you money, and make you more powerful than that dweeb known as Japan. :-P KO

Thats why the PLA intefered during the Korean war huh? Finally somebody admits the truth. Their is a reason SK is doing a hell of alot better than the North. Chinese nationalist are nothing but class traitors.

You speak highly of a very green Army... Most people do and most people are not willing to be trigger fingers so are you a trigger or just another keyboard warrior?

[devils666]

Thats why the PLA intefered during the Korean war huh? Finally somebody admits the truth. Their is a reason SK is doing a hell of alot better than the North. Chinese nationalist are nothing but class traitors.

You speak highly of a very green Army... Most people do and most people are not willing to be trigger fingers so are you a trigger or just another keyboard warrior?

No one here said the Chinese army is good. Actually most people agree that the Chinese army sucks in comparison to the US Army. that's why China is fearful of US presence at their border.

Also, it's clear the US dictates a lot of covert operations in Korea - not necessarily military, but also politically and through media.

This post has been edited by devils666: Jun 28 2011, 01:46 AM

[VJDay]

What?

China comes to the aid of Korea to resist Japanese/foreign aggression in 663, 1592-1598, 1892-1895, and most recently in 1950.

China has always come to the aid of Korea.

With this kind of attitude, why should Chinese cooperate to help aid South Korea and establish a United Korea? No respect for Chinese aid?

This post has been edited by VJDay: Jun 28 2011, 01:50 AM