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does anyone find it ironic that the Japanese have a more favorable opi
machpunch777
post Nov 3 2011, 08:16 PM
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opinion of U.S compared to china?

Considering in WWII the atom bombs fat man and little boy killed at least 200,000 people. While us chinese only defended our homeland against foreign invaders.

since when have chinese people ever done any wrong against the japanese?

This post has been edited by machpunch777: Nov 3 2011, 08:22 PM
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devils666
post Nov 3 2011, 08:39 PM
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QUOTE (machpunch777 @ Nov 3 2011, 08:16 PM) *
opinion of U.S compared to china?

Considering in WWII the atom bombs fat man and little boy killed at least 200,000 people. While us chinese only defended our homeland against foreign invaders.

since when have chinese people ever done any wrong against the japanese?


That does sound weird. But I guess the Japanese have been brainwashed over the years to worship whites.

In reality, China has done nothing to Japan - while Japan has done many bad things to China. Yet, China is the "threat"? This can only be explained by Western propaganda.
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machpunch777
post Nov 3 2011, 08:47 PM
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QUOTE (devils666 @ Nov 3 2011, 09:39 PM) *
That does sound weird. But I guess the Japanese have been brainwashed over the years to worship whites.

In reality, China has done nothing to Japan - while Japan has done many bad things to China. Yet, China is the "threat"? This can only be explained by Western propaganda.



\( o)/
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rahul1000
post Nov 3 2011, 09:54 PM
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The United States defeated Japan and been the only country to have been nuked and has had American troops on its soil for over 60 years now.

The U.S has wanted to keep Japan "safe" from Communism that took over China.

I'm sure there has been brainwashing and propaganda to make the Japanese like the U.S, especially since its been subjugated by them.
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chiuchimu
post Nov 3 2011, 09:58 PM
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QUOTE (machpunch777 @ Nov 3 2011, 09:16 PM) *
opinion of U.S compared to china?

Considering in WWII the atom bombs fat man and little boy killed at least 200,000 people. While us chinese only defended our homeland against foreign invaders.

since when have chinese people ever done any wrong against the japanese?


Where are the stats showing this? I've never heard Japanese people talk ill of Chinese even in private conversations. I'm not saying there is no racist against China of course there is racist against everybody. But, seeing a few hundred protest against China on TV and what real people talk about are two different things. Compare that to 1 in ten of the older Japanese men are racist against Korea. I don't know what it is but a small portion of the older generation has mean feelings towards Korea while the vast majority of Japanese have positive or neutral feelings about Korea.

China is not a target of hatred in Japan. Now, Japan doesn't view Chinese culture in the same light as Chinese do but that's not hatred. for example, Shaolin Kung Fu is viewed with honor and respect among Chinese. It is something that Chinese hold in great pride. Japanese are also blown away by Kung Fu but NOT in the same way. Japanese view Kung Fu in the same sense as watching acrobats or a circus show. Things like this could lead Chinese to think Japan is disrespecting China. Things like that could lead to misunderstandings.


The current territorial aggressive actions of China does worry Japan as well as the rest of Asia. This is at the core of mistrust of Chinese governments intentions. But that's how Japan feels about the Chinese government - not the Chinese people.


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machpunch777
post Nov 3 2011, 10:04 PM
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QUOTE (chiuchimu @ Nov 3 2011, 10:58 PM) *
Where are the stats showing this? I've never heard Japanese people talk ill of Chinese even in private conversations. I'm not saying there is no racist against China of course there is racist against everybody. But, seeing a few hundred protest against China on TV and what real people talk about are two different things. Compare that to 1 in ten of the older Japanese men are racist against Korea. I don't know what it is but a small portion of the older generation has mean feelings towards Korea while the vast majority of Japanese have positive or neutral feelings about Korea.

China is not a target of hatred in Japan. Now, Japan doesn't view Chinese culture in the same light as Chinese do but that's not hatred. for example, Shaolin Kung Fu is viewed with honor and respect among Chinese. It is something that Chinese hold in great pride. Japanese are also blown away by Kung Fu but NOT in the same way. Japanese view Kung Fu in the same sense as watching acrobats or a circus show. Things like this could lead Chinese to think Japan is disrespecting China. Things like that could lead to misunderstandings.


The current territorial aggressive actions of China does worry Japan as well as the rest of Asia. This is at the core of mistrust of Chinese governments intentions. But that's how Japan feels about the Chinese government - not the Chinese people.


i never said anything about japanese actually hating china. im saying that i feel like japanese have a more favorable opinion of U.S compared to china and how I think that is rather ironic given historical circumstances.

i don't have stats showing this. only my gut feeling

This post has been edited by machpunch777: Nov 3 2011, 10:05 PM
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machpunch777
post Nov 3 2011, 10:14 PM
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lol here is a poll from 2006:



source: http://www.pewglobal.org/2006/09/21/public...of-one-another/

according to this japanese probably has a higher opinion of U.S than china (only 21% of japanese are favorable towards china)

also, how is it that japanese can have a lower opinion of china than china has a lower opinion of japan?

what did china even do other than defend itself? anyone else see the irony in this?

This post has been edited by machpunch777: Nov 3 2011, 10:22 PM
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Yerroperil
post Nov 4 2011, 02:04 AM
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QUOTE (chiuchimu @ Nov 3 2011, 09:58 PM) *
Where are the stats showing this? I've never heard Japanese people talk ill of Chinese even in private conversations. I'm not saying there is no racist against China of course there is racist against everybody. But, seeing a few hundred protest against China on TV and what real people talk about are two different things. Compare that to 1 in ten of the older Japanese men are racist against Korea. I don't know what it is but a small portion of the older generation has mean feelings towards Korea while the vast majority of Japanese have positive or neutral feelings about Korea.

China is not a target of hatred in Japan. Now, Japan doesn't view Chinese culture in the same light as Chinese do but that's not hatred. for example, Shaolin Kung Fu is viewed with honor and respect among Chinese. It is something that Chinese hold in great pride. Japanese are also blown away by Kung Fu but NOT in the same way. Japanese view Kung Fu in the same sense as watching acrobats or a circus show. Things like this could lead Chinese to think Japan is disrespecting China. Things like that could lead to misunderstandings.


The current territorial aggressive actions of China does worry Japan as well as the rest of Asia. This is at the core of mistrust of Chinese governments intentions. But that's how Japan feels about the Chinese government - not the Chinese people.

Chinese I met even the younger generations don't like Japan because of what Japan did to China in ww2(go to the Nanjing Massacre Memorial Hall) ,hell China never invaded Japan unless you count the Yuan dynasty as Chinese while in reality it was the mongols who forced Koreans and Chinese to wage war only to drown. lol how ironic that Japanese are worried about territorial aggressiveness,Chinese are regaining their lost islands and seas,unlike Japan which invaded foreign lands that were never under Japanese control.
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Boron
post Nov 4 2011, 03:08 AM
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QUOTE (machpunch777 @ Nov 3 2011, 11:14 PM) *
lol here is a poll from 2006:



source: http://www.pewglobal.org/2006/09/21/public...of-one-another/

according to this japanese probably has a higher opinion of U.S than china (only 21% of japanese are favorable towards china)

also, how is it that japanese can have a lower opinion of china than china has a lower opinion of japan?

what did china even do other than defend itself? anyone else see the irony in this?

That survey looks rubbish. The pakistan numbers can't be right. They're usually at least 80% favorable on China in other surveys.
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KraterosHellas
post Nov 4 2011, 04:21 AM
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US is seen as the world's most powerful military power because of those atom bombs. also i think US men have a reputation for being muscular, athletic, romantic and exotic in japan. there's also the cultural influence, the longetivity of their alliance and the general fact that japan worships white men. i don't think they hate china or anything, just apathetic
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pochi
post Nov 4 2011, 12:30 PM
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QUOTE (chiuchimu @ Nov 4 2011, 11:58 AM) *
The current territorial aggressive actions of China does worry Japan as well as the rest of Asia. This is at the core of mistrust of Chinese governments intentions. But that's how Japan feels about the Chinese government - not the Chinese people.


That's true.
I'd say most of japanese don't trust the current c cp at all due mainly to its anti-japan education.

This post has been edited by pochi: Nov 4 2011, 12:44 PM
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chiuchimu
post Nov 4 2011, 10:00 PM
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QUOTE (machpunch777 @ Nov 3 2011, 10:14 PM) *
lol here is a poll from 2006:



source: http://www.pewglobal.org/2006/09/21/public...of-one-another/

according to this japanese probably has a higher opinion of U.S than china (only 21% of japanese are favorable towards china)

also, how is it that japanese can have a lower opinion of china than china has a lower opinion of japan?

what did china even do other than defend itself? anyone else see the irony in this?


Favorable and unfavorable is not the type of questioner I'd would have asked. Most Asian nations including Japan are worried what the Chinese government plans to do in the future.

What about questions like:
What do you think about the Chinese government?
What do you think about the Chinese people?
Would you like to go to China on Vacation?
Would you rather marry an American or a Chinese?


I will say that currently, Japanese Government and the Japanese citizen will Allie with the American Government over the Chinese Government because they perceive the current Chinese government unpredictable and aggressive. Reading what Chinese like Yerroperil have to say only confirms that China's aggressive actions are being supported more and more by the people. That is what 70% unfavorable really is about.








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qnpfr
post Nov 4 2011, 10:39 PM
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QUOTE (Yerroperil @ Nov 4 2011, 01:04 AM) *
Chinese I met even the younger generations don't like Japan because of what Japan did to China in ww2(go to the Nanjing Massacre Memorial Hall) ,hell China never invaded Japan unless you count the Yuan dynasty as Chinese while in reality it was the mongols who forced Koreans and Chinese to wage war only to drown. lol how ironic that Japanese are worried about territorial aggressiveness,Chinese are regaining their lost islands and seas,unlike Japan which invaded foreign lands that were never under Japanese control.

china threatened to use force against vietnam and philippines during the recent incident over spratley
u don't think other nations would see that as a threat?
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Yerroperil
post Nov 5 2011, 06:47 AM
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QUOTE (chiuchimu @ Nov 4 2011, 10:00 PM) *
Reading what Chinese like Yerroperil have to say only confirms that China's aggressive actions are being supported more and more by the people. That is what 70% unfavorable really is about.

At least the islands that China claim have been recorded to be under Chinese jurisdiction,I'm not going to comment on the seas,personally I don't get why people can own seas and oceans... Unlike Japan who invaded and took over Korea,Taiwan and parts of China for no reason...
QUOTE (qnpfr @ Nov 4 2011, 10:39 PM) *
china threatened to use force against vietnam and philippines during the recent incident over spratley
u don't think other nations would see that as a threat?

All I seen is one article trying to justify war,China is just trying to write what people want to hear(nationalism is a cheap substitute for communism),I don't think the CPP is stupid enough to wage war.

This post has been edited by Yerroperil: Nov 5 2011, 06:49 AM
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KraterosHellas
post Nov 5 2011, 10:44 PM
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QUOTE (chiuchimu @ Nov 4 2011, 11:00 PM) *
Favorable and unfavorable is not the type of questioner I'd would have asked. Most Asian nations including Japan are worried what the Chinese government plans to do in the future.

What about questions like:
What do you think about the Chinese government?
What do you think about the Chinese people?
Would you like to go to China on Vacation?
Would you rather marry an American or a Chinese?


I will say that currently, Japanese Government and the Japanese citizen will Allie with the American Government over the Chinese Government because they perceive the current Chinese government unpredictable and aggressive. Reading what Chinese like Yerroperil have to say only confirms that China's aggressive actions are being supported more and more by the people. That is what 70% unfavorable really is about.

correction: they've been manipulated by the US to perceive current chinese government as unpredictable and aggressive
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TheWhiteDevil
post Nov 6 2011, 04:54 PM
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Well I think its just a matter of hostility between the two nations. China certainly has more reason to dislike the Japanese, but I think its grown to become a mutual dislike. Japan sees China as unpredictable or aggressive. This is not to say that America isn't aggressive, but they are more predictable in that region.

In the last 60 years, America has adopted a very unique plan with Japan. Mostly this was out of fear to keep Japan from turning communistic. Regardless, whatever the reasons, both countries have embraced a lot of the same values in recent years. In America, it is rare to find anyone that dislikes Japan (Maybe some old WWII vets). Every friend I talk to LOVES japan and would love to visit there. The women, manga/anime, Japanese horror films, video games, pokemon and entertainment has really coaxed Americans into loving the Japanese culture. Its very common (Myself included) to have Japanese art, samurai swords, ect in their home as direction. One of my friends had a whole book shelf with manga books. Now I doubt any Japanese tote any american decorations in their home, but I think most of the Japanese realize the American opinion of them. I also think the Japanese realize the Chinese opinion of them. It has unfortunately created a sort of rivalry. Gary and ash?

Its hard to dislike and hate someone that likes you in return.

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SkyBurial
post Nov 6 2011, 05:56 PM
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Exactly. It doesn't even matter what he is, he's a troll and that's all there is to it.
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qwerty2010
post Nov 7 2011, 12:03 AM
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No one will ever know for sure the background of the trolls - the whole point of trolling is deception, manipulation of opinions and trouble-making, so DON'T FEED THE TROLLS, as that's what they're after.

As for the topic, tbh, public opinion and views are extremely easy to manipulate and shape, you don't even need a lot of investments or efforts, just exercise some control and influence over some of the most popular media, and sure enough, a naked invasion of another sovereign state half the world away can be spun into a benign "liberation".

Of course Japan's politicians and media are firmly under the control of the US behind the scenes, even the DP's top politicians make their regular pilgrimage to Washington, so there's no doubt that there will be a lot of fear-mongering about China and whitewashing of the US and its allies. And most Americans don't even know about this or support such interventions.

This is what I'm taught:

Be glad when the other underestimates you and thinks of you as inferior - sure it is humiliating and a blow to your pride, but it means you are left alone to make your own progress undisturbed and secure your advantage.

Be wary when the other magnifies you, praises you and kisses up to you - it feels good to be "polished" and amplified, but it means they are plotting your downfall. Look at Tom Friedman, a Neocon whom I despise SO MUCH.....he was singing praises about China's achievement in every aspect, technology, healthcare, etc. in the NYTimes all the time, it felt good to a lot of Chinese but he is in fact making China appear a bigger competitor to the West, and this is his true intentions on the same side as Brzezinski's Grand Chessboard:

QUOTE
As Friedman put it:

America today needs much more cost-efficient ways to influence geopolitics in Asia than keeping troops there indefinitely. We need to better leverage the natural competitions in this region to our ends. There is more than one way to play The Great Game, and we need to learn it. [2]


http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/02/opinion/...tml?_r=2&hp

Cheap way to "check" China by an impoverished USA governed by Nobel Peace Prize Laureate is to destabilize the Asian region, making use of the "natural competitions" among Asians, don't even need troops like in Afghanistan and Iraq! China's neighbours shouldn't be too happy about this - they're just pawns, and when the giant is sufficiently set back, they're next in line to be fleeced, as power abhors a vacuum, and it *will* be filled by another giant which is indebted, hungry and cash-strapped.


More here:

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China/MK05Ad02.html

Finally, if the other accurately sizes you up, your strengths and weaknesses, then it shows wisdom, honesty and judgment, and is either a worthy ally or a worthy rival.

Unfortunately, China simply has to live with this for now. There are however, also many Japanese and other Asian neighbours who think independently. The future for the neighboring countries going forward in peace lies in those in Asia who understand perfectly this dynamic, and are willing to be patient and wait for the waning of such influences and control.

Meanwhile, the less misunderstanding and mud-flinging, the better. We're all proud people, if we think so highly of ourselves, perhaps we should also act and behave accordingly, disagree with each other but in a respectful manner.

This post has been edited by qwerty2010: Nov 7 2011, 02:19 AM
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DOUBLEMINT
post Nov 7 2011, 02:04 AM
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Chiuchimu lives in this little bubble where japanese people are kind and nice,but please dont forget its the same "kind and nice" japanese people decided to invade china and murdered tens and millions of people.

This post has been edited by DOUBLEMINT: Nov 7 2011, 02:22 AM
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KraterosHellas
post Nov 8 2011, 09:01 AM
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QUOTE (qwerty2010 @ Nov 7 2011, 12:03 AM) *
No one will ever know for sure the background of the trolls - the whole point of trolling is deception, manipulation of opinions and trouble-making, so DON'T FEED THE TROLLS, as that's what they're after.

As for the topic, tbh, public opinion and views are extremely easy to manipulate and shape, you don't even need a lot of investments or efforts, just exercise some control and influence over some of the most popular media, and sure enough, a naked invasion of another sovereign state half the world away can be spun into a benign "liberation".

Of course Japan's politicians and media are firmly under the control of the US behind the scenes, even the DP's top politicians make their regular pilgrimage to Washington, so there's no doubt that there will be a lot of fear-mongering about China and whitewashing of the US and its allies. And most Americans don't even know about this or support such interventions.

This is what I'm taught:

Be glad when the other underestimates you and thinks of you as inferior - sure it is humiliating and a blow to your pride, but it means you are left alone to make your own progress undisturbed and secure your advantage.

Be wary when the other magnifies you, praises you and kisses up to you - it feels good to be "polished" and amplified, but it means they are plotting your downfall. Look at Tom Friedman, a Neocon whom I despise SO MUCH.....he was singing praises about China's achievement in every aspect, technology, healthcare, etc. in the NYTimes all the time, it felt good to a lot of Chinese but he is in fact making China appear a bigger competitor to the West, and this is his true intentions on the same side as Brzezinski's Grand Chessboard:



http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/02/opinion/...tml?_r=2&hp

Cheap way to "check" China by an impoverished USA governed by Nobel Peace Prize Laureate is to destabilize the Asian region, making use of the "natural competitions" among Asians, don't even need troops like in Afghanistan and Iraq! China's neighbours shouldn't be too happy about this - they're just pawns, and when the giant is sufficiently set back, they're next in line to be fleeced, as power abhors a vacuum, and it *will* be filled by another giant which is indebted, hungry and cash-strapped.


More here:

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China/MK05Ad02.html

Finally, if the other accurately sizes you up, your strengths and weaknesses, then it shows wisdom, honesty and judgment, and is either a worthy ally or a worthy rival.

Unfortunately, China simply has to live with this for now. There are however, also many Japanese and other Asian neighbours who think independently. The future for the neighboring countries going forward in peace lies in those in Asia who understand perfectly this dynamic, and are willing to be patient and wait for the waning of such influences and control.

Meanwhile, the less misunderstanding and mud-flinging, the better. We're all proud people, if we think so highly of ourselves, perhaps we should also act and behave accordingly, disagree with each other but in a respectful manner.

of course. this "natural competition" explains clearly why US hasn't invaded china yet. they're going to use japan to destroy china.
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