Luzon as the Lesser Song Dynasty and related topics, Not for Sinophobes. Options

[ocrapdm]

The Luzon Empire (呂宋國)

Written History:
In 1279 AD, in the Naval Battle of Yamen (崖門戰役) at the Pearl River Delta (珠江), the final conflict between the Mongol Forces (元) and the Southern Sung Empire (南宋國) was fought. The Mongol forces managed to advance to the center of the Southern Sung fleet and attack the boat of the child emperor Songdi Bing (宋帝昺). Seeing no hope of breaking free, the Minister of the Left (重臣) Liu Xiufu (陸秀夫) decided to commit suicide with the boy emperor rather than be captured by the Mongols. He jumped into the sea with the boy emperor and many officials and concubines followed suit. A few days later, the tattered remains of the boy emperor was found floating in Shekou Bay(蛇口). This sealed the fate of the Southern Song Empire.

Purported Oral History:
Before the final sea battle at Yamen (崖門戰役), Minister of the Left Liu Xiufu (陸秀夫) disguised his own son to look like the boy emperor Songdi Bing (宋帝昺). When the Mongols finally managed to attack the center of the Southern Sung fleet, Liu Xiufu committed suicide with his own son disguised as the emperor. The finest and most loyal of the Southern Sung fleet under the command of Grand General Zhang Shijie (張世傑). managed to break off from the battle with the real emperor and escape across the sea. There they established the Lesser Song Empire (呂宋國) at its capital Tondo (東都).

Facts:
1. Even though the corpse of the last emperor of the Southern Song Empire was reportedly found, no graveyard was ever erected.
2. Chinese historians agree that the Southern Sung Fleet under the command of Grand General Zhang Shijie (張世傑) did survive the final Battle of Yamen (崖門戰役) and that they simply vanished from record.
3. Tondo (東都) was the capital of an empire recorded by the Ming Dynasty (大明國) as the Luzon Empire (呂宋國).
4. Luzon Empire (呂宋國) was conquered by the Spaniards in 1571 and the province of Pampanga was the first colonial province carved out of it. The whole northern island was named Luzon. Tondo (東都) still exist today as a mere suburb of Manila.

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"The Philippines then was made up of many little kingdoms with chieftains who were friendly or hostile to each other, but who recognized each other's independence. Trade and commerce was carried on among themselves and with foreigners. The Chinese, Japanese, Arabs, Siamese, Sumatrans and other neighboring traders had brought to the country their various customs and cultures, without attempting to bring the authority of their kings."


Certain tribes such as Tinggianes and Sambals have even the same hairstyles as the Chinese.

Even as Legaspi conquered the various kingdoms of Luzon, he noticed that there are already hundreds of thousands of Chinese concentrated in the central plains and western coasts of Luzon, either living in the city-states of the natives, OR LIVING IN THEIR OWN CITY-STATES. SO with regard to the last sentence, DO CHINESE have the right to the PHILIPPINES? THE ANSWER IS A RESOUNDING YES!

The Philippines belongs not only to the Taiwanese Aboriginal descendants or Malays but ALSO to the Chinese who settled here.

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Ming annals have reported kingdoms in Luzon and called their kings as "wang" / "ong" (in Hokkien). If not for their Chinese connection, they would be called and treated as "barbarian rulers".

The following selection talks about internal politics (and way of life including crimes) in Luzon and the large numbers and way of life of the Hokkien in Luzon. It also attests the closeness of Luzon to Zhangzhou (Fujian province).

The Ming Annals about Luzon in Chinese:
http://web.archive.org/web/20080618154044/...ztyz/ms323.html

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"Duck culture was also practiced by the natives, particularly those around Pateros and Taguig City. This resembled the Chinese methods of artificial incubation of eggs and the knowledge of every phase of a duck's life. This tradition is carried on until modern times."

"Some of them used compass similar to those used among maritime communities of Borneo and traders of China, although most had no need for such devices."

Even agricultural and farming methods in the Philippines were reportedly brought over from Mainland China, according to Prof. Arsenio Manuel and many archaeologists.

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The Haplotype O3 in many Filipinos (especially in Luzon) also attests to a migration from Mainland China.

The premier ruler of Luzon come from a long line of rulers (mixed Bruneian-Chinese) who settled in what is now Pampanga. They thus share bloodlinks with the present Brunei royalty, as well as with the royalties of Tang Dynasty and Song Dynasty of China. If you take a look at it, ALL the world's royalties are interrelated to one another, and this includes the original Chinese ruler of Luzon who intermarried with a Bruneian sultan and eventually gave rise to the Luzon Empire/Kingdom.

Kapampangans have oral traditions about the existence of a large "empire" that traded with other nations. Yes, this is the Lesser Song Dynasty of China, eventually localized into the Liu-sung-kuo, or Luzon Empire.

Manila north of Pasig River was still Kapampangan during the 1500s. Only around 1600s did the Tagalogs capitulated the Kapampangans and occupied Manila, Bulacan, Bataan, and Nueva Ecija. Otherwise, all these are Kapampangan territory. Kapampangans are largely descendants of AMI PEOPLE FROM TAIWAN, not Malay immigrants. On the other hand, Tagalogs and Visayans are partly Malays. Tagalogs were considered to be a Visayan people before (and up to now, pure linguists consider Tagalog to be a Visayan language). Tagalog region during the 1500s only consisted of Batangas up to the Pasig River in Manila, and a few plains in Laguna. Large swathes of Rizal and Quezon then were still largely Negrito/Proto-Ainuid/Australoid.

There were many city-states (city-kingdoms) in Luzon then. The city-states were not only made by natives - in fact, there were A LOT OF CITY-STATES FOUNDED BY JAPANESE, SIAMESE, and CHINESE MIGRANTS!

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So as you can see, the forced imposition of Malay ideals and supposed Malay connection to Luzon is stupid. Luzon is mostly Taiwanese Aboriginal with Chinese and of course, the usual Australoid suspects again. And the haplotypes attests to this.

The reason Luzon natives don't look Chinese for obvious reasons is that Luzonians, like other Filipino peoples, have heavy Australoid admixtures (6-35%, depending on the source), but still, that does not justify the willful erasure of the Chinese origins of the Luzon empire or the Chinese connection of Luzon's peoples.

This post has been edited by ocrapdm: Jan 11 2012, 09:17 PM

[moppom]

how is it that you have time to write this, but dont have time to

a) answer the chinese posters who write to you in chinese

b) explain what "yo habla espanol" means

c) explain why your chinese school has a lot of spanish mestizos

d) explain how you have delicate and soft eurasian features, yet your "chinese relatives are pango."

e) explain why you continue to pretend you are chinese, when you blatantly stated 3 years ago, "No, I'm not Chinoy."

[ocrapdm]

how is it that you have time to write this, but dont have time to

a) answer the chinese posters who write to you in chinese

b) explain what "yo habla espanol" means

c) explain why your chinese school has a lot of spanish mestizos

d) explain how you have delicate and soft eurasian features, yet your "chinese relatives are pango."

e) explain why you continue to pretend you are chinese, when you blatantly stated 3 years ago, "No, I'm not Chinoy."

a) LOL. I did. I even answered one as soon as he posted it.
b) Like I said, it was a typographical error.
c) I did not say that it has LOTS of Spanish Mestizos. I said it has SOME.
d) Well well, a pure pango Pinoy can surely have a Mestizo Eurasian cousin, isn't that right? LOL
e) Chinoy has several meanings. You keep on posting that phrase and yet you never posted the next sentence: "I'm not Chinoy, but I am of Chinese ancestry". By that I referred to Chinoy as 1/2 Chinese and 1/2 Pinoy.

So my question to you is: Why, PinkCream, do you keep harassing users here? I already answered YOUR stupid questions. Sooner or later, if you won't stop your harassment, you're gonna get banned, including your IP.

And don't derail the discussion. I won't mind if you didn't reply to my questions above.

This post has been edited by ocrapdm: Jan 11 2012, 10:34 PM

[moppom]

a) LOL. I did. I even answered one as soon as he posted it.
b) Like I said, it was a typographical error.
c) I did not say that it has LOTS of Spanish Mestizos. I said it has SOME.
d) Well well, a pure pango Pinoy can surely have a Mestizo Eurasian cousin, isn't that right? LOL
e) Chinoy has several meanings. You keep on posting that phrase and yet you never posted the next sentence: "I'm not Chinoy, but I am of Chinese ancestry". By that I referred to Chinoy as 1/2 Chinese and 1/2 Pinoy.

So my question to you is: Why, PinkCream, do you keep harassing users here? I already answered YOUR stupid questions. Sooner or later, if you won't stop your harassment, you're gonna get banned, including your IP.

And don't derail the discussion. I won't mind if you didn't reply to my questions above.

a) thats odd, from what im reading, most chinese posters conclude that you are not chinese due to basic amateur mistakes, which all point to a 100% google translated sentence

b) No - you said it was actually correct - only to flip flop to your current stance that it was typographical - besides how can it be a typo if a is nowhere next to o on the keyboard?

c) You can't flip flop your story and say "a lot" means "some" - first of all you refuse to address the fact that your chinese school has spanish mestizos at all, which in itself is highly suspect. Second, this is a complete 180 from what you said before. You used to go on about how your school was all chinese with some tagalog - then you added in koreans to try avoid getting caught, then even worse, you added in spanish mestizos lmao..

d) technically correct - although your sentence implies that you [supposedly 87.5% chinese] have 100% pango chinese relatives..I repeat: "My chinese relatives are pango."

e) lmao - you cant all of a sudden change the benchmarks. What your sentence implies is that you do not have enough chinese blood to consider yourself chinese, but you do after all have some chinese blood. Which may or may not be true - the fact is that even if you do, it is not enough for you to truly consider yourself chinese. Besides, what chinese blood you do have, you admitted that your chinese relatives are pango!! [YOU said it, not me ]




There is a plethora of statements made by you in the past which completely contradicts everything you are saying today. Mind you, this is only the tip of the iceberg, as this was only 5 of about 10 or 12 contradictions you made....the most interesting of which is how you went from illiterate to fluent to advanced spanish all in the space of one week !

[ocrapdm]

a) thats odd, from what im reading, most chinese posters conclude that you are not chinese due to basic amateur mistakes, which all point to a 100% google translated sentence

b) No - you said it was actually correct - only to flip flop to your current stance that it was typographical - besides how can it be a typo if a is nowhere next to o on the keyboard?

c) You can't flip flop your story and say "a lot" means "some" - first of all you refuse to address the fact that your chinese school has spanish mestizos at all, which in itself is highly suspect. Second, this is a complete 180 from what you said before. You used to go on about how your school was all chinese with some tagalog - then you added in koreans to try avoid getting caught, then even worse, you added in spanish mestizos lmao..

d) technically correct - although your sentence implies that you [supposedly 87.5% chinese] have 100% pango chinese relatives..I repeat: "My chinese relatives are pango."

e) lmao - you cant all of a sudden change the benchmarks. What your sentence implies is that you do not have enough chinese blood to consider yourself chinese, but you do after all have some chinese blood. Which may or may not be true - the fact is that even if you do, it is not enough for you to truly consider yourself chinese. Besides, what chinese blood you do have, you admitted that your chinese relatives are pango!! [YOU said it, not me ]

There is a plethora of statements made by you in the past which completely contradicts everything you are saying today. Mind you, this is only the tip of the iceberg, as this was only 5 of about 10 or 12 contradictions you made....the most interesting of which is how you went from illiterate to fluent to advanced spanish all in the space of one week !

a) Oh really? The fact is that they said I made ONLY ONE mistake. And you see, that ONE mistake is due to the fact that Mandarin and Hokkien initially didn't share the same writing system. As ONE Hokkien in that thread later confirmed, the article "chhi-ge" is really USED in Hokkienese language. Even Cantonese and Mandarin writing systems don't always match. I can give you a lot of examples but it simply isn't worth the time...

b) I already said what is needed to be said. If you don't accept it, then don't. JUST DON'T DERAIL THIS THREAD, OK?

c) What all Chinese? It IS a Chinese school alright. But that doesn't preclude Tagalogs, Koreans, and those with Spanish ancestry from entering the school. Of course all Chinese schools somehow would have SOME students of Spanish ancestry - after all, this is the Philippines, a former Spanish colony. And besides, the Spanish Mestizos I am talking about are mostly Chinese-Spanish, NOT Filipino-Spanish.

d) I said that of the pango relatives I have are those who are Chinese. This is vastly different from saying that ALL my Chinese relatives are pango.

e) Like I said, not Chinoy means 1/2 Chinese-1/2 Filipino. You see, all old members here know that I am Chinese since the outset. If you're not convinced, then don't believe me. LOL

f) What Spanish-illiterate? Like I said before, I can read Spanish books, and in fact, I do read Spanish books.


And even if I deliberately chose to lie about my identity (which isn't the case anyway), WHAT IS THAT TO YOU?!?! Are you my KEEPER?

And honestly, I don't see why a Filipino would like to claim to be PURE Chinese. Only the ones who are Chinese would claim to be so.

This is my last reply to you, considering you're here to DERAIL THIS TOPIC.

If you hate the Chinese (which you do, considering your White heritage), you better get out of the Philippines because like it or not, the Philippines, whatever it is now, is partly based on its Chinese heritage. LOL. Just LOL.

This post has been edited by ocrapdm: Jan 12 2012, 05:47 AM