Why Do Tibetans Choose to Make their own Hell?, The Dalai Lama has not condemned self immolation - why? Options

[elleX0]

Why do Tibetans challenge the PRC all the time when they know that the PRC will never change their minds? Are Tibetans masochistic or just suicidal? It is the intransigent attitude of the Dalai Lama that puts his followers at risk. No one else is responsible for such foolhardy actions. The Responsibility lies entirely with the Dalai Lama.

It is the Dalai Lama with the help of the CIA that is causing great sufferings to the People of Tibet.

China steps up security in Tibet following protests

Security has been stepped up in Sichuan following the protests last week, activists say
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A senior Chinese official has ordered tighter security in Tibetan Buddhist monasteries and on main roads following deadly protests in Sichuan province.

Lhasa Communist Party Secretary Qi Zhala also warned of a crackdown on those involved in "separatist, destructive and criminal" activities.

The move came after protesters clashed with security forces in parts of Sichuan province last week.

At least three people are reported to have died, with dozens more injured.

Sichuan province borders Tibet and several areas have large ethnic Tibetan communities.

'Strike hard'
Mr Qi called on police to step up security at monasteries to prevent further unrest.

"We must strike hard at all the separatist, destructive and criminal activities of the Dalai clique and make efforts to realise our goal of not letting any incident, big or small, occur," he said in a speech published on the Lhasa government website.

He was referring to Tibet's exiled spiritual leader, the Dalai Lama.

Continue reading the main story
The Tibet Divide

China says Tibet was always part of its territory
Tibet enjoyed long periods of autonomy before 20th Century
In 1950, China launched a military assault
Opposition to Chinese rule led to a bloody uprising in 1959
Tibet's spiritual leader, the Dalai Lama, fled to India
Dalai Lama now advocates a "middle way" with Beijing, seeking autonomy but not independence
"Lhasa officials and functionaries at all levels, especially the police, must increase... efforts to rationally dispatch police forces and step up registration and inspection work along national roads, at key monasteries and among leading suspects."

The BBC's Martin Patience says these comments highlight Beijing's growing concern that the recent unrest could spread.

Observers say the recent violence is the most serious outbreak of anti-government protest among Tibetans in nearly four years.

Tibetan areas of Sichuan are said to remain extremely tense. Since March 2011, at least 16 Tibetans have set themselves on fire in apparent protest against Beijing's rule.

Last week three violent protests were reported in the province.

China said that one protester was killed on 23 January in a confrontation with security forces in Draggo county, known as Luhuo in Chinese.


China also confirmed that a Tibetan was shot dead by security forces in Seda county on 25 January, the second incident of unrest that week.

And just last week, a man in Aba prefecture was also reportedly shot dead during a protest.

Tibetan campaign groups, however, say that the number of Tibetans shot dead is higher than the Chinese government's count. The figures are hard to verify because foreign journalists are not allowed to enter areas of unrest in Sichuan.

The Chinese government claims that protesters in Draggo and Seda attacked police stations. But rights groups said that the marches were peaceful protests.

The groups say the protests are a sign of rising frustration among Tibetans because of growing religious repression and harsh security measures adopted by China.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-16805695
I believe that the Dalai Lama and Lobsang Sangay are both allowing "self Immolation" for their own personal propaganda gains. This is unforgivable. Neither the Dalai Lama nor Lobsang Sangay have openly banned "self immolation" and un-Buddhist act.

By Vishal Arora
Religion News Service

DHARMSALA, India (RNS) At least three Tibetan Buddhist monks drank gasoline and set themselves ablaze in January, bringing the count of self-immolations to 15 since March 2011.

Lobsang Sangay, the prime minister of the Tibetan government-in-exile, attributes the deaths to restrictions being imposed by the Chinese government on traditional Tibetan practices.

The U.S. State Department has raised concerns over the self-immolations. However, Beijing, which regards Tibet as part of China, alleges that Tibetan exiles are encouraging the monastic community to take this extreme step, disregarding the Buddhist principle of non-violence.

Sangay, a former scholar from Harvard Law School and the political successor of the Dalai Lama, spoke about religious restrictions and self-immolation in Tibet. Some answers have been edited for length and clarity.

Q: Why are monks and nuns self-immolating in Tibet?

A: Repressive policies of China have pushed them to the brink of desperation. Members of the Communist Party of China dictate what monks and nuns should do, how they should pray, and who should be allowed into the monasteries.


Those who give up worldly life to join a monastery see their follow monks as their world, their family. When they see their associates being expelled because they refused to denounce His Holiness the Dalai Lama or to stamp on his photograph, hopelessness sinks in. When they think their sufferings are not being noted, they take such a desperate step.

Q: Does Buddhism allow self-immolation?

A: It's a complex issue. One could refer to Jataka tales, which concern the previous births of the Buddha. In one story, the Buddha, in a previous incarnation, gives up his body to feed a starving tigress and her four cubs. Some other stories also talk about self-sacrifice by the Buddha.

Although suicide is violent and prohibited in Buddhism, some Buddhists believe it depends on the motivation. If you do it out of hatred and anger, then it is negative. But if you do it for a pure cause ... it's such a complex theological issue. You can't go either way or have a definitive answer. But the action is tragic, so painful.

Q: Do you discourage monks setting themselves ablaze?

A: My stand on self immolation is the same as that of the Dalai Lama, who has always discouraged drastic actions by Tibetans. He does not even endorse hunger strikes.

Q: Can you stop the wave of self-immolations?

A: I am expected to do something about it, but it has been challenging, difficult and painful. As a human being, it is so difficult to hear someone dying for a cause. And as a Buddhist, it is even more painful.

I went to the United Stated and Europe to get statements of support so that I could send a message of hope to Tibet. I tried my best to get everything I did covered by the Tibetan media. And during my visit -- almost until the last leg of my trip -- self-immolations stopped. I thought I was able to pass on the message of hope. But when I was in London, I heard there was one more self-immolation. That dampened my mood. I cancelled all my appointments for that morning.

Q: Do you see a solution to the Tibet-China conflict in sight?

A: I do believe so. That's why I have left Harvard to be in India to lead the movement. The Tibetan struggle has to go on. Had I not moved to India, where I am living on about $300 a month, my life would have been normal and boring.

One Buddhist lesson I have learned is that one who is born has to die. That means what you do is what you leave behind. If you live for yourself, you won't make much difference. I, as a Buddhist, as a Tibetan, want to live for a cause greater than myself and my life.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/25/l..._n_1231954.html

This post has been edited by elleX0: Feb 6 2012, 03:59 AM

[devils666]

Why do Tibetans challenge the PRC all the time when they know that the PRC will never change their minds? Are Tibetans masochistic or just suicidal? It is the intransigent attitude of the Dalai Lama that puts his followers at risk. No one else is responsible for such foolhardy actions. The Responsibility lies entirely with the Dalai Lama.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-16805695

Why do cultists committ mass suicide? Why do cultists murder other people? Why do cultists believe in stupid $hit. Who knows? The Dalai Lama cult is no exception to the "children of god" cult.

You should read the comments on Yahoo news - it's crazy!

[phop]

Why do cultists committ mass suicide? Why do cultists murder other people? Why do cultists believe in stupid $hit. Who knows? The Dalai Lama cult is no exception to the "children of god" cult.

You should read the comments on Yahoo news - it's crazy!

Hail to the all mighty dalai lama, he is our lord LMFAO........

[elleX0]

Why do cultists committ mass suicide? Why do cultists murder other people? Why do cultists believe in stupid $hit. Who knows? The Dalai Lama cult is no exception to the "children of god" cult.

You should read the comments on Yahoo news - it's crazy!

So, Tibetan Buddhist is a cult. So is the PRC legitimate in removing a cult that threatens their national security? America has persecuted and condemned cults, but then why is America supporting in cult in China?

This post has been edited by elleX0: Jan 31 2012, 02:26 PM

[samnang]

Every religion is a cult. Just some are more accepted 'cause they're 1000+ years old and have a billion+ members.

Religion is a scourge that only promotes division, hate, and ignorance. I applaud China for cracking done on it.

This post has been edited by samnang: Jan 31 2012, 03:47 PM

[faydabakery]

Why do Tibetans challenge the PRC all the time when they know that the PRC will never change their minds? Are Tibetans masochistic or just suicidal? It is the intransigent attitude of the Dalai Lama that puts his followers at risk. No one else is responsible for such foolhardy actions. The Responsibility lies entirely with the Dalai Lama.

Is Mohamed Bouazizi foolish for committing suicide? It was he that inspired the Arab Spring as is considered a hero.

How about the Tradition? Why did Japanese believe in Seppuku? People find honor in death. Why should one die for one's country in combat and in the name of nationalism? People have different reasons for wanting to die prematurely.

I think everyone is responsible for their own actions. If you commit suicide for whatever reason, it's on you. You can't blame others.

[Mid-Night_Sun]

well i doubt rioting is a buddhist act either. didnt stop them in 2008.

people will say "well Chinese gov. censors and lies". but ask James Miles for the truth. he was the only one allowed in. look what he had to say.





Transcript: James Miles interview on Tibet

Q. What you say you saw corroborates the official version. What exactly did you see?

A. What I saw was calculated targeted violence against an ethnic group, or I should say two ethnic groups, primarily ethnic Han Chinese living in Lhasa, but also members of the Muslim Hui minority in Lhasa. And the Huis in Lhasa control much of the meat industry in the city. Those two groups were singled out by ethnic Tibetans.

At one point, I saw them throwing stones at a boy of maybe around 10 years old perhaps cycling along the street. I in fact walked out in front of them and said stop.



Q. There was an official response to this. In some reporting, info coming from Tibetan exiles, there was keenness to report it as Tiananmen.

A. Well the Chinese response to this was very interesting. Because you would expect at the first sings of any unrest in Lhasa, which is a city on a knife-edge at the best of times. That the response would be immediate and decisive. That they would cordon off whatever section of the city involved, that they would grab the people involved in the unrest. In fact what we saw, and I was watching it at the earliest stages, was complete inaction on the part of the authorities. It seemed as if they were paralyzed by indecision over how to handle this.

And what they did instead was let the rioting run its course and it didn't really finish as far as I saw until the middle of the day on the following day on the Saturday, March the 15th. So in effect what they did was sacrifice the livelihoods of many, many ethnic Han Chinese in the city for the sake of letting the rioters vent their anger. And then being able to move in gradually with troops with rifles that they occasionally let off with single shots, apparently warning shots, in order to scare everybody back into their homes and put an end to this.

http://articles.cnn.com/2008-03-20/world/t...asa?_s=PM:WORLD

who gets thrown under the bus in their own country by their government like han chinese were?

but nobody has any interest in what really happened because it doesnt fit the agenda. although its to their own peril. you think the Chinese people dont have any reaction when this happen in their own country? people seem to think its alllll the CPC's fault. they are oppressing everybody. i dont think any of them is aware what will happen if the Chinese people actually got their way. there are many injustices that ONLY the Han Chinese face. its not even about that. when it comes to the US coming back to Asia and bringing troops or w/e, its the Chinese government that have a calm response. the PEOPLE want a strong reaction.

it really is amusing to me that these people calling for the downfall of the communist party in favour of democracy doesnt know what the people really think and want. boy are they in for a surprise. learn something about the arab states. you replace "dictator" with what. radical islamic sharia law.







heres the most recent example i can find of the Chinese PEOPLE wanting harsh responses that the Chinese government prefers the opposite.


In recent days, users of China’s most popular microblog service, Sina Weibo, have expressed frustration with the government’s inability to help the captured workers. “If it was the United States or Russia, they would have air-dropped in special commandos by now,” one post said.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/01/world/af...g-in-sudan.html


well i guess to be fair to the CPC, its not always necessary to go in guns blazing. i JUST heard about Chinese getting kidnapped in Egypt and apparently they are already freed.

25 Chinese workers held by Egyptian locals freed
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/china/20...c_131385714.htm

This post has been edited by Mid-Night_Sun: Jan 31 2012, 08:57 PM

[oolong]

If you think about it,if chinese government just keeps not responding,chinese citizens may be less likely to be targeted in the future.So in the long run,its the smart move.

[Yearofthedragon]

(Fools like) Angeline Jolie, Sharon Stones and Richard Gere (a billionaire Budhist) and Dalai Lama is a deadly mix...for the Tibetans.

[Type98G]

The Dalai Lama wants to separate 'Greater Tibet' from China

[InitialDJay]

it's kind of hard to tell from 2nd hand sources whether tibetan do want to be part of this chinese nation or majority of them want independent. it's clear breaking off china is not a possibility. and if the qing exterminated them, then today china wouldn't have this problem. well, i guess you live with the consequence of being indecisive. there's probably two ways to deal with it, wait until dalai lama death and see what happen. another is to continue developing tibetan region and hoping those tibetans are being assimilated into the mainstream.

[ReginaRae]

Why do Tibetans challenge the PRC all the time when they know that the PRC will never change their minds? Are Tibetans masochistic or just suicidal?

Riots are the language of the unheard. When someone is under tremendous stress and inner turmoil has been wearing them thin, they will resort to drastic things. When driven to that point, people will do just about anything. I don't agree with this method; Setting yourself ablaze. It's just awful and it does upset me. The fact that Tibetans feel so helpless like this is the only thing they can do - harm themselves? Sigh. That's really depressing. But...in a way I find it admirable, as weird as that sounds. I find it admirable that they've never stopped fighting and will go this far for the cause. I admire their loyalty and their strength. I just wish they could find new ways to express their suffering to the public.

[elleX0]

it's kind of hard to tell from 2nd hand sources whether tibetan do want to be part of this chinese nation or majority of them want independent. it's clear breaking off china is not a possibility. and if the qing exterminated them, then today china wouldn't have this problem. well, i guess you live with the consequence of being indecisive. there's probably two ways to deal with it, wait until dalai lama death and see what happen. another is to continue developing tibetan region and hoping those tibetans are being assimilated into the mainstream.

You know, the solution seems so simple. If Gelugpa Buddhist Tibetans do not like the Government of China, Why don't Tibetan supporters of the Dalai Lama follow him to his new kingdom in Dharamsala?

[Yerroperil]

Riots are the language of the unheard. When someone is under tremendous stress and inner turmoil has been wearing them thin, they will resort to drastic things. When driven to that point, people will do just about anything. I don't agree with this method; Setting yourself ablaze. It's just awful and it does upset me. The fact that Tibetans feel so helpless like this is the only thing they can do - harm themselves? Sigh. That's really depressing. But...in a way I find it admirable, as weird as that sounds. I find it admirable that they've never stopped fighting and will go this far for the cause. I admire their loyalty and their strength. I just wish they could find new ways to express their suffering to the public.

Tibetans are admirable for killing Huis and Han how nice...

[elleX0]

Tibetans are admirable for killing Huis and Han how nice...

But that is OK because they are Yellow Hat Buddhists and have exemptions from heaven.

[faydabakery]

At this point its one person's word against another. If there's such an information block, how do we know that what's happening to the Han Chinese and Muslim Hui is even true? How do we know whether the Han and Hui are or are not retaliating in full force? The Chinese government is making their own hell. People in China don't even know wtf is going on over there.

[elleX0]

At this point its one person's word against another. If there's such an information block, how do we know that what's happening to the Han Chinese and Muslim Hui is even true? How do we know whether the Han and Hui are or are not retaliating in full force? The Chinese government is making their own hell. People in China don't even know wtf is going on over there.

The fact is, there are tensions between different groups in multi-ethnic China. Do we know why there are tensions? Does the Government? It is the duty of the Government to maintain peace and order in the country, but they must first know the reasons for the tensions and then solve it.

Do you know what is causing the tensions between the Hui and the Han?

[robot_devil]

Riots are the language of the unheard. When someone is under tremendous stress and inner turmoil has been wearing them thin, they will resort to drastic things. When driven to that point, people will do just about anything. I don't agree with this method; Setting yourself ablaze. It's just awful and it does upset me. The fact that Tibetans feel so helpless like this is the only thing they can do - harm themselves? Sigh. That's really depressing. But...in a way I find it admirable, as weird as that sounds. I find it admirable that they've never stopped fighting and will go this far for the cause. I admire their loyalty and their strength. I just wish they could find new ways to express their suffering to the public.

Oh just f*** off. You find what would universally be considered cult behaviour admnirable only because it is counter PRC interest. You are one disgusting person, along the lines of that hypocrite god-king the Dalai Lama. Self immolation under ANY circumstances should only be condemned. Has it even occurred to you that all cases were by the impressionable young. Monks and nuns that are rarely above their teenage years. When your opinion is not appreciated, try keeping it to yourself.

[robot_devil]

When the god-king bids for blood sacrefice......

[robot_devil]

Seriously, why hasn't that old fu-ker of a monk called for a stop?

And why has the press conveniently ignored this fact when they incessantly; "his holiness this" and "his holiness that" as if his $hit can't stink. Just sickening.

This post has been edited by robot_devil: Feb 1 2012, 10:43 AM