Penghinaan Quran... Options

[brucewayne]

Just read a news today from Berita harian...

Tentera AS cuci kasut guna al-Quran

TELUK GUANTANAMO: Tentera Amerika Syarikat di Afghanistan menggunakan halaman yang dikoyakkan dari naskhah al-Quran untuk mengesat dan menyuci kasut mereka yang kotor, kata seorang tahanan Islam di penjara Amerika di Cuba itu.
Jumah Al-Dossary, 30, salah seorang daripada enam warga Bahrain yang ditahan di penjara Guantanamo mengesahkan bahawa al-Quran dihina di kem itu manakala tahanan Islam turut menjadi mangsa penderaan seksual, lapor The Associated Press.

Al-Dossary berkata, beliau melihat dengan mata kepalanya sendiri tentera Amerika di Pangkalan Udara Tentera Amerika di Kandahar, Afghanistan membersihkan kasut mereka menggunakan kertas yang dikoyak dari naskhah al-Quran.

Menurut dokumen sulit yang baru didedahkan oleh peguamnya, Joshua Colangelo-Bryan, Al-Dossary dibelasah dan dipijak oleh lapan tentera Amerika sejurus selepas tahanan Islam itu baru menjalani pembedahan perut.

Menurut dokumen itu, pada September 2002, al-Dossary dibawa ke bilik soal siasat dan berdepan dengan empat polis tentera dengan salah seorang daripadanya membawa kamera video.

Katanya, beliau dirantai di atas lantai sebelum dilucutkan pakaian sehingga bogel atas arahan seorang penyoal siasat wanita.

“Wanita itu kemudiannya berbogel, bertinggung di atas kemaluan, dada dan muka saya sebelum dia mengesat darah haidnya ke atas badan saya bagi memaksa saya membuat pengakuan mempunyai hubungan dengan rangkaian al-Qaeda,” kata al-Dossary yang dicatatkan dalam dokumen itu.

Selepas bertemu dengan enam tahanan Bahrain di penjara Guantanamo, Colangelo-Bryan, yang baru tiba di Amerika berkata, enam lelaki itu kini bimbang mereka terpaksa merengkuk di dalam penjara itu seumur hidup.

Sementara itu, laporan terbaru menyatakan, tentera Amerika berulang kali memasukkan tiub makanan kotor ke hidung banduan yang melancarkan mogok lapar sehingga banduan itu muntah darah. – Agensi

“Mereka menjolok salur itu menerusi hidung banduan sehingga salur itu tiba ke perut berulang kali,” kata peguam yang melaporkan kejadian itu kepada hakim persekutuan Amerika pada Ogos lalu.

“Keadaan itu mengakibatkan banduan terbabit muntah darah. Apabila muntah, tentera menghina banduan dengan menyatakan, lihatlah apa yang agama kamu lakukan ke atas diri kamu,” menurut dokumen itu yang baru didedahkan, lapor Associated Press.

Warga Arab Saudi, Yousef al Shehri, 21, yang ditahan di Guantanamo, berkata pegawai memindahkan tiub itu dari seorang banduan kepada banduan lain tanpa mencucinya terlebih dulu.

Seorang lagi banduan berkata, doktor tentera menjolok tiub itu menerusi hidungnya ke perut sehingga menyebabkannya muntah darah. – Agensi


`Nauzubillah....`
Semoga Allah memberi kekuatan kpd mangsa2 penderaan.
Hanya utk menyampaikan kekejaman yg dilakukan oleh tentera Amerika ke atas saudara2 kita.

[caramel]

“U.S. soldiers cleaned their boots with Qur’an pages”

Aljazeera.com / October 22, 2005

A Bahraini detainee held at the U.S. detention center in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba revealed more sexual abuses by the American soldiers there and confirmed Qur’an desecration.

Jumah Al-Dossary, one of six Bahraini detainees the U.S. holds in Guantanamo prison said he was subject of sexual abuse. He also confirmed desecration of the Qur’an, Islam’s Holy Book, by U.S. soldiers in Afghanistan, The Associated Press reported.

Al-Dossary, 30, said he witnessed U.S. soldiers at Kandahar Air Base in Afghanistan cleaning their boots with pages they had ripped from the Holy Qur’an.

According to the recently declassified documents issued by his lawyer Joshua Colangelo-Bryan Al-Dossary, the Bahraini detainee was beaten and stamped on by eight U.S. soldiers, as he was recovering from an earlier stomach operation.

Sexual abuse

In September 2002, Al-Dossary was taken to an interrogation room where he found four MPs, one carrying a video camera. Al-Dossary said he was shackled to the floor, stripped naked on orders from a female interrogator, who stripped and squatted over his genitals, chest, and face smearing him with her menstrual blood to force him admit having links to Al-Qaeda network.

On a later occasion Al Dossary says he was forced to watch naked man and woman having sex, then offered sex with the woman if he co-operated with the interrogators, Gulf Daily News reported.

Al Dossary’s accusations of being harshly beaten and stamped on by U.S. guards have been widely reported already.

Now Al Dossary suffers heart problems, and he wakes up screaming from nightmares. He fears he has been driven to mental illness, the paper reported.

After visiting all six Bahraini detainees at Guantanamo jail, Colangelo-Bryan, who has just arrived in the U.S., says the six men fear they will stay there for the rest of their lives.

Force-fed torture

Hunger-strikers at Guantanamo jail accused U.S. guards of repeatedly inserting and removing dirty feeding tubes until the detainee would vomit blood.

According to declassified documents recently released by defense lawyers for three men held at the U.S. detention center in Cuba, the guards used feeding tubes as thick as a finger, as objects of torture.

"They were forcibly shoved up the detainees' noses and down into their stomachs," the lawyers reported to a federal judge in August. "No anesthesia or sedative was provided."

The force feedings resulted in prisoners "vomiting up substantial amounts of blood. When they vomited up blood, the soldiers mocked and cursed at them, and taunted them with statements like `look what your religion has brought you.'"

Yousef al Shehri, a 21 year-old Saudi detainee held at Guantanamo, said guards removed a nasal feeding tube from one prisoner and inserted it into another without cleaning.

Another detainee said that a military doctor put a tube in his nose, down his throat and "kept moving the tube up and down" until he finally "started violently throwing up blood."

-----

Direct translation.

Oh God. This is too much.

[rx7boy]

Well sometimes human can act worse than animal.. Nauzubillah..

[Wulandari]

“U.S. soldiers cleaned their boots with Qur’an pages”

Aljazeera.com / October 22, 2005

A Bahraini detainee held at the U.S. detention center in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba revealed more sexual abuses by the American soldiers there and confirmed Qur’an desecration.

Jumah Al-Dossary, one of six Bahraini detainees the U.S. holds in Guantanamo prison said he was subject of sexual abuse. He also confirmed desecration of the Qur’an, Islam’s Holy Book, by U.S. soldiers in Afghanistan, The Associated Press reported.

Al-Dossary, 30, said he witnessed U.S. soldiers at Kandahar Air Base in Afghanistan cleaning their boots with pages they had ripped from the Holy Qur’an.

According to the recently declassified documents issued by his lawyer Joshua Colangelo-Bryan Al-Dossary, the Bahraini detainee was beaten and stamped on by eight U.S. soldiers, as he was recovering from an earlier stomach operation.

Sexual abuse

In September 2002, Al-Dossary was taken to an interrogation room where he found four MPs, one carrying a video camera. Al-Dossary said he was shackled to the floor, stripped naked on orders from a female interrogator, who stripped and squatted over his genitals, chest, and face smearing him with her menstrual blood to force him admit having links to Al-Qaeda network.

On a later occasion Al Dossary says he was forced to watch naked man and woman having sex, then offered sex with the woman if he co-operated with the interrogators, Gulf Daily News reported.

Al Dossary’s accusations of being harshly beaten and stamped on by U.S. guards have been widely reported already.

Now Al Dossary suffers heart problems, and he wakes up screaming from nightmares. He fears he has been driven to mental illness, the paper reported.

After visiting all six Bahraini detainees at Guantanamo jail, Colangelo-Bryan, who has just arrived in the U.S., says the six men fear they will stay there for the rest of their lives.

Force-fed torture

Hunger-strikers at Guantanamo jail accused U.S. guards of repeatedly inserting and removing dirty feeding tubes until the detainee would vomit blood.

According to declassified documents recently released by defense lawyers for three men held at the U.S. detention center in Cuba, the guards used feeding tubes as thick as a finger, as objects of torture.

"They were forcibly shoved up the detainees' noses and down into their stomachs," the lawyers reported to a federal judge in August. "No anesthesia or sedative was provided."

The force feedings resulted in prisoners "vomiting up substantial amounts of blood. When they vomited up blood, the soldiers mocked and cursed at them, and taunted them with statements like `look what your religion has brought you.'"

Yousef al Shehri, a 21 year-old Saudi detainee held at Guantanamo, said guards removed a nasal feeding tube from one prisoner and inserted it into another without cleaning.

Another detainee said that a military doctor put a tube in his nose, down his throat and "kept moving the tube up and down" until he finally "started violently throwing up blood."

-----

Direct translation.

Oh God. This is too much.

Hmmmmm...................

Reading your writing, my dear

I doubt the story. You took the story from Al Jazeera news. They are Muslims extrimist news. I think we should not believe that kind of evil source, shouldn't I?

We should get news from neutral channels, such as: CNN, BBC News and and......

Agree?

[caramel]

Yousef al Shehri, a 21 year-old Saudi detainee held at Guantanamo, said guards removed a nasal feeding tube from one prisoner and inserted it into another without cleaning.

Another detainee said that a military doctor put a tube in his nose, down his throat and "kept moving the tube up and down" until he finally "started violently throwing up blood."

^ Agreed. The first part I am not too sure. I was just searching for the news and I found this website. However, the 2nd or 3rd part, as I quoted above, was cited as I recall by reputable online news coverages. You can try searching them.

[Wulandari]

Yousef al Shehri, a 21 year-old Saudi detainee held at Guantanamo, said guards removed a nasal feeding tube from one prisoner and inserted it into another without cleaning.

Another detainee said that a military doctor put a tube in his nose, down his throat and "kept moving the tube up and down" until he finally "started violently throwing up blood."

^ Agreed. The first part I am not too sure. I was just searching for the news and I found this website. However, the 2nd or 3rd part, as I quoted above, was cited as I recall by reputable online news coverages. You can try searching them.

Okay, I believe you, my dear

I wonder......

Did Muslims do such horrible things so Americans treat them badly?

If you are not a Muslims, my dear Caramel, this question is not for you.

I think it is just Muslims who can answer my question.

[Iron Malayan]

“U.S. soldiers cleaned their boots with Qur’an pages”

Aljazeera.com / October 22, 2005

A Bahraini detainee held at the U.S. detention center in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba revealed more sexual abuses by the American soldiers there and confirmed Qur’an desecration.

Jumah Al-Dossary, one of six Bahraini detainees the U.S. holds in Guantanamo prison said he was subject of sexual abuse. He also confirmed desecration of the Qur’an, Islam’s Holy Book, by U.S. soldiers in Afghanistan, The Associated Press reported.

Al-Dossary, 30, said he witnessed U.S. soldiers at Kandahar Air Base in Afghanistan cleaning their boots with pages they had ripped from the Holy Qur’an.

According to the recently declassified documents issued by his lawyer Joshua Colangelo-Bryan Al-Dossary, the Bahraini detainee was beaten and stamped on by eight U.S. soldiers, as he was recovering from an earlier stomach operation.

Sexual abuse

In September 2002, Al-Dossary was taken to an interrogation room where he found four MPs, one carrying a video camera. Al-Dossary said he was shackled to the floor, stripped naked on orders from a female interrogator, who stripped and squatted over his genitals, chest, and face smearing him with her menstrual blood to force him admit having links to Al-Qaeda network.

On a later occasion Al Dossary says he was forced to watch naked man and woman having sex, then offered sex with the woman if he co-operated with the interrogators, Gulf Daily News reported.

Al Dossary’s accusations of being harshly beaten and stamped on by U.S. guards have been widely reported already.

Now Al Dossary suffers heart problems, and he wakes up screaming from nightmares. He fears he has been driven to mental illness, the paper reported.

After visiting all six Bahraini detainees at Guantanamo jail, Colangelo-Bryan, who has just arrived in the U.S., says the six men fear they will stay there for the rest of their lives.

Force-fed torture

Hunger-strikers at Guantanamo jail accused U.S. guards of repeatedly inserting and removing dirty feeding tubes until the detainee would vomit blood.

According to declassified documents recently released by defense lawyers for three men held at the U.S. detention center in Cuba, the guards used feeding tubes as thick as a finger, as objects of torture.

"They were forcibly shoved up the detainees' noses and down into their stomachs," the lawyers reported to a federal judge in August. "No anesthesia or sedative was provided."

The force feedings resulted in prisoners "vomiting up substantial amounts of blood. When they vomited up blood, the soldiers mocked and cursed at them, and taunted them with statements like `look what your religion has brought you.'"

Yousef al Shehri, a 21 year-old Saudi detainee held at Guantanamo, said guards removed a nasal feeding tube from one prisoner and inserted it into another without cleaning.

Another detainee said that a military doctor put a tube in his nose, down his throat and "kept moving the tube up and down" until he finally "started violently throwing up blood."

-----

Direct translation.

Oh God. This is too much.

I think some of these allegations are true.
Terrible.
I guess sickos will always be sickos.

[caramel]

Well, it was published on CNN how the American, British and some of the other soldiers tortured their detainees. I can't remember the details but it was pretty unhumane. Even though the Al Qaeda or whatever sort of people did attack the WTC but there was no way one should treat its detainees with such humiliation which would scar them for life. If everyone keeps attacking one another, it will never stop.

This world is getting crazy. I feel sometimes I am the only one left sane. Or maybe not.

[Wulandari]

Well, it was published on CNN how the American, British and some of the other soldiers tortured their detainees. I can't remember the details but it was pretty unhumane. Even though the Al Qaeda or whatever sort of people did attack the WTC but there was no way one should treat its detainees with such humiliation which would scar them for life. If everyone keeps attacking one another, it will never stop.

This world is getting crazy. I feel sometimes I am the only one left sane. Or maybe not.

My dear Caramel,

I believe it is not about WTC attack in 2001. It is about that those Iraq prisoners indeed are bad people. They are rebels from Islam Sunni who blew up thousands of Americans, and their own people, innoncent Iraq. They are war criminals.

I believe it is very difficult to treat those beasts in good way. Those people already have extreme hatred to Americans and to everybody who has different opinions. They are very dangerous people. And dangerous people like those prisoners should be treated harsh.

[caramel]

I was talking about the Afghans my dear. It's obvious when I mentioned Al Qaeda and WTC.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/23/...ain637823.shtml

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/06/16/911.commission/

There wasn't anything on the Iraqi detainees in the main post.

In the shrine city of Najaf, the head of a charitable organisation affiliated to radical Shiite cleric Moqtada Sadr said a riot in Camp Bucca prison on April 1 caused US troops to open fire on some of the detainees with rubber bullets wounding an undetermined number of them.

"We condemn these acts and we ask that human right organisations intervene quickly," said Saheb al-Ameri, secretary general of the Shahidallah organisation.

The US military denied any knowledge of a riot at the camp in southern Iraq, home to 6,054 detainees, since an outbreak on January 31 in which four inmates were killed when prison guards opened fired.

The International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) contradicted the US denial, saying the riot had been witnessed by one of its delegations.

"There was a riot at Camp Bucca on April 1. An ICRC delegation was there that day on one of its regular prisoner visits and it is now following up the situation, " said Christophe Beney, the head of the ICRC's Baghdad delegation.

According to Ameri, the disturbance was triggered when one of the detainees, a member of the Sadr movement, got sick and was denied medical treatment.

Since the riot, the detainees have had no water or electricity and were living in tents burnt during the violence, he added.

In Baghdad, a bomb went off near Abu Ghraib, another US-run prison, wounding five people, including three policemen, according to the interior ministry.

This came two days after a brazen assault by insurgents on the notorious prison where US guards humiliated and abused naked Iraqi prisoners. The attack resulted in 44 US soldiers and 13 detainees being wounded.

The US military said 40 to 60 gunmen were involved in the two-hour assault that included two car bombs and rocket propelled grenade, mortar rounds and small arms fire. It estimated that 50 of the attackers may have been either wounded or killed.

An estimated 3,400 Iraqi and Arab prisoners are being held in Abu Ghraib.

The US military said one of its soldiers was killed and another wounded on Saturday in a small arms attack by insurgents in Tal Afar, west of the main northern city of Mosul, bringing to 1,530 the number of US military personnel killed in Iraq since the US-led invasion more than two years ago.

http://www.theallineed.com/news/0504/049248.htm
Quoted from AFP a reliable news source.

Read some of these articles:

http://regimechangeiran.blogspot.com/2005/...i-american.html
Quoted from http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/53185.htm

http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=26706

More Iraqi Civilians Killed by US Forces Than By Insurgents, Data Shows
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0925-02.htm

If Islamic peoples detest America, why not let them discover democracy in their own time, rather than trying to convert them with thermobaric bombs and cruise missiles?

Quoted from one of the articles.

How true.

It's with more people like you, that this world is becoming more miserable than it already is. Violence is never a way to solve anything. If it is true that you are a grandmother, you should know that better.

This post has been edited by caramel: Oct 26 2005, 08:53 AM

[ponpon]

^_Wulan as a grandmama you should set a good example, you must practice what you preach in the "malay muslim" thread, that is to be civilised

[Iron Malayan]

Speaking of weirdos desecrating the Quran, the satanic cult Black Metal is making a comeback in Malaysia.

Investigate 'Black Metal' Anti-Religion Cult, Govt Told 


KUALA LUMPUR, Oct 25 (Bernama) -- A parliamentarian, Tuesday asked the Government to investigate the "Black Metal" anti-religion cult practised by a group of Malay Muslim youths who step on and burn the Al-Quran.

Datuk Mohamad Aziz (BN-Sri Gading) said the culture and trend brought in from western countries have started to creep into certain section of the Malaysian society and had diverted their true Islamic faith.

"The Malay Muslim followers of Black Metal have confessed they are satan's children. This cult, if left unchecked, will spread," he said when debating the 2006 Budget at committee stage in the Dewan Rakyat.

Mohamad asked the Islamic Development Department of Malaysia (Jakim) to give serious attention and act promptly to avoid more Malay youths from being misguided and lured into this cult.

"I thank the Mastika magazine for boldly exposing activities of the cult's followers," he said.

Describing their activities as more terrible than during the Era of Ignorance, Mohamad said it was not the time now to blame anyone but instead the relevant authorities like Jakim, Home Ministry and police must cooperate to address the problem.

Datuk Badruddin Amiruldin (BN-Jerai), who rose to interject, urged the government to take appropriate action against the followers.

Datuk Raja Ahmad Zainuddin Raja Omar (BN-Larut) questioned whether Jakim was not pro-active in this matter, thus giving rise to such cults.

"I've spoken to Jakim many times on this. Is Jakim not pro-active. Do we need to revamp Jakim?" he asked.

Datuk Mohd Said Yusof (BN-Jasin) urged the Home Ministry to ban Black Metal's magazines and books sold widely in the country.

-- BERNAMA

[caramel]

That is so weird. I heard that there is this Satanic Church in Bangsar where the cross is inverted. And also a few weird churches in KL.

[malaccan]

That is so weird. I heard that there is this Satanic Church in Bangsar where the cross is inverted. And also a few weird churches in KL.

Really?! Gotta ask my Bangsar kakis about this.

When I was secondary school, black T-shirts were banned from being worn in the weekends during co-curricular activites. That was at the height of the supposed satanic black metal cult.

[Iron Malayan]

That is so weird. I heard that there is this Satanic Church in Bangsar where the cross is inverted. And also a few weird churches in KL.

Hmm

[Wulandari]

I was talking about the Afghans my dear. It's obvious when I mentioned Al Qaeda and WTC.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/23/...ain637823.shtml

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/06/16/911.commission/

There wasn't anything on the Iraqi detainees in the main post.

In the shrine city of Najaf, the head of a charitable organisation affiliated to radical Shiite cleric Moqtada Sadr said a riot in Camp Bucca prison on April 1 caused US troops to open fire on some of the detainees with rubber bullets wounding an undetermined number of them.

"We condemn these acts and we ask that human right organisations intervene quickly," said Saheb al-Ameri, secretary general of the Shahidallah organisation.

The US military denied any knowledge of a riot at the camp in southern Iraq, home to 6,054 detainees, since an outbreak on January 31 in which four inmates were killed when prison guards opened fired.

The International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) contradicted the US denial, saying the riot had been witnessed by one of its delegations.

"There was a riot at Camp Bucca on April 1. An ICRC delegation was there that day on one of its regular prisoner visits and it is now following up the situation, " said Christophe Beney, the head of the ICRC's Baghdad delegation.

According to Ameri, the disturbance was triggered when one of the detainees, a member of the Sadr movement, got sick and was denied medical treatment.

Since the riot, the detainees have had no water or electricity and were living in tents burnt during the violence, he added.

In Baghdad, a bomb went off near Abu Ghraib, another US-run prison, wounding five people, including three policemen, according to the interior ministry.

This came two days after a brazen assault by insurgents on the notorious prison where US guards humiliated and abused naked Iraqi prisoners. The attack resulted in 44 US soldiers and 13 detainees being wounded.

The US military said 40 to 60 gunmen were involved in the two-hour assault that included two car bombs and rocket propelled grenade, mortar rounds and small arms fire. It estimated that 50 of the attackers may have been either wounded or killed.

An estimated 3,400 Iraqi and Arab prisoners are being held in Abu Ghraib.

The US military said one of its soldiers was killed and another wounded on Saturday in a small arms attack by insurgents in Tal Afar, west of the main northern city of Mosul, bringing to 1,530 the number of US military personnel killed in Iraq since the US-led invasion more than two years ago.

http://www.theallineed.com/news/0504/049248.htm
Quoted from AFP a reliable news source.

Read some of these articles:

http://regimechangeiran.blogspot.com/2005/...i-american.html
Quoted from http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/53185.htm

http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=26706

More Iraqi Civilians Killed by US Forces Than By Insurgents, Data Shows
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0925-02.htm

If Islamic peoples detest America, why not let them discover democracy in their own time, rather than trying to convert them with thermobaric bombs and cruise missiles?

Quoted from one of the articles.

How true.

It's with more people like you, that this world is becoming more miserable than it already is. Violence is never a way to solve anything. If it is true that you are a grandmother, you should know that better.

Violence is never a way to solve anything?

What a naive young girl !





I give you an example from recent time:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/4387604.stm

Three Indonesian girls beheaded

By Tim Johnston
BBC News, Jakarta

OCTOBER 29, 2005

Three girls have been beheaded and another badly injured as they walked to a Christian school in Indonesia.

They were walking through a cocoa plantation near the city of Poso in central Sulawesi province when they were attacked.

This is an area that has a long history of religious violence between Muslims and Christians.

A government-brokered truce has only partially succeeded in reducing the number of incidents in recent years.

Police say the heads were found some distance from the bodies.

It is unclear what was behind the attack, but the girls attended a private Christian school and one of the heads was left outside a church leading to speculation that it might have had a religious motive.

Islamic state

Central Sulawesi and Poso in particular was the scene of bitter fighting between Muslims and Christians in 2001 and 2002.



More than 1,000 people were killed before a government-brokered truce.

Although the violence has been subdued, it has never gone away completely.

A bomb in May in the nearby town of Tentena, which is predominantly Christian, killed 22 people and injured over 30.

The fighting four years ago drew Islamic militants from all over Indonesia and many have never gone home.

Analysts say the militants have targeted central Sulawesi and believe that it could be turned into the foundation stone of an Islamic state.

The analysts have warned that the violence could resurface at any time.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/worl...fic/4387604.stm

Published: 2005/10/29 08:32:05 GMT

© BBC MMV

3 Christian girls were beheaded by terrorist Muslims.



Now, let's presume you and I were 2 of the girls.

Some people approach us, they want to cut our head off.

We all bring knife for protection because the area has many religious wars between Christians and Muslims. You said that you don't support violence. As a result, you didn't do anything when those Muslims want to cut your head off. On the contrary, I used my knife. I can stab one of them and run away. I safe. You were not.



The point is: it is not about whether we support violence or not. It is about whether the use of violence is necessary or not.

You live in Malaysia or Australia. I live in Indonesia and America. Indonesia is not a safe place. It is a dangerous place. If you are not becareful, you can lose your life just for $10 cents. I am not kidding. There are so many poor people, they will stab each other just for $10 cents to eat food.

In this kind of dangerous environment like Indonesia, if you have attitude not using violence at all to protect yourself, you will always become the victims. People will treat you as easy target. You need to be tough to survive. But, it doesn't mean you must use violence to survive. It means you need to know when and where you need to use violence to protect your self from people who want to cut your head off, and what kind of violences we need to use. We need to be smart !!

Safe places like Malaysia and Australia, and your young age make you naive. It is okay . One day, when you become older, more mature, having more experiences in many different places and differenct people, you will understand my words.

[caramel]

You do not know me. So, you shouldn't presume what I am and what I am not. Your selfishness and sarcasm disgusts me. You do not know what I went through life and how I solved my problems; so don't judge me.

The point is: it is not about whether we support violence or not. It is about whether the use of violence is necessary or not.

I never said anything about supporting violence. I just said that violence never solve anything. So by saying that are you trying to agree that "Violence never solve anything". But it is just that you felt that it is a necessity because of the world we live in today.. which is full of violence. Isn't that right? See the root of it. VIOLENCE. Until human kind can stop seeing the difference in one another. Stop being selfish.. greedy and spend more time loving one another.. violence will stop.

You chose to correct my facts and when I presented you the facts (referring to the previous posts).. you ignored it and diverted me into the topic above. How cunning. I am sorry but I am not interested in debating with you all these pesty things anymore. I find it very unproductive. Until I find myself with nothing better to do. See you.

[ponpon]

Safe places like Malaysia and Australia, and your young age make you naive. It is okay 

But grandmama you are contradicting yourself,

My dear,

I am sorry for the misunderstanding.

There are many replies in this thread, I just try to answer one by one from the beginning. I forget you already reply the second time.

I understand that it is impossible all Muslims in Malaysia are terrorist. There must be some good Muslims, agree? 

However, what bother me is your country is a SAFE HEAVEN for terrorist Muslims who bother neighborhood countries, like mine, Thailand, Singapore and so on.

Malaysia is supposed to be a SAFE HEAVEN for Muslims terrorists, therefore it isn't safe at all,... am i correct ?

[Wulandari]

You do not know me. So, you shouldn't presume what I am and what I am not. Your selfishness and sarcasm disgusts me. You do not know what I went through life and how I solved my problems; so don't judge me.

The point is: it is not about whether we support violence or not. It is about whether the use of violence is necessary or not.

I never said anything about supporting violence. I just said that violence never solve anything. So by saying that are you trying to agree that "Violence never solve anything". But it is just that you felt that it is a necessity because of the world we live in today.. which is full of violence. Isn't that right? See the root of it. VIOLENCE. Until human kind can stop seeing the difference in one another. Stop being selfish.. greedy and spend more time loving one another.. violence will stop.

You chose to correct my facts and when I presented you the facts (referring to the previous posts).. you ignored it and diverted me into the topic above. How cunning. I am sorry but I am not interested in debating with you all these pesty things anymore. I find it very unproductive. Until I find myself with nothing better to do. See you.

The root of the problems is not violence

The root of the problems is ourselves. Being selfish, greedy, envious and racist

Violences are the results of our bad characters.

Calm down

[Wulandari]

Safe places like Malaysia and Australia, and your young age make you naive. It is okay 

But grandmama you are contradicting yourself,

My dear,

I am sorry for the misunderstanding.

There are many replies in this thread, I just try to answer one by one from the beginning. I forget you already reply the second time.

I understand that it is impossible all Muslims in Malaysia are terrorist. There must be some good Muslims, agree? 

However, what bother me is your country is a SAFE HEAVEN for terrorist Muslims who bother neighborhood countries, like mine, Thailand, Singapore and so on.

Malaysia is supposed to be a SAFE HEAVEN for Muslims terrorists, therefore it isn't safe at all,... am i correct ?

Are you playing words now, my dear?



Let me explain to you..


It is correct that Malaysia and Australia are safe, safer than my country. I admit that. You just take some of my words from the whole writing and twist them.

Naughty........naughty............naughty...................




And it is true that Malaysia is a SAFE HEAVEN for Muslim terrorist.

Before your people blew up my people in Bali, helping Muslim traitors in Thailand, supporting Muslim terrorist in Philipine, your government didn't do anything to terrorist Muslims in your country. It is because your government is controlled by Muslims too. And majority of Malaysians are Muslims. Your government allow all kinds of Muslim terrorist to come to Malaysia, plan terrorist attack, and do whatever they want.

You Malaysia allow all kinds of Muslim terrorists to have fun in Malaysia, as long as they don't bother Malaysian people. It is a smart move from your government.

However, after your people do terrorist stuff in my country, in Thailand, in Philipine and in other countries, your government is under pressures from other countries. If your government doesn't do anything to suppress their own terrorist, you Malaysia will get big problems from your neighborhood. So, you Muslims have no choice but detaining some of your own terrorist, or else.

It is your own mistake, Muslims.

The way you treat Muslim terrorist in your country is just like the way you people treat beasts. You breed and spoil beasts since they were children in your country. So, when the beasts become adults, you cannot control them anymore. When your beasts started attacking other people, you Muslims act like Saints, trying to whitewash your sins. It won't work that way.

You Muslims must take care of your own beasts, before other countries come to your country and take care of them. Or, the beasts and you Muslims are the same people?