Very interesting site about the flow of ancient..., people Options

[Emawk]

Link to website

This site talks about the flow of different major human populations around the world (i.e. the age of the pygmies, Anu/ Vedas and so on). There is alot to read. What do you guys think?

On the website, you can click the back botton(at the bottom of the page) to go to the beginning.

Here is a quote from the conclusion of this article (or whatever it is called) to give you a better idea of what the article is about:

"The idea that there has always been a slow upward trend in the development of civilization since the days of the cave man, is a rather simplistic picture of our past. There have been many rapid developments, followed by a hiatus, then slowly it all begins again. It may even be found that previous species of humans may well have had periods of development far more advanced than previously thought. There are many archaeological enigmas that abound around the world that can be answered by this process involving natural calamities on a global scale. There is no need to have these mysteries answered by aliens arriving from another planet, they are merely previous peaks in mans development, prior to destruction by mother nature. If one doubts the rate of development possible from early man, one just needs to look at how rapid the development of technologies has been over the last 200 years."

In fact, because there's too much to read, it's better to look at the conclusion first. Here it is:

Link to the conclusion

This post has been edited by Emawk: Jan 3 2006, 04:30 PM

[dalawapo]

The first migration of Homo sapiens spread out from Africa between 80 and 100,000 years ago across India into S.E. Asia and across to America. It is believed from genetic markers in remnant populations around the world, that these people were dark skinned, short, with very frizzy, almost woolly hair. Relic populations of these pygmies can still be found in the; Congo Basin, Andaman Islands, the Highlands of New Guinea and the Phillipines.

!cick!

[zee]

!cick!

Huh?

[bond007]

Huh?

The click language is that of southern African such as the San and Khoi people.

[kermit_criminal]

is it possible that the asian epicanthal fold isnt a cold-weather trait developed in siberia afterall and probably came from a bushmen-like peoples out of africa? maybe a separate wave/migration out of africa from the taller blacks came out to form the caucasians

This post has been edited by kermit_criminal: Jan 8 2006, 11:54 AM

[dalawapo]

are u implying that east asians having the as it was put by some quirky fellow "uncircumsized eye" and being shorter because they are descendants of the khoisan migration out of africa?

[Jagger]

That is a likely scenario, that the Capoids (Khoi, Bushmen) are the ancestors of Mongoloids. Think about it, the only two races to have epicanthal folds are Capoids and Mongoloids, so there just might be some kind of relationship between them.

[kermit_criminal]

it is clear i am not implying anything at all, but asking of the possibility of such a scenario

[dalawapo]

do negritos in asia have the epicantric fold? (IMG:http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/icon_rolleyes.gif)

[kermit_criminal]

do negritos in asia have the epicantric fold? (IMG:http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/icon_rolleyes.gif)

and your point? cut to the chase before you ruin this thread

[dalawapo]

if you can not deduce why i would ask if negritos in asia have epicantric fold then maybe you should not be involved in this conversation. i mean ur trying to trace back mongoloid parentage to some african pegymy thousands of miles away when there are already pegymy in asia already a few feet away from you and inhabiting co-existing for thousands of years. (IMG:http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/icon_rolleyes.gif)

[kermit_criminal]

if you can not deduce why i would ask if negritos in asia have epicantric fold then maybe you should not be involved in this conversation. i mean ur trying to trace back mongoloid parentage to some african pegymy thousands of miles away when there are already pegymy in asia already a few feet away from you and inhabiting co-existing for thousands of years. (IMG:http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/icon_rolleyes.gif)

well then maybe you should put more efforts into your post then the one sentance garbage.

bushmen are not the same as negritos in asia, and thats why i said they could have come in different waves out of africa. the population distrbution in modern times isnt the same as it likely was back 13,000 years ago before the last ice ages ended. Why are the Olmec statues in mesoamerica depicting blacks? why is the oldest native american skull in the Americas a skull of a negroid? populations merge, conquer and migrate. elementary son

This post has been edited by kermit_criminal: Jan 8 2006, 02:57 PM

[dalawapo]

you know kermit you are so ugly in your personality, look how hostile your becoming every second! u thinking your soooooo magnificent. please. (IMG:http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/icon_rolleyes.gif) you are truly evil mischevious guy calling other's things garbage but truly it is your mouth that is the stinkiest garabage, u have a lowly humanity factor! GOODBEY!!

(IMG:http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/victory.gif)

[Thanol]

is it possible that the asian epicanthal fold isnt a cold-weather trait developed in siberia afterall and probably came from a bushmen-like peoples out of africa? maybe a separate wave/migration out of africa from the taller blacks came out to  form the caucasians

I doubt it. For there to be a direct migration, there should be a people in between East Asia and Africa with epicanthic folds and yellow skin, but there isn't.

Fewer SEA have epicanthic folds than North Asians. So it would seem that the trait originated in the North, then spread by means of immigration down to SEA. That immigration idea, is supported by the fact that so many Southern Ethnic groups (Hmong, Thai, etc) claim their orginal homelands to be near the Yangtze.

This post has been edited by Thanol: Jan 8 2006, 04:11 PM

[bond007]

That is a likely scenario, that the Capoids (Khoi, Bushmen) are the ancestors of Mongoloids. Think about it, the only two races to have epicanthal folds are Capoids and Mongoloids, so there just might be some kind of relationship between them.

Pygmies also have the same features especially those of the Andaman Islands who up to 1858 had NO contact with any other humans. (the other pygmies did mix with other Asians)

Since the first wave of humans were Pgymies, I tend to disagree unless you can explain why Andaman Pygmies have almond eyes like Khoi and San people.

Also this so called Capoids are Nubians, not another "race". They have very similar features like any other Africans apart from the eyes, yet I explained that Pygmies also have that feature as well.

This post has been edited by bond007: Jan 8 2006, 07:48 PM

[bond007]

well then maybe you should put more efforts into your post then the one sentance garbage.

bushmen are not the same as negritos in asia, and thats why i said they could have come in different waves out of africa. the population distrbution in modern times isnt the same as it likely was back 13,000 years ago before the last ice ages ended. Why are the Olmec statues in mesoamerica depicting blacks? why is the oldest native american skull in the Americas a skull of a negroid? populations merge, conquer and migrate. elementary son

Olmecs were not Nubians. Those features as I explained are not exclusively Africans. Asians also have full lips and broad noses.

Pygmies have been found as far away as South America. There were the first wave of humans to migrate out of Africa and inhabited all warm regions. That is not in dispute.
BTW people do not employ the term "Negroid" anymore not even in scientific terms.

[Emawk]

I doubt it.  For there to be a direct migration, there should be a people in between East Asia and Africa with epicanthic folds and yellow skin, but there isn't. 

Fewer SEA have epicanthic folds than North Asians. So it would seem that the trait originated in the North, then spread by means of immigration down to SEA.  That immigration idea, is supported by the fact that so many Southern Ethnic groups (Hmong, Thai, etc) claim their orginal homelands to be near the Yangtze.

Not necessarily. For all we know, this epicanthic fold (along with other traits) could have been completely overhelmed by other populations like the Caucasians.

This post has been edited by Emawk: Jan 9 2006, 08:26 AM

[dalawapo]

i read somewhere that the epicantric fold was inherant in all human being , early man, but eventually the european and african peopple lost the trait, only the mongoloid race retain it predominately

[Jagger]

Pygmies also have the same features especially those of the Andaman Islands who up to 1858 had NO contact with any other humans. (the other pygmies did mix with other Asians)

Since the first wave of humans were Pgymies, I tend to disagree unless you can explain why Andaman Pygmies have almond eyes like Khoi and San people.

Also this so called Capoids are Nubians, not another "race".  They have very similar features like any other Africans apart from the eyes, yet I explained that Pygmies also have that feature as well.

In that case, the Khoi and San could be the ancestors of Pygmies.

I think everyone already knows Capoids are Africans by the way.

This post has been edited by Jagger: Jan 9 2006, 05:34 AM

[bond007]

In that case, the Khoi and San could be the ancestors of Pygmies.

I think everyone already knows Capoids are Africans by the way.

Another feature that is exclusively Pgymy at least in the Andamans and the San and Khoi people are fatty bottom (Steatopygia). No body else has that feature anywhere on the planet but the above mentioned group.

You may be right that they share similar genotypical characteristics
(IMG:http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/b9/Steatopygia.jpg/150px-Steatopygia.jpg) Hottentot woman's Fatty Bottom in Africa

Fatty bottom of an Onge woman, Andaman Island. Remember, these people had no contact with outsiders until 1858 when the British employed the Islands as a penal colony for Indians "prisoners" fighting for Indian independence. So it is very unlikely she is mised with Africans since the only people since that time were Indians and British which do not carry that fatty bottom genes. Now the British did rape the women and the Indians eventually intermarried with them.
(IMG:http://www.andaman.org/book/chapter5/fig05-2.jpg)


(IMG:http://www.andaman.org/book/chapter5/peppercornhair.jpg) Typical Andaman Pygmy

Among the Andamanese negrito, body hair is generally scanty and limited to head and the pubic region. Hair on the head is of the so-called peppercorn variety, i.e. it grows in tightly curled spiral tufts that form into cones with naked skin visible between the cones. The only other people with that type of hair are the Khoisan of South Africa.
similarities of Pygmies and San.

Nicobar Islands South of Andaman Islands. Nicobar are inhabited by Hmong people not Pygmies also undisturbed until 1858 where the British used their islands as a penal colony for Indian dissidents. A group of Nicobari on Chamorta island posing for a photographer, ca. 1900. The islands then were one of the remotest possessions of the British Crown. Among the few visitors there was the occasional photographer. Early photographs from the islands are rare.
(IMG:http://www.andaman.org/NICOBAR/book/photoalbum/06-Nicgroup1900.jpg)

Throughout the Nicobars, standing kareau figures represent the head of a family, while sitting kareau represent important ancestors. They are cultiic figures of great importance to all Nicobari.
(IMG:http://www.andaman.org/NICOBAR/book/photoalbum/08-Kareaufigs1.jpg)


A mixed Shompen group, 1886, Nicobar Islands
(IMG:http://www.andaman.org/NICOBAR/book/photoalbum/Shompenphotos/Shompen1.jpg)

A Shompen group, 1886. Note the different hair forms present - one possible indication of genetic mixing.
(IMG:http://www.andaman.org/NICOBAR/book/photoalbum/Shompenphotos/Shompen2.jpg)
(IMG:http://www.andaman.org/NICOBAR/book/photoalbum/Shompenphotos/Shompen3.jpg)

This post has been edited by bond007: Jan 9 2006, 05:19 PM