Cape Malays Options

[tangawizi]

I've just seen a cookbook featuring Cape Malay cuisine by the community of Cape Malays still existing in South Africa. Did a search on the wiki and here's what they have to say :

Cape Malays

The Cape Malay community is an ethnic group or community in South Africa, taking its name from what is now known as the Western Cape of South Africa and the Malay people who started this community in South Africa. The community's earliest members were slaves brought by the Dutch East India Company, followed shortly thereafter by political dissidents and Muslim religious leaders who opposed the Dutch presence in what is now Indonesia. Starting in 1654, these resistors were imprisoned or exiled in South Africa by the Dutch East India Company, which founded and used what is now Cape Town as a resupply station for ships traveling between Europe and Asia. They are the group that first introduced Islam to South Africa.

Culture

The founders of this community were the first to bring Islam to South Africa. The community's culture and traditions have also left an impact that is felt to this day. Adaptations of traditional foods such as bredie, bobotie, sosaties and koeksisters are staples in many South African homes. The Muslim community in Cape Town remains large and vibrant to this day, now much expanded beyond those exiles who started the first mosques in South Africa.

People in the Cape Malay community generally speak Afrikaans, English or local dialects of the two. The Malay languages and other languages that their ancestors brought are no longer spoken, though various Malay words and phrases are still employed in daily usage.

Population and location

It is estimated that there are about 166,000 people in Cape Town who could be described as Cape Malay, and about 10,000 in Johannesburg. The picturesque Malay Quarter of Cape Town is found on Signal Hill, and is called the Bo-Kaap. Many Cape Malay people also lived in District Six before it was demolished; after its demolition, most were forced to move to so-called Coloured townships on the Cape Flats.

The cookery book emphasizes a number of recipes using spices, chillies, and curries. Hmmmm....... I wonder if this community still has links with the Malayan world in SE Asia? Do they for instance watch soap operas and listen to pop from Indonesia or Malaysia?

[purnomor]

Cape Malays are all from Indonesia, hence this thread should be in Indonesian chat.

BTW, yes the premier of Western Cape Province, a Cape Malay, visited Indonesia a few times. Indonesian Vice President Jusuf Kalla, who is Buginese (same ethnicity as the original Cape Malay) paid a visit to Cape Town last year, signing some trade deals with the province.

[tangawizi]

Oh well, I suppose you could be right. Why were the Malay Indonesians transported to Africa as slaves? I didn't think the Europeans extended slavery as far as to include asians.

[purnomor]

Oh well, I suppose you could be right.  Why were the Malay Indonesians transported to Africa as slaves?  I didn't think the Europeans extended slavery as far as to include asians.

They were political exiles, banished to Africa from Indonesia for resisting Dutch rule (Cape Town was then a Dutch colony). The most famous political exile were Syekh Yusuf, a Buginese Islamic cleric who was banished to South Africa for leading an anti-Dutch rebellion in Banten, western Java.

[tangawizi]

It seems alot of their ancestors came from Bali as well. They are now numbering some 160,000 cape Malays living in Cape Town.

One of their most spectacular custom of the Cape Malay is the performance of the Chalifah which is an exhibition of skillful swordplay and symbolic of the power of faith. Many of the imams disapprove of it. With a background of monotonous chanting and the rhythmical beating of drums, the performers go into a semi-hypnotized state. They stab the flesh with sharp instruments, wounding themselves without flinching. The name Chalifah is really the name for the leader who blesses the swords, directs the performance, and prays while it is being carried out.

http://www.encounter.co.za/article/52.html

This sword ritual seems to have a certain resemblance to the Balinese trance ceremonies when they try to stab without flinching.

[rasibiduk]

Seeing as a lot of the exiles came also from Banten, I wouldn't be surprise they are performing the unique art of 'Debus' from Banten.

From RRI Banten website (not the best translation however) & pics from Kompas :

Banten-RRI-Online,
It is true that each region in Indonesia has its own characteristic that is interesting to complete a tourist enchantment. For example, Debus is a famous traditional art performance in Banten which makes this youngest province in Java interesting

The art performance is well known across the world. Debus has not only a unity with the art of self defense but also an attractive complexity. Debus has always been attractive and created tensity in its audience nerves. Why? Because in its performance, machete, knives, and many other parts of the players’ body. However, the players always remain save. All the scratches in their body are cured only in a blink of eyes by the sweap of hand of their master. In the peek of the performance, the game of sharp long iron is generally presented. In one of the point the iron, a round wood which diameter is around 20-30 Cm is installed(Trans by Lydia Sari UNJ)

[Protoculture]

Cape Malays are all from Indonesia, hence this thread should be in Indonesian chat.

BTW, yes the premier of Western Cape Province, a Cape Malay, visited Indonesia a few times. Indonesian Vice President Jusuf Kalla, who is Buginese (same ethnicity as the original Cape Malay) paid a visit to Cape Town last year, signing some trade deals with the province.

Hey, purnomor, create new thread regarding this topic on your own there.

You know what, Malaysian Malays have good relationship with Cape Malays, sending visitors or even delegations.

Every year, the Cape malays send their delegation to UMNO General Assembly, uniting in Malay identity.

We rejoiced in a manner where the Cape Malays & Malaysian Malays considered as long-lost cousins.

[purnomor]

Hey, purnomor, create new thread regarding this topic on your own there.

You know what, Malaysian Malays have good relationship with Cape Malays, sending visitors or even delegations.

Every year, the Cape malays send their delegation to UMNO General Assembly, uniting in Malay identity.

We rejoiced in a manner where the Cape Malays & Malaysian Malays considered as long-lost cousins.

We already have a thread abt this subject on the Indonesian Serious Talk

Too bad, all Cape Malays came from Indonesia. Additionally, they are not ethnic-Malays, but they are Buginese, Balinese, and Javanese, plus most of them already intermixed with Indian and Arab latecomers. So, it is impossible for them to be "cousins" of Malaysian Malays. Cape Malays send delegation to Indonesia's "Buginese World Meeting" held each two years in Makassar.

The Cape Malay

"Malay" refers to that section of the Muslim community in the Peninsula whose ancestors were sent there during the 17th and 18th centuries. They came mainly from Java and the Indonesian islands (especially Bali). The first group arrived in 1667 with other groups following later. In the Cape however, they mingled with other races, among them the indigenous peoples of South Africa, as well as Arabs, Indians, Chinese and Whites. 

...

A feast called Lebaran follows this. Men wear their newest clothes and bear gifts to the priest and to the poor. The children are dressed up and receive presents from their friends and neighbors.

http://www.encounter.co.za/article/52.html

This post has been edited by purnomor: Jan 26 2006, 10:44 PM

[Protoculture]

We already have a thread abt this subject on the Indonesian Serious Talk

Too bad, all Cape Malays came from Indonesia. Additionally, they are not ethnic-Malays, but they are Buginese, Balinese, and Javanese, plus most of them already intermixed with Indian and Arab latecomers. So, it is impossible for them to be "cousins" of Malaysian Malays. Cape Malays send delegation to Indonesia's "Buginese World Meeting" held each two years in Makassar.

They can be .... because through history, Selangor Sultanate is of Bugisnese ancestry (and still), Johore Sultanate are of Bugisnese stock (from previous Johore Riau Sultanate era), large numbers of Bugisnese settlers in Johore, Selangor, Malacca & Sabah.

In the end, it all matters because we're 'serumpun'.

[malaccan]

In the end, it all matters because we're 'serumpun'.

Ditto! Cape Malays themselves feel afffinity for both Malaysians and Indonesians.
Cape Malays have been sending their delegates to the Malay world meet that happens every so often in Malaysia. And any newspaper articles about South Africa will always mention the close ties Malaysian has with South Africa as Commonwealth nations, and the Cape Malay settlement there. You know how Malays in Malaysia have come to accept all members of the Malay race, not just Malay ethnicity as being the same. Bugis, Minang, Jawa, in the eyes of the government we're all Malay. And myself for example, although I have ancestors from my dad's side who was from Minangkabau, I see myself first as part of the bigger Malay race, as many other Malays do. Well, actually I see myself as a Malaysian first but that's another story.

[tangawizi]

Purnomor, I think when the Cape Malay ancestors were first being taken as slaves from Indonesia, the Dutch also transported some muslim folk from India and Mauritius to their South African colony.

And thats how the Cape Malay community was formed. It's not a community purely of Indonesian origin.

And the growing ties with Malaysia is probably a recent economic endeavour by the Cape Malay community to get onto the global economy.

I actually wonder if the Malaysian government is giving any guidance on the affirmative action programme in the Mbeki government? Perhaps the Cape Malay community have some influence in the government on this?

[tangawizi]

Purnomor, I did a search in Indonesian Serious Talk and there was nothing that came up specifically about the Cape Malays. Could you direct me to the thread in question please? Thanks alot!!!

[purnomor]

Purnomor, I did a search in Indonesian Serious Talk and there was nothing that came up specifically about the Cape Malays. Could you direct me to the thread in question please?  Thanks alot!!!

Click here, the title is "Indonesia-South Africa Historical Link"..

It's OK if Malaysians say they have business deals with the Cape Malays, but claiming Cape Malays to be from Malaysia is outrageously unacceptable. What would the French said if suddenly Australia claims to have invented the champagne?

At the end of apartheid, some Cape Malays visited Malaysia to re-connect with their heritage. They asked the local Malaysians, "where is the city of Macassar? I want to visit it since that's where my ancestors come from and where our great leader Syekh Yusuf was buried." The Malaysian replied, "Oh, Macassar is in Indonesia".

That's the end of the role of Malaysia as the place for Cape Malays to rediscover their heritage. Since then, thousands of Cape Malays have visited Makassar in South Celebes province to visit the venerable tomb of the legendary progenitor of their community, Syekh Yusuf (Indonesian national hero). Cape Malays are not from Malaysia. Deal with it.

This post has been edited by purnomor: Jan 27 2006, 11:29 AM

[tangawizi]

Sorry to be pedantic. Perhaps this could be cleared up if they juz call themselves something like Cape Makassarese. The fact is they call themselves Cape Malays which is a reflection of the political era when they were taken as to the Cape. In those days, the Indonesians and Malaysians were collectively known as the Malays, is that a correct assumption?

[tangawizi]

BTW, that thread was hilarious! There's some serious fuedal mindsets displayed there... :P

[Protoculture]

That's the end of the role of Malaysia as the place for Cape Malays to rediscover their heritage. Since then, thousands of Cape Malays have visited Makassar in South Celebes province to visit the venerable tomb of the legendary progenitor of their community, Syekh Yusuf (Indonesian national hero). Cape Malays are not from Malaysia. Deal with it.

If you read the previous posts earlier in this thread, never did we Msians indicated that Cape Malays are from MY.

The purpose of the thread is mainly touching of the Cape Malays & their culture, which is very similar to those in Malay Archipelago.

So, their roots are from Indonesia .... like Indo-Dutch in Holland. But, that's where it ends.

Deal with it.

[purnomor]

Sorry to be pedantic.  Perhaps this could be cleared up if they juz call themselves something like Cape Makassarese. The fact is they call themselves Cape Malays which is a reflection of the political era when they were taken as to the Cape.  In those days, the Indonesians and Malaysians were collectively known as the Malays, is that a correct assumption?

Not really, the original Cape Malays were political exiles were of Javanese, Balinese, Makassarese, Buginese, and Balinese origins, each with their own language and culture. So, to communicate with each other, they uses the lingua franca of the archipelago, the Malay language (which originated from Sumatera Island of Indonesia). Hence, they were called "Cape Malays".

So, their roots are from Indonesia .... like Indo-Dutch in Holland. But, that's where it ends.

Deal with it.

LOL, I think many Cape Malays and Indo-Dutch people would beg to disagree..

Just ask the many Indo-Dutch forummers in Indo chat.

[tangawizi]

Hey guys, I dug this table up from this south african website on this book about the history of muslims in the Cape, interestinigly, it shows that between 1658 to 1700, 0.3% of the captives shipped by the Dutch to the Cape were from Malaysia :


http://www.sahistory.org.za/pages/sources/...slims/1700s.htm

This post has been edited by tangawizi: Mar 11 2006, 04:06 PM

[Iron Malayan]

^^ All I see in that link are cheap stories with nothing to back them up
If you ask some deluded Dutch, they'll claim all those Indonesian exiles are slaves and all Bengali slaves are Malays.
Hmm, well, I never said the Dutch are clever.

Some people think they can change history by printing fairy tales in their national history books and travel guides
and they may have fooled some ppl but they sure as hell can't fool me.

I have already exposed who the slave race really are in this Indonesian thread here. Enjoy.
http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/index.php?...ndpost&p=742735

I'd like to add that the pattern of Indonesian migrations to South Africa is similar to their migrations to Dutch ruled Ceylon.

http://www.rootsweb.com/~lkawgw/malaychrono.html

1640 The storming of Galle by Admiral Coster and Malay troops. Ref: E.Reimers Govt. Archivist- Jubilee book of the Colombo Malay Cricket Club
1657 Malays under Captain Raja Talella accompanied Rycklof Van Goers and took part in the capture of Mannar and Jaffna. Ref: (i) Ibid (ii) E.Reimers Govt archivist -p: 158 of Jubilee book of Colombo Malay Cricket club
1706 Susuna Mankurat Mas- Ex King of Java landed in Ceylon Ref: Page 160 of Jubilee book of Colombo Malay Cricket club
1708 Javanese Prince Pangeran Adipathi Amang Kurat 111, with family and retinue was banished to Ceylon. Ref: De Graf (1949 pp 238-241) for this event in Javanese History
1722-1723 Group of 44 Javanese including Princes and Chief’s sent to Ceylon. Ref: Article by CH Mantara- p: 166 of Jubilee Book of Colombo Malay Cricket Club.
1723 Chief Minister Danuraja was banished to Ceylon. Ref : Page 160 of Jubilee book of Colombo Malay Cricket club
1728 Arya Mankunegara, a brother of king Pakubuwana banished to Ceylon by the Dutch. Ref: Dr Husseinmiya’s -Paper presented at the Naleemiah Institute of Islamic studies Beruwela in 1984- p: 10
1737 Death of Susuna Mankurat Mas in Colombo, and his family sent back to Java. Ref : Page 160 of Jubilee book of Colombo Malay Cricket club
1743 A Javanese Noble, Radini Adipati Nata kusuma was banished to Ceylon by the Dutch. Ref: Dr Husseinmiya’s Lost Cousins Page 45 (some historians gives this date as 1738)
1745 Susuna Kuning - King of Java surrenders himself to Dutch and is banished to Ceylon. Ref : Page 160 of Jubilee book of Colombo Malay Cricket club
1761 More troops sent to reinforce Malay troops in Ceylon.
1763 Formation of Malay company consisting of deportees and 31 slaves. Ref: Dutch Political comment of 1786
1765 Arrival of Malay battalion from Batavia led by Captain Baba Lye with the intention of capturing the Kandyan capital. Ref: Article “ History of Malay “ by F E Gooneratne p: 160 in Malay Jubilee book.
1767 Batara Gowa Amas Madina 11. the former King of Gowa was exiled to Ceylon by the Dutch. Ref: Dr Hussainmiya Lost Cousins p: 44
1783 Javanese Pandan Balie donates land in Wekanda, Colombo to build a Malay Mosque. The Mosque was built in 1786. Ref: CH Mantara, Jubilee Book of Colombo Malay Cricket Club (p: 167)
1795 The death of the King of Goa after 30yrs of life in exile in Ceylon. Ref: Dr Hussainmiya’s Lost Cousins (p: 44).
1798-1811 The appointment of a Malay Committee by Frederick North, the first British Governor of Ceylon to inquire into the grievances of the Indonesian Princes and Noblemen.
1803 Capt. Nouredeen, Commander of Malays, executed by the Kandyan King for refusal to sever his allegiance to the British, and enter the Kandyan King’s service. Ref: p: 163 of Jubilee Book of Colombo Malay Cricket Club
1813 Arrival of 413 men from Surabaya to join the Ceylon Malay Regiment during the governorship of Robert Brownrigg. Ref: Dr. Hussainmiya’s article “Exiles No Longer” in the publication Hemisphere
1816 Arrival of 228 of Javanese soldiers and thier families to Ceylon from Semmreng and Gresik in Java. Ref: Dr Hussainmiya’s Lost cousins (p: 61)
1834-1841 Migration of Malay’s to Ceylon. Total of 332 Malay’s migrated to Ceylon. Ref: Dr Hussainmiya’s Lost Cousins (p: 62).
1840 Setting up recruiting depots in Penang and later in Singapore for Malays from the Malay Peninsula for Permanent settlement in Ceylon. Ref: Dr Hussainmiya’s Lost Cousins (p: 12)
1869 Publishing of Alamat Lankapuri, a fortnightly Malay language paper by Baba Ounus Saldin in Colombo. Newspaper published in the Jawi Script. Ref: Dr. Hussainmiya’s article “Exiles No Longer” in the publication- Hemisphere
1872 Formation of Colombo Malay Cricket club. The first ever Malay sports club in Ceylon. Ref: Durham Saldin’s paper presented at World Malay Symposium of 1985, titled “Malay Organisations and Social Movements in Sri Lanka”
1873 The disbandment of the Ceylon Rifle regiment of Malays. Ref: CH Mantara’s article-Jubilee Book of Colombo Malay Cricket club
1922 Formation of all Ceylon Malay Association. The patron being his Highness the Sultan of Johore. The first President being Mr. MK Saldin. Ref: Jubilee Book of Colombo Malay Cricket Book of 1924
1924 Election of first Malay, Dr TB Jayah to the legislative council.

As you can see, there were no such thing as Malay slaves. Only soldiers, exiles and their retinue.

BTW in a television documentary "Jejak Rasul" there was a South African Malay in Port Elizabeth speaking Malay and said his family moved from Indonesia to South Africa during the war. I assume he means the 2nd world war.

[daoLearner]

I actually wonder if the Malaysian government is giving any guidance on the affirmative action programme in the Mbeki government? Perhaps the Cape Malay community have some influence in the government on this?

Cape Malay/Coloured/Indian/East Asian/White don't benifit from this programme.

Mbekis political party (ANC - 80 seats) is not commonly voted for by non-blacks. Cape Malays according to recent polls in Cape Town voted for the ID (Independent Democrats - 21 seats) or DA (Democratic Allience - 90 seats). These partys dont support Affirmative action.

IMO i think it is a racist programme where people are seperated by race NOT by previously disadvantaged people as i was meant to be...