Philippine Claim To Sabah, North Borneo, Sultanate of Sulu is rightful owner Options

[Dimasangkay]

January 22,1878 - In exchange for US$5,000, Sultan Jamal ul-Alam leased North Borneo to the Hong Kong-based British trading company of Baron Gustavos von Overbeck and Alfred Dent and conferred upon Overbeck the title Datu Bendahara, Raja of Sandakan [K.B. Tregoning, A History of Modern Sabah/Agoncillo history of the Filipino People]

It is clear it was leased, by papers and history, Sabah belongs to the Sultan of Sulu, his successors and heirs. The House of the Royal Sultanate of Sulu want that recognition, that the sovereignty of Sabah belongs to them. In a way, it is yours because you annexed it and also as i read through, the people chose you over us. But for real, the land belong to the Sultanate, which is [the Sultanate], part of the Philippines. You can't dispute that fact. The land historically and legally belong to the Sultanate. Also it is a fact that your still paying your annual lease.

It was just so sad, why Filipinos are deported in the lands which in the first place they have the right to live in.

[bisaya]

it's a lame excuse to grab someone's land by saying that since the people who settled in those land have already decided not to give the land to the owner/heir so the owner has already lose his claim over his own land.

it's like someone rented your property and then when he leaves the group of people who were staying in that property were told that they can decide if they are to give the property back to the owner or take the property as their own.

it would really be best if we just give it back to the sultanate of sulu. it belongs to them.

the best way to make philippines prosper in peace is to let go of sulu and let the tausug claim sabah back on their own. coz i'm sure and i've heard that they'll take it back after gaining independence from the philippines. it's up to them to decide if they want to be malaysians but i'v heard they hated the malaysians because of what happened to them in malaysia. many of those who were maltreated were also muslims and tausug. that is why they hated the malaysians. so, giving sulu back to the sultanate of sulu and the tausugs would be peace for the philippines but it might mean terror for malaysia. let the brave and proud tausugs terrorize malaysia till malaysia give back what they(the tausugs) believe to be their land.

[bisaya]

double posts

This post has been edited by bisaya: Jan 23 2006, 11:15 AM

[bisaya]

sorry double posts.

This post has been edited by bisaya: Jan 23 2006, 11:16 AM

[pancaindera]

long time ago the ppl of Sabah lived in peace,
despite the occasional headhunting
ppl lived in tribes and didnt have any need for governance.
they were self sufficient and lived in small communities
with minimal social complications. they farm and raise livestock.
everything was fine and dandy
until,...
the kingdom of brunei claimed dominance over sabah
then sultan from sulu, then the british, and lastly the malaysians.
Sabah belongs Sabahans
and we have chosen to maintain and affirm the status quo.
the way i see it,
the sultan of brunei has given to sultan of sulu something he never owned.
nemo dat quod non habet.
that means everytrhing else becomes null and void.

[Datu Mandub]

long time ago the ppl of Sabah lived in peace,
despite the occasional headhunting
ppl lived in tribes and didnt have any need for governance.
they were self sufficient and lived in small communities
with minimal social complications. they farm and raise livestock.
everything was fine and dandy
until,...
the kingdom of brunei claimed dominance over sabah
then sultan from sulu, then the british, and lastly the malaysians.
Sabah belongs Sabahans
and we have chosen to maintain and affirm the status quo.
the way i see it,
the sultan of brunei has given to sultan of sulu something he never owned.
nemo dat quod non habet.
that means everytrhing else becomes null and void.

Of course, why would you give someone that he already owned ? you don't own it until it was given to you. Oh if the other way around, why would it called be a Dutch sponsored rebellon in the first place ?

Some descendants of the royal family nowadays are Sabahans, so you only speak for yourself....these people are mostly living in Sandakan, Kudat and Tuwau. When the Sultan first wants to claim Sabah from the British in 1958 it was the Taganak Islands (Turtle Island) that was turned over until the inventory of lands is completed. It was only 1980 that the person assigned to do inventory returned to the Philippines. The Malaysian acknowledges the propreity and hereditary rights of the heirs( but not sovereignty), that is why they allowed inventory of lands decades ago and still paying the heirs up to this day.....that is the fact and undisputed.

This post has been edited by Datu Mandub: Jan 23 2006, 11:03 PM

[samheisfl]

As far as everyone in Indonesia  and the Philippines is concern Malaysia is a land grabber

I think the Sabahan and Sarawakian vote to join Malaysia..
Not like Indonesia that grab Timor leste? or Maybe west Papua?
And the pilipinos that attack the Sulu sultanate during the spanish era.. watever..

[Ek-ek]

Malaysia had land grabbed Turtle islands, Sabah from the Philippines , Kedah and Perlis from Thailand, Sarawak , Ligitan and Sipadan from Indonesia with the aid from the British empire and had forged the so -called election.

[Protoculture]

January 22,1878 - In exchange for US$5,000, Sultan Jamal ul-Alam leased North Borneo to the Hong Kong-based British trading company of Baron Gustavos von Overbeck and Alfred Dent and conferred upon Overbeck the title Datu Bendahara, Raja of Sandakan [K.B. Tregoning, A History of Modern Sabah/Agoncillo history of the Filipino People]

It is clear it was leased, by papers and history, Sabah belongs to the Sultan of Sulu, his successors and heirs. The House of the Royal Sultanate of Sulu want that recognition, that the sovereignty of Sabah belongs to them. In a way, it is yours because you annexed it and also as i read through, the people chose you over us. But for real, the land belong to the Sultanate, which is [the Sultanate], part of the Philippines. You can't dispute that fact. The land historically and legally belong to the Sultanate. Also it is a fact that your still paying your annual lease.

It was just so sad, why Filipinos are deported in the lands which in the first place they have the right to live in.

Have you being reading my posts?

Darn it to hell, drummed in your head that Sabah IS OF MALAYSIAN ENTITY!

Sabahans want to remain MALAYSIANS!

The rights of native Sabahans outstrip those Filipino immigrants!

[Protoculture]

it's a lame excuse to grab someone's land by saying that since the people who settled in those land have already decided not to give the land to the owner/heir so the owner has already lose his claim over his own land.

it's like someone rented your property and then when he leaves the group of people who were staying in that property were told that they can decide if they are to give the property back to the owner or take the property as their own.

it would really be best if we just give it back to the sultanate of sulu. it belongs to them.

the best way to make philippines prosper in peace is to let go of sulu and let the tausug claim sabah back on their own. coz i'm sure and i've heard that they'll take it back after gaining independence from the philippines. it's up to them to decide if they want to be malaysians but i'v heard they hated the malaysians because of what happened to them in malaysia. many of those who were maltreated were also muslims and tausug. that is why they hated the malaysians. so, giving sulu back to the sultanate of sulu and the tausugs would be peace for the philippines but it might mean terror for malaysia. let the brave and proud tausugs terrorize malaysia till malaysia give back what they(the tausugs) believe to be their land.

Those native people of Sabah lived in the land before even Sulu Sultanate even exists!

Their rightful descendants chose to be MALAYSIAN, something those Sulu heirs suckers don't even think about!

Tausugs terrorists? Heck, let 'em come, let our brave troops stationed all along Sabah's coast with the help of native Sabahans slaughter them all should those terrorists ever come within Malaysian soil. We don't givva a damn to hostile forces hellbent terrorising Sabah, cause we're more than ready to protect, defend Sabah to the bitter end from foreign aggression!

[Protoculture]

Of course, why would you give someone that he already owned ?  you don't own it until it was given to you. Oh if the other way around, why would it called be a  Dutch sponsored rebellon in the first place ?

Some descendants of the royal family nowadays are Sabahans, so you only speak for yourself....these people are mostly living in Sandakan, Kudat and Tuwau. When the Sultan first wants to claim Sabah from the British in 1958 it was the Taganak Islands (Turtle Island) that was turned over until the inventory of lands is completed. It was only 1980 that the person assigned to do inventory returned to the Philippines.  The Malaysian acknowledges the propreity and hereditary rights of the heirs( but not sovereignty), that is why they allowed inventory of lands decades ago and still paying the heirs up to this day.....that is the fact and undisputed.

Yes, some of the Sulu Sultanate's descendants are Malaysian. A few of them are quite active in Sabah's politics, but they sure as heck don't wanna become Filipino.

We still paying the rent, honoring the ol' agreement. But, to return the land, its up to the people of Sabah. The people of Sabah choose MALAYSIA!

[Dimasangkay]

Yes as I read through, the people chose Malaysia. The people are yours, but the land belongs to the Sultanate and that is irrevocable.

It is so difficult to pass judgement upon this case. If the people don't want to be part of the Sultanate, which is they are supposed to be, then maybe I think, agree to a new contract. By paying the lease according to the price in the modern value.
I heard it was 78,212.62 PhP which is way too low for an annual lease for that big land.

[poknat]

I must agree with Dimasangkay , The Malaysian government is still paying that amount to the heir of the Sultan of Sulu up to this date.

[Protoculture]

Yes as I read through, the people chose Malaysia. The people are yours, but the land belongs to the Sultanate and that is irrevocable.

It is so difficult to pass judgement upon this case. If the people don't want to be part of the Sultanate, which is they are supposed to be, then maybe I think, agree to a new contract. By paying the lease according to the price in the modern value.
I heard it was 78,212.62 PhP which is way too low for an annual lease for that big land.

Its up to native Sabahan. Its up to Sabah state Govt.

MY Govt. pays according to contract. Thats it. The case had been referred to ICJ. The case is strong enough for MY to win hands down.

MY had the backing of Sabahan. In today's democracy, MY wins .... no question asked!

[poknat]

SO THAT MEANS, the Malaysian government acknowledges the right of Sultan of Sulu over Sabah and Turtle islands!

[RL33]

SO THAT MEANS, the Malaysian government acknowledges the right of Sultan of Sulu over Sabah and Turtle islands!

Sabahano's = squatters

[Protoculture]

SO THAT MEANS, the Malaysian government acknowledges the right of Sultan of Sulu over Sabah and Turtle islands!

Hell no!

We pay the darn fee cause we just want to honor the agreement, nothing less. Ohh, we pity them too. Is there a legitimate Sultanate of Sulu Kingdom? Oooops nope ... its the messed up Filipino backdoor!

Sabahano's = squatters

Native Sabahan are not squatters. Their ancestors lived in Sabah long before Sulu Sultanate ever exists. Their rights overrode the Sulu Sultan's heirs rights.

That means their rights to remain as MALAYSIAN.

[halohalo]

Hell no!

We pay the darn fee cause we just want to honor the agreement, nothing less. Ohh, we pity them too. Is there a legitimate Sultanate of Sulu Kingdom? Oooops nope ... its the messed up Filipino backdoor!
Native Sabahan are not squatters. Their ancestors lived in Sabah long before Sulu Sultanate ever exists. Their rights overrode the Sulu Sultan's heirs rights.

That means their rights to remain as MALAYSIAN.

can't we all juz be frends? cheers mate! (IMG:http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) (IMG:http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/biggthumpup.gif)

This post has been edited by halohalo: Jan 26 2006, 04:51 AM

[Protoculture]

can't we all juz be frends? cheers mate! (IMG:http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) (IMG:http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/biggthumpup.gif)

Of course, no problem. My aunt loved watching Philippines soap dramas currently being aired in Malaysian TV ... what was it ... Sanay Walang Na Wakas or something like that ....

Legal Filipino workers, generally maids are very professional. They can speak English too, thank God - so my friend say, lah!

[samheisfl]

had forged the so -called election.

How do you know it is forged?