It may sounds like a thunderbolt on daylight but from what I heard Indonesia will mostly have war with Malaysia because of Ambalat island. The Indonesian defense ministry also have prepare to draft a new law that enforce any Indonesian youth between the age of 18 - 45 to experience atleast 2 year military experience. As for me, I'm ready to die to defend the one I love including my homeland, girls and peace. Merdeka!

I think 45 might be a bit old but I'm glad you consider 45 youth

Yeah, I support another Konfrantasi.
Go go go...

Indonesian even able to win with sharpedned bamboo and have over 350 years war experience while Malaysian never have any war experience since Malaysia born not by a fight but by a pity from England. What most infortant is, Indonesian have what it known as the spirit of 45.

agreed on this, at 45 most people already wearing out with regards to their stamina.

So after you win what you gonna do. Kill all people in Malaysia like you did in Aceh . Trust me war is bad. Nobody want it from happening.

No one want war even me but if there are those who want to take away my homeland then it is my duty to protect it with my own life. Win or lose not imfortant, what imfortant is fighting for truth and justice.

Good luck to you

War is stupidity in human's history.
We just had peaceful solutions for Aceh issue.
I don't wanna Indonesia to experience another war.

I hope Malaysian armed force wouldn't do anything stupid like provoking Indonesian navy......

THAT'S NOT TRUE.MALAYSIA GAINED INDEPENDENCE THROUGH THE MIND OF OUR GENIUS LEADERS.WE DON'T WANT TO GAIN IT BY KILLING PEOPLE,DEATH OR MISERY.INSTEAD WE USE OUR BRAINS TO GAIN IT.EVERYBODY WAS PROUD OF US AT THAT TIME BECAUSE WE GAIN INDEPENDANCE WITHOUT WAR.PEOPLE WHO SAID THAT WE GAIN IT BACAUSE ENGLAND PITY US ARE JUST JEALOUS!

Fact are fact, it may very bitter to the Malaysian knowing England pity them to gain their freedom. And I can see there are some loser Indonesian replying this topic who don't want to go to the front line of war by saying pathetic hope such as "I hope Malaysian armed force wouldn't do anything stupid like provoking Indonesian navy......"
If you want to be a loser then just get out from Indonesia, loser only a burden to others. There is a reason to have war and that only reason is to protect the one we love, that is including our homeland, girls and peace. Those 3 are worth dying for.

Hey our former Prime Minister, Tunku Abdul Rahman go to London and tell the British govt that British need to release Malaysia. And they did that not because they pity (of course everybody know British love to suck money from Malaysia) but because they know that the right thing to do. Our leader just tell them that they are wrong for not allow MY gaining its independence and guess what, british leader just accept that they are wrong and asked the forgiveness from our leader....

But war between MY and INDO was just a mistake. It just in your stupid imagination.

edit: this is serious talk.

over an island? is this you guys spratly?

Heheheh yes. Just for a small tiny island which happen to have a lot amount of black gold.

Unfortunately this is not true. England after WWII could not hold on to her empire and as a result had already started to take steps to give her colonies independence when TAR went to England.

But giving Malaysia independence was the right thing to do.

i heard that our gov need 6 miliions for one trainee.....how many 18 to 45 peeps in Indonesia? millions!! how much money we waste then? A LOT!!!!.were economically and culturally colonized now...y it happens? because theres so many uneducated people in Indo...so, give the MONEY to THEM!!! educate them!!! WAR dosent only mean a real WAR, with gun,bomb and tank involved...thats soooo old thinking....we face economic and techonology war now...and Indonesia clearly become a looser in this war...having educated people is the only way to win this modern war!! and its not gonna happen if our gov keep wasting our money to unnecessary thing....including this "Wajib Militer thingy"....wasting money, a new corruption place for corruptor....

i bet the 6million rupiah.....4 million will be siphoned into somebody pocket

Stupid-fukhead war-mongering twerp who play too much war game and watch too much war movie without take the lessons from the story, or just too dumb to understand......
I bet you never even been to war torn area, or witnessed the sorrow and destructions caused by war.
You just too much full of $hit, and your childish heroic masturbated imaginations is only pumped by unbalanced immature testosterone level.

Yappari...., Omae wa Hontouni BAKA-yarou....!

Saying anybody loser is the sign of how pathetic you are.....

My words "I hope Malaysian armed force wouldn't do anything stupid like provoking Indonesian navy......"
is a soft warning to Malaysia, not to do stupid things like provoke Indonesia, coz they will face destruction to waking up ever militant TNI. And we Indonesian people do somehow more militant than them.

And I don't know how your brain cells work (if you have any) so you take my words as pathetic hope...?
Did you have good mark in english...., or did you just skip classes to play video games....?
(biar ngerti pake bahasa Indonesia aja...., dulu nilai bahasa Inggrisnya berapa mas....? sampe enggak bisa nangkep makna tersirat dalam kata-kata....?, blo'On banggets deh loe...!).

How do you know I don't wanna go to frontline....? Stupid presumptions....
You know..., I have being trained basic traininng latihan dasar keprajuritan during my college years. Dephan got my files (omg.... ).... So if war ever broke out, me and my friends are among the first men enlisted to wajib militer. While sorry asses like you only dare to b!tching out to Malaysia in warnet.....



Who the hell do you think you are....? Pak Lurah who sign my KTP....?
"Siape elu sama moyang lu bisa ngusir gue keluar Indonesia....? Elo yang punya tanah ini.....? you filthy fart bag...
Totally sign of foolishness..... I'm really ashamed to have fellow Indonesian who has severe level of stupidity beyond recognition like you.....



I love my country and my family too, but not as stupid as you.
And what about your silly philosophy of homeland, girls and peace worth dying for.....
Is it totally come from anime or silly cheesy film you ever seen......?
I bet if the guns pointed to your sorry empty head, you will not this gung-ho anymore, and wet your pants. If I was a general, I would love to have warmongering private like you, and send you to war torn area like Palestine, Kongo, Somalia, Afghanistan and Irak..... then look in about a decade, how mentally broken you will be.......

...tone it down, please...
there was no need for that, just discuss the issue at hand, thanx.

Ih ngagetin.... tau tau nongol di belakang....... stalker.....!
(I start to hate authority..... ).

calm down guys..there won't be a war between these two countries..it will be a waste of lives and money and can only cause destructions..but if a war happens, the first basic strategy is to have air superiority..the country that has greater air superiority will win the war..and then there should be fortified walls along the coastline of peninsula malaysia or sumatera..and then there will be the largest invasion ever..even larger than normandy..in your face hitler!! ..i'm just kidding guys..

Leave the Malaysian that bordered to Sumatra Island to the Andalas peoples, we will crush them to bits if they dare to take Ambalat island even only 1 mm. I'm from the Andalas island, we will do what we need to do. We all will die sooner or later but how we die are what matters, I wish to die in the way of truth and justice.

seriously what's wrong with you man?..you're sick n you need help..see a doctor or something..giler ape mamat ni..ntah ape2 ntah..

And leave the Malaysian bordered with Kalimantan island to the Kalimantan peoples, just send them thick haze and it will probably paralize the Malaysian bordered with Kalimantan economy it the haze keep covering their homeland over than 1 month. At least they will have a hard live to live in a normal live because of the haze.

Anyway....look at the streams of catastrophes in Indonesia right now...quakes after quakes, crash after crash, ...so be proud of whatever you want to do to us....mother nature takes care of it

Hmmm from what I hear, Indonesia was was born out of pity by the UN who pressured the Dutch to give independence to Indonesia. As for 1945, didn't the British win that battle?

Nah, Indonesia was born by:

1) Killing 4000 Dutch soldiers and 1500 British soldiers and 1000 Japanese soldiers working for the Allies during the 4-year war of independence.

2) Massacring 4000 white settlers between 1945-1946

3) Killing 10,000 PKI communist rebels who in 1948 despicably tried to overthrow the nationalist govt which had proclaimed independence in 1945, whilst we are still facing Dutch invasion. Amongst those killed by glorious Indonesian army was Indonesia's Ho Chi Minh wannabe, Musso, who had spent the previous two decades in Moscow. By killing the communist traitors, Indonesia suddenly gained support from the USA who had previously supported the Dutch.

Indonesia born by a fight for over 350 years and from the help of Japanese who invade Indonesian in 1941.

Well, I don't know the whole context. I just read on various history sites that the UN pressured the Dutch to give independence to the Indonesians and they did. I do know there was various conflicts between the 2 going on, but I'll try to investigate more before I come to a better conclusion.

According to the country studies US library of congress it says the Dutch were able to retake control of Indonesia but their hard tactics towards the Indonesians were condemned by the UN so they got pressured to give it Independence.

Maybe this isn't the whole story and I would like to hear the Indonesian side of it.

http://lcweb2.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/r?frd/...d(DOCID+id0030)

There was a four-year war of independence (1945-1949) pitting Indonesian freedom fighters against an invasion force of 300,000 Dutch soldiers (the biggest military operation in Dutch history) and 30,000 British soldiers that killed 20000 Indonesians, 8000 Dutch soldiers and settlers, 1500 British soldiers (including two generals: Brigadier AWS Mallaby and Brigadier Robert Guy Loder-Smith), and 1000 Japanese soldiers fighting for the Allies.



Far from "retaking control" of Indonesia, the Dutch between 1948 and 1949 only captured some major cities, but the entire countryside (particularly in Java, Sumatera, South Celebes, and South Kalimantan) remains under the control of Indonesian army who launched periodic assaults into Dutch-held cities. The entire TNI (Indonesian Army) structure remained intact, while a functioning Emergency Government operates from Bukittinggi.

Between 1945-1948, the Dutch were confined to several beachheads (Jakarta, Semarang, Surabaya, Medan) which had been captured for them by the British at the cost of 1500 British lives. Majority of Java, Sumatera, and Madura were under the control of independent Republic of Indonesia government. This is a superior accomplishment compared with Vietnamese insurgents, who lost control over most of the country to the French early in 1945-1946.

That the UN and the entire international community supported Indonesia and shunned the Dutch is thanks to the superior Indonesian strategy of combining military struggle with diplomatic struggle. Indonesia's excellent diplomats (such as Haji Agus Salim and Lambertus Nicodemus Palar) successfully persuaded the world to back Indonesia. The USA was persuaded to support Indonesia since we successfully crushed the treacherous Madiun communist rebellion of 1948, convincing them that Indonesian nationalists are good allies in the upcoming Cold War against communism.

As proof of our superior performance, Indonesia won the war of independence relatively easily within short four years (1945-1949). Compare this with Vietnam, which required 30 years of war (1945-1975) to finally free itself from foreign domination. There are several reasons for the superior performance of Indonesian freedom fighters compared to Vietnamese rebels:

1) Superior diplomatic skills of Indonesian freedom fighters, compared with inferior Vietnamese diplomatic efforts.

2) Our enemy was a weakling small country with limited capacity, Netherlands. The Vietnamese faced a stronger enemy France, and later faced the USA. This is because Vietnamese freedom movement was taken-over by the communists, hence drawing itself against USA in the Cold War situation.

3) Indonesian freedom fighters were relatively extremely united against colonialism, while the Vietnamese movement was divided between the equally-strong communists (under Ho Chi Minh) and nationalists (under Bao Dai and later Ngo Dinh Diem). The Vietnamese war was as much fighting the foreign forces as with civil war amongst the Vietnamese themselves, to the extent that the nationalists ask for American help to defend itself from communist attacks. Worse, the Cambodians and Laotians refused to support Vietnam, while most of Vietnam's ethnic minority supported the foreign powers.

Well I don't see how that's a superior accomplishment considering the fact that they only had control because the British refused to give Java, Sumatera and other islands to the Dutch which they had under their control.

I would call it a British accomplishment and not a Indonesian one.

http://www.fsmitha.com/h2/ch23t.htm





Hmmmm I don't see how that is different from how South Africa got its independence from the Dutch as well. I believe it was due to UN International pressure as well. So I guess the South Africians were master diplomacist as well.



But Indonesia never got independence by defeating the West in battle. So I don't see how that is superior in accomplishment to Vietnam to defeated the West in battle to get independence.

Sure Indonesia may have got independence first, but it was just due to mercy by the UN like how South Africa got it, while Vietnam had to fight the enemy and take it from their dead bodies.

I personally would like to avoid a Vietnam vs. Indonesia thing so lets discuss without dragging "whose accomplishment is more superior than the other".



But in the end they all ended up under Vietnam's rule.

@ Purnomor.... let's not become arrogant Indonesian shall we.....

@ Byron
IMO Vietnam is great.... they managed to outwitted and exhaust world's great power.
From China to French, then USA. They are like David facing Goliath.
Although with long, bitter and tremendous bloody struggle of Vietnam people. (That's why if I saw Red Vietnam flag, first things occur to my mind is BLOOD..... ).
Indonesia and Vietnam both are brothers in arm in fighting colonialism.
The different is Indonesia went Nationalist, when Vietnam goes for Communist.....

Both facing bitter and difficult struggle, winning our liberty with our own strength, with honor and pride.
While others South East Asian countries gain their independence smoothly, blodlessly, almost seems effortlessly, bestowed by their former colonizer. Coz the British empire are crumbling down, and it was the world's demand and movement to move ahead towards decolonization.

Your statement's nonsensical content indicates complete lack of comprehension in your part. Let me make our history clearer for you: the British never had any control of Java and Sumatera. 90% of these islands are under control of Indonesian government with its capital in Yogyakarta, a city in Central Java. The British were successfully intimidated from occupying the islands after experiencing battles with Indonesian fighters that killed 1500 British soldiers, including two British generals. Even in the few areas occupied by the British, Indonesian govt maintained a functioning shadow government. Due to their losses, the British hurriedly departed Indonesia in 1946.

Compare this with the successful British occupation of Saigon at the same period, when the British easily crushed communist Vietminh organisation in South Vietnam. As consequence of this British accomplishment in 1945, South Vietnam remained outside communist hands until 1975.

Meanwhile, in the north, the French basically have crushed the Vietminh in Operation Lea and gained control over all the cities and most of the countryside of Vietnam by 1946. It was only communist Chinese help since 1949 that prevented Vietminh from being totally annihilated by the French.



Wrong on all counts:

1) South Africa was not colonised by the Dutch, it was ruled by white minority (14% of the population) who practiced racial discrimination against the rest 86% of the population.

2) South African anti-apartheid movement did not control any territory, did not possess any military, did not have any form of alternative government, and failed to wage an insurgency against the apartheid regime. Indonesia quickly established a full-fledged government (including President and Parliament, with its emergency capital in Yogyakarta), a full-fledged military, which controlled majority of Indonesia throughout the war of independence.

3) South Africans are indeed good diplomats (with their Nelson Mandela and Bishop Tutu), but the quality of their diplomacy are inferior to Indonesians, since it took until from 1910s until 1994 for ANC to end apartheid, while it merely took four short years for Indonesians to liberate itself from the Dutch.



Wrong again, since Indonesia killed thousands of foreign soldiers during the war of independence while winning battles as well (Battle of Ambarawa, etc) without any foreign military aid at all. Vietnamese rebels might won several battles (which is thanks to unlimited military and personnel aid from neighboring China), but they lost most of the battles (for instance, the Tet Offensive which destroyed most Vietcong infrastructure in South Vietnamese cities). That Indonesian battles were not as numerous and bloody as the Vietnam battles is because the Dutch surrendered too quickly before Indonesia can kill more foreign soldiers.

It is clear Indonesian freedom fighters are superior in defeating the Western invaders without foreign military support at all, unlike Vietnam.



Wrong again, since Indonesia's independence is secured mostly by killing enemy soldiers, complemented by a stellar diplomatic and propaganda offensive that successfully isolated Netherlands from the international community. Vietnam only got its independence through massive aid from China and the communist bloc. Additionally, Indonesia secured its victory with much less loss of lives and destruction of property than Vietnam's total devastation.



LOL, if you are so sensitive about acknowledging the fact of the superiority of Indonesia's historical accomplishments over Vietnam, then why you came to Indonesian Forum and belittle our struggle for independence?



Are you sure Cambodia and Laos are under Vietnam's rule

Yes to Kue Cucur is So Yummy....... no to war!

Earthquakes, volcanoes eruptions, cities disappearing and life lost due to floods, corruptions, forest fires, pollution, bird flue ...hmmm, now wars over a tiny island? Another politicians’ deterrence teknik?

War should be the last option, but it will always be an option.



These are unrelated things. Natural disasters will not stop Indonesia from defending every inch of its territory from foreign aggression.

Ok for the sake of peace, since some people are uncomfortable with this topic, I will stop this discussion even though there are a lot of factual errors made by Purnomor like the Tet Offensive which was not part of the war with the French.

bwahahaha..baru sekali ngeliat, eh ngebaca Madja sewot...bwahahaha..terusin aja...orang itu emang pantes digituin...Go Madja!!!

The truth is the U.N have nothing to do with Indonesian freedom because in 17 August 1945 the day when Indonesian declare its independence from the Dutch, the U.N still not born. And when the Dutch and a few other western country such as england and portugese attack Indonesia, the U.N never send any of its peace guard army to defend Indonesia.

dont worry.. we filipinos will back indonesia because we are taking back sabah one way or another..
its going to be RP and Indonesia vs Malaysia

Nah-nah, we will crush the Malaysian alone and leave Sabah to the Fhilippino.

Let us the Indonesian show the might of what known as Tiger Of ASIA

is this the mentality represented in most afer members? if it is, how sad!

Nope..... don't generalize lah.....!

sorry la...joking

That's OK....
He's gotta issue I think.....
Maybe need help..... you shouldn't take him seriously.....

For loser, they don't know how to talk wuth sword come out from their tongue. What loser know are how to lick the people they are talking too.

Wow, you're very patriotic dude. When you planned to help your countrymen who involved in earthquake in Sumatera Barat ???

being nice and friendly doesnt equal lick people, u shallow-minded-brain-damage human being.....but yes, theres someone born to be evil, like the Omen, i feel sorry for u.....

tone it down dude, just discuss the topic without resorting to name-calling, thanx.

@proud asian
how are you gonna fight anyway huh..with woods and sticks?!..I don't think so..I bet you can't even hold a stick..

Here's a thought.

Instead of war-mongering with each other, why don't we just unite Indonesia, Malaysia, The Philippines, Brunei, East Timor, Papua, and Singapore to create one big Malay Empire?

Then we could annex the Australian continent.