I would like fellow Vietnamese opinions on this.
It has been reported that many Vietnamese "refugees" at the Philippines when given a chance to have permanent resident status there declined, but wanted to go to first world nations like the USA, Canada, Australia, etc. They were holed up there from late '80s to 2005 praying for a chance to go to first world nations.
So if they were really political refugees why not accept the Philippines offer?
For the same reasons YOUR parents chose the US. Which one were they, 'political whiners' or 'economic whiners'? Which country is irrelevant.
I would have to say that most people left because of the economic conditions in Vietnam and not because the government was Communist per se.
^^ exactly ...but some who has already landed themself in first world nations proudly label themself as political refugees 
....
My parents wanted a new life,a future for us.most important,they wanted to escape poverty in a war torn country.
....My parents wanted a new life,a future for us.most important,they wanted to escape poverty in a war torn country.
'political refugee' is just a term used to discredit the deserted governtment..
QUOTE(jimm¥ @ May 2 2007, 11:19 AM) 
^^ exactly ...but some who has already landed themself in first world nations proudly label themself as political refugees ....
My parents wanted a new life,a future for us.most important,they wanted to escape poverty in a war torn country.
....My parents wanted a new life,a future for us.most important,they wanted to escape poverty in a war torn country.
in this situation political refugees are sort of like rigid protocols to see porn... but really porn is what's driving
From a humanistic psychological perspective, the hierarchy of need begins with physiological needs... political masturbation are merely after hour activities to illustrate the hypocrisy of an unfulfilled lives, specifically refering to the yellow flaggies 
Maybe, but just a few. I think the most vietnamese people left vietnam, because of the communist regime.
Those people are trying to escape/hide from the corrupted Commies government. More reason why Commies need to die..
QUOTE(jimm¥ @ May 2 2007, 11:26 AM)
'political refugee' is just a term used to discredit the deserted governtment..
In those days, the government did plenty on its own to discredit itself.
QUOTE(jose cuervo @ May 2 2007, 06:36 AM)
I would like fellow Vietnamese opinions on this.
It has been reported that many Vietnamese "refugees" at the Philippines when given a chance to have permanent resident status there declined, but wanted to go to first world nations like the USA, Canada, Australia, etc. They were holed up there from late '80s to 2005 praying for a chance to go to first world nations.
So if they were really political refugees why not accept the Philippines offer?
It has been reported that many Vietnamese "refugees" at the Philippines when given a chance to have permanent resident status there declined, but wanted to go to first world nations like the USA, Canada, Australia, etc. They were holed up there from late '80s to 2005 praying for a chance to go to first world nations.
So if they were really political refugees why not accept the Philippines offer?
are you sure man? I remember watching a video(PBN or something) with Trinh Hoi showing many make a living there by going around selling stuffs because they are allowed to have citizenship and cannot hold any job.
QUOTE
Last of Vietnamese Boat People in Philippines Start for United States
By Douglas Bakshian
Manila
26 September 2005
The last group of Vietnamese boat people in the Philippines has started leaving for the United States, under a program coordinated by the International Organization for Migration.
About 1,600 Vietnamese refugees, who fled their nation more than 16 years ago, are finally making their way to the United States. The International Organization for Migration (IOM), says more than 200 left on a flight to Los Angeles Monday, and the rest will follow over the next six months.
Tony Do, an IOM supervisor handling the Vietnamese resettlement project in the Philippines, says many of the refugees came to the country at the height of the "boat people" era of the mid-1980s, when thousands were still fleeing the 1975 communist takeover of South Vietnam.
When the Philippine refugee camps closed in 1996, the refugees spread throughout the country, mostly making a living as market or street vendors.
Mr. Do says they are mostly being allowed into the United States on claims of persecution or fear of persecution. Many had originally been denied refugee status because they were viewed as economic rather than political cases.
"They've been here as stateless people," said Mr. Do. "They're allowed to stay here in the Philippines, but they were never given citizenship, so many of them could not get jobs. People who had professional training in Vietnam could not practice. It was a state of limbo."
Many of the refugees have relatives in the United States, and Mr. Do says the return program ends a long ordeal for them.
"It is very emotional," he said. "I was at the airport seeing the first group off. They were very happy, they were very emotional, and they were very appreciative of what we did to help them."
The U.S. and Philippine governments agreed to a resettlement program in 2004 for the remaining refugees, believed to number about two-thousand. Several hundred have not received final approval for resettlement.
The IOM coordinated medical screening and administrative support for the refugees, who were also checked by U.S. authorities.
By Douglas Bakshian
Manila
26 September 2005
The last group of Vietnamese boat people in the Philippines has started leaving for the United States, under a program coordinated by the International Organization for Migration.
About 1,600 Vietnamese refugees, who fled their nation more than 16 years ago, are finally making their way to the United States. The International Organization for Migration (IOM), says more than 200 left on a flight to Los Angeles Monday, and the rest will follow over the next six months.
Tony Do, an IOM supervisor handling the Vietnamese resettlement project in the Philippines, says many of the refugees came to the country at the height of the "boat people" era of the mid-1980s, when thousands were still fleeing the 1975 communist takeover of South Vietnam.
When the Philippine refugee camps closed in 1996, the refugees spread throughout the country, mostly making a living as market or street vendors.
Mr. Do says they are mostly being allowed into the United States on claims of persecution or fear of persecution. Many had originally been denied refugee status because they were viewed as economic rather than political cases.
"They've been here as stateless people," said Mr. Do. "They're allowed to stay here in the Philippines, but they were never given citizenship, so many of them could not get jobs. People who had professional training in Vietnam could not practice. It was a state of limbo."
Many of the refugees have relatives in the United States, and Mr. Do says the return program ends a long ordeal for them.
"It is very emotional," he said. "I was at the airport seeing the first group off. They were very happy, they were very emotional, and they were very appreciative of what we did to help them."
The U.S. and Philippine governments agreed to a resettlement program in 2004 for the remaining refugees, believed to number about two-thousand. Several hundred have not received final approval for resettlement.
The IOM coordinated medical screening and administrative support for the refugees, who were also checked by U.S. authorities.
LINK
Also, i think we should take racism into account of why most Vietnamese dont want to stay in Philippine or other southeast asian countries.
QUOTE(chanoi @ May 2 2007, 03:50 PM)
Also, i think we should take racism into account of why most Vietnamese dont want to stay in Philippine or other southeast asian countries.
Well put. Most people knew US started this war, stopped the election, dumped bombs and poisons etc. So they feel US and the first nations have a responsibility. Vietnamese settle in countries like Phil or China would definitely face racism another form of discrimination much political discrimination.
Philippines Offers Residency To Vietnamese Refugees
Jun. 02, 1998
MANILA (CWNews.com) - President Fidel Ramos on Monday signed an executive order to allow Vietnamese refugees to apply for permanent residency in the Philippines and eventually citizenship.
About 1,500 Vietnamese are living in the Philippines, most in a resettlement camp, after their bids to travel to Western countries were rejected. During a visit to Palawan, where the Vietville resettlement camp is located, Ramos announced the order "which will pave the way for the processing of the applications and supporting documents for permanent residency and possibly citizenship of Vietnamese nationals."
More than 40,000 "boat people" who fled to the Philippines after the Communist takeover of South Vietnam in 1975 were eventually resettled in the United States and other countries. The group still in the country failed to qualify for asylum and those in Vietville are being taken cared of by Catholic charity groups.
http://www.cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=7762
================
On the same boat
Editor's Note: Published on Page A14 of the September 30, 2005 issue of the Philippine Daily Inquirer
THE DEPARTURE of the first batch of the “remnants” of the so-called “boat people” marked a poignant moment for both Vietnam and the Philippines. On the one hand, it brought the refugee problem that swept Southeast Asia and the West immediately after the victory of the communists in Indochina to its closing chapter, even as it leaves unresolved questions on how to deal with asylum-seekers fleeing from totalitarian regimes.
The boat people represent the wages of the Cultural Revolution, which was borne out of the utopian fantasy that was communist reeducation. In their eagerness to reinvent the economic wheel, the communist ideologues and bosses sent professionals and merchants -- the bourgeois elite in their estimation -- to the farms for reeducation. Although the degree of cultural experiment varied (it seemed harsher in Cambodia than in Vietnam), the fantasy turned into a monumental nightmare. Industries and professions were emptied of intellectuals, educators, scientists and businessmen. Poverty was socialized. Widespread famine ensued. Blind to its own depredations that caused the general poverty, the communist bosses freely pointed their guns at the people. Rice fields became killing fields.
Not wishing to be part of the killing fields, thousands of Indochinese boarded rickety boats and headed for the high seas. They would rather brave uncertain weather than face certain death at home. Their intrepidity had touches of madness -- and this madness defied reservations -- particularly in the West -- that the boat people were not political dissidents but merely “economic migrants.” The tag glosses over the fact that the search for political sanctuary is as much a product of economics as politics.
The Philippines, of course, knows the economic determinism that propels a diaspora. Filipinos themselves have made an art out of migration. Many of them take pride in the income they make from their jobs abroad -- income that translates to dollar remittances to their home country and keeps the domestic economy afloat. But they themselves admit that if they could make generous income at home, they would rather stay put. They know that the Indochinese people were hurting. They felt the hurt.
Perhaps, that explains why, unique among Southeast Asians, the Philippines welcomed the boat people instead of turning them away. It put up refugee processing centers in Puerto Princesa City and Bataan province that became models for refugee hosting around the world. When the Ramos administration in 1996 put its foot down and refused to accept more boat people, even turning away one batch and leading it back to the mercies of the high seas, the Catholic Church and civil society cried foul. The Ramos administration received a stern scolding; it later backtracked on its policy of forced repatriation.
The Catholic Church, through Bishop Ramon Arguelles, the military chaplain at that time and chair of the bishops’ commission on migration, raised money to purchase a 10-hectare land in Puerto Princesa in the western province of Palawan that came to be known as Vietville. When the village was inaugurated in 1998, a US-based Vietnamese Buddhist monk came to the inauguration and praised the Philippines and the Catholic Church. “We have heard praises for what you have done for the people,” said the Venerable Thich Giac Nhien. “I’d like to tell the world of our admiration for the Church and the government of the Philippines.”
Today, Vietville showcases the acculturation of the Vietnamese and other Indochinese to Philippine life. It shows how Filipinos practice their hospitality not only in word but in deed. Early this week, when 229 of the 1,600 stateless individuals left the Philippines for the United States, many expressed profuse thanks to the Filipinos. They said they would surely miss the sounds, sights and scents of the Philippines -- from television variety shows such as “Eat Bulaga,” to Filipino dishes such as the sour broth sinigang, and even the unique brand of Filipino humor that pokes fun at Filipino misery and travails. The same humor made them endure the ordeal of being “stateless” persons, they said.
But despite the hardships, the Philippines will continue to play a humanitarian role in refugee problems. Bishop Arguelles said it best about the boat people and about the Filipinos’ willingness in helping them: “They are not here knocking on our doors. We have accepted them to share in our simplicity. We will do this again if given the chance.” The prelate’s message was clear: Filipinos will continue to help those fleeing injustice and poverty, and it’s not just because they’re on the same boat.
http://news.inquirer.net/opinion/index.php...1794&col=84
Jun. 02, 1998
MANILA (CWNews.com) - President Fidel Ramos on Monday signed an executive order to allow Vietnamese refugees to apply for permanent residency in the Philippines and eventually citizenship.
About 1,500 Vietnamese are living in the Philippines, most in a resettlement camp, after their bids to travel to Western countries were rejected. During a visit to Palawan, where the Vietville resettlement camp is located, Ramos announced the order "which will pave the way for the processing of the applications and supporting documents for permanent residency and possibly citizenship of Vietnamese nationals."
More than 40,000 "boat people" who fled to the Philippines after the Communist takeover of South Vietnam in 1975 were eventually resettled in the United States and other countries. The group still in the country failed to qualify for asylum and those in Vietville are being taken cared of by Catholic charity groups.
http://www.cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=7762
================
On the same boat
Editor's Note: Published on Page A14 of the September 30, 2005 issue of the Philippine Daily Inquirer
THE DEPARTURE of the first batch of the “remnants” of the so-called “boat people” marked a poignant moment for both Vietnam and the Philippines. On the one hand, it brought the refugee problem that swept Southeast Asia and the West immediately after the victory of the communists in Indochina to its closing chapter, even as it leaves unresolved questions on how to deal with asylum-seekers fleeing from totalitarian regimes.
The boat people represent the wages of the Cultural Revolution, which was borne out of the utopian fantasy that was communist reeducation. In their eagerness to reinvent the economic wheel, the communist ideologues and bosses sent professionals and merchants -- the bourgeois elite in their estimation -- to the farms for reeducation. Although the degree of cultural experiment varied (it seemed harsher in Cambodia than in Vietnam), the fantasy turned into a monumental nightmare. Industries and professions were emptied of intellectuals, educators, scientists and businessmen. Poverty was socialized. Widespread famine ensued. Blind to its own depredations that caused the general poverty, the communist bosses freely pointed their guns at the people. Rice fields became killing fields.
Not wishing to be part of the killing fields, thousands of Indochinese boarded rickety boats and headed for the high seas. They would rather brave uncertain weather than face certain death at home. Their intrepidity had touches of madness -- and this madness defied reservations -- particularly in the West -- that the boat people were not political dissidents but merely “economic migrants.” The tag glosses over the fact that the search for political sanctuary is as much a product of economics as politics.
The Philippines, of course, knows the economic determinism that propels a diaspora. Filipinos themselves have made an art out of migration. Many of them take pride in the income they make from their jobs abroad -- income that translates to dollar remittances to their home country and keeps the domestic economy afloat. But they themselves admit that if they could make generous income at home, they would rather stay put. They know that the Indochinese people were hurting. They felt the hurt.
Perhaps, that explains why, unique among Southeast Asians, the Philippines welcomed the boat people instead of turning them away. It put up refugee processing centers in Puerto Princesa City and Bataan province that became models for refugee hosting around the world. When the Ramos administration in 1996 put its foot down and refused to accept more boat people, even turning away one batch and leading it back to the mercies of the high seas, the Catholic Church and civil society cried foul. The Ramos administration received a stern scolding; it later backtracked on its policy of forced repatriation.
The Catholic Church, through Bishop Ramon Arguelles, the military chaplain at that time and chair of the bishops’ commission on migration, raised money to purchase a 10-hectare land in Puerto Princesa in the western province of Palawan that came to be known as Vietville. When the village was inaugurated in 1998, a US-based Vietnamese Buddhist monk came to the inauguration and praised the Philippines and the Catholic Church. “We have heard praises for what you have done for the people,” said the Venerable Thich Giac Nhien. “I’d like to tell the world of our admiration for the Church and the government of the Philippines.”
Today, Vietville showcases the acculturation of the Vietnamese and other Indochinese to Philippine life. It shows how Filipinos practice their hospitality not only in word but in deed. Early this week, when 229 of the 1,600 stateless individuals left the Philippines for the United States, many expressed profuse thanks to the Filipinos. They said they would surely miss the sounds, sights and scents of the Philippines -- from television variety shows such as “Eat Bulaga,” to Filipino dishes such as the sour broth sinigang, and even the unique brand of Filipino humor that pokes fun at Filipino misery and travails. The same humor made them endure the ordeal of being “stateless” persons, they said.
But despite the hardships, the Philippines will continue to play a humanitarian role in refugee problems. Bishop Arguelles said it best about the boat people and about the Filipinos’ willingness in helping them: “They are not here knocking on our doors. We have accepted them to share in our simplicity. We will do this again if given the chance.” The prelate’s message was clear: Filipinos will continue to help those fleeing injustice and poverty, and it’s not just because they’re on the same boat.
http://news.inquirer.net/opinion/index.php...1794&col=84
QUOTE(wildernesscalling @ May 2 2007, 04:03 PM)
Well put. Most people knew US started this war, stopped the election, dumped bombs and poisons etc. So they feel US and the first nations have a responsibility. Vietnamese settle in countries like Phil or China would definitely face racism another form of discrimination much political discrimination.
Nice words but racism runs long and deep. If China says the words above, many would still hesitate. And it is US and the first world responsibility anyway.
QUOTE(Hensoldt @ May 2 2007, 02:13 PM)
Philippines Offers Residency To Vietnamese Refugees
Jun. 02, 1998
MANILA (CWNews.com) - President Fidel Ramos on Monday signed an executive order to allow Vietnamese refugees to apply for permanent residency in the Philippines and eventually citizenship.
About 1,500 Vietnamese are living in the Philippines, most in a resettlement camp, after their bids to travel to Western countries were rejected. During a visit to Palawan, where the Vietville resettlement camp is located, Ramos announced the order "which will pave the way for the processing of the applications and supporting documents for permanent residency and possibly citizenship of Vietnamese nationals."
More than 40,000 "boat people" who fled to the Philippines after the Communist takeover of South Vietnam in 1975 were eventually resettled in the United States and other countries. The group still in the country failed to qualify for asylum and those in Vietville are being taken cared of by Catholic charity groups.
http://www.cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=7762
================
On the same boat
Editor's Note: Published on Page A14 of the September 30, 2005 issue of the Philippine Daily Inquirer
THE DEPARTURE of the first batch of the “remnants” of the so-called “boat people” marked a poignant moment for both Vietnam and the Philippines. On the one hand, it brought the refugee problem that swept Southeast Asia and the West immediately after the victory of the communists in Indochina to its closing chapter, even as it leaves unresolved questions on how to deal with asylum-seekers fleeing from totalitarian regimes.
The boat people represent the wages of the Cultural Revolution, which was borne out of the utopian fantasy that was communist reeducation. In their eagerness to reinvent the economic wheel, the communist ideologues and bosses sent professionals and merchants -- the bourgeois elite in their estimation -- to the farms for reeducation. Although the degree of cultural experiment varied (it seemed harsher in Cambodia than in Vietnam), the fantasy turned into a monumental nightmare. Industries and professions were emptied of intellectuals, educators, scientists and businessmen. Poverty was socialized. Widespread famine ensued. Blind to its own depredations that caused the general poverty, the communist bosses freely pointed their guns at the people. Rice fields became killing fields.
Not wishing to be part of the killing fields, thousands of Indochinese boarded rickety boats and headed for the high seas. They would rather brave uncertain weather than face certain death at home. Their intrepidity had touches of madness -- and this madness defied reservations -- particularly in the West -- that the boat people were not political dissidents but merely “economic migrants.” The tag glosses over the fact that the search for political sanctuary is as much a product of economics as politics.
The Philippines, of course, knows the economic determinism that propels a diaspora. Filipinos themselves have made an art out of migration. Many of them take pride in the income they make from their jobs abroad -- income that translates to dollar remittances to their home country and keeps the domestic economy afloat. But they themselves admit that if they could make generous income at home, they would rather stay put. They know that the Indochinese people were hurting. They felt the hurt.
Perhaps, that explains why, unique among Southeast Asians, the Philippines welcomed the boat people instead of turning them away. It put up refugee processing centers in Puerto Princesa City and Bataan province that became models for refugee hosting around the world. When the Ramos administration in 1996 put its foot down and refused to accept more boat people, even turning away one batch and leading it back to the mercies of the high seas, the Catholic Church and civil society cried foul. The Ramos administration received a stern scolding; it later backtracked on its policy of forced repatriation.
The Catholic Church, through Bishop Ramon Arguelles, the military chaplain at that time and chair of the bishops’ commission on migration, raised money to purchase a 10-hectare land in Puerto Princesa in the western province of Palawan that came to be known as Vietville. When the village was inaugurated in 1998, a US-based Vietnamese Buddhist monk came to the inauguration and praised the Philippines and the Catholic Church. “We have heard praises for what you have done for the people,” said the Venerable Thich Giac Nhien. “I’d like to tell the world of our admiration for the Church and the government of the Philippines.”
Today, Vietville showcases the acculturation of the Vietnamese and other Indochinese to Philippine life. It shows how Filipinos practice their hospitality not only in word but in deed. Early this week, when 229 of the 1,600 stateless individuals left the Philippines for the United States, many expressed profuse thanks to the Filipinos. They said they would surely miss the sounds, sights and scents of the Philippines -- from television variety shows such as “Eat Bulaga,” to Filipino dishes such as the sour broth sinigang, and even the unique brand of Filipino humor that pokes fun at Filipino misery and travails. The same humor made them endure the ordeal of being “stateless” persons, they said.
But despite the hardships, the Philippines will continue to play a humanitarian role in refugee problems. Bishop Arguelles said it best about the boat people and about the Filipinos’ willingness in helping them: “They are not here knocking on our doors. We have accepted them to share in our simplicity. We will do this again if given the chance.” The prelate’s message was clear: Filipinos will continue to help those fleeing injustice and poverty, and it’s not just because they’re on the same boat.
http://news.inquirer.net/opinion/index.php...1794&col=84
Jun. 02, 1998
MANILA (CWNews.com) - President Fidel Ramos on Monday signed an executive order to allow Vietnamese refugees to apply for permanent residency in the Philippines and eventually citizenship.
About 1,500 Vietnamese are living in the Philippines, most in a resettlement camp, after their bids to travel to Western countries were rejected. During a visit to Palawan, where the Vietville resettlement camp is located, Ramos announced the order "which will pave the way for the processing of the applications and supporting documents for permanent residency and possibly citizenship of Vietnamese nationals."
More than 40,000 "boat people" who fled to the Philippines after the Communist takeover of South Vietnam in 1975 were eventually resettled in the United States and other countries. The group still in the country failed to qualify for asylum and those in Vietville are being taken cared of by Catholic charity groups.
http://www.cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=7762
================
On the same boat
Editor's Note: Published on Page A14 of the September 30, 2005 issue of the Philippine Daily Inquirer
THE DEPARTURE of the first batch of the “remnants” of the so-called “boat people” marked a poignant moment for both Vietnam and the Philippines. On the one hand, it brought the refugee problem that swept Southeast Asia and the West immediately after the victory of the communists in Indochina to its closing chapter, even as it leaves unresolved questions on how to deal with asylum-seekers fleeing from totalitarian regimes.
The boat people represent the wages of the Cultural Revolution, which was borne out of the utopian fantasy that was communist reeducation. In their eagerness to reinvent the economic wheel, the communist ideologues and bosses sent professionals and merchants -- the bourgeois elite in their estimation -- to the farms for reeducation. Although the degree of cultural experiment varied (it seemed harsher in Cambodia than in Vietnam), the fantasy turned into a monumental nightmare. Industries and professions were emptied of intellectuals, educators, scientists and businessmen. Poverty was socialized. Widespread famine ensued. Blind to its own depredations that caused the general poverty, the communist bosses freely pointed their guns at the people. Rice fields became killing fields.
Not wishing to be part of the killing fields, thousands of Indochinese boarded rickety boats and headed for the high seas. They would rather brave uncertain weather than face certain death at home. Their intrepidity had touches of madness -- and this madness defied reservations -- particularly in the West -- that the boat people were not political dissidents but merely “economic migrants.” The tag glosses over the fact that the search for political sanctuary is as much a product of economics as politics.
The Philippines, of course, knows the economic determinism that propels a diaspora. Filipinos themselves have made an art out of migration. Many of them take pride in the income they make from their jobs abroad -- income that translates to dollar remittances to their home country and keeps the domestic economy afloat. But they themselves admit that if they could make generous income at home, they would rather stay put. They know that the Indochinese people were hurting. They felt the hurt.
Perhaps, that explains why, unique among Southeast Asians, the Philippines welcomed the boat people instead of turning them away. It put up refugee processing centers in Puerto Princesa City and Bataan province that became models for refugee hosting around the world. When the Ramos administration in 1996 put its foot down and refused to accept more boat people, even turning away one batch and leading it back to the mercies of the high seas, the Catholic Church and civil society cried foul. The Ramos administration received a stern scolding; it later backtracked on its policy of forced repatriation.
The Catholic Church, through Bishop Ramon Arguelles, the military chaplain at that time and chair of the bishops’ commission on migration, raised money to purchase a 10-hectare land in Puerto Princesa in the western province of Palawan that came to be known as Vietville. When the village was inaugurated in 1998, a US-based Vietnamese Buddhist monk came to the inauguration and praised the Philippines and the Catholic Church. “We have heard praises for what you have done for the people,” said the Venerable Thich Giac Nhien. “I’d like to tell the world of our admiration for the Church and the government of the Philippines.”
Today, Vietville showcases the acculturation of the Vietnamese and other Indochinese to Philippine life. It shows how Filipinos practice their hospitality not only in word but in deed. Early this week, when 229 of the 1,600 stateless individuals left the Philippines for the United States, many expressed profuse thanks to the Filipinos. They said they would surely miss the sounds, sights and scents of the Philippines -- from television variety shows such as “Eat Bulaga,” to Filipino dishes such as the sour broth sinigang, and even the unique brand of Filipino humor that pokes fun at Filipino misery and travails. The same humor made them endure the ordeal of being “stateless” persons, they said.
But despite the hardships, the Philippines will continue to play a humanitarian role in refugee problems. Bishop Arguelles said it best about the boat people and about the Filipinos’ willingness in helping them: “They are not here knocking on our doors. We have accepted them to share in our simplicity. We will do this again if given the chance.” The prelate’s message was clear: Filipinos will continue to help those fleeing injustice and poverty, and it’s not just because they’re on the same boat.
http://news.inquirer.net/opinion/index.php...1794&col=84
Thanks for the article. I knew the Philippines did offer permanent residency and citizenship for these so called "political" refugees, but they didn't want to stay in the Philippines because it's a 3rd world nation, even though it a democratic country.
Instead of thanking the government of the Philippines they in turn slander the government and said they weren't offered permanent residency or citizenship and left stateless.
QUOTE(wildernesscalling @ May 2 2007, 04:03 PM)
Well put. Most people knew US started this war, stopped the election, dumped bombs and poisons etc. So they feel US and the first nations have a responsibility. Vietnamese settle in countries like Phil or China would definitely face racism another form of discrimination much like political discrimination.
Like I said racism runs deep and long. Did we slander Phil? Another racist comment?
QUOTE(blacklight @ May 2 2007, 02:57 PM)
In those days, the government did plenty on its own to discredit itself.
Such as?????? please elaborate..
I was reading the posts and I came across ''boat people.'' My question is when someone disses a person and calls him/her a boater is it referring to vietnamese people?
QUOTE(phreezen @ May 2 2007, 05:35 PM)
Such as?????? please elaborate..
Do I have to repeat myself over and over? Pig headed economic policies, harsh reeducation camps where quite a few people were helld for years, totalitarian surveillance and harassment of ordinary citizens, limiting to the extreme access to secondary and university education.
QUOTE(blacklight @ May 2 2007, 07:20 PM)
Do I have to repeat myself over and over? Pig headed economic policies, harsh reeducation camps where quite a few people were helld for years, totalitarian surveillance and harassment of ordinary citizens, limiting to the extreme access to secondary and university education.
Well you know we did fight wars and that whole isolation and embargo had our hands tied....
Treason is punishable by death and beside, why the hell didn't the US take the rejects...that was their responsibility.
Totalitarian surveillance??? Where did your warped mind get this from? Try Britain where there are cameras on every street corner.....And maybe soon the US will fit you americans with RFID.......for public safety of course.....
QUOTE(phreezen @ May 2 2007, 08:23 PM)
Well you know we did fight wars and that whole isolation and embargo had our hands tied....
Crap. The embargo would have not been effective, if these economic policies had not been implemented. The US eventually suspended the embargo, but only after the new leadership under Nguyen Van Linh had changed the economic policies so that the embargo was not only less and less effective but actually counterproductive for the US.
QUOTE(phreezen @ May 2 2007, 08:23 PM)
Treason is punishable by death and beside, why the hell didn't the US take the rejects...that was their responsibility.
When the Communists under Pham Van Dong and Le Duan took over in 1975, they promised reconciliation, but they just lied. Aside from that, I'd call anybody a traitor to Vietnam, when his economic policies results in 60% of the population suffering from severe malnutrition. Since you support those economic policies, I am calling you a traitor to Vietnam. Because only traitors would do that kind of harm to the Vietnamese people.
QUOTE(phreezen @ May 2 2007, 08:23 PM)
Totalitarian surveillance??? Where did your warped mind get this from? Try Britain where there are cameras on every street corner.....And maybe soon the US will fit you americans with RFID.......for public safety of course.....
Totalitarian surveillance means the government watching everything you say and do, and keeping files on you. Cameras watching every street corner in Britain are not eveidence of totalitarianism - Streets are public places where anybody can do anything as long as it is legal: it is understood that the consent to videotape is given.
QUOTE(blacklight @ May 3 2007, 12:45 PM)
Totalitarian surveillance means the government watching everything you say and do, and keeping files on you. Cameras watching every street corner in Britain are not eveidence of totalitarianism - Streets are public places where anybody can do anything as long as it is legal: it is understood that the consent to videotape is given.
whos watching who?
...if ur high profile anywhere,u'd be watched! ..not only by the government,but the media also.the media has more if not as much power as the government..
QUOTE(jimm¥ @ May 3 2007, 02:17 AM)
whos watching who? ...if ur high profile anywhere,u'd be watched! ..not only by the government,but the media also.the media has more if not as much power as the government..
...if ur high profile anywhere,u'd be watched! ..not only by the government,but the media also.the media has more if not as much power as the government..Being watched because you are Angelina Jolie is different from being watched because you are you. The only approximation to this surveillance in US society is the info the banks and the finiancial institutions keep on you including their evaluation of your credit rating. That's why it is very difficult to disappear in the US: you will do something that will help somebody track you down.
QUOTE(blacklight @ May 3 2007, 07:32 PM)
Being watched because you are Angelina Jolie is different from being watched because you are you. The only approximation to this surveillance in US society is the info the banks and the finiancial institutions keep on you including their evaluation of your credit rating. That's why it is very difficult to disappear in the US: you will do something that will help somebody track you down.
...please enlighten me as to how the vietnamese government keep their people under surveillance.I dont see how the vietnamese people r being watched
QUOTE(jimm¥ @ May 3 2007, 06:52 AM)
...please enlighten me as to how the vietnamese government keep their people under surveillance.I dont see how the vietnamese people r being watched
I was talking about our "golden" period from 1975-1986. Since then, most of everything has obviously changed for the better.
^^ i was asking how,not when...
Cracks me up so often I see the commie lovers here will not hesitate to defend their US citizenships, as in "I'm an American citizen." or something similar, whenever they wish to criticize the US, but on the other face of their two-faces they will also not hesitate to call any VKs who criticizes the communist regime of Viet Nam as not 'real' Viets. Why don't they 'prove' themselves being 'real' Viets by renouncing their US citizenship their 'political whiners' and/or 'economic whiners' parents risked their lives to give them?
Just an observation..
Anyway...
Whenever people feels they have to leave their ancestral homeland for any reasons, observers would be wise to take notice of their justifications for doing so, and the process inevitably leads back to country in question. Casting dubious aspersions on the morality of the people who risked their lives to leave the country will not for long distract the process from its completion. Why were there, in the history of the 20th century, a label called 'the boat people'? Which is more important, their compelling reasons to leave or their petty nit-pickings of which country to settle? Only those who would wish to whitewash the crimes of communism would focus on the latter. They are the Johnnies-come-lately 'patriots' who felt guilty at the good life they have in America compared to the miseries of Viet Nam they probably saw for the first time in their lives.
Just an observation..
Anyway...
Whenever people feels they have to leave their ancestral homeland for any reasons, observers would be wise to take notice of their justifications for doing so, and the process inevitably leads back to country in question. Casting dubious aspersions on the morality of the people who risked their lives to leave the country will not for long distract the process from its completion. Why were there, in the history of the 20th century, a label called 'the boat people'? Which is more important, their compelling reasons to leave or their petty nit-pickings of which country to settle? Only those who would wish to whitewash the crimes of communism would focus on the latter. They are the Johnnies-come-lately 'patriots' who felt guilty at the good life they have in America compared to the miseries of Viet Nam they probably saw for the first time in their lives.
QUOTE(jimm¥ @ May 3 2007, 05:49 AM)
^^ i was asking how,not when...
From my own personal experience. My family left in 1982. There were communist police guard stations in every corner the streets I played on. In the school I went to. There were pictures of Uncle wHOre every where. The communist school superintendents would stand in the back of the classroom, making sure all the kids recited their loyalties to Ho and the communist party. The history book my mother and father read when they were kids, were completely different from my text book. And no it had nothing to do with France. These were Vietnamese History books written by ancient Vietnamese Scholars.
When the commies say there was a new era, they were not kidding. They came in and re-wrote everything about Vietnam.
So you tell me, did my family leave for political reasons or economic? I have many more personal stories about the beloved Reds to tell about. I'll do it when I have time.
QUOTE(petev1975 @ May 4 2007, 12:29 AM)
From my own personal experience. My family left in 1982. There were communist police guard stations in every corner the streets I played on. In the school I went to. There were pictures of Uncle wHOre every where. The communist school superintendents would stand in the back of the classroom, making sure all the kids recited their loyalties to Ho and the communist party. The history book my mother and father read when they were kids, were completely different from my text book. And no it had nothing to do with France. These were Vietnamese History books written by ancient Vietnamese Scholars.
When the commies say there was a new era, they were not kidding. They came in and re-wrote everything about Vietnam.
So you tell me, did my family leave for political reasons or economic? I have many more personal stories about the beloved Reds to tell about. I'll do it when I have time.
When the commies say there was a new era, they were not kidding. They came in and re-wrote everything about Vietnam.
So you tell me, did my family leave for political reasons or economic? I have many more personal stories about the beloved Reds to tell about. I'll do it when I have time.
so this is surveillancing?
tough cookies..its postwar and u've been invaded.Its somewhat part of reform i guess. I really cant agree or disagree with u as i dont live in the south...i just dont buy alot of what u said
to honestly say that ur family left for economic reason is too honest, so u can be a political refugee if it makes u happy
QUOTE(nomad @ May 3 2007, 11:12 PM)
Only those who would wish to whitewash the crimes of communism would focus on the latter. They are the Johnnies-come-lately 'patriots' who felt guilty at the good life they have in America compared to the miseries of Viet Nam they probably saw for the first time in their lives.
they should be Johnnies-keepit-shut.
Regardless of the reason I know I am a better person because grown up in USA.
QUOTE(jimm¥ @ May 3 2007, 08:49 AM)
^^ i was asking how,not when...
Source:
Testimony on the Human Rights Situation in Vietnam before the House Committee on International Relations, Delivered by Minky Worden, Media Director for Human Rights Watch
http://www.hrw.org/english/docs/2005/06/21/vietna11177.htm
"At the same time, for many ordinary citizens of Vietnam there have clearly been areas of gradual improvement in recent years, particularly in the economic sector. Restrictions on everyday life for most citizens have eased noticeably as the market economy has taken hold. Travel within Vietnam is easier. Surveillance of ordinary citizens through the country's extensive network of monitors has become less intrusive"
Unfortunately, one side effect of this reduced surveillance may very well have been an increase in human and drug trafficking.
QUOTE(blacklight @ May 2 2007, 10:45 PM)
Crap. The embargo would have not been effective, if these economic policies had not been implemented. The US eventually suspended the embargo, but only after the new leadership under Nguyen Van Linh had changed the economic policies so that the embargo was not only less and less effective but actually counterproductive for the US.
When the Communists under Pham Van Dong and Le Duan took over in 1975, they promised reconciliation, but they just lied. Aside from that, I'd call anybody a traitor to Vietnam, when his economic policies results in 60% of the population suffering from severe malnutrition. Since you support those economic policies, I am calling you a traitor to Vietnam. Because only traitors would do that kind of harm to the Vietnamese people.
Totalitarian surveillance means the government watching everything you say and do, and keeping files on you. Cameras watching every street corner in Britain are not eveidence of totalitarianism - Streets are public places where anybody can do anything as long as it is legal: it is understood that the consent to videotape is given.
When the Communists under Pham Van Dong and Le Duan took over in 1975, they promised reconciliation, but they just lied. Aside from that, I'd call anybody a traitor to Vietnam, when his economic policies results in 60% of the population suffering from severe malnutrition. Since you support those economic policies, I am calling you a traitor to Vietnam. Because only traitors would do that kind of harm to the Vietnamese people.
Totalitarian surveillance means the government watching everything you say and do, and keeping files on you. Cameras watching every street corner in Britain are not eveidence of totalitarianism - Streets are public places where anybody can do anything as long as it is legal: it is understood that the consent to videotape is given.
Do you actually know how the embargo works and how Viet Nam broke it? The action by one resulted in another. Simply put, no embargo no need for doi moi. The fact that the US tried economic warfare on Viet Nam and we broke it proves we defeated the Americans in every aspect of the war. You don't have a argument in your post, you just summed up how we defeated America's economic warfare on us....
And the embargo on Cuba will also end with our help....suck it anti-commies.....
Actually, cameras on every street corner is indeed evidence. It isn't put there to watch birds. It's designed for one purpose and one purpose only, to keep an eye on its citizens. Britain has be labeled a surveillance society by privacy rights group and they do keep database of people. So does the US. Vietnam isn't technologically advanced enough to do what you or any other Americans claimed.
Britain is 'surveillance society'
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6108496.stm
Is the Pentagon spying on Americans?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10454316
or
http://news.yahoo.com/s/usnw/20070425/pl_u...atabase_program
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070425/pl_af...se_070425230526
Lackeys calling me a traitor....that made my day....
QUOTE(phreezen @ May 3 2007, 03:14 PM)
Do you actually know how the embargo works and how Viet Nam broke it? The action by one resulted in another. Simply put, no embargo no need for doi moi. The fact that the US tried economic warfare on Viet Nam and we broke it proves we defeated the Americans in every aspect of the war. You don't have a argument in your post, you just summed up how we defeated America's economic warfare on us....
You do not even see the contradiction you made for yourself. Such is the blindness of communists. The fact that economic reforms were enacted meant that ultimately Viet Nam lost. Did the US change its own economic system? If Viet Nam supposedly 'broke' the embargo, then who else was in on it? And if it was so 'successful', why be so drastic as to change one's entire economic policy to that of your supposedly 'defeated' enemy? Embargo ended up with self reform and a communist call it a 'victory'. QUOTE(phreezen @ May 3 2007, 03:14 PM)
And the embargo on Cuba will also end with our help....suck it anti-commies.....
The US embargo on Cuba will end at the whims of the US government, not with your 'help'. Not one of these Johnnies-come-lately 'patriots' will ever have the courage to live in Viet Nam immediately after unification.
QUOTE(nomad @ May 3 2007, 09:12 AM)
Cracks me up so often I see the commie lovers here will not hesitate to defend their US citizenships, as in "I'm an American citizen." or something similar, whenever they wish to criticize the US, but on the other face of their two-faces they will also not hesitate to call any VKs who criticizes the communist regime of Viet Nam as not 'real' Viets. Why don't they 'prove' themselves being 'real' Viets by renouncing their US citizenship their 'political whiners' and/or 'economic whiners' parents risked their lives to give them?
Just an observation..
Anyway...
Whenever people feels they have to leave their ancestral homeland for any reasons, observers would be wise to take notice of their justifications for doing so, and the process inevitably leads back to country in question. Casting dubious aspersions on the morality of the people who risked their lives to leave the country will not for long distract the process from its completion. Why were there, in the history of the 20th century, a label called 'the boat people'? Which is more important, their compelling reasons to leave or their petty nit-pickings of which country to settle? Only those who would wish to whitewash the crimes of communism would focus on the latter. They are the Johnnies-come-lately 'patriots' who felt guilty at the good life they have in America compared to the miseries of Viet Nam they probably saw for the first time in their lives.
Just an observation..
Anyway...
Whenever people feels they have to leave their ancestral homeland for any reasons, observers would be wise to take notice of their justifications for doing so, and the process inevitably leads back to country in question. Casting dubious aspersions on the morality of the people who risked their lives to leave the country will not for long distract the process from its completion. Why were there, in the history of the 20th century, a label called 'the boat people'? Which is more important, their compelling reasons to leave or their petty nit-pickings of which country to settle? Only those who would wish to whitewash the crimes of communism would focus on the latter. They are the Johnnies-come-lately 'patriots' who felt guilty at the good life they have in America compared to the miseries of Viet Nam they probably saw for the first time in their lives.
lol, they wont respond 2 you when you speak the truth.
QUOTE(nomad @ May 3 2007, 03:53 PM)
You do not even see the contradiction you made for yourself. Such is the blindness of communists. The fact that economic reforms were enacted meant that ultimately Viet Nam lost. Did the US change its own economic system? If Viet Nam supposedly 'broke' the embargo, then who else was in on it? And if it was so 'successful', why be so drastic as to change one's entire economic policy to that of your supposedly 'defeated' enemy? Embargo ended up with self reform and a communist call it a 'victory'.
The US embargo on Cuba will end at the whims of the US government, not with your 'help'.
Not one of these Johnnies-come-lately 'patriots' will ever have the courage to live in Viet Nam immediately after unification.
The US embargo on Cuba will end at the whims of the US government, not with your 'help'.
Not one of these Johnnies-come-lately 'patriots' will ever have the courage to live in Viet Nam immediately after unification.
And what economic system are we?????? You might want to also look up America's economic system before making an @$$ of yourself. We are still a communist nation.....GO COMMIES!!!
Don't be so bittered in defeat VNCH/Anti-Commies. We know if it is up to you the embargo will NEVER end......but hey....thanks for the laughs....
Suck it anti-commies.
QUOTE(phreezen @ May 3 2007, 03:14 PM)
Simply put, no embargo no need for doi moi.
Unless I am wrong , doi moi is going from strength to strength even though the embargo was lifted a decade ago and even though Vietnam is a member of WTO. It's more like "no Orthodox Communist economic and social policies, no need for doi moi"
The topic is about boat people and whose responsibility it is. It is a good topic because it touches the core of everyone of us. Obviously most people know it is the US and the Church's responsibility since they started the whole thing. For hundreds of years no one wanted to leave Viet Nam only people wanted to come to it. We call Chinese people "nguoi tau", boat people for the reason that we lived in a peaceful society, home of the truly brave, home of sharing and caring for this was our culture. We lelf the country because US and the first world made it into hell so they can control and abuse its corruption. Therefore it is their responsibility. Is there any argument with this?
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