Afghanistan is a land to many races. There are Hazara Mongol, there are Turks, Persians and Pashtuns. After the defeat of Russia's communist regeme, Afghanistan got into internal war. Now that its getting back to normal, Bollywood is trying to create another internal problem in Afghanistan. Bollywood should stay out of Afghan issues. If they they want to help they can do that through the governments. Indian government is helping us a lot, but seriously who the hell is Bollywood trying to be? Another power?

Bollywood made a movie called "Kabul Express", just recently, and there are very offensive comments in that movie against Hazara Mongols. Hazara Mongols didn't do anything to Indians, or did they? Whoever is the writer of that movieis, he has no idea about Hazara Mongols. He should've done a research before writing the story at least. Or may be he just hates Mongol race or something like that who knows.

Whoever was involved in making that movie have to be brought to justice. Indian goverment have to do something about them. They must be stopped. Afghanistan and India have always been good partners. Im sure Indians don't want to bring their good reputation down just because of a few irresponsible people in their population. Seriously it ain't no joke, its swearing to the whole Hazara nation.

I didn't see the movie so I can't comment much, but I have heard about the controversy. I think the director did that unintentionally, may be to make the movie more spicy. Those scenes should be cut from the film and the director should apologize.

Isn't the director of the movie an Afghan himself?

Is this that John Abraham movie? I avoid movies with him in it lol...

yeah it has him. Don't you have a problem with him?

^You mean do I? Yes, his acting annoys me.

Hazara qawme batur zenda bod

The director is Indian. His name is Kabir Khan, he is an Indian Pathan.

LoL unintentionally? It has to be a joke. Its common sense not to say something offensive to someone. I thought people these days were more open minded. Now that the movie has over a million copies all over the world, the scenes should be cut off, for what? LOL He has already done what he wanted to do, too late now. I find it funny VANMAN. But thanks for sharing your openion.

Naimani, I think your smoking up the wrong chimney. I don't think anyone on this part of the forum wants to see anyone's heritage stomped on.

Glad to hear that, but about the smoke and chimney part I think your wrong, because there is no chimney needed, Naimani doesn't smoke up. I didn't mean to look like I was smoking up.

Unfortunately people aren't.

i bet you haven't seen 'Water'

fair enough



I thought he was ok in Water.

Nope, should I?

don't worry, no one will see the movie except indians

i guess you should.. it's a nice movie though i couldn't understand anything they said... lol but subtitle served me well

Out of curiosity, seeing as it seems you aren't Indian. How did you feel Water portrayed Indians and Indian culture. Did you feel it was a negative portrayal?

I'm going to have to use those subtitles too.

err... you don't know hindi?


well, actually yeah i'm not Indian but i guess our culuture is similar to theirs so i didn't actually had problems in understanding cultures nor with the language... Mujhe hindi aachhi tara se aati hai but the language they used it was different,most likely to be Sanskrit may be.. just a random guess.. hence Subtitle served me well =)

Negative portrayal... mm.. yea kinda, - by the way... i'm from Nepal

Could you please refer to a scene in themovie, because I don't remember it quite well.

well this should remind you...

Oh I was talking about the Kabul Express thing

In water I think they used the more traditional Hindi way of talking, instead of the Bollywood Hindi that is mixed with Urdu. Because there are lots of words they use that I recognize from Hindu mythologic shows on TV

Not fluently.

Rare to see Nepalese posters here. Welcome btw

It was hindi, but definately seemed a bit different to the Hindi used in Bollywood, I found it a lot easier to understand (my hindi isn't too good, I only speak Gujarati fluently).

Hope you don't mind me asking, but how did you feel it was negative? There's a lot of debate surrounding the film about how offensive or negative it is, some who do find it offensive, others who don't. Also, being Nepalese, I'd probably guess you're Hindu? If so, how did you find how Hindus are shown in the film. If you aren't Hindu though, what did you think of the way Hindus are shown?

Sorry if that's a lot of questions, I'm curious to see a new opinion on the matter

That makes two of us


Thanks That was gracious ^.^
well... yea i felt it kinda negative i wouldn't call it offensive though
Firstly, Hindu... uhmmm i don't think so..i don't know actually hehe* what a pity, my dad is hindu mom isn't we don't really give much priority to the religious stuffs it's not that we're disrespecting it's just...

As shown in movie - young girls are married to older men and they're forced (most probably... i'm not sure) to spend their rest of their in that strange place strange place 'Ashram' and live rest of life without a question after their husband's death.... No choice at all, it was the priest and their so called holy books and the laws/codes written in it that decided the way to live for them, that was very mean!!!
Widows,they're treated like different human beings... inferior i don't remember well but they were even restriced in terms of foods and dress.... A husband dies and wife becomes widow, a living dead body~ a life limited within four walls.... when a husband dies, why do their ladies have to be punished in such a way?? is this because hinduism states there's a magical cosmic bond between husband and wife ??... i would still proudly call it a 'punishment' No freedom at all for widows... Freedom is free to all

i remember in movie when 'Shakuntala' asked if there's a way for widow to high priest, priest said something like... there are only two options for widows
#1. burn herself at stakes with dead husband
#2. marry someone else of that family.... (this doesn't sounds Sacred at all ) 1
well, these were the stuffs that made it negative(in my opinion).. but i'm pretty sure they have light excuse for these statements... i wouldn't love to debate about it, if that's how Hinduism was as shown in movie... omg, i wonder why People were so much devoted to it

i don't like jumping at conclusion but now that you've asked... i feel like Hinduism wasn't Plain at all.. i guess i'm clear enough...

Oh yes, the debate i heard of it, it's written even in water's soundtrack Dvd Cover that "For Five Year Extremist Groups Waged a Campaign of death threats,arson and riots to stop the production of Water....... BUT THE FILM MAKERS WEREN'T TO BE SILENCED"

Very true.

I don't dispute the negative nature of this film, but I have to ask, why do you refer to them as Hazara Mongols? They don't even speak Mongolian.

Interesting perspective on things. Essentially, it is things like these that caused controversy. However, at the same time I never found the film too offensive (being Indian hindu myself), I think the film has emphasised some negative aspects of past hindu culture. Some of these issues were changed as the Independance movement arose, which I also think the film highlights though, so in that respect, I don't think it's so bad.

Sorry for mistaking your religion, though it makes it interesting to see a non-hindu point of view.

Yeah, the distributors milked the controversy to make the film more famous. Personally, I would like to see Mira Nair's (the director) view of what she wanted to do with this film. I think the fact it made such an impact and caused so many debates and thoughts shows it is an intelligent film.

Anyway, I'll stop here as this thread is for a different film anyway

The Mongol People of Afghanistan (Hazar Mongols or Hazara Mongols):
Many historians are wrong about the way they describe Hazaras. And many other confuse the readers about our history. 'Hazara' should not be described as a tribe, its more like a symbol of unity under which many Mongol and Turkic tribes were united by Chingiz Khaan (a Mongol ruler in 12th century and a father to Hazara people). Hazaras spoke Halha (Mongolian) till the beginning of 18th century, eg. Naimans. We speak Hazaragi Dari today because we slowly moved into the cities in Afghanistan. Hazaras don't have to communicate in Halha, but still Chingis Khaan's blood is running through Hazara veins.

HAzara sub-clans:
-Jaghury (The biggest Hazara sub-clan, the name is Mongolian, its is pronounced as çaud quri~ja'ud quri~ça'u quri, remnats of Chingis Khaan Army)
-Behsudi (clan of Behsud Khaan from Mongolia, Remnants of Chingis Khaan army)
-Daikondi (very similar to Mongolian Daichin, remnants of Chingis Khaan army)
-Bamiyani (Ancient Hazaras before Mongol empire)
-Daizangi (remnants of chingis khaan army)
-Daimirdad (remnants of chingis khaan army)
-Turkmo (remnants of chingis khaan army)
-Ghaznichi (Hazaras before Mongol Empire)
-Naiman (one of the ancient and original Mongol tribes of Mongolia)
-Temury (remnants of chingis khaan army)
-Uruzgani (remnants of chingis khaan army)
Tatars used to be part of Hazar Mongols, but because of a dirty trick by others, now they are not part of us unfortunately. Haza Mongol love Tatars. They are always welcome back. There are also three other smaller sub-clans: Abaka, Karam Ali, ...can't remember the other one. But they are very small in numbers.

Initially most Hazaras were nomads who moved out of Siberia to Mongolia, and eventually from Mongolia to Northern and Central Afghanistan (Hazarstan). They were not known as the 'Hazaras'. It was during Mongol Empire when they became known as the 'Hazaras'.

Before Islam, they practiced Buddhism. One of the most ancient civilizations was found in Bamyan. Two giant Buddha's which were destroyed by the Taliban in 2001 were built by these people over 2000 years ago, during Kushan Empire. Kushans were made of Turkic tribes. Bamyan has always been the main city or capitol city of Hazarstan, and a home to Mongols and Turks.

Hazarstan area was very rich and a very important country in the past. The reason for that is because the Silk Road crosses from Bamiyan city. And because it was a very spiritual city for Buddhists, a large number of monks used to reside in Bamiyan.

Hazaras have been living in the area which is now called Afghanistan for over 2500 years. They were not called as ‘Hazaras’ before the Mongol Empire. But that does not mean they did not existed. Buddhas of Bamiyan are the proof of their existence in Afghanistan before the empire. Sadly, many people think that Hazaras came in Afghanistan during Mongol Empire, which is wrong. They existed in the area for a long time; in fact they had their own empire once, called ‘Hazarstan’.

During the Mongol Empire the population of Hazaras rapidly increased as more and more Mongol and Turkic soldiers stayed in Afghanistan. When Mongol Empire collapsed, even more soldiers from countries such as Iraq and Iran fled those countries and joined other Hazaras in Hazarstan, and stayed with them because Mongolia was too far to reach.

Aaare yaar!! aap ko Hindi aati hai? Hamhe bhi aati hai. Mojhe likna, parna, sab koch aati hain LOL Leken mojhe Hindi filmein pasand nahi hai.
Mojhe pata nahi tha ke Nepalese logo ko bhi Hindi aati hain. Its good that we all can communicate in two languages ha? LOL...

I don't think most Hazaras would view this rather strange form of racial nationalism with anything more than a grain of salt.

lol i never said Film was offensive nor negative.... it was just kinda negative as shown in movie about 'Hinduism' not a movie... the movie was intresting ^.^

why do you keep saying sorry for no reason? lol you're not a widow, are you?

Nahin yaar, mujhe hindi nahin aati .... mein hindi mein utna fluent to nahin huun phir bhi kabhi kabhi bol le ta huun. hehe* mujhe bhi pata nahin Neplease ko kaise hindi aati hai... sayad eyislye kyun ki haam neighbours hei LOL

"Its good that we all can communicate in two languages ha?"
Oh yea,

I don't think the movie speaks about Hinduism as much as Indian culture at that time. Just because it happens in India doesn't mean it involves Hinduism, so time these things are independent. Anyway I'll jus repeat what I said before.

Hinduism is probably the most multi-dimensional of all the modern faiths. I myself follower the Swaminarayan sect of Hinduism.


The word Hinduism is a misnomer. It doesn't refer to one religion, but many.

Vaishnavism and Shavism are different branches of religions but they're all categorized as apart of Hinduism.

Saivism(Shiva worship) is a predomenently South Indian faith.

Vaishnavism, (Vishnu worship[or any of the nine avatar]) mostly North India faith. Responsible for Bhagavat Gita, Srimad Bhagavatam, Mahabharata, Ramayana etc... In Vaishnavism there are hundreds of sects Iskcon, Swaminarayan Sampradaya, Sri Vaishnava, Gaudiya Vaishnavism, being only some of many. Vedanta philosophy has many schools and sub-branches that each Vaishnava sect falls under.


There are thousand of scriptures in Sanatana Dharma(Hinduism) different sects follow their own scriptures. No sect follow all scriptures. Most don't except any scripture out side of there sect. So there beliefs have to be judged individually, because they hold different ideals.

I've already chatted with Role Model about Hinduism, figure I'd just post the same thing publicly for others.

Peace!

I see. btw, about "sorry", it's just a habit of mine, can annoy people



Pretty much agree, when I was referring to Hinduism, I meant both religious aspects, but more importantly cultural aspects of hinduism, as it was and is a huge influence on Indian culture.

oh yes! and you're mastery in it

Keep thinking then.

Aap to bohot fluent baatt karte ho. Sydney main ek Napakease larki ko janta hun, bohot khobsorat cute log hien <3

Jara hosiyaar rahena... Neplease larkiya bahut gusse waali hoti hai

mmm interesting openions. i kinda understand Indain too.