lol, true

Um..Indian skin? Blacks, hispanics and Southern Italians can have skin that looks similar to Indians.

Ya'll still brown.

But blacks, latinos and itialians are k nowhere close to southeast asia as india is.

Culturally definately yes, genetically I don't think so. We didn't get browness from Indians, its from the climate and region. SE Asia lies directly on the equator so its no surprise the people have adapted and are naturally brown.

I believe looking by the name and location PingLing is probably Chinese, so probably "yellow" more than brown

Theres tons of Dark brown Chinese. Actually I see those more than light skin chinese. Different ethnic people there too. Like india.

The Indian influence dates back from before the spread of Islam in Southeast Asia. Parts of the Philippines were ruled by Hindu/Buddhist Malay kingdoms like the Srivijaya and Majapahit kingdoms, though other parts remained animist. Most of the Hindus & Buddhists in the Malay archipelago converted to Islam later on. It's also worth noting that Islam spread to the Malay archipelago mainly through Indian Muslim traders and missionaries.

Bangladesh and Nepal are not Southeast Asian countries by the way.


I wouldn't really consider them dark brown, but there are some Chinese that are light brown. Dark brown would be more like South Indians or Sri Lankans.

I've never seen any that are really dark brown (like Indians), the darkest I've seen are more like a caramel or toffee like colour, which to me would be described a more dusky yellow rather than brown. I'm sure those who get tanned enough could probably look brown like Indians.

hey i heard that the name singapore is derived from a sanskrit word ; Singhpura(city of lion/ lion city). is that true?

Yes that is very much true.

Singa (Malay) -->(derived fom)--> Singh (Sanskrit) means Lion
Pura (Sanskrit) means City.

It was Bodhidharma who inspired Shaolin martial arts. The other family of martial arts were Taoist inspired martial arts. There are a number of other martial arts in China that predate Buddhism. There are some really odd forms of martial ats revolving wrestlers sparring with horns tied to their heads like buffalos.

True. Plus the native animist religions of course.
I must say Philipino religious culture is very interesting!

Wow! That's very interesting! I can actually understand what it's saying! I'm sorry, but before reading that inscription I always wonder why The Philippines always claim Visaya region as a part of Srivijaya, yeah I was a lil bit skeptic. The inscription is indeed a mix of Old Malay, Kavi (Old Javanese) and there are some Sanskrit loanwords too.

So we Filipinos and Indonesians have another thing in common now, aside from being the same Austronesian race

^ You can seriously understand it? Cool. I wonder why that language is not present in the Philippines anymore. It looks nothing like Tagalog or Bisayan.

Yeah, it's really difficult because the writing is in old forms of Malay and Javanese (I understand almost all of the Malay words and some of the Javanese words), and Sanskrit loanwords (which are very hard for me to understand), but I kinda get the meaning.

Example of Sanskrit loanword: Catur=four
Example of Old Malay: Ulih (modern Malay:oleh)=by
Example of Kavi (Old Javanese): Ngaran (in modern time seen as casual,impolite)=name

The words used in the text is very old and very peculiar for modern Indonesians. It's also very unique, I don't think even people in Palembang (Srivijaya's old capital) talk in this kind of mixed manner any longer.

Your asking me? If I can understand the meaning of Singapore? Do you really wanna know how much similar Tagalog or Bisaya looks like?

He was talking to me, because I said I understand the Laguna Copperplate Inscription. D'uh!

There is an interesting story about the naming of Singapura. Sang Nila Utama is a Malay prince from Sumatra (Indonesia). He set sail to an island known as Temasek/Tumasik (in Javanese means "Sea Town"). There he saw a strange-looking animal. He asked his chief minister what animal it was, and his chief minister answered that it was a lion. The prince was pleased and took it as a good omen. He built a city on the island and named the city "Singapura" (the city of lion).

Are you really sure !!! As far as I know there's not any lion in Singapore... Ok maybe they have know but in zoo ??

You know what, Betong. I think you're right. I think the animal was not a lion, but they mistook it for one. I'm no Singaporean, but i think there's an explanation about the misunderstanding in their textbooks.

^ I just kidding. That what written in that book because I learn that book before. I think that book called Sulatus Salatin or Sejarah Melayu or History of the King. Also mention of that book that the king decsendent from Raja Suran, King of some place in India, who lost a war and coming to Sumatera and become a King.

before i think it was influenced by india quite a bit but now it is influenced by middle east. malaysia and indonesia anyway. phillipines influenced by spain and america. vietnam by china. thailand by a lot of countrie.

Beneath all the influences, though, I'm proud of our Austronesian root. One of the thing that I'm really proud of is Indonesia's I la Galigo ( Sare Galigo ), which is considered as the LONGEST known epic poem – even longer than the Indian Mahabharata or Odysee and Iliad together.

The work is non-Islamic also non-Hindu, so it gives us also an idea of Austronesian customs and religion. I welcome all my Austronesian brothers and sisters (Malaysia, Singapore, Brunei and the Philippines) to embrace our common root through this literature

im with you ostriche boleh eh i mean austonesian boleh

Actually, the longest epic is apparently the Tibetan Epic of King Gesar, although the whole story never been compiled in written form. The Greek Iliad and Odyssey aren't that long to begin with. Both of them combined are shorter than the Indian Ramayana and only a fraction of the Mahabharata's length.

What's the story of I La Galigo about? Is it considered a national epic in Indonesia, Malaysia, Brunei, Singapore, or the Philppines?

I thought most of the people there are chinese and not austronesians.

True, but Malays make up at least a quarter of the population there.

Jagger: I La Galigo is both oral and written. The oral tradition is still alive at a few places in Sulawesi. The old written manuscripts held in Musea Leiden contain more than 300.000 verses. I La Galigo tells the powerful story of a god from the Upper World and a goddess from the Lower World, about the adventure of Sawerigading, about his true love to his own sister....

Sonofvisayas: True, today most Singaporeans are of Chinese descent. But the native Singaporeans are the Malays. Even their constitution hold the Malay language as their official language.

This is madness!

Isn't it, though?
Forbidden love is a popular theme all around the world, isn't it? But Sawerigading's story didn't end in a twisted event of a wedding between him and his sister, and it's rather sad than mad (it's a lil bit complex, really).

This is the ancient Brahmi script. It has the answer to all your queries.



This is Telugu Script.


This is Tamil Script.


This below is Meetei Mayek (Manipuri Script)

There were no kingdoms in the Philippines with the exception of the Muslim people in SUlu and Mindanao.
The rest of Philippines were scattered villages and tribes...like the t'boli...who have no influence from India at all

Though Muslims in the south were influenced

The second one looks related to Alibata. hmm nice.

Actually, Lao was influenced by India since the times of the Ai Lao in Northern India before they migrated to Southern China and then down to present day South East Asia. Laos got Theravada Buddhism from the Khmers. Before Theravada Buddhism, Ai Lao were Mahayana Buddhists.

Notice how Lao architecture and ancient Khom(Khmer architecture) are very distinct. Old Khom/Khmer is more Hindu style.






More on the Ai Lao

http://www.singto.co.uk/History/History.htm

So is it like the Ramayana, but just a bit more... incestuous?


Some of the western and southern Philippine islands were part of the Srivijaya and Majapahit kingdoms (Malay kingdoms which followed Hinduism and Buddhism). From the 15th century, most of the Hindus and Buddhists in the Malay archipelago converted to Islam. Most of the animists in the northern and eastern Philippines remained largely unaffected by the Hindu/Buddhist/Muslim influences.

Which part of the story is similar to Ramayana to you? Anyway it's not incestuous. They are twins who were raised separately, and when they met each other, maybe there were affections as sibling which was misinterpreted as love. Anyway, they soon found out that they were related. They canceled their wedding and Sawerigading left on an adventure, swearing that he'd never come back....

Yeah, reading that Laguna inscription from the age of Srivijaya, the fact that I am able to understand the meaning makes me feel really close to my Filipino sisters and brothers

The second one you pointed out the Telugu Script (a South Indian script) is itself derived from Brahmi Script. The Kannada Script another South Indian Script is very similar to Telugu Script is also derived from Brahmi.

Now see the similarities with Kannada.

Kannada


Baybayin


This must be of some interest to you.

I don't mean to put a damper on things but why do you guys always use a crappy website written by some non-historian Muay Thai teacher to provide "evidence" for 4000 years of Ai_Lao existence . I've seen links to this webpage more than twice by Lao posters . It's not even as reliable as Wiki for gawds sake !


Many ethnicities have existed far longer than the nations they have founded ( and many ethnicities have never founded nations ) but to say that Indian influence on the Lao started during their presumed migration through India is pure speculation .

If that is not accurate enough, how about this? Evidence is mounting up, man. Quote from the link, "power of the language(language in the genes) that can tell us the story of the very remote past of the Tai[Ai Lao] migration settlement from a place in India"... Our origins were in India way before we settled in Southern China. As a matter of fact, I read somewhere that one the reasons why the Ai Lao people fought with the Han Chinese was because we blocked the Han Chinese access to India or something like that.

http://ling.uta.edu/~jerry/pol.pdf

I've read this paper too several times . I think it was perhaps originally posted by P'Raja ( I forget ) . This is better but nevertheless just one of the theories of the origin of Tai linguistics . It supports the "out of Africa" hypothesis which is still simply that : a hypothesis . Nevertheless it's a reasonably written paper .

However it doesn't support any conclusion that Tai precursors received any influence from any pre Indus civilisation ( or indeed some even wilder speculation that the Tai were the inhabitants of the Mohenjadaro culture in the Indus valley ) . Our idea of Indic culture and influence stems from the Magadha empire at about the time of the Buddha and not really anything before that .


However I guess this newer theory isn't as far fetched as the Altaic homeland assumption popular until recently .

The evidence of Indian Hindu-Buddhist Influence in Indonesia.


Prambanan temple compound in the mist of rainy morning.


The elegance and grandeur figure of Shiva temple in Prambanan temple compound.


Prambanan Temple,
Yogyakarta, 9th century AD

A huge Trimurti temple with three main temple dedicated for Lord Brahma, Shiva, and Vishnu.

Prambanan is the largest Hindu temple compound in Indonesia, located in Central Java, approximately 18 km east of Yogyakarta.






The plan of reconstructed Prambanan temple compound.
The holiest central compound is where the three Trimurti main temples with Vahana temple in front of them, three temple dedicated for Hamsa, Nandi, and Garuda. The middle compound is 4 rows of hundreds smaller shrines (most of then now are ruins). While the outer compound suggested to be park or living quarters of Brahmins.

The origin of Prambanan name probably means "Para Brahman" or the Brahmans, since in it's glorious era, the complex probably packed with lots of Brahmins Hindu priest or Hindu hermits or ascetics.
It was built around 850 CE by either Rakai Pikatan, king of the second Mataram dynasty or Balitung Maha Sambu, during the Sanjaya dynasty. The temple is suggested near the ancient capital of Medang i Bhumi Mataram. Not long after its construction, the temple was abandoned and began to deteriorate. Reconstruction of the compound began in 1918. The main building was completed in around 1953, since it is next to impossible to find the original stonework, which has often been stolen and reused at remote construction sites. A temple will only be rebuilt if at least 75% of the original stones are available. Therefore only their foundation walls of most of the smaller shrines are visible and they will not be rebuilt.


The Javanese Ramayana Ballet performance on open air stage on eastern part of Prambanan.
The dance depicting the abduction of Shinta (Sita) by Rahwana (Ravana) king of Alengka (Lanka)


Today, it is a UNESCO World Heritage Site and one of the largest Hindu temples in south-east Asia. It is characterised by its tall and pointed architecture, typical of Hindu temple architecture, and by the 47m high central building inside a large complex of individual temples.





The temple was damaged during the earthquake in Java in 2006. Early photos suggested that although the complex appears to be structurally intact, damage is significant, with large pieces of debris, including carvings, scattered over the ground. The temple has been closed to the public until damage can be fully assessed. The head of Yogyakarta Archaeological Conservation Agency stated that: "it will take months to identify the precise damage".[2] However, some weeks later in 2006 the site re-opened for visitors. The immediate surroundings of the Hindu temples remain off-limits for safety reason.

This is the Majapahit empire, the last and the greatest Hindu empire in Indonesian Archipelago, during the height of the glory.
The map shown the area conquered by Majapahit empire as mentioned in Kakawin Negarakertagama written in 1365 by Mpu Prapanca.

I don't know about another part of the Phillippines, but the Solot islands mentioned in Negarakertagama is identified with Sulu island of Phillippines.

indian influence on asean in the past?? ......... yup

in the present?? .............. no

indian influence was cultural influence not migrations which is the reason u dont find indians in those countries ......... some of the areas were deserted for eg. cambodia where the forest is consuming all the historical architecture ........

truly amazing photos majapahitans

what is the present day status of hindus and buddhists in indonesia? do you know any of the native people there that practice it

i know the situation in malaysia is bad as the government has demolished several temples in recent days

Well, I would say that south vietnam has some indian influences, too, because of the mixing with cham and khmer people.

Thanx....



Hinduism and Buddhism are considered one of the 5 official religions in Indonesia next to Islam, Catholicism, and Protestant Christianity. Recently Confucianism also granted as official religion/beliefs.

Although majority of Indonesian are muslim, hindus and buddhist are free to practice their beliefs.
Majority of Indonesian muslims are tolerant and moderate, even many still hold dear our cultural legacy that many are from our hindu-buddhist past. However there's also small numbers of fundamentalist Islam. But believe me majority of Indonesian muslim are peace loving and tolerant.

Yes I have some friends, native Indonesian that practice hinduism or buddhism.
Sometimes I even love to visit Pura (Balinese Hindu Dharma temple) or Vihara (Budhist temple)





Puja at Pura Parahyangan Agung Jagadkertha, Ciapus Taman Sari Bogor, West Java





The shrine of King Siliwangi, the famous King of Pajajaran kingdom, the last Hindu kingdom in West Java.




Stupa at Vihara Mendut Monastery, Near Borobudur, Central Java





Buddhist shrine in Vihara Mendut compound.

Erh, let me correct you..., Indian influence is well and alive in Indonesia as part of our cultural legacy.

Past

King Airlangga of Java depicted as Vishnu riding Garuda

Present



Garuda Pancasila, Indonesian Coat of Arms



Garuda Indonesia, Indonesian National Airlines


Garuda Wishnu Kencana, a gigantic statue to be build in Bali, Indonesia


Past


Lingga-Yoni from ancient Mataram Kingdom

Present


Monas (National Monument) in Jakarta, Indonesia. Modeled after Lingga-Yoni, the symbol of fertility. The flame above symbolize flame of struggle for independence.

Past

Bas relief from Prambanan temple depicting Rama intervere in the Sugriwa and Subali fights


Present


Rama and Shinta (Raam and Sita) lovely intimacy is gracefully described in Javanese Ramayana Ballet.


Arjuna Wijaya statue in Jakarta, not far from National Monument, depicting Arjuna (Arjun) and Kresna (Krishna) in chariot during Bharatayudha


Javanese Wayang Orang dance performance, depicting Arjuna defeating the bhutas/denawas (demons)


Pandawa (Pandavas) in Javanese Wayang Kulit (shadow puppets)

Indeed Indian influence is cultural influence, not migrations, imperialism, colonialism or whatsoeva.
Actually there's Indian immigrant here, although the number is insignificant.
But the cultural impact is lasting.

These are some interesting posts in this thread.

The architectural similarities are very prominent between South and Southeast Asia, as many of the pictures clearly show.

Hi, majjy. Great pics! I see that you've been to that Pura in Bogor! Cool! I haven't been there, I haven't even visited that Vihara in Lembang which is closer

What I noticed, though, majjy. When we are talking about "garuda", most of the time we are talking about a mythological bird rather than the real garuda in Hinduism (half man-half bird). I wonder why...

i think there is two forms of garuda

one which is in buddhism and one in hinduism

in buddhism it is shown as a bird but in hinduism it is half man and half bird



to my indonesian friends - are most hindus in indonesia of indian origin or do actual indonesians practice ?

bali hindus yes there are many though there are many differences in worship

but how about in java sumatra and borneo region ?


i do think hindus should go to indonesia instead of malaysia if they go abroad . indonesia government is more tolerant