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Aerain
Well, in the fields of mathematics and other sciences, I have heard of many western thinkers, but I have never heard of any who were Chinese ethnics. It leaves me perplex, because China has lead western countries for many centuries in sciences and technology, it is hard to think there weren’t as many thinkers as in Europe. Therefore, I would like to know why we don’t hear much about them, and what thinkers made significant discovery in ancient China.
kimuchi
Talktohand.gif
EvilAsianDude
China contains 1/5th of the worlds population. Theres bound to be an Einstein or two in them.
Titanium
QUOTE(EvilAsianDude @ Aug 11 2007, 04:51 PM) *
China contains 1/5th of the worlds population. Theres bound to be an Einstein or two in them.

Hehe unfortunately we haven't found one yet.
tung2sai
QUOTE(Aerain @ Aug 11 2007, 10:24 AM) *
Well, in the fields of mathematics and other sciences, I have heard of many western thinkers, but I have never heard of any who were Chinese ethnics. It leaves me perplex, because China has lead western countries for many centuries in sciences and technology, it is hard to think there weren’t as many thinkers as in Europe. Therefore, I would like to know why we don’t hear much about them, and what thinkers made significant discovery in ancient China.


eh, thats a very big topic that will take many posts to explain it but anyways heres a little summary.

For one thing, the whole "system" of math and science was organized by western countries, so in other words, even if non-western nations discovered theories or made technological advances earlier, it wasn't consider "official" unless it could be describe using Latin or Greek. The Islamic civilizations made many advances and invented many things like algebra and chemistry, so if judging by history, we should be using Arabic or Farsi definitions instead of Latin or Greek in our science and math textbooks. Instead, a lot of the Arabic and Farsi became "latinized" to make it more "acceptable".
And then for so many other reasons, overtime, people just came to accept and adopt the science and math system organized by western countries. So don't really be surprised if one finds more Western names than others in our textbooks.

The other thing was the most of the great Chinese thinkers were statesmen or wandering literati. They were more concerned with the affairs of the state and the lives of the people than exploring nature for nature's sake or making a profit and name.
Occasionally there will be someone llike Shen Kuo who would write down the names of different botanical and bird species, but in general, outside of the Chinese world, no one would use those chinese definitions.
Some of these great inventions like gunpowder was invented by accident, some were created by ordinary peasents using their ingenuity, and some like the seismograph was invented by these talented statesmen.
Overall, it was for the sake of practicality and usefulness in their ideas. The need for fame and recognition was desired and appreciated but not priority.

There's more to it though.

heosuabi
In Ancient land of China, whoever ruled over that land, every 100 - 300 years at a time, was busy threatening the neighbors and collecting extortion payments ( tributes ).

Chinese are very inventive and cunning people: this is where things fail, many new discoveries or novel inventions die out after the inventor dies becasue of that is the chinese culture to keep things secret.

Here's something invented during Tang period by a monk, its somesort of discrete mathematics, I am just starting to learn:

This is " I Ching " :

http://afpc.asso.fr/wengu/wg/wengu.php?l=Yijing
the_falcon
QUOTE(tung2sai @ Aug 11 2007, 06:02 PM) *
eh, thats a very big topic that will take many posts to explain it but anyways heres a little summary.

For one thing, the whole "system" of math and science was organized by western countries, so in other words, even if non-western nations discovered theories or made technological advances earlier, it wasn't consider "official" unless it could be describe using Latin or Greek. The Islamic civilizations made many advances and invented many things like algebra and chemistry, so if judging by history, we should be using Arabic or Farsi definitions instead of Latin or Greek in our science and math textbooks. Instead, a lot of the Arabic and Farsi became "latinized" to make it more "acceptable".
And then for so many other reasons, overtime, people just came to accept and adopt the science and math system organized by western countries. So don't really be surprised if one finds more Western names than others in our textbooks.

The other thing was the most of the great Chinese thinkers were statesmen or wandering literati. They were more concerned with the affairs of the state and the lives of the people than exploring nature for nature's sake or making a profit and name.
Occasionally there will be someone llike Shen Kuo who would write down the names of different botanical and bird species, but in general, outside of the Chinese world, no one would use those chinese definitions.
Some of these great inventions like gunpowder was invented by accident, some were created by ordinary peasents using their ingenuity, and some like the seismograph was invented by these talented statesmen.
Overall, it was for the sake of practicality and usefulness in their ideas. The need for fame and recognition was desired and appreciated but not priority.

There's more to it though.



yes ofcourse tung2sai pls dont mention that india was literally the cradle for maths .......... and that the numbers that u use everyday in your lives is hindi not english ........... but obviously why should china say anything good about india ........... not to mention the many advances in science that the indians and arabs did together and the fact that majority of the books on maths was translated from hindi to arabic and then given to europeans......... although algebra was named after a guy called al jabar

did i forget to mention chess and invention of zero ......... embarassedlaugh.gif

u guys need a good lecture on the history of maths ....... or read up books in the library .... heck why dont u read wikipedia icon_smile.gif
riversouth
there was one in the 3 kingdom

a name of zhang feng
tung2sai
QUOTE(the_falcon @ Aug 11 2007, 08:01 PM) *
yes ofcourse tung2sai pls dont mention that india was literally the cradle for maths .......... and that the numbers that u use everyday in your lives is hindi not english ........... but obviously why should china say anything good about india ........... not to mention the many advances in science that the indians and arabs did together and the fact that majority of the books on maths was translated from hindi to arabic and then given to europeans......... although algebra was named after a guy called al jabar

did i forget to mention chess and invention of zero ......... embarassedlaugh.gif

u guys need a good lecture on the history of maths ....... or read up books in the library .... heck why dont u read wikipedia icon_smile.gif



I do know about the indian contributions to the world.
you seem to not like my statement.
I was only giving a short summary of why topic of why there aren't more known CHinese thinkers and explaining the scientific system as organized by the west and adopted by the rest of the world. I used the Islamic civilization as an example.
I said at the end of my statement there is more to it.
ham_let
only time the word 'chineses' appears on AF is when someone actually wanted to type 'chiñks' :O
DMonkey
QUOTE(the_falcon @ Aug 11 2007, 09:01 PM) *
yes ofcourse tung2sai pls dont mention that india was literally the cradle for maths .......... and that the numbers that u use everyday in your lives is hindi not english ........... but obviously why should china say anything good about india ........... not to mention the many advances in science that the indians and arabs did together and the fact that majority of the books on maths was translated from hindi to arabic and then given to europeans......... although algebra was named after a guy called al jabar

did i forget to mention chess and invention of zero ......... embarassedlaugh.gif

u guys need a good lecture on the history of maths ....... or read up books in the library .... heck why dont u read wikipedia icon_smile.gif


Of course India has made a lot of contributions to maths. But he was talking about Europe and cultural exchange betwixt them and the Arabs, it doesn't mean he denies India's influence. So STFU.
SnoSlick55
QUOTE(Aerain @ Aug 11 2007, 08:24 AM) *
Well, in the fields of mathematics and other sciences, I have heard of many western thinkers, but I have never heard of any who were Chinese ethnics. It leaves me perplex, because China has lead western countries for many centuries in sciences and technology, it is hard to think there weren’t as many thinkers as in Europe. Therefore, I would like to know why we don’t hear much about them, and what thinkers made significant discovery in ancient China.

If you are talking about the modern time, there aren't many, but there are some. There are 7 Chinese sccientists got the Nobel prize for Physics. There are couple world's top mathmatician currently residing in the US. Leave it to you to do the research.

Talk about the ancient science, astronomy and mathmatic achievement, it was way ahead of western, it's also not hard to find in the internet
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