As all u know Hmongs without outside interferance Hmongs are still kinda hill billyish....which is good in its own way and bad...

but the world is growing and growing way too fast.....

how will Hmongs keep Shamanish alive 50 years from now....when those hill billies in the remote & roadless mountianous areas going to be sharing spaces with Chinese folks....how will they preserve it...

Not to mention those in Loas....America....

Like raindrops that connect as they roll down your window... the minority usuallly kinda get suck up into the majority sometimes...

Hmongs of the future will start to adapt other religions.....of which is already happening with Christianity...


And if we're to preserve it.... how can we make it better??

thus question is:

How to: Preserve
Better it

wat the hell is wrong with all the hmongs in here....geeze.....no ideas

This is what i think.......in order to preserve Hmong....Hmong must first force themselves to want to learn keep the traditions.....

In my experience and i believe to most....

THE OG'S DON'T FORCE US TO LEARN THE TRADITIONS ANYMORE....YEA...they say...that in America it's different...

that everyone is busy....but for the OG's that's bull$hit....they don't do anything but chill at home...

and for the little kids....or us teenagers or however old u are......we somehow found time for our bfs or gfs...
time to drink with our so call homies.....time to watch TV and play video games...

im damn sure there is time to learn of Hmong traditions...

I think the majority of the OG's are just lazy or if not then looking for something to get out of teaching like cash...

THat's not just in AMerica...because....else where Hmongs r getting sucked up into the majorities...for we r minorities..


IN laos....and Thailand....HMONG CITIZENS aren't speaking Hmong as primary language anymore...they speak Thai or Lao as Hmong Americans are speaking english as primary language...

Same in China the educated youth are speaking more Chinese than HMong


and in France......THEY CAN'T EVEN SPEAK HMONG ANYMORE......PERIOD

dang u ppl suck [size="7"][/size] COCKroaches...........anyway...

The answer is not advancement... Any radical ideas to alter the way we do things in our culture voids of it's authenticity. If it were to come to that We should all stop doing it and go white. It was supposed to be a practice that we learn it at our own pace. Why shouldn't we be appreciative of that? Why do we need to be like muslims, jews, and christians going by the book and be forced into the practice at such a young age? Why do we need to be religious extremists like those other religions that give way for radicals?

Excuses not to practice because we're in America is the lamest excuse or to abandon the practice because it is not modern is also lame and stupid. The stupid ones would convert because it's so modern. How pathetic and an ingrate...

[quote name='yajthaugluv' post='3182759' date='Sep 2 2007, 06:01 PM']The answer is not advancement... Any radical ideas to alter the way we do things in our culture voids of it's authenticity. If it were to come to that We should all stop doing it and go white. quote]

hell yes on advancement....and y u so sterotypical about being a fanatic.......if i happened to seem to be that way... im not.....

anyways.....if u been really observing rituals and ceremonies or heard of past ceremonies.....u'll see that things now are

done differently. it's no longer as complex as it used WHICH IS FOR THE BETTER....

traditional hmong funeral last as long as 7 days....with the corpse rotting all the while....but in america ....it's a drain on work....time ....money.......hmong folks generating trash....and damn those cows cost so much...

in america it's like 3 days only now....NOW THAT'S AN ADVANCEMENT...to me at least.....

TO MAKE THE CULTURE EASIER TO PRESERVE AND MAKE IT MORE DESIRABLE TO PRESERVE...

All the more reason to stop making advancements as so much has already been changed and lost because of the inconvenience and expense. The more you revise and temper with its core values, the useless it becomes... You don't need to degraded down to the big religions' level. To be that low, it don't deserve to be remember or practice... Why bother preserving it anyways if you are just going to change it as if its got no origin or values?

really....

really....and who ever stays the same.....((IT"S NOT EVEN A RADICAL IDEAL EITHER)...Hmongs have been adapting to new customs, traditions and new spirtuality for centuries....y do u think theres so many different kinds of hmongs out there

It won't stay the same.....in fact IT'LL GO DOWN IF NO ONES DOES ANYTHING ABOUT IT

I MEAN MAKE IT MORE DESIRABLE TO PRESERVE

What?? u think modern day educated Hmongs would still have the ((((strong desire)))) to learn of ua neej....or blowing the qeej...

Oh yea....hell...hmong folks see the importance of preserving culture.... they really do want to preserve it....but hell....most of us don't want to be the ones preserving it.....we just talk of it.....like someone needs to do it.....
((((I'm learning the qeej and funeral drums by the way))))))

BY ADVANCING IT...(MAKING IT EASIER TO PRESERVE BY STOPPING CERTAIN TRADITIONS OR SHORTENING IT)

so WE (YOUNNGer GENERATION) WOULD WANT TO PRESERVE IT

by the way.....Hmong funeral......A TLEAST FOR THOSE IN LAOS....takes seven days to perform....that's right


BUT IN AMERICA...IT GOES USUALLY AS HIGH AS THREE DAYS.......

Hmong Americans have somehow adapted to it and there's nothing wrong with it....
THERE'S NO PISSED OFF ANCESTORS OR SPIRITS

That's because this is kind of an ((((((((ADVANCEMENT)))))))))) in HMONG CULTURE......

mabe advanement is too exaggerating....but simplifying it will totallly work






Funeral's arent the only thing that we hmong droped some traditions out of.......there's other rituals too....and we're just fine without them....

for ex: there's a hmong ritual in laos were a dog is sacrificed and te head of the dog is staked up on a stick to guard the household from spirits...

In america it's not possible....with Animal cruelty laws.....


AND HMOOB AMERICANS ARE FINE WITHOUT THEM.

Why do we need to be like muslims, jews, and christians going by the book and be forced into the practice at such a young age? Why do we need to be religious extremists like those other religions that give way for radicals?

Excuses not to practice because we're in America is the lamest excuse or to abandon the practice because it is not modern is also lame and stupid. The stupid ones would convert because it's so modern. How pathetic and an ingrate...
[/quote]


HELL.....THERE'S NO EXCUSE TO ABONDADONE HMONG TRADITIONS AND RITUALS.....and i've rather have it where.....one strong shaman comes and unite all hmongs under one roof of common ideology....to better organize the religion..

HELL.....THERE'S NO EXCUSE TO ABONDADONE HMONG TRADITIONS AND RITUALS.....and i've rather have it where.....one strong shaman comes and unite all hmongs under one roof of common ideology....to better organize the religion..

You state that you want to preserve on the other hand you say you want to change it. You're making a very contradictory statement here. I guess it's best not to believe in anything. Since we have radicals whom wants everyone to follow one ideal. You should understand that each groups got their own thing. It's not possible to be under one roof.

You speak of adapting to animal rights? Tell that to the slaughter houses whom does a mass slaughter on a daily basis to just put a drumpstick in a package at the grocery store. Tell me if the slaughter process isn't cruel? Why should we adhere to their laws as guarantee by the Freedom of Religion Clause? Always having to yield, that's what makes Hmong people so pathetic.

hell yea...to preserve it gotta change it......but change only to adapt....for hmongs are behind the times.....and when we try to catch upm our ppl tend to only do the catching up.......like going to modern schools...learning new languages and making money..


IT WILL BE LOSS GIVEN TIME......UNLESS IT'S CHANGE TO BE EASIER TO CARRY......LIKE ALL HMONGS OF THE PAST....WE CHANGED....

THAT'S Y THERE'S SO MANY TRIBES....

hell yea...to preserve it gotta change it......but change only to adapt....for hmongs are behind the times.....and when we try to catch upm our ppl tend to only do the catching up.......like going to modern schools...learning new languages and making money..


IT WILL BE LOSS GIVEN TIME......UNLESS IT'S CHANGE TO BE EASIER TO CARRY......LIKE ALL HMONGS OF THE PAST....WE CHANGED....

THAT'S Y THERE'S SO MANY TRIBES....

Such ideals are a copy cat of unworthy religions. You can change it if you wish. The rest will not care.

Exactly that.....THat's y Hmong Shamanism must be changed to make it more desirable to be carry on...that means ridding of some things.....like the so many times we've done it before.

I don't know how you can say that Hmong Shamanism "must be changed to make it more desirable to carry on" ????
Shamanism is to be appreciated because it's a choosen gift, thats where it starts, how can you change that kind of a start? How can you change the gift of being choosen when you yourself are human, and not a spiritual one? So to answer that question, it's not of your nature to understand Shamanism....I can tell you that because I am one of the choosen ones to become a Shaman. You have to understand that some things cannot be changed because you don't have the gift to change those things.....

To also answer the other question, you imposed earlier :"What?? u think modern day educated Hmongs would still have the ((((strong desire)))) to learn of ua neej....or blowing the qeej..."
**there are modern day hmong individuals who have even stronger desires now days to learn the qeej as these people are the ones who notices how much we are starting to loose our FAITH in who we are, also, there are modern day educated Hmongs who still have the strong desire to learn ua neej>>>>>>I'm a educated hmong woman in my late 20s, confirmed to become a shaman as my desire to learn is as big as this universes, but one must understand, it takes time to learn these things...just like the qeej......you have to have love and patience.....

good question... Im a guy but i think they didnt get what they needed in bed and thats why they had to go else where to get it. I also think that it is an adventure and excitement for them to go around and cheat...same goes for the men...

what i want to know is why do our hmong women are having affairs with white, black, and hispanic people these days? do our hmong brothers need to get our penises enlarged? what seems to be the problem?

hmong shamanism is unprecedented. only by shared and collective words and stories.
that said, hmong shamanism, if not in general, is entirely a different facet of a religion, one that may be unparalleled to other spiritual-type religions. it can not be a doctrine nor a stable practice. more or less in that it changes (inconsistent). it's rather experimental, theorizing in ideologies and beliefs; some actually false beliefs or simply, not in all cases, beliefs that are rather out of place (incoherent), hence it's ancient origins, in today's society.
it changes a person drastically, physical appearance is enough to speak for itself. verbal diction and the like is another.
some may say that it's a gift where one has to be chosen, some may say it comes with age and with aging comes ailments.
if you or anyone should know, if you should or have to ask a hmong shaman, there are things forbidden to be told. there are things a shaman, I claim safety for saying this, may have to sacrifice.
some take it as a religious practice while some, I claim safety for saying this, take it as an art/craft. communing with spirits is one thing, using instruments and objects for whatever reasons is another. but, why not just take it as a philosophy?
it can be rather risky. one must approach it with care and be responsible, not that my statements and beliefs are in an way notion or form implying over-exaggeration.
they say, do be careful and do be responsible.

anyway, I agree in that hmong shamanism should be changed in ways to adapt.