25% of the population.. And just think of all the northern nomads that have been absorbed into the fold.. literally hundreds of ethnic groups

ROFL, you're part Manchu, now?

anyway, i don't know where you got your source that 25% of the Jin empire was NuZhen. the NuZhens back then unlike their Manchu descendants were full nomads, the Manchus toggled back and forth between nomadic and settled lifestyles allowing their population to grow. however, the NuZhen population never exceeded 1 million. F. W Motte,without a doubt, the westerner with the most knowledge about nomadic groups as well as every other source i've read shows the nuzhen population of the Jin was a bit less than a million vs. 50 million Hans

"You're part Manchu now?"
Dude just go look up where I introduced myself on CNA half a year ago.. I stated it then plain and simple..
50 million Hans in the whole of China or the area they controlled?
I got my figures out of a Chinese book..

Here's a map of a much earlier time, but it shows how incessant the nomadic peoples were in hoppin the border. Like Mexicans, it accrues over time:

the Jin had 50 million Hans, Southern Song had 100 million. if you call that population depletion. the population was only depleted compared to the southern song (which by the way, the main areas of settlement wree the areas directedly around the YangZi, provinces like Guangdong wouldn't be fully China proper until as late as the Ming)

the southern centric population depletion theory is bullcrap. its clear during the conquest dynasties that the Han population outnumbered the NuZhen by ALOT. the early NuZhen could care less about the superiority of Han culture, it took many years and a HUGE han population to turn a portion (not all, otherwise, no manchus) of the NuZhen into ethnic Hans

give me the source for this..
25% of 50 mil is 12 million.. sounds right..

go get Imperial China 900 Ad-1800 AD by F.W Motte. its over 1000 pages long and has in its bibliography over 600 sources. he is an expert regarding nomadic groups. over the years in college, i've read most of the sources hes listed(i've tracked down 250 articles he used as source regarding the nomadic groups)

the NuZhen population could not have exceeded 1.5 million. they're nomads, its quite difficult to have many kids when you're on a horse hunting and raiding all day. its common sense. also, there is no record of population growth during the Jin of either Han or NuZhen, even you realize this

Maybe I remember wrong then..
If not the Jurchen having 12 million, then all the non-Han nomads that lived on their territory. There were a lot of ethnic groups.. You know this.. and 12 million doesn't sound reasonable?

Give me source for your claims. If Jin had 25% jurchen pop then Siniszation would have hardly occured.

I read a part of this book in Chinese at my father's friends house..
They moved.. But if it's true, other sources should also say it.

yes, the NuZhen extended authority over all kinds of groups. not just Han and Qidan. but its clear from the lack of information about these other groups that their populations were not large. The nuzhen (despite pan altaic belief) discriminated against the Qidan (their first major enemy) and other nomad groups. from this, i can infer that these smaller groups did not settle within Huabei but remained on the steppe or Liaodong forrests. it would give these groups absolutely no advantage to live within Huabei

We need to stop hi jacking this thread.

It's been a trend for SOME nomads to abandon their harsh lifestyle, the Huaxia for one. Toba, Khitan, Tangut, Jurchen, Manchu, Huns.. Whole tribes of Huns would settle down and receive a Chinese surname from the emperor.. go look it up..

Where did these people go then? The central government were using all of these languages up until the Ming Dynasty.. (I saw this on a documentray on CCTV4), so these people were absorbed fairly recently.

Many Nuzhen and Qidan adopted Han names and identify themselves as "Han". In the northern plain and the northeast, there had always been constant barbarianization/Sinicization. Some "barbarians", who lived south of the great wall or within the Han-based dynasty, regard themselves as "Han". While the "Han" who migrated outward were regarded as barbarians.

By the way, Jin had about 48,490,000 people at its peak, Nuzhen numbered about 6 million. That's according to the 1206 census.

where do most mongolian ppl live in the US?

LA, SF, CHICAGO, DENVER and DC. probably around 20 thousand Mongolians in the USA.

no shyt i got few friends in usa who are mongolians

i heard many of them are in denver. cuz the weatehr is like in mongolia. shoot i go to denver twice a week.

oh seen well i seen mongolians in denver hehe they looked....okay hahaha

okay..do you suggest me giving them a hollah hehe jk.

ye sure wats ur name then hehe

Most Mongolians live in CA huh..

flip ma'm. i go tos school there.

u haven't seen all of them. hehehe

i've never met a Mongolian in the US. i did have mongolian classmates in China however

yeaahhh true mongolhuu but i checked some of their pix in newmgl hehe but oaklands they seemed to have pretty good time in there
and flip ill make sure deliver your message lol...i guess you live in denver right?

d-town, the hood.. haha

i live an hour, if i speed in i 25, from denver.

csu, fort collins?

greeley

Hi again you guys,

Can you guys tell me about Mongolian Desserts?
Oh and whats the best school in Mongolia?

Thanks

i would have said "aaruul", but that its like a treat. its made by drying a fermented milk in the sun. and there's also "urum", its the fat from a boiled milk. theres also yogurt.

u know they say ice cream might have originated from mongolia along with yogurt, but i donno about that.

and u don't want to go to school in mongolia, unless if ure majoring in something mongolian.

What age do you guys usually finish high school in Mongolia?

i bet with the biggest concentration of mongols. my friend told me cuz dtown's weather is as changeable as in harsh mongolia. y'all g'in it up with khmers, filipinos, and viets, in aurora huh?

kids usually graduate by the time their 17.




most mongolians live in glendale.

really? i thought it was denver. glendale CO right? where's taht by?

Mongolian probably already know this site but in case you don't:

http://www.mongolmessenger.mn/

News about Mongolia in English.

I like Mgl_Style's nose, its very close to the 'pure' Chinese girl ideal nose(it could be a little more narrower), but its better than all the noses Ive seen from the females in the forum.

But Mgl's face...not my pick.

---

According to genetic data, Mongolians are heterogenous; but the Mongoloid(East Asian) component originally came from Tibet/Northen China/East Asian coast, and they were displaced into Mongolia by Thai/Sinic(Chinese) people beginning about 10,000 years ago. And...

The people that used to live in Mongolia(before the Alatic speakers lived there) moved furthern north, and are related to certain Caucasian people & Jomon/Ainu (according to crania data) and to Native Americans(genetic data).

---

Here's a general map of contribution into Mongolia.

No offense here to you Re2001fined, but that comment reminds me of another guy who used to come around here. 2 PrismKnight.

[quote=Re2001fined,Jan 5 2005, 11:01 AM]
I like Mgl_Style's nose, its very close to the 'pure' Chinese girl ideal nose(it could be a little more narrower), but its better than all the noses Ive seen from the females in the forum.

But Mgl's face...not my pick.


my nose??? i hate my nose!!! haha not your pick huh 2 2 hmmm good to know mate

Hi,

What are some famous cartoons/kid show in Mongolia?
Do they have radio stations that play popular music (rap, pop, rock, etc)
How come so many Mongolian girls are tall?
What is the most popular job in Mongolia?

Thank again :p

famous cartoon kid show?? mine was used to be...tom and jerry lollllll but there is so many japanese stuff coming on so its like many i think right now
Yep there is popular radio station which was 102.5 and also 101.5 etc but my fave was 102.5 and yeah my age group peoples more likely to listen to rap and hip hop
Why is it most Mongolians girls are so tall? hmm im 5'7 and to me thats average and i classify myself as short loll maybe because we use dairy stuff more often you know? like we eat "aaruul" which tastes soo great and we drink milk and stuff haha well i dont know maybe in gene?? hehe
Most popular job? ohh its gotta be doctor isnt it but now many youngsters wants to be pragramme makers and i think that is the popular job i think

"my nose??? i hate my nose!!! haha not your pick huh hmmm good to know mate"

Your nose is not prominent, or flared up, like those Korean noses; or low and flat, like that of southeast Asians/S. Chinese. Your nose is a genuine northern Mongoloid nose, without Caucasian admixture.

You have a strange pose, so your face looks wierd from it, maybe you are more attractive from the looks of it, your features are very nice from the middle of your face. Althought your eyes, and chin don't exactly match the 'pure' Chinese girl ideal.

loool

pure chinese what??

she looks pretty, that's all that matters.

favorite kids show from my era: "nu pogodi" its a 70's cartoon from russia.

radio stations? there are even tv programming dedicated to it.

why are mongolian girls are tall? better question is why are the rest of em are so short? girls from south especially.

prefered job is to run your own business.

2 Re2001fined you are PrismKnight7, aren't you? Or maybe his twin brother.

man he just tried to get some @$$ by kissing some. now you came and c@ck blocked his @$$ item. hehe.

2 I got a feeling I will be making another friend on AF. Yay!!!

Ok before I ruin this thread. Back to the topic.

What's "nu pogodi" about? And do people in Mongolia watch a lot of American shows?

Mgl_Style has somewhat of a resemblence to a pure Chinese girl I know.



[!!!]

I used photoshop to modify her pic, and I must say the result is....divine. Now imagine HER at 14yrs and 5', recently from China... That is what made me into what I am today.

User1, are you listening; that's a support to my theory of the pure Chinese female morphology originating in upper Central China, and encapsulated(protected from Caucasian/Jomonese/Austronesian/Negrito elements) by a semi-radial expansion of Sinic people pushing away primitive or mongrel phenotypes.

---

"pure chinese what??"

Read my post in Serious Korean Talk, "Ancient Koreans".

whaaaatt is going on?????? so im like what? pure chinese girl???? hahaha okay carry on your theory thingy.....and what the hell is that mole thing on my cheek????

hahahaha