okay, so today my stepdad and mom celebrated my birthday. I didn't know who was going to show up since I don't have many friends or relatives.
My stepdad's relatives show up as well as lots of youth from his church. Omg, I thought it was just going to be me, my cousin, my mom, stepdad, stepmom and an aunt. All of a sudden, there were tons of people. I didn't know anyone. There were lots of people around my age. They all came and greeted me.

My mom gave her speeches, then my stepdad. I had to give a speech. I was all sweaty and nervous since I don't even know 2/3 of the guests. Omg, I did had lots of fun getting to know all the people. I was crying because my bowl of noodles was extremely spicy. ahaha

heheh got to meet many new friends.

Sounds good...what was so special about this particular birthday?

Don't worry...I don't even celebrate my birthday.

Well, it's an introduction to all CHURCH YOUTHS to come greet me.
It's an introduction to my stepdad's relatives.

I'm so embarrassed. I just got done cleaning the whole house. Everyone left now, so I'm all alone.

Tomorrow, some of the church youths want to invite me to a meeting.

Oh so this church thing is new to you? Yeah you probly aren't gonna be so reclusive anymore with the church youth community.

Some really cool youths 16-24 hehehe. I feel like I'm not lonely anymore.

Congrats, get any spankings from the hotties?

But you're so into the old ways (shamanism) how will you let that go?

Happy late birthday to you : D. I didn't know it was your birthday already.
Glad you had a great birthday full of people. I usually get embarrassed even if it's just with my family haha.. I'm also glad you met a lot of people. Maybe, this is your chance to make a lot of Hmong friends. That's what you want, right? More Hmong friends.

Oh, btw, what church was it?

Hmmm, I might have to attend church starting today.


No, my biological father still practice the old way. I live with my mom and my stepdad.

It's the Sacramento Hmong CMA.

OOOH, how many CMA churches do you guys have up there? My cousin lives up there and she's a CMA.

I think we have like two or three, but the majority of Hmong churches up here are "Church of Latter Day Saint."
Majority of Hmong here in Sacramento are Mormons.

I still believe in the old ways. Religion doesn't bug me.

You'll learn eventually. ^^

Oh yeah, happy B-day btw. *kicks you 21 times*

I too, want to join a church. Maybe in a few years.

@ BH: Yes, i would enjoy spanking too. LOL

^Is you a dude or chick?

ahahah thank you.

Religion doesn't bug me because I'm too liberal to even be influenced by the new faith.
I have friends of all religion, sexual orientations, races and ethnic groups.
I don't find one right over the others. All are right.

It would be hard for me to adjust, because I am tooooooooooooooooooooo liberal in some social understanding.

^ Then she's out of the question then.

@TUTOR: It's illogical for all religion to be right. All has to be wrong or one has to be right but not all.

@KOJ

nope, it's like saying, one language has to be right, others are wrong. It's like saying, one race is superior, all others are inferior.

NOPE, I don't believe in the typical perspective of Christianity. It's just a religion to me. To me, shamanism is still the true religion of the Hmong people and I greatly respect that. In anthropology, shamanism is indeed the oldest practice in the world. There is no origin of shamanism.

Christianity is an alien belief. To me, Hmong people become Christianity to create a social place of worship and gathering/coming together.

Religion doesn't bug me. You can tell me that other faiths are WRONG, but they'll tell you that your is WRONG. There is no point of me trying to tell you. I've been through enough debate with EXTREME CHRISTIAN from the midwest that protested on my college campus.

Your wrong, mine right, mine the best, your the best.. I don't play that game.

Amen Lol!!! Havnim Got Beasted On!!!

^Well, BH, it seems you don't understand the laws of contradiction either . Don't PWN me so fast cause you're the one who's going to get PWNED badly here.

Let me test your level of logic to see if I should deal with you or if I'm just wasting my time. So, there's a question for you:
Can a person have 20/20 vision and be blind at the same time?

So, let me relate that to religion. There are religions that says you must marry multiple wives and some that says you must have only one wife. So, can these two be right at the same time? Logically, if you have any, the answer is no.



@TUTOR: Your example is subjective. It's like asking is vanilla or chocolate ice cream is better? There's no absolute right or wrong answer in that. Meaning, there's no "vanilla is truly better and chocolate comes second." It's all opinion.


No what's funny here is that, you just made an objective claim. Remember, you said there's no RIGHT or WRONG religion but then you said, "... shamanism is still the true religion of the Hmong people..." What if I or someone disagree. Then it's subjective and is all about opinion, and your claim that it's the "true" religion is really based on your opinion which equates to NOT true at all (your claim, that is). You get me?


This is OG thinking. This is why they start joining church, which is not a wrong thing.. but after 20 years and this is still your reason to go to church? Sorry, but you haven't learned of Jesus' death and salvation for you and why you attend church and do the things you do. To you, church is a social gathering.. to you, it's all about having kwvtij and whatnot.

The focus of this post I'm making here is not whether Shamanism or Christianity is right but to get both your logic straight.

BTW
Sure about that? We believe God existed before time.. BEFORE TIME, so that would make all Abrahamic religions the oldest (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam).

How could a blind person have 20/20 vision? You know someone that does? And why do you hate me lately? weird.

^It is only you SUBJECTIVE opinion that I hate you.

So, you do have logic haha.
That's exactly my point. You can't have two views or many views that oppose each other to be right at the same time. It's kind of like a DUH thing.. and when people say all religion is right... logic wasn't really there.

well, you can trace our ancestors all the way back to the yellow river and i tell you what, it's nothing close to christianity.

i wouldn't argue with you. people have their own beliefs. as of right now, i may not practice the old ways, but it's still part of my root and my understanding of my culture and history.

if you really know what Hmong is about, you would know that the hmong culture is inseparable from the hmong religion, as the hmong practices have something to do with the hmong new year, festivals and etc..

just like how judaism shape the culture of the Jewish people. a religion cannot be separated from a culture, because a religion forms a culture in some sense.

i have friends of all religion, races, languages and culture. i respect all their differences. no where in my mind have i come to believe in NAZISM that their beliefs are WRONG like what you said

RELIGIONS and CULTURES are developed based on GEOGRAPHY. A Hmong would never survive in the desert like the Navajo. The Navajo would never survive in the regions where Hmong people live.

You can tell me how much you know about Judaism, Christianity and Islam. It's still not part of Hmong culture. As I said, you can believe in whatever you want. In the end, we all die. We all live trying to survive. You can live your life based on your faith no matter how much you want, it's up to you.

You have no right to tell someone that their religion is wrong, because you would be a hypocrite if I was to tell you that your faith is wrong. This is why I CARELESS about religion. Hmong shamanism is a way for me to understand Hmong history and culture. Without knowing Hmong shamanism, you will in NO WAY understand the HMONG HISTORY, because HMONG TRADITIONS ARE ACTUALLY INTERPRETING AND REENACTING HISTORICAL EVENTS.

^ BBBBBEAST! Fatality! j/k RIght on brother.

Why choose to believe in something that has little to do with your culture? I still don't understand. I don't hate Hmong Christians, but their agendas in trying to convert non-Christians really bug me. What are you trying to do? What is your purpose? That these people need God? That they need a savior because they're all sinners?

In that case, everyone is a sinner. Sin is part of life. It's inseparable. In that case, do whatever you please. One will be judged on his or her performances. It's not your deal to tell someone that they're going to hell or that they need God. They might have their owns spiritual concepts of repenting or reaching peace/purity.

To tell you the truth, sin doesn't exist in Hmong culture. A person will be judged by his or her parents.

TO BE HUMAN, YOU MUST BE HUMANE. (moral respect and honor one's parents)
That's the most important virtue and part of being human in the Hmong culture. Without that, you are simply TSIAJ (animal).

The Hmong concepts of who to believe and worship are very different. No one shall judge you, but your parents. That's the Hmong ways.

Who said it has to do with Christianity? I never brought that up.


What if a person (no matter what his new belief is) doesn't want to practice those things anymore? What if he no longer wants to sacrifice a cow to the spirits? Doesn't that mean we can ostracize this person? Maybe we can kick him out of shamanism but we can't kick his ethnicity out of him.
Culture is culture and being Hmong genetically is being Hmong genetically. It's safe for you to believe in whatever be Hmong. This is why we can separate the both.
You're right about the influence of religion and how it shapes people. In order for something to be influenced, it must have another thing controlling or overpowering it. So, in this case Shamanism (or Hmong animism) is the thing that guides most Hmong people's way of doing things from how to bring up a child to festivals. Because Shamanism influence (key word here), we can see why these two are separate things (Hmong and religion) and not one thing to begin with, otherwise the Hmong culture cannot be influenced. One cannot influence itself, it needs something from the to encourage, guide, control it to be called influenced.

"if you really know what Hmong is about, you would know that the hmong culture is inseparable from the hmong religion"
It seems to you, you define Hmong as strictly Shamanism:
Hmong=shamanism
or
shamanism=Hmong

and those who don't practice it aren't Hmong:
NO shamanism = NO Hmong

Instead of calling people Hmong just Hmong, why not call them Shamans too because to you that seems to be the only qualification to become a Hmong person.
But you can't, because you know these two are separable from each other.. yeah shamanism may have a big influence on a lot of Hmong but doesn't mean it's Hmong.
So your equation should be like this:
Hmong = Shamanism
Shamanism =/= Hmong


How can I be a hypocrite for something you said?

I agree because that's what the majority have been practicing for years and it would be impossible to understand the Hmong heavily influenced animist culture if you don't understand anything about Hmong animism.
That still doesn't prove anything that not being an animist is not being Hmong (genetically).

My culture is Christianity. My ethnicity is Hmong. You agree or disagree with that? Why?

Remember, you said no religion is right or wrong so why won't you tolerate the things Christians do. Are you saying what they do is wrong?

Hmong don't judge others? Are you sure about that?
If judgment doesn't exist, punishment doesn't exist either. You cannot stone two Hmong couples who had and an affair with each other then otherwise you would be judging their actions.

I think you're carrying some pretty dangerous philosophy there.
We don't believe that because we all are sinners that we must continue sinning. I think you're misunderstanding Christianity. You and I are sinners that's why we need Jesus. When we believe in God we learn how to strive to become better people.. STRIVE is the keyword. No one can ever be spotless of sin but everyone can try.

About the converting thing.. You can't convert people but you can encourage them. Conversion is a personal choice.. When you have made that choice, you can then ask the church, if you want to, it's optional, to muab koj lawb dab. You don't need a lawb dab ceremony thingy to officially transit from animism to Christianity. If you truly believe in God then he would know from your heart. So, it doesn't make sense to me when you say we convert people. No one can force someone to believe or feel a certain way, only that person can.

^ Weren't the Crusaders trying to force the Persians into converting but got their asses kicked? Christianitay has caused a lot of bloodshed you'd have to admit.

I don't know much about the Crusade but I do know it happened and I won't deny it (for some funny reason people think Christians deny this even though Christians themselves have books on this). By the way, it was a war between religions involving other religions... or at least one other religion that I know of.

But the question is, what would Jesus do? If you have cracked open a Bible and read it before, you would know what Jesus would do.
It's a kind of good (bleh) attack to use on Christians but not good enough because the real way of a Christian is written all in the Bible. This is how we know who's following the word of God and who's violating them.

You guys should debate at HNY.

Ahaha ..
I don't want to make a scene there.