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Wulandari
My friends call me today, October 1, asking me about the news below:



QUOTE
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/asiapcf/10/0...asts/index.html


Bali terrorist blasts kill at least 26

Bloody attacks recall 2002 bombings linked to al Qaeda



(CNN) -- Terrorists brought death to Indonesia's Bali paradise for the second time in three years Saturday, as blasts killed at least 26 people at two resort spots packed with tourists.

The series of blasts began in the resort area of Jimbaran Bay, where there were two explosions at about 8 p.m. Saturday night (8 a.m. ET). They were followed minutes later by one or more blasts at Kuta, 30 kilometers away.

In addition to the 26 fatalities, hospital officials said 102 people were wounded.

Earlier, officials said 36 people had died, but on Sunday morning, Sanglah Hospital in Bali -- charged with overseeing the emergency response -- reduced the number of dead to 26.

A hospital emergency room where victims were treated resembled a war zone, journalist Sean Mulcahy told CNN. (Watch chaotic aftermath of Bali blasts -- 1:30)

"The ground is just covered in blood, people walking around with arms missing," said Mulcahy, who, at the time of the blasts, happened to be next door to a restaurant that was hit in the town of Kuta.

The attack came almost exactly three years after terrorists bombed Kuta nightclubs on October 12, 2002 -- killing 202 people.

"People were just starting to build up confidence again, and to have this happen was devastating for the locals. But I think it's the nail in the coffin for people coming to this place," Mulcahy said.

Indonesian President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono condemned Saturday's bombings as an act of terrorism. There were no immediate claims of responsibility.

But terrorism expert Rohan Gunaratna told CNN that the attacks had the hallmarks of Jemaah Islamiyah -- a Southeast Asian terrorist group with ties to al Qaeda.

"There is no other group with this level of capability," he said.

The 2002 bombings were blamed on Jemaah Islamiyah.

Four key militants involved in the 2002 attack have been sentenced -- three to death -- while dozens of others have also been convicted.

Video of the scene in Kuta showed glass windows of several upscale stores shattered, glass littering the street, and the awning of Raja's noodle house blown askew.

Maria Bakkalapulo, a journalist who arrived at Kuta about an hour after the blasts, said it appeared a bomb detonated inside Raja's, which "was pretty much gutted."

According to unconfirmed reports, a second bomb detonated on the restaurant's second floor, Bakkalapulo said.

U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan joined Yudhoyono in condemning the latest attacks in Bali, as did other world leaders.

The White House issued a statement Saturday offering sympathy to victims, "their families and the people of Bali who have suffered meaningless violence before. We also express our solidarity with the government of Indonesia and convey our readiness to assist in any way."

Australian Prime Minister John Howard told the Nine television network on Sunday morning that he was horrified and deeply saddened by the attacks, which he characterized as an attempt to undermine democracy in Indonesia.

He said Australia was offering medical evacuation facilities to Indonesia for anybody wounded in the blasts.

Kuta and Jimbaran -- the other resort spot targeted -- were "chock-a-block" with tourists celebrating a holiday weekend, Mulcahy said.

Foreign Ministry spokesman Marty Natalegawa said reports indicate the blasts appeared to have occurred only minutes apart.
'Tried to save myself'

In the Jimbaran attack, two explosions tore through a long row of outdoor tables at a beachfront cafe where tourists often gather to watch the sun set, Mulcahy said. The blast sites were about 40 meters apart, he said.

Ketut Suartana, 33, told Reuters he was eating when the first Jimbaran bomb exploded.

"We were eating and suddenly it just went dark," Suartana said from a hospital bed, where he was treated for scratches on his face and chest.

"I tried to run but I kept falling over. Then the second blast happened. People were in panic. I just tried to save myself."

Mulcahy -- who felt the blast while inside a restaurant next to Raja's -- had plans to dine with friends at Jimbaran, but the streets were backed up with heavy traffic so they headed to Kuta, instead.

"Had we gone to Jimbaran, we would more than likely be dead," Mulcahy said.

The attack left tourists filled with "fear and terror," and they are fleeing their hotels in Bali with suitcases in hand, Mulcahy said.

"I imagine they'll put on extra flights to cope with the amount of people that are leaving," he said.

Australian Foreign Minister Alexander Downer told Australia's ABC radio that a 16-year-old Australian boy was among those killed, and there were "grave fears" for two other Australians.

Downer said it appeared most of those killed were Indonesian. He said 17 Australians were among the injured. Local media reports also said several foreigners are among those wounded.

So far 15 bodies had been identified, according to Reuters news agency, quoting hospital officials. It said among the dead were 12 Indonesians, including a six-year-old boy, two Australians and a Japanese national.

The wounded included 17 Australians, six South Koreans, three Americans, three Japanese and one Briton.

Downer said Australia was sending a response team to Bali, and Australian Federal Police were ready to work with their Indonesian colleagues in investigating the attacks.
Warnings of terrorism

Shortly after Saturday's blast, Yudhoyono addressed the nation on state television, expressing his concern and condemning what he called a terrorist attack.

"These were clearly acts of terrorism because the victims were indiscriminately chosen and the targets were public areas. As president and on behalf of the Republic of Indonesia, I strongly condemn these inhuman acts," the leader said.

Yudhoyono said he had received intelligence information in July about terrorist elements in Malaysia and Philippines planning to target Indonesia, and had increased security in Jakarta and Bali as a precaution.

Recently, Yudhoyono issued a warning that terrorist cells inside the country were still active, despite hundreds of arrests.

Several other governments, including the United States, had warned about a high terrorist threat to foreigners in Indonesia ahead of the Muslim holy month of Ramadan, which begins next week.

A report issued in early September warned that Osama bin Laden and his top lieutenant, Ayman al-Zawahiri, may be planning a series of attacks in October, dubbed "The Great Ramadan Offensive."

On Friday the U.S. Embassy in Jakarta reiterated its warning of last May that the threat of terrorism is high and Americans there should be vigilant.

"Attacks could occur at any time and could be directed against any location, including those frequented by foreigners and identifiably American or other western facilities or businesses in Indonesia," the message said.

The island of Bali -- a popular spot for international tourists -- is a Hindu enclave in Indonesia, which has the highest Muslim population of any nation in the world.

The Australian government warned immediately after the Saturday night blasts that the possibility of further explosions could not be ruled out. It urged Australians in Bali to remain in their hotels.

Aside from the 2002 Bali attack, there have been a number of other terrorist incidents in Indonesia in recent years.

The Australian embassy in Jakarta was bombed in September 2004 in an attack that left 10 people dead, while in August 2003, 12 people were killed after a suicide bomber struck the J.W. Marriott hotel in Jakarta. Both attacks were blamed on JI.

Australia and the United States consider Indonesian cleric Abu Bakar Ba'asyir to be the spiritual head of JI.

In March this year, Ba'asyir was sentenced to 30 months in jail for involvement in the 2002 Bali nightclub bombings, but was cleared of all other terror-related charges, including those related to the Marriott Hotel bombing.

CNN's Elaine Quijano and Geoff Hiscock, and journalists John Aglionby and Maria Ressa contributed to this report.



Find this article at:
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/asiapcf/10/0...asts/index.html








They asked me, What happen in Indonesia?

I said: another bomb blew up, killing many people



They asked: Who did this?

I said: I don't know. Accoding to news, it is done by Muslims. According another resource, the Indonesian government did this to deflect people attention from gasoline price increase to bombings



They asked: Is your family okay in Indonesia?

I said: Yes, they are okay. Thank you.




They asked: Why there are so many violences in Indonesia? Why they never stop?

I said: I don't know. Many bad people, I think




They said: I feel sorry for your people

I said: Me too

**************



Indonesia is famous in here. Many people know about Indonesia. People know about Bali bombings in 2002, killing 202 people, religious wars between Muslims and Christians, anti Chinese riots in May 1998, one of the worst corrupt people in the world, Suharto has between $15 billions and $35 billions dollar IN CASH, and so on ....and so on.....

I am tired defending Indonesia everytime people asking me those questions. They are nice to me. But, behind my back, I don't know. Maybe, I will move to another different church, another city, and tell people that:

I am a Philipino or I am a Thailand

So, I don't need to defend Indonesia no more.

icon_sad.gif
purnomor
LOLZ.. what do you expect us to say? Why should we care what you do? You can become a citizen of Philippines or Thailand or Ethiopia, it's up to you.

IMO It's absolutely selfish and inappropriate that while Bali got bombed, you are the one complaining as if you are the victim.
kunomchu
your country got a $hitload of probs.
purnomor
^ yeah, luckily we have neutralised our illegal fishing problem..
kunomchu
lol how can you compare a suicide bomb to fishing probs?
purnomor
the easier problem always got solved first..
kunomchu
islamic countries always so violent,
purnomor
i hate terrorists!
LaoShare
QUOTE (purnomor @ Oct 1 2005, 07:08 PM)
LOLZ.. what do you expect us to say? Why should we care what you do? You can become a citizen of Philippines or Thailand or Ethiopia, it's up to you.

IMO It's absolutely selfish and inappropriate that while Bali got bombed, you are the one complaining as if you are the victim.
*



Ibu Wulandari may sound selfish but she is actually very tired, very sad and deeply in pain.

Like today's younger generation Indonesians , Ibu generation were once young and hopefull too;
at one time or more, they always think the very best for their country.
They were full of hope: they studied hard; they served and contributed with all their heart,
hoping that they are part of the solutions to the country's problems.

However, their country's problems are so huge and complex that their dreams were crushed time after time.
They felt so helpless and hopeless; leaving the country became their final and only option!



QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 1 2005, 06:54 PM)
I am tired defending Indonesia everytime people asking me those questions. They are nice to me. But, behind my back, I don't know.  Maybe, I will move to another different church, another city, and tell people that:

I am a Philipino or I am a Thailand

So, I don't need to defend Indonesia no more.

She sound very very tired. She is so tired that she want to turn her back to her people, however her love for her country would not allow her to do just that and that is the reason she is telling us all this in this public forum.

Again Ibu Wulandari, we all love you and we love your openness and honesty!
Your generation's hard works are not in vain!


Dear Purnomor, I can understand your frustration.
We all really need to pray hard to the Almighty for the country, beg for mercy for everyone in Indonesia,
especially the homeless and penniless millions; these are the people suffered the most!
e_vaholic
hey!!! purnomor and madam wulandari should end their conflict!!!
don't blame each other!!!!!
chilli21
QUOTE (purnomor @ Oct 2 2005, 01:50 PM)
i hate terrorists!
*


so, what's your way of dealing with terrorists?
LaoShare
QUOTE (chilli21 @ Oct 2 2005, 01:37 AM)
QUOTE (purnomor @ Oct 2 2005, 01:50 PM)
i hate terrorists!
*


so, what's your way of dealing with terrorists?
*



Indonesia is a land of riches in natural and people resources; languages and dialects, cultures, foods, music, religions, etc. The varieties and the differences of this land are as huge and numerous as the numbers of islands She consisted of.
The people in this island country are almost 100% theists; they believe in THE ALMGHTY.This common faith in the Almighty of either Muslins, Christians or any other faiths is one of the common denominator that hold Indonesians together like the water and the air that the lands depended on.

Since the country independence 1949, we have made too much mistakes but for sure we have never lacks of trying! We are one of the most rich, most beautiful, most brilliant and hardest working people on earth (I personally disagree with the overwork ethic and habit of the Chinese or the Japanese.) and yet we failed again and again! We seems to be always haunted by one disaster after another, no ending like our Rupiah ballooning itself almost out of existence!

We as human have failed! We all once have high hope, however the reality is our dreams were crushed completely! Every generation is the samo samo story; we had enough and so we moved!

Human can fail but God would never fail! (Otherwise God is no God)
God always have solutions! (Otherwise God is no God)
Really? We really believe that?

We all like to call ourselves as Muslins, Christians, Catholics, etc; and we like to think we all believe in the Almighty.
Are we really?
Majapahitans
QUOTE (chilli21 @ Oct 2 2005, 03:37 AM)
QUOTE (purnomor @ Oct 2 2005, 01:50 PM)
i hate terrorists!
*


so, what's your way of dealing with terrorists?
*



Kill all terrorist......!!!!! madgo.gif madgo.gif madgo.gif madgo.gif madgo.gif
kunomchu
This is why i think religion is bull$hit. Too many innocents die over ideology.
charlee
I heard that Indonesia has the biggest islamic population in the world.......how can we hope to solve islamic terrorism elsewhere when even in Predominantly muslim countries they are yet to control these kind of ppl???

It's all very sad....and all getting totally outta hand across the globe.....
sido
QUOTE (kunomchu @ Oct 2 2005, 11:46 AM)
This is why i think religion is bull$hit. Too many innocents die over ideology.
*


If its not religion its going to be something else. Unless everyone looks the same talks the same has the same coloured hair and the same coloured skin humans will pick out differences and find ways to discriminate. If religion wasnt an issue it WOULD be something else. It just comes down to the idiots that cant see everyone is entitled to their own opinions that cause the problems.

QUOTE (charlee @ Oct 2 2005, 12:27 PM)
I heard that Indonesia has the biggest islamic population in the world.......how can we hope to solve islamic terrorism elsewhere when even in Predominantly muslim countries they are yet to control these kind of ppl???

It's all very sad....and all getting totally outta hand across the globe.....
*


It only just started, indonesia NEVER had these problems 10 years ago partly due to suharto's iron fist but its also a result of the latest events of the world. Who do you blame. America who want to impose their international laws (similar to terrorist who want a complete muslim word) and beliefs on everyone or these terrorists who are killing innocent people through these terrible acts as a retaliation method ?
Wulandari
QUOTE (LaoShare @ Oct 2 2005, 01:50 AM)
QUOTE (purnomor @ Oct 1 2005, 07:08 PM)
LOLZ.. what do you expect us to say? Why should we care what you do? You can become a citizen of Philippines or Thailand or Ethiopia, it's up to you.

IMO It's absolutely selfish and inappropriate that while Bali got bombed, you are the one complaining as if you are the victim.
*



Ibu Wulandari may sound selfish but she is actually very tired, very sad and deeply in pain.

Like today's younger generation Indonesians , Ibu generation were once young and hopefull too;
at one time or more, they always think the very best for their country.
They were full of hope: they studied hard; they served and contributed with all their heart,
hoping that they are part of the solutions to the country's problems.

However, their country's problems are so huge and complex that their dreams were crushed time after time.
They felt so helpless and hopeless; leaving the country became their final and only option!



QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 1 2005, 06:54 PM)
I am tired defending Indonesia everytime people asking me those questions. They are nice to me. But, behind my back, I don't know.  Maybe, I will move to another different church, another city, and tell people that:

I am a Philipino or I am a Thailand

So, I don't need to defend Indonesia no more.

She sound very very tired. She is so tired that she want to turn her back to her people, however her love for her country would not allow her to do just that and that is the reason she is telling us all this in this public forum.

Again Ibu Wulandari, we all love you and we love your openness and honesty!
Your generation's hard works are not in vain!


Dear Purnomor, I can understand your frustration.
We all really need to pray hard to the Almighty for the country, beg for mercy for everyone in Indonesia,
especially the homeless and penniless millions; these are the people suffered the most!
*








My dear Lao

Thank you for your lovely support. I always love my country and my people.

icon_smile.gif

However, many people in Indonesia have no idea how to become an Indonesian (with brown skin and big eye) in America here. Everytime I introduce my self to people that I am from Indonesia, they give me strange looks.

They said: "Uhh.....Indonesia huh? Hmmmm...................."

They don't say something impolite in front of me, they just give me a look, as if I were an alien, worse, a terrorist. Lucky me, I am a lady and not young anymore, so they don't say something rude.

But, my friends from Philipines and Thailands (the same brown skins and big eyes) don't get that kind of strange looks. Americans treat them well. I thought, it is just coincidence about that kind of strange looks, but when I talked to other Indonesians (with brown skins and big eye), they say they get strange looks from Americans too. It is just Chinese from Indonesia who don't get that kind of strange looks. My children and my husband are lucky. They look like Chinese. I am not that lucky.

icon_sad.gif
purnomor
mbak wulandari, why don't you say you are an arab, the americans will give you even stranger look..

if just because someone give you what you think is strange looks then you decide you want to pretend you are not indonesian, then it is good riddance if you moved out bcoz only an idiot would want to change nationality just because somemone "looked" at her "strangely" sure.gif
Nusantara
QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 3 2005, 12:37 AM)
QUOTE (LaoShare @ Oct 2 2005, 01:50 AM)
QUOTE (purnomor @ Oct 1 2005, 07:08 PM)
LOLZ.. what do you expect us to say? Why should we care what you do? You can become a citizen of Philippines or Thailand or Ethiopia, it's up to you.

IMO It's absolutely selfish and inappropriate that while Bali got bombed, you are the one complaining as if you are the victim.
*



Ibu Wulandari may sound selfish but she is actually very tired, very sad and deeply in pain.

Like today's younger generation Indonesians , Ibu generation were once young and hopefull too;
at one time or more, they always think the very best for their country.
They were full of hope: they studied hard; they served and contributed with all their heart,
hoping that they are part of the solutions to the country's problems.

However, their country's problems are so huge and complex that their dreams were crushed time after time.
They felt so helpless and hopeless; leaving the country became their final and only option!



QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 1 2005, 06:54 PM)
I am tired defending Indonesia everytime people asking me those questions. They are nice to me. But, behind my back, I don't know.  Maybe, I will move to another different church, another city, and tell people that:

I am a Philipino or I am a Thailand

So, I don't need to defend Indonesia no more.

She sound very very tired. She is so tired that she want to turn her back to her people, however her love for her country would not allow her to do just that and that is the reason she is telling us all this in this public forum.

Again Ibu Wulandari, we all love you and we love your openness and honesty!
Your generation's hard works are not in vain!


Dear Purnomor, I can understand your frustration.
We all really need to pray hard to the Almighty for the country, beg for mercy for everyone in Indonesia,
especially the homeless and penniless millions; these are the people suffered the most!
*








My dear Lao

Thank you for your lovely support. I always love my country and my people.

icon_smile.gif

However, many people in Indonesia have no idea how to become an Indonesian (with brown skin and big eye) in America here. Everytime I introduce my self to people that I am from Indonesia, they give me strange looks.

They said: "Uhh.....Indonesia huh? Hmmmm...................."

They don't say something impolite in front of me, they just give me a look, as if I were an alien, worse, a terrorist. Lucky me, I am a lady and not young anymore, so they don't say something rude.

But, my friends from Philipines and Thailands (the same brown skins and big eyes) don't get that kind of strange looks. Americans treat them well. I thought, it is just coincidence about that kind of strange looks, but when I talked to other Indonesians (with brown skins and big eye), they say they get strange looks from Americans too. It is just Chinese from Indonesia who don't get that kind of strange looks. My children and my husband are lucky. They look like Chinese. I am not that lucky.

icon_sad.gif
*



You chinese just loitering around other countries, native Indonesian will got more respect in America than chinese. American do not care about someone religion, But they do care which people who flooded their countries.

Don't you know you chinese being called g@@k by caucasian.
Wulandari
QUOTE (LaoShare @ Oct 2 2005, 08:49 AM)
QUOTE (chilli21 @ Oct 2 2005, 01:37 AM)
QUOTE (purnomor @ Oct 2 2005, 01:50 PM)
i hate terrorists!
*


so, what's your way of dealing with terrorists?
*



Indonesia is a land of riches in natural and people resources; languages and dialects, cultures, foods, music, religions, etc. The varieties and the differences of this land are as huge and numerous as the numbers of islands She consisted of.
The people in this island country are almost 100% theists; they believe in THE ALMGHTY.This common faith in the Almighty of either Muslins, Christians or any other faiths is one of the common denominator that hold Indonesians together like the water and the air that the lands depended on.

Since the country independence 1949, we have made too much mistakes but for sure we have never lacks of trying! We are one of the most rich, most beautiful, most brilliant and hardest working people on earth (I personally disagree with the overwork ethic and habit of the Chinese or the Japanese.) and yet we failed again and again! We seems to be always haunted by one disaster after another, no ending like our Rupiah ballooning itself almost out of existence!

We as human have failed! We all once have high hope, however the reality is our dreams were crushed completely! Every generation is the samo samo story; we had enough and so we moved!

Human can fail but God would never fail! (Otherwise God is no God)
God always have solutions! (Otherwise God is no God)
Really? We really believe that?

We all like to call ourselves as Muslins, Christians, Catholics, etc; and we like to think we all believe in the Almighty.
Are we really?

*






I agree with you my son, LaoShare

We have most materials to become a great nation or great people. But, we fail !!!!. It is because our moral is terrible. We don't like do self instropection. We always blame other people for our own mistakes. We never look at our faces in mirror, and asking this kind of question:

"Why do we always become such losers ? "

icon_sad.gif



I found an interesting article about us and Bali Bomb part 2 in internet from The Jakarta Post Online





QUOTE
http://www.thejakartapost.com/detailheadli....A03&irec=2

October 3, 2005

Intolerance, hatred fertile soil for terrorism



Kornelius Purba, The Jakarta Post

The Air Force jet fighters were maneuvering on Sunday morning at low altitude near the Halim Perdanakusuma Air Base in East Jakarta, in preparation for the Indonesian Military's (TNI) 60th anniversary.

Such a scene would usually have invoked a sense of pride in those below; the exercise becoming for them a symbol of the nation's strength and a demonstration of the state's readiness to protect its citizens.

Only this time it was annoying, at least for a group of desperate men who were discussing the increased fuel prices and also the fresh attacks on Bali.

"I am just afraid the jets will fall," said one of them, citing recent air crashes involving both commercial and military aircraft.

"The pilots should fly directly to Bali to hunt down the terrorists. They don't need to show off here," another said.

Their despair over the running of the nation, the fuel price increases in particular, meant that rather than giving them a sense of security, the jets' presence only made them feel more vulnerable.


On Saturday, just four days before Muslims enter the fasting month of Ramadhan, fuel prices were raised by an average of 126.6 percent. The people had already been feeling anxious over the recent bird flu fatalities in the country and polio's reemergence.

And then Bali was bombed again. Three years ago, 202 people, mostly foreign tourists, had been killed in a terrorist attack on the island. On Saturday, over 25 people were killed and dozens of others injured. People's suffering seems complete now. Innocent people were killed and Bali's economy was dealt another blow. The terrorists have succeeded in humiliating the nation.

After working hard to regain global trust following the Oct. 12 bombing in 2002, the Balinese have overnight been ruined. It would not come as a surprise if action was taken against non-Balinese residents, migrants from Java in particular. Emotional demands, like calls for self-rule, may increase in the coming weeks.

World leaders condemned Saturday's barbaric acts. As usual, many groups from a range of religious and social backgrounds will hold press conferences to formally denounce the attacks and emphasize that Indonesia has zero tolerance for terrorism.

We Indonesians always insist that terrorism, fundamentalism and extremism (of any kind) do not have a place in the hearts of the majority here, because we are a peaceful nation. We strongly believe that only a very small number of people are responsible for these evil acts. But no matter how small they are, terrorism in this country has become an alarming issue, even by world standards.

Let us look into the mirror: Are we really as peaceful and as tolerant as we have proclaimed ourselves to be to the world? Maybe -- though we long to deny it -- we are not that sincere and honest.

There are many among us who are becoming intolerant of those who are of a different faith, ideology or political party. The forced closures of places of worship, including the Ahmadiyah mosques, have been incidents many of us have chosen to ignore. Differences in religious interpretation or even cultural teachings are regarded as unpardonable sins. The government, in many cases, is also reluctant to enforce the law -- or is this incompetency -- because it does not want to create "unnecessary problems" just to protect minorities.

Is the choice of Bali as the target of bombings just because many foreigners -- or "infidels" -- visit the island? Or is it because the Balinese have a different religion and culture from the majority of the population. Do the terrorists feel less guilty killing people on Bali?

Do we really condemn all acts of terrorism? If so, our condemnation should be reflected in our daily conduct. Or are some acts less condemned than others?

Innocent victims have fallen in Bali, and in many other places in the country. And more victims will fall if we are not prepared to admit that we are a sick nation.


The state has an obligation to protect its citizens and anyone staying or living in its territory. But the people are the most important part of the state. We cannot just blame the government. No matter how strong the government is in its fight against terrorism, if its lacks public support, more people will fall victim to those who maybe rightly think they can commit a crime and walk away scot-free.

The writer can be reached at purba@thejakartapost.com






The last statement from the new above

Are we sick people?

I am afraid, the answer is YES !!

We are sick people who like to be brain-washed by our government for decades, that we are great people, polite society, generous generation, tolerance people, great nation and all kinds of mambo jambos

In reality, we are just losers who like blaming other people for our own mistakes, full of hatred and violence to everybody.

I don't believe we have tolerance culture to other people, just like our government always brainwash us for decads. Too many violences and hatred in our history for decades. I believe actually we have "slave" culture. It means we are "nice" to our superior and stronger parties. It is because we have feodalism culture in which we always obey to our superiors/leaders. Plus, we were colonialized by Dutch and Japan for 350 hundred years. Our moral become "slave" moral who are afraid of guns and power.

However, we always cruel and brutal to minority. We persecute minority Christian and Chinese without mercy. It is because they are weak, we are not afraid of them. We kick all poor people hard in their assess. Poor people cannot fight back.

On the contrary, we are afraid of strong parties, especially if they have guns. We are afraid of Australia, so when their troops landed on our soil, East Timor, without permission, we didn't do anything to them. We are afraid of small country Singapore. So, when their people torture, kill hundreds of our blue collar workers, we never attack Singapore. It is because we might lose in war against Singapore. We are afraid of any parties who are stronger than us.

We have "slave" culture.

Thinking our people's attitudes carefully, we actually don't have polite or kind culture that our government always brainwash us for decades. We actually have "slave" culture in which we dare to persecute weaker parties, BUT we are "nice" to stronger parties.
purnomor
^ yet another pointless talk going nowhere, consisting mainly nonsensical bullcrap, offering no solution, as i said before the indonesians' favourite hobby of today, wasting time and energy by insulting themselves like some retard you can find in a mental hospital.
Nusantara
QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 3 2005, 01:13 AM)
QUOTE (LaoShare @ Oct 2 2005, 08:49 AM)
QUOTE (chilli21 @ Oct 2 2005, 01:37 AM)
QUOTE (purnomor @ Oct 2 2005, 01:50 PM)
i hate terrorists!
*


so, what's your way of dealing with terrorists?
*



Indonesia is a land of riches in natural and people resources; languages and dialects, cultures, foods, music, religions, etc. The varieties and the differences of this land are as huge and numerous as the numbers of islands She consisted of.
The people in this island country are almost 100% theists; they believe in THE ALMGHTY.This common faith in the Almighty of either Muslins, Christians or any other faiths is one of the common denominator that hold Indonesians together like the water and the air that the lands depended on.

Since the country independence 1949, we have made too much mistakes but for sure we have never lacks of trying! We are one of the most rich, most beautiful, most brilliant and hardest working people on earth (I personally disagree with the overwork ethic and habit of the Chinese or the Japanese.) and yet we failed again and again! We seems to be always haunted by one disaster after another, no ending like our Rupiah ballooning itself almost out of existence!

We as human have failed! We all once have high hope, however the reality is our dreams were crushed completely! Every generation is the samo samo story; we had enough and so we moved!

Human can fail but God would never fail! (Otherwise God is no God)
God always have solutions! (Otherwise God is no God)
Really? We really believe that?

We all like to call ourselves as Muslins, Christians, Catholics, etc; and we like to think we all believe in the Almighty.
Are we really?

*






I agree with you my son, LaoShare

We have most materials to become a great nation or great people. But, we fail !!!!. It is because our moral is terrible. We don't like do self instropection. We always blame other people for our own mistakes. We never look at our faces in mirror, and asking this kind of question:

"Why do we always become such losers ? "

icon_sad.gif



I found an interesting article about us and Bali Bomb part 2 in internet from The Jakarta Post Online





QUOTE
http://www.thejakartapost.com/detailheadli....A03&irec=2

October 3, 2005

Intolerance, hatred fertile soil for terrorism



Kornelius Purba, The Jakarta Post

The Air Force jet fighters were maneuvering on Sunday morning at low altitude near the Halim Perdanakusuma Air Base in East Jakarta, in preparation for the Indonesian Military's (TNI) 60th anniversary.

Such a scene would usually have invoked a sense of pride in those below; the exercise becoming for them a symbol of the nation's strength and a demonstration of the state's readiness to protect its citizens.

Only this time it was annoying, at least for a group of desperate men who were discussing the increased fuel prices and also the fresh attacks on Bali.

"I am just afraid the jets will fall," said one of them, citing recent air crashes involving both commercial and military aircraft.

"The pilots should fly directly to Bali to hunt down the terrorists. They don't need to show off here," another said.

Their despair over the running of the nation, the fuel price increases in particular, meant that rather than giving them a sense of security, the jets' presence only made them feel more vulnerable.


On Saturday, just four days before Muslims enter the fasting month of Ramadhan, fuel prices were raised by an average of 126.6 percent. The people had already been feeling anxious over the recent bird flu fatalities in the country and polio's reemergence.

And then Bali was bombed again. Three years ago, 202 people, mostly foreign tourists, had been killed in a terrorist attack on the island. On Saturday, over 25 people were killed and dozens of others injured. People's suffering seems complete now. Innocent people were killed and Bali's economy was dealt another blow. The terrorists have succeeded in humiliating the nation.

After working hard to regain global trust following the Oct. 12 bombing in 2002, the Balinese have overnight been ruined. It would not come as a surprise if action was taken against non-Balinese residents, migrants from Java in particular. Emotional demands, like calls for self-rule, may increase in the coming weeks.

World leaders condemned Saturday's barbaric acts. As usual, many groups from a range of religious and social backgrounds will hold press conferences to formally denounce the attacks and emphasize that Indonesia has zero tolerance for terrorism.

We Indonesians always insist that terrorism, fundamentalism and extremism (of any kind) do not have a place in the hearts of the majority here, because we are a peaceful nation. We strongly believe that only a very small number of people are responsible for these evil acts. But no matter how small they are, terrorism in this country has become an alarming issue, even by world standards.

Let us look into the mirror: Are we really as peaceful and as tolerant as we have proclaimed ourselves to be to the world? Maybe -- though we long to deny it -- we are not that sincere and honest.

There are many among us who are becoming intolerant of those who are of a different faith, ideology or political party. The forced closures of places of worship, including the Ahmadiyah mosques, have been incidents many of us have chosen to ignore. Differences in religious interpretation or even cultural teachings are regarded as unpardonable sins. The government, in many cases, is also reluctant to enforce the law -- or is this incompetency -- because it does not want to create "unnecessary problems" just to protect minorities.

Is the choice of Bali as the target of bombings just because many foreigners -- or "infidels" -- visit the island? Or is it because the Balinese have a different religion and culture from the majority of the population. Do the terrorists feel less guilty killing people on Bali?

Do we really condemn all acts of terrorism? If so, our condemnation should be reflected in our daily conduct. Or are some acts less condemned than others?

Innocent victims have fallen in Bali, and in many other places in the country. And more victims will fall if we are not prepared to admit that we are a sick nation.


The state has an obligation to protect its citizens and anyone staying or living in its territory. But the people are the most important part of the state. We cannot just blame the government. No matter how strong the government is in its fight against terrorism, if its lacks public support, more people will fall victim to those who maybe rightly think they can commit a crime and walk away scot-free.

The writer can be reached at purba@thejakartapost.com






The last statement from the new above

Are we sick people?

I am afraid, the answer is YES !!

We are sick people who like to be brain-washed by our government for decades, that we are great people, polite society, generous generation, tolerance people, great nation and all kinds of mambo jambos

In reality, we are just losers who like blaming other people for our own mistakes, full of hatred and violence to everybody.

I don't believe we have tolerance culture to other people, just like our government always brainwash us for decads. Too many violences and hatred in our history for decades. I believe actually we have "slave" culture. It means we are "nice" to our superior and stronger parties. It is because we have feodalism culture in which we always obey to our superiors/leaders. Plus, we were colonialized by Dutch and Japan for 350 hundred years. Our moral become "slave" moral who are afraid of guns and power.

However, we always cruel and brutal to minority. We persecute minority Christian and Chinese without mercy. It is because they are weak, we are not afraid of them. We kick all poor people hard in their assess. Poor people cannot fight back.

On the contrary, we are afraid of strong parties, especially if they have guns. We are afraid of Australia, so when their troops landed on our soil, East Timor, without permission, we didn't do anything to them. We are afraid of small country Singapore. So, when their people torture, kill hundreds of our blue collar workers, we never attack Singapore. It is because we might lose in war against Singapore. We are afraid of any parties who are stronger than us.

We have "slave" culture.

Thinking our people's attitudes carefully, we actually don't have polite or kind culture that our government always brainwash us for decades. We actually have "slave" culture in which we dare to persecute weaker parties, BUT we are "nice" to stronger parties.
*



Yeah I agree too, you ancestors came to Indonesia as slave labour and coolie immigrants.
furansizuka
Calm down, pipol. Mas Nus, Mas Pur, I’m afraid this is going to another unnecessary war again. Ibu Wulandari Yth, keluhan anda didengar tapi berkeluh kesah terus menerus apa ngga cape’ juga? icon_wink.gif
freefallz
QUOTE (Nusantara @ Oct 3 2005, 01:01 AM)
QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 3 2005, 12:37 AM)
QUOTE (LaoShare @ Oct 2 2005, 01:50 AM)
QUOTE (purnomor @ Oct 1 2005, 07:08 PM)
LOLZ.. what do you expect us to say? Why should we care what you do? You can become a citizen of Philippines or Thailand or Ethiopia, it's up to you.

IMO It's absolutely selfish and inappropriate that while Bali got bombed, you are the one complaining as if you are the victim.
*



Ibu Wulandari may sound selfish but she is actually very tired, very sad and deeply in pain.

Like today's younger generation Indonesians , Ibu generation were once young and hopefull too;
at one time or more, they always think the very best for their country.
They were full of hope: they studied hard; they served and contributed with all their heart,
hoping that they are part of the solutions to the country's problems.

However, their country's problems are so huge and complex that their dreams were crushed time after time.
They felt so helpless and hopeless; leaving the country became their final and only option!



QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 1 2005, 06:54 PM)
I am tired defending Indonesia everytime people asking me those questions. They are nice to me. But, behind my back, I don't know.  Maybe, I will move to another different church, another city, and tell people that:

I am a Philipino or I am a Thailand

So, I don't need to defend Indonesia no more.

She sound very very tired. She is so tired that she want to turn her back to her people, however her love for her country would not allow her to do just that and that is the reason she is telling us all this in this public forum.

Again Ibu Wulandari, we all love you and we love your openness and honesty!
Your generation's hard works are not in vain!


Dear Purnomor, I can understand your frustration.
We all really need to pray hard to the Almighty for the country, beg for mercy for everyone in Indonesia,
especially the homeless and penniless millions; these are the people suffered the most!
*








My dear Lao

Thank you for your lovely support. I always love my country and my people.

icon_smile.gif

However, many people in Indonesia have no idea how to become an Indonesian (with brown skin and big eye) in America here. Everytime I introduce my self to people that I am from Indonesia, they give me strange looks.

They said: "Uhh.....Indonesia huh? Hmmmm...................."

They don't say something impolite in front of me, they just give me a look, as if I were an alien, worse, a terrorist. Lucky me, I am a lady and not young anymore, so they don't say something rude.

But, my friends from Philipines and Thailands (the same brown skins and big eyes) don't get that kind of strange looks. Americans treat them well. I thought, it is just coincidence about that kind of strange looks, but when I talked to other Indonesians (with brown skins and big eye), they say they get strange looks from Americans too. It is just Chinese from Indonesia who don't get that kind of strange looks. My children and my husband are lucky. They look like Chinese. I am not that lucky.

icon_sad.gif
*



You chinese just loitering around other countries, native Indonesian will got more respect in America than chinese. American do not care about someone religion, But they do care which people who flooded their countries.

Don't you know you chinese being called g@@k by caucasian.
*


Why on earth would you pay attention to name calling? Mind you, it is these type of pesky attitudes that gets a country nowhere. You reduce terrorism by minimising racism. The FIRST step in minimising racism is to stop propagating it.
soro_i
QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 3 2005, 02:37 AM)
My dear Lao

Thank you for your lovely support. I always love my country and my people. icon_smile.gif

However, many people in Indonesia have no idea how to become an Indonesian (with brown skin and big eye) in America here. Everytime I introduce my self to people that I am from Indonesia, they give me strange looks.

They said: "Uhh.....Indonesia huh? Hmmmm...................."

They don't say something impolite in front of me, they just give me a look, as if I were an alien, worse, a terrorist. Lucky me, I am a lady and not young anymore, so they don't say something rude.

But, my friends from Philipines and Thailands (the same brown skins and big eyes) don't get that kind of strange looks. Americans treat them well. I thought, it is just coincidence about that kind of strange looks, but when I talked to other Indonesians (with brown skins and big eye), they say they get strange looks from Americans too.  It is just Chinese from Indonesia who don't get that kind of strange looks. My children and my husband are lucky. They look like Chinese. I am not that lucky. icon_sad.gif

Is LaoShare and Wulandari the same person?... They sounded the same... And I don't think Wulandari is in US.

---

I'm abit shock to see a patriotic Nusantra... He seemed to defend Indonesia from other Indonesian... IMHO... I think he should be more patriotic when a Malaysian talking shět about Indonesia. icon_wink.gif
Wulandari
QUOTE (furansizuka @ Oct 3 2005, 03:19 AM)
Calm down, pipol. Mas Nus, Mas Pur, I’m afraid this is going to another unnecessary war again. Ibu Wulandari Yth, keluhan anda didengar tapi berkeluh kesah terus menerus apa ngga cape’ juga?  icon_wink.gif
*






My dear Furansizuka,

I don't realize that I do complains about our country's condition. I think I do introspection of our conditions. To get solutions to solve our problems, we must find the roots of the problems. We must face our dirty laundries and take them bravely. It is impossible to get solutions if we don't dare to face our dark sides. If a person say " let's get the solutions without finding the roots of the problems", I believe that person try to hide something dirty and mislead other people to other directions, so the dirty secrets won't be disclosed and the real problems won't be never solved.

For example:

If our child has problem in math, his/her grade is so low, we cannot just ask the child to study harder. We must find the root of the problem first. It is possible that the child cannot understand what the teacher said in school, or the child is always bothered by his/her friends so the child cannot concentrate in class and so on. Without getting the root of the problem, just asking the child to study harder, we will never solve the problems. How can the child get higher grade in math by asking him/her to study harder if the real problem is it is difficult for the child to understand the teacher's pronounciations. We must ask the child to take more language class to solve the problem.

It is the same with what I do in here. Our condition is very very bad. To solve the problems, we must dare to take the problems "like men". If we just do talking talking how to solve the problems without getting the real causes, it is no more than mambo jambo brainwash indoctrinations, just like our goverment have been doing for decades to us.
LaoShare
QUOTE (soro_i @ Oct 3 2005, 03:58 AM)
Is LaoShare and Wulandari the same person?... They sounded the same...


Is LaoShare and soro_i not the same person?... They sounded not the same... embarassedlaugh.gif2
LaoShare
In all seriousness, Ibu and LaoShare do have something to share.

We both not only are a tad older than most of you, the advantages that we have are our mix-cultures and real experiences.
We are able to weave in and out of more than 2 cultures and see things from different times and perspectives !

So, anak anak, duduk baik baik, djangan kurang adjar sama orang tua jah!? biggrin.gif
LaoShare
QUOTE (furansizuka @ Oct 3 2005, 12:19 AM)
Calm down, pipol. Mas Nus, Mas Pur, I’m afraid this is going to another unnecessary war again. Ibu Wulandari Yth, keluhan anda didengar tapi berkeluh kesah terus menerus apa ngga cape’ juga?  icon_wink.gif
*


Tjikalau we are all foods;
May I say:
furansizuka you are .........es kopi susu. icon_smile.gif
LaoShare
QUOTE (Nusantara @ Oct 2 2005, 11:32 PM)
Yeah I agree too, you ancestors came to Indonesia as slave labour and coolie immigrants.


Sedih tetapi saja ngerti perasahanmu!

Tjikalau saja seorang pribumi,
begitulah saja bisah ada perasahaan bohuat!

baru kita usir si belanda......eh..eh....... sisipit jang gantiin...............
ini si tjina...mau diapain ni...baik bukan....usir bukan...makin bakar makin kaja confused.gif
......................dasar bangsat!
LiuMaiShenJian
You guys should just take it easy. Using your anger and emotion won't get anything done and we won't have any problems solved or done. Be open minded, accept critisism from others. Critisism is good, feeling unsatisfied is good, it's what drive us to fix ourselves. Pride will only destroy us. Blindly defending obscure pride is even worse for it will lead us to destruction and total mayhem.

A great nation is a nation who is not ashamed of herself, a great nation is a nation who can look at herself in the mirror and admit how she really looks like without make-up or any clothes on and how to heal herself from all the marks and scarfs on her face and body and identify what make-up and clothes are the most appropriate for her to look stunning but at the same time natural for the parties in years to come.
chilli21
QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 4 2005, 01:52 AM)
My dear Furansizuka,

I don't realize that I do complains about our country's condition. I think I do introspection of our conditions. To get solutions to solve our problems, we must find the roots of the problems. We must face our dirty laundries and take them bravely. It is impossible to get solutions if we don't dare to face our dark sides. If a person say " let's get the solutions without finding the roots of the problems", I believe that person try to hide something dirty and mislead other people to other directions, so the dirty secrets won't be disclosed and the real problems won't be never solved.

*


agree
purnomor
QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 3 2005, 09:52 AM)
My dear Furansizuka,

I don't realize that I do complains about our country's condition. I think I do introspection of our conditions. To get solutions to solve our problems, we must find the roots of the problems. We must face our dirty laundries and take them bravely. It is impossible to get solutions if we don't dare to face our dark sides. If a person say " let's get the solutions without finding the roots of the problems", I believe that person try to hide something dirty and mislead other people to other directions, so the dirty secrets won't be disclosed and the real problems won't be never solved.


so your solution is to pretend to be a thai or filipino next time someone asks you where u come from. that is sure gonna help reduce terrorism..
chilli21
QUOTE (purnomor @ Oct 4 2005, 01:00 PM)
QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 3 2005, 09:52 AM)
My dear Furansizuka,

I don't realize that I do complains about our country's condition. I think I do introspection of our conditions. To get solutions to solve our problems, we must find the roots of the problems. We must face our dirty laundries and take them bravely. It is impossible to get solutions if we don't dare to face our dark sides. If a person say " let's get the solutions without finding the roots of the problems", I believe that person try to hide something dirty and mislead other people to other directions, so the dirty secrets won't be disclosed and the real problems won't be never solved.


so your solution is to pretend to be a thai or filipino next time someone asks you where u come from. that is sure gonna help reduce terrorism..
*



he's saying that to fight terrorism u need to know the nature of it and why the terrorists are doing in bali. etc. sure.gif
purnomor
no, he didn't
purnomor
Signs that life on Bali fast returning to normal after bomb blasts
By Dominique Loh, Channel NewsAsia


KUTA, Indonesia : Less than a day after the bomb blasts in Bali, there are already signs on Sunday that life on the resort island is getting back to normal.

Even hospital staff treating the injured say that after the painful lesson 3 years ago, they are much better equipped this time round to deal with the casualties and to help families locate their loved ones.

Our reporter spent the day among the walking wounded at Bali.

There are now about a hundred and forty casualties warded at Sanglah Hospital, nearly half of them are Indonesians.

All round the hospital, anxious family members and friends wait for news about their loved ones.

Among them is Fanty Fong, a Bali resident whose friend was injured in the bomb blast at Jimbaran.

She said: "She got 6 pieces in her body. It is very bad for us particularly for people who live in Bali, we depend on tourism very much. It contributes 75 percent to the local economy. I myself am in the industry, it's very bad, second time in 3 years. Enough is enough, the victims are innocent people, not their target, totally unnecessary."

One of the lessons learnt after the first bombing is to quickly set up a crisis centre like the one in Sanglah Hospital.

It helps to provide crucial information to friends and families looking for their loved ones.

Yvonne Verbeet, Bali International Women's Association, said: "They come here asking for names, which hospital they are in, how are the badly wounded, all kinds of questions and missing people. Hey! I'm missing this person, can you help me look. An Australian doctor she found me and asked if she can help us."

But having survived an even deadlier attack three years ago, life was quickly back to normal less than a day after the blasts.

Shops near the one of the blast sites have re-opened and tourists are back on the street.

Even as forensic experts comb the debris for clues, more tourists from all over the world are arriving for a holiday in Bali. - CNA /ch
LaoShare
QUOTE (LiuMaiShenJian @ Oct 3 2005, 05:08 PM)
You guys should just take it easy. Using your anger and emotion won't get anything done and we won't have any problems solved or done. Be open minded, accept critisism from others. Critisism is good, feeling unsatisfied is good, it's what drive us to fix ourselves. Pride will only destroy us. Blindly defending obscure pride is even worse for it will lead us to destruction and total mayhem.

A great nation is a nation who is not ashamed of herself, a great nation is a nation who can look at herself in the mirror and admit how she really looks like without make-up or any clothes on and how to heal herself from all the marks and scarfs on her face and body and identify what make-up and clothes are the most appropriate for her to look stunning but at the same time natural for the parties in years to come.
*

Bagus sekali! biggthumpup.gif


If the Indonesians were the slaves to the Dutch,
wouldn't you agree that the Chinese are the slaves to the Indonesians now?
We have to be "nice" or else!

Sometime I felt that we are all damaged goods, the problem is that
it is too darn pain to admit to it!
Nusantara
QUOTE (LaoShare @ Oct 3 2005, 09:54 PM)
QUOTE (LiuMaiShenJian @ Oct 3 2005, 05:08 PM)
You guys should just take it easy. Using your anger and emotion won't get anything done and we won't have any problems solved or done. Be open minded, accept critisism from others. Critisism is good, feeling unsatisfied is good, it's what drive us to fix ourselves. Pride will only destroy us. Blindly defending obscure pride is even worse for it will lead us to destruction and total mayhem.

A great nation is a nation who is not ashamed of herself, a great nation is a nation who can look at herself in the mirror and admit how she really looks like without make-up or any clothes on and how to heal herself from all the marks and scarfs on her face and body and identify what make-up and clothes are the most appropriate for her to look stunning but at the same time natural for the parties in years to come.
*

Bagus sekali! biggthumpup.gif


If the Indonesians were the slaves to the Dutch,
wouldn't you agree that the Chinese are the slaves to the Indonesians now?

*



I see.
Nusantara
QUOTE (soro_i @ Oct 3 2005, 05:58 AM)
QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 3 2005, 02:37 AM)
My dear Lao

Thank you for your lovely support. I always love my country and my people. icon_smile.gif

However, many people in Indonesia have no idea how to become an Indonesian (with brown skin and big eye) in America here. Everytime I introduce my self to people that I am from Indonesia, they give me strange looks.

They said: "Uhh.....Indonesia huh? Hmmmm...................."

They don't say something impolite in front of me, they just give me a look, as if I were an alien, worse, a terrorist. Lucky me, I am a lady and not young anymore, so they don't say something rude.

But, my friends from Philipines and Thailands (the same brown skins and big eyes) don't get that kind of strange looks. Americans treat them well. I thought, it is just coincidence about that kind of strange looks, but when I talked to other Indonesians (with brown skins and big eye), they say they get strange looks from Americans too.   It is just Chinese from Indonesia who don't get that kind of strange looks. My children and my husband are lucky. They look like Chinese. I am not that lucky. icon_sad.gif

Is LaoShare and Wulandari the same person?... They sounded the same... And I don't think Wulandari is in US.

---

I'm abit shock to see a patriotic Nusantra... He seemed to defend Indonesia from other Indonesian... IMHO... I think he should be more patriotic when a Malaysian talking shět about Indonesia. icon_wink.gif
*



If you look at this forum history, from the beginning of this forum before there were any Indonesian regulars coming into this forum to defend Indonesian, this forum was flooded by deragatory remarks toward Indonesian collaboration among the guuk of chinese Malaysian and the guuk of chinese Indonesian.

QUOTE
I think he should be more patriotic when a Malaysian talking shět about Indonesia.  icon_wink.gif

I Think you refer this about Iron Malaysian who mentioned about majority genes in Indonesia are mongoloid in Indo-Aryan thread.

It was about how mongoloid aborigine genes found among majority Indonesian make Indonesian becomes weak not as superior as caucasian genes found among Malay in Sumatra and Borneo/Brunei/Sabah.

he actually dissed his own people who are also have mongoloid aborigines. It is fair enough.
LaoShare
QUOTE (Nusantara @ Oct 3 2005, 09:39 PM)
I see.


Nusantara,
Do you hate Chinese?
soro_i
Nusantara:

He explicitly said that malaysian police can easily identify Indonesians illegal by their look... "they're short, dark and ugly"... And if I'm not mistaken, you let it slide... like nothing happen... It seemed to me that you let him said that bcoz he used "Malay" as bond between you and him to belittle other Indonesians.

I think that's the prob about Indonesia, bcoz of the diversity, ppl there are easily divided... ex.. some foreigners (Indians, Malaysians, Arabs, Chinese, Westerners, etc.) can always go to any ethnic groups in Indonesia and manipulate them to help the foreigners to take advantage of other Indonesians.

Is my observation correct? confused.gif

--


QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 3 2005, 02:37 AM)
My dear Lao

Thank you for your lovely support. I always love my country and my people. icon_smile.gif

However, many people in Indonesia have no idea how to become an Indonesian (with brown skin and big eye) in America here. Everytime I introduce my self to people that I am from Indonesia, they give me strange looks.

They said: "Uhh.....Indonesia huh? Hmmmm...................."

They don't say something impolite in front of me, they just give me a look, as if I were an alien, worse, a terrorist. Lucky me, I am a lady and not young anymore, so they don't say something rude.

But, my friends from Philipines and Thailands (the same brown skins and big eyes) don't get that kind of strange looks. Americans treat them well. I thought, it is just coincidence about that kind of strange looks, but when I talked to other Indonesians (with brown skins and big eye), they say they get strange looks from Americans too.   It is just Chinese from Indonesia who don't get that kind of strange looks. My children and my husband are lucky. They look like Chinese. I am not that lucky. icon_sad.gif

I still think LaoShare and Wulandari is the same person... both tried too hard to flatter themself by lamenting about bad things in Indonesia and both have very delusional airy view of their ethnicity.

The thing about Wulandari probably not in US is bcoz the thing she said...

In US, if you tell ppl you're from Indonesia, you better bring a map. Bcoz most ppl don't know what is Indonesia or where is it... Indonesians generally look like Hawaiians, Mexicans, Cambodians, Filipinos, Blacks, etc... Unless you look like Arabs with crooked nose and the whole enchiladas, nobody would ever associate you with terrorist... Also, if you mention about the riot, the response you would get is "what riot?... where?"

About Alien: Anybody who resides in US and not an American or American National, is an alien.
LaoShare
QUOTE (LaoShare @ Sep 13 2005, 03:43 AM)
Just to share some of my thoughts with you:
Although I look like a “pure Chinese”, speak and write Chinese, (Mandarin and 2 other dialects) and also studied ancient Chinese philosophy and sometime I observed Chinese customs. I also love to associate with Chinese from China, Taiwan, HK, SE Asia, USA, Canada or anywhere else. I enjoy very much all these, however I often ask:
Are all these qualified me to be a Chinese?
Who is Chinese anyway? Where is the word Chinese comes from?
Can I really call myself a “pure Chinese”? Or is there such a thing as “pure Chinese”?
Who is going to guarantee me that I am not a bi-product of the descendants of Mongol invader and Han?

Yes, it is important to be a good Indonesian,
Yes, it is important to be a good Chinese,
Yes, it is important to be a good Canadian,
Above all, shouldn’t the most important thing is to be  a Good Person?

Does anybody really care what Mother Teresa’s nationality is?

QUOTE (soro_i @ Oct 4 2005, 03:01 AM)
I still think LaoShare and Wulandari is the same person... both tried too hard to flatter themself by lamenting about bad things in Indonesia and both have very delusional airy view of their ethnicity.


soro_i,

Those kinds of thinking are so old school, promoting hatred but love and peace among human race!
Can we all afford it!
Where do you think Bali Bombing originate?
Terrorists' hatred all started from their evil hearts!

Pure blood of any "ethnicity" in this age of information like today is nothing but a joke!

The world is not getting any bigger but smaller, our welfares so interrelated;
Loving or hating your neighbors in all practicality is loving and hating yourselves!

So what if LaoShare and Wulandari is the same person; that kind of perception proves hate and pride do blur thoughts and blind visions.


To stop Bali Bombing
is to stop the hatred and the formation of that
little baby Terrorists inside all of us!

The million-dollar question shoud be
"how to stop and clean that ugliness inside every one of us?"
instead of a useless question like " is LaoShare and Wulandari the same person?"
e_vaholic
Madam wulandari, why don't you try that idea? i mean..pretending to be thai or phillipino...that's good idea!!
why should we become shy with our nationality? if they see you from head to toe as if you were an alien..cuek aja lagee!!! if i were you i will say "SIAPA LO??" to them for looking at me like that...

i think how to stop and clean the ugliness inside of us is only YOURSELF know..well..just start it from yourself...from small things..i believe we can!!

SEMANGAT!!!
furansizuka
QUOTE (LaoShare @ Oct 3 2005, 11:13 AM)
Tjikalau we are all foods;
May I say:
furansizuka you are .........es kopi susu. icon_smile.gif
*

maksud anda? biggrin.gif
LaoShare
QUOTE (furansizuka @ Oct 5 2005, 10:38 PM)
QUOTE (LaoShare @ Oct 3 2005, 11:13 AM)
Tjikalau we are all foods;
May I say:
furansizuka you are .........es kopi susu. icon_smile.gif
*

maksud anda? biggrin.gif
*


Refreshing and mau lagi...........so we are able to taste more spicy........ icon_smile.gif
furansizuka
QUOTE (LaoShare @ Oct 6 2005, 01:23 AM)
Refreshing and mau lagi...........so we are able to taste more spicy........ icon_smile.gif
*

Terima kasih Bapak Lao. Saja fikir saja membuat ketjanduan biggrin.gif
undercontrol
QUOTE (Wulandari @ Oct 1 2005, 08:54 PM)
So, I don't need to defend Indonesia no more.


There's exactly no need to defend anything here. There was a bombing done by terrorists (maybe..???) and it happened in Indo, it's just like 9/11 in US and suddenly somebody asks "What's wrong with US??"
sido
QUOTE (e_vaholic @ Oct 5 2005, 04:40 PM)
Madam wulandari, why don't you try that idea? i mean..pretending to be thai or phillipino...that's good idea!!
why should we become shy with our nationality?  i think how to stop and clean the ugliness inside of us is only YOURSELF know..well..just start it from yourself...from small things..i believe we can!!

SEMANGAT!!!
*


QUOTE
if they see you from head to toe as if you were an alien..cuek aja lagee!!! if i were you i will say "SIAPA LO??" to them for looking at me like that...


Love it beerchug.gif SIAPA LO ?? embarassedlaugh.gif2 cuek aja lagee!!! embarassedlaugh.gif2 I have had people look at me funny after i say im from indonesia, i usually reply with a 'WHAT ?!?!' biggthumpup.gif
Wulandari
QUOTE
Soro said:

The thing about Wulandari probably not in US is bcoz the thing she said...

In US, if you tell ppl you're from Indonesia, you better bring a map. Bcoz most ppl don't know what is Indonesia or where is it... Indonesians generally look like Hawaiians, Mexicans, Cambodians, Filipinos, Blacks, etc... Unless you look like Arabs with crooked nose and the whole enchiladas, nobody would ever associate you with terrorist... Also, if you mention about the riot, the response you would get is "what riot?... where?"

About Alien: Anybody who resides in US and not an American or American National, is an alien.





You are correct in half, my dear

Before economic crisis in 1997 and anti Chinese riots in 1998, most Americans will be confused if someone says that he/she comes from Indonesia. But, after those events, and attacks on Christians and Bali bombing in 2002 and tsunami in 2004 and...and...and........................ more and more Americans know about Indonesia

I don't think Indonesians look like Blacks or Mexicans or Hawaiians or Cambodians. Our profile looks like Filipino or Malay or some Thailands.

What I mean with alien is not foreigner, but mahluk luar angkasa or non human beings from other planets icon_wink.gif . In Indonesia, if we mention about "alien", it means strangers from other planets, not foreigner.

I am sorry for the misunderstanding, my dear icon_smile.gif
Wulandari
QUOTE (e_vaholic @ Oct 5 2005, 05:40 PM)
Madam wulandari, why don't you try that idea? i mean..pretending to be thai or phillipino...that's good idea!!
why should we become shy with our nationality? if they see you from head to toe as if you were an alien..cuek aja lagee!!! if i were you i will say "SIAPA LO??" to them for looking at me like that...

i think how to stop and clean the ugliness inside of us is only YOURSELF know..well..just start it from yourself...from small things..i believe we can!!

SEMANGAT!!!
*





icon_smile.gif

My dear,

I agree with you that we should not feel shame about our nationality. However, the problem is not just the word " Indonesia". The problem is what happen in Indonesia. If our people do good things in Indonesia and our conditions are good and respectable, people in other countries will consider the word "Indonesia" with respect. However, if our conditions are not good and unrespectable, foreigners will consider the word "Indonesia" with suspicious.

Eventhough we have strong self confident, but if the reality in our country is not good, people will not buy whatever we tell them. They see realities, not words. Besides, because majority of Indonesians are Muslims, many Westerners/Non Muslim countries consider us as pariah and trouble-maker people.

If we were in other countries, I suggest all of us not to provoke non Indonesians. We should be flexible and avoid problems. If people look at us in funny way, and we said: "SIAPA LO ?" or "WHAT ARE YOU LOOKING AT?" , we might provoke them, and we can get a physical fight situation. Remember my dear, outside Indonesia, we are minority and weak. If we have problems with them, we always lose. If we go to the court as the result of the fight, the judge/jorors might determine that we are already guilty, before the court process even starts. It is because the name of "Indonesia" is considered as not a good name. We have no credibility. icon_sad.gif. In addition, the cost to hire a lawyer is very expensice.

So, for all my fellow Indonesian who stay in out of country, please be flexible and avoid problems. If people look at us in strange way, just smiling to them, try to be nice, say something nice or walk away. Dont' challenge them. We will lose. Stay out of trouble. Be good icon_smile.gif
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