Full Version: The Thais Stole Lao Fabrics And...
Hey I got a question...How come Thais are using elephants on their flags now, I thought that was our animal
QUOTE(Sirikittong @ Jul 2 2006, 12:31 AM) [snapback]2010111[/snapback]
lol. lol. dont do that my friend, Ruler of Elephants. HAHAHAHA
Hows the family?
More like Ruler of Cocks.
QUOTE(SofaKingAwesome @ Jul 3 2006, 01:29 AM) [snapback]2013416[/snapback]
Hey I got a question...How come Thais are using elephants on their flags now, I thought that was our animal
If Thais don't steal, then its not Thai.
That's how they are.
QUOTE(Mizz_Luv3r @ Jul 2 2006, 10:15 PM) [snapback]2013207[/snapback]
I can read Thai better than Lao scripts. To me, Laos script is just a little rounder in character than the Thais. But I don't see a very big significant difference between the two..
Lao:
Thai:
I think there is a huge difference. Lao script is way more simplified (less letters) and are also more ambiguous in appearance (hard to differentiate letters for me at least).
QUOTE(Dara @ Jul 3 2006, 02:02 PM) [snapback]2014487[/snapback]
I think there is a huge difference. Lao script is way more simplified (less letters) and are also more ambiguous in appearance (hard to differentiate letters for me at least).
Visually, it does look a lot different. But if you've been reading it for a long time, they're really not that different. But I am more familiar with the Thai alphabet. I think it's more easier to read than the Lao alphabet. The rounding of the Lao alphabet gets me confused at times.
QUOTE(SofaKingAwesome @ Jul 3 2006, 04:59 PM) [snapback]2013416[/snapback]
Hey I got a question...How come Thais are using elephants on their flags now, I thought that was our animal
QUOTE
The blue border matches the original source's background and is not part of the flag
from the Singha Beer source
From the Singha Beer source:
The Governor's Flag
The Governor's Flag is a red flag with a white elephant —in full caparison— standing on a raised dais. In the top left-hand corver [sic], there is a white circle, the diameter of which is one fourth of the width of the entire flag. In the middle of the circle stands the city's coat of arms. [Like the War Ensign 1891-1917 with city coat-of-arms inside a circle on the canton and a smaller elephant, slightly offset towards the fly.]
The flag, which first made an appearance in B.E.2434 [1891 AD], was known as "The White-Elephant-on-a-Platform Flag". The version shown here is the one used in B.E.2455 [1912 AD] by the Governor of Ayudhya during the reign, of King Rama VI. Governor's flag of this type were adopted for only a short period of time before their use was discontinued.
Santiago Dotor, 5 November 1999
from the Singha Beer source
From the Singha Beer source:
The Governor's Flag
The Governor's Flag is a red flag with a white elephant —in full caparison— standing on a raised dais. In the top left-hand corver [sic], there is a white circle, the diameter of which is one fourth of the width of the entire flag. In the middle of the circle stands the city's coat of arms. [Like the War Ensign 1891-1917 with city coat-of-arms inside a circle on the canton and a smaller elephant, slightly offset towards the fly.]
The flag, which first made an appearance in B.E.2434 [1891 AD], was known as "The White-Elephant-on-a-Platform Flag". The version shown here is the one used in B.E.2455 [1912 AD] by the Governor of Ayudhya during the reign, of King Rama VI. Governor's flag of this type were adopted for only a short period of time before their use was discontinued.
Santiago Dotor, 5 November 1999
http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/th_his.html#cam
Thai used to use the one head elephant flag ,but after some drunk soldier make a mistake by hoist an upside down flag. So it seem like the elephant is die ,it look funny their legs point to the sky
QUOTE(Dara @ Jul 3 2006, 11:02 AM) [snapback]2014487[/snapback]
I think there is a huge difference. Lao script is way more simplified (less letters) and are also more ambiguous in appearance (hard to differentiate letters for me at least).
I can read both Lao and Thai, although more easily Lao. But I will have a big difficulty writing Thai without having first taken the proper lessons.
QUOTE(lanxan @ Jul 3 2006, 01:54 AM) [snapback]2013488[/snapback]
More like Ruler of Cocks.
If Thais don't steal, then its not Thai.
That's how they are.Lanxan:
Sometimes you seem to have improved; other times you really need to grow up beyond those childish and silly nonsenses.
If you think Thai is hard; try reading Khmer, lol. Ive been reading and learning it so far..its pretty similar, but quite complicated.
Khmer is oh so complicated because the pronunciation of words can be ambiguous. I won't even try to explain here. Anyway, have you heard of/learned Lanna script? Lanna script is very similar to Khmer. It shares the using of subscript consonants with Khmer and Mon/Burmese. But the vowel symbols are more like modern Thai. Anyhoot, it seems that Lannna script has preserved a lot of aspects of ancient scripts that even Khmer hasn't kept.
Old Khmer has extra vowels and constinence, that no longer used in Modern Khmer. Just a modifycation in redundency. But there are plenty of invisible vowels.
And why are u learning Khmer Siri,.... Wanna become a killa Thai Tattoo artist one day... lol j/k.
And why are u learning Khmer Siri,.... Wanna become a killa Thai Tattoo artist one day... lol j/k.
Im learning it because I'm rather interested in khmer culture/art. Ive always been interested in the khmers for some time now; and since Ayuthaya adopted many things that were Khmer--its like reconnecting with my Ayuthayan roots when I learn khmer. And since most Ayuthayan arts were pillaged by the Burmese...the only door to Ayuthayan arts is through Khmer art. Per se, their writings.
Soksabai che te ^_^
Soksabai che te ^_^
QUOTE(Sirikittong @ Jul 3 2006, 09:17 PM) [snapback]2016041[/snapback]
Im learning it because I'm rather interested in khmer culture/art. Ive always been interested in the khmers for some time now; and since Ayuthaya adopted many things that were Khmer--its like reconnecting with my Ayuthayan roots when I learn khmer. And since most Ayuthayan arts were pillaged by the Burmese...the only door to Ayuthayan arts is through Khmer art. Per se, their writings.
Soksabai che te ^_^
Maybe you should also reconnect with your Issan roots.
My mother's side was RAISED in esarn areas; but they were chinese ethnics. Besides, esarn are already central thai.
Only things that interest me so far is Ayuthayan culture as well as Khmer (Angkor) culture.
Only things that interest me so far is Ayuthayan culture as well as Khmer (Angkor) culture.
QUOTE(grandmaster @ Jul 1 2006, 10:26 AM) [snapback]2008723[/snapback]
Okay me clearify the whole thing to you guys so but keep the debate going cause I learn many things from it. In northern thailand there are different groups of lao and non tai that makes up the people. The northern thai are lao but thai by unity and nationality. In northern thailand the lao are tai puan, tai lue, tai dam, tai daeng, tai yuan, tai neur , and tai yai( shan). NOw, in northern laos the lao are tai puan, tai lue, tai dam, tai daeng, tai yuan, tai neur. As you can see in northern laos and northern thailand it is the same. Every tai and town in laos has a different design for their SIN that shows the history of that group and represent their tai group. IF you compare tai vieng chan to tai puans design it would look different. NOw let me explain why thailand did not steel design from laos. All the groups you have in laos thailand has . Why ? cause we are the same people. Its just we have two different governments and our politics is what seperate us. Lanna = luangprabang lanxang, northern issan= vieng chan lanxang, half of southern issan = champasak lanxang. There is the reason why thailand did not steal design and fabric from laos. We buy it in laos because it is chaeaper to get it from laos then buy the ones that it mad in thailand. Once we get if from laos we stamp made in thailand then sell it. If its made in laos and made in thailand, what is the difference. I can understand if its made in cambodia or vietnam. In this case it was made by the same people on the other side of the mekong why would it matter?
Now about siamese and the sukhothai language and script. IF you read ancient thai and lao language 800 years ago there are no differences. The central thai used to speak like the central lao of vieng chan and puan. The only reason why the central thai language so much is the influence from MOn/khmer language. The majority of the people in central thai back then were MON KHMER and MALAY. Only the minority and ruling class were ai lao(first group from Nanchao) and tai (second group from Nanchao) . During the time of Sukhothai , lao and thai were still the same people using the script of King Ramkhamhaeng and speaking like vieng chan and puans of xieng khuang. As years went by central thai language began to evole with influence of MON/Khmer the script also got influence and change . The mordern day thai script is a mixture of sukhothai and khmer script. My point is when you guys argue it doesn't get anywhere because when you go back a few hundred years you guys are the same country and same people.
I like your style of debate and informative answers. This is the most unbiased answer as far as politic is concerned thus far. Thank you. A lot of us here need to stop being so political about everything. We need to debate and share information conducively and in a mature manner without attacking the other person's point of view politically and personally. Yes, Ayuthaya had done a lot of damage to Vientiane, its very sad, but that's the past. Let's accept it, make it a learning experience, move on from it and grow.
cheers
QUOTE(AEROFORCE1 @ Jul 3 2006, 10:29 AM) [snapback]2014542[/snapback]
http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/th_his.html#cam
Thai used to use the one head elephant flag ,but after some drunk soldier make a mistake by hoist an upside down flag. So it seem like the elephant is die ,it look funny their legs point to the sky
This is kind of interesting, my dad told me the other day that the old flag of Laos with the three headed elephant was an idea from Thailand. Does anyone have more information on this. I even saw a picture of a carving with a three headed elephant on the door a Chiang Mai wat.
QUOTE(lanxan @ Jul 3 2006, 12:54 AM) [snapback]2013488[/snapback]
More like Ruler of Cocks.
If Thais don't steal, then its not Thai.
That's how they are.Huh? I thought Lao cocks are bigger than Thai cocks? I'm confused!
QUOTE(Sirikittong @ Jul 4 2006, 05:38 AM) [snapback]2017730[/snapback]
My mother's side was RAISED in esarn areas; but they were chinese ethnics. Besides, esarn are already central thai.
Only things that interest me so far is Ayuthayan culture as well as Khmer (Angkor) culture.
No wonder why you look like a Khmer, that's good that you're trying to find your roots.
Good luck!
QUOTE(Shampoo @ Nov 1 2006, 01:05 AM) [snapback]2442005[/snapback]
This is kind of interesting, my dad told me the other day that the old flag of Laos with the three headed elephant was an idea from Thailand. Does anyone have more information on this. I even saw a picture of a carving with a three headed elephant on the door a Chiang Mai wat.
Huh? I thought Lao cocks are bigger than Thai cocks? I'm confused!
That's absurd. The threed headed elephant is LAO. To say it's Thai is like saying the Chinese got its written script from the Japanese. That's how ridiculous it is. The people of Chiang Mai, Chiang Rai, and Isan, basically all of Northern Thailand are Lao by ethnicity. They might claim Thai nationality and diss Lao people, but they can't hide the truth.
QUOTE(Sirikittong @ Jul 4 2006, 10:08 PM) [snapback]2017730[/snapback]
My mother's side was RAISED in esarn areas; but they were chinese ethnics. Besides, esarn are already central thai.
Only things that interest me so far is Ayuthayan culture as well as Khmer (Angkor) culture.
Only things that interest me now is you are Filipino
QUOTE(AEROFORCE1 @ Nov 14 2006, 07:31 AM) [snapback]2481237[/snapback]
Only things that interest me now is you are Filipino
His new name now is Al.B the Gay Flip.
the three headed elephant is not only lao.
khmer people also use it. at angkor wat, there's a picture of the three elephants with preah vishnu on top of it.
plus khmer use elephants during war time of course.
khmer people also use it. at angkor wat, there's a picture of the three elephants with preah vishnu on top of it.
plus khmer use elephants during war time of course.
QUOTE(Sovann @ Nov 14 2006, 09:02 PM) [snapback]2482420[/snapback]
the three headed elephant is not only lao.
khmer people also use it. at angkor wat, there's a picture of the three elephants with preah vishnu on top of it.
plus khmer use elephants during war time of course.
But it has mainly been linked and widely used by Lao people. Go hug Angkor Wat and leave the 3 headed elephants alone.
LOL
the three headed elephants is of hindi origin, and the lao people were from southern china, so...? i'm not saying that it's khmer. but khmer adopted the three elephants before the lao people came and became what it is today.
and of course they use elephants more than khmer.
how can i leave the three elephants alone when there is three headed elephants on angkor wat walls? lols.
the three headed elephants is of hindi origin, and the lao people were from southern china, so...? i'm not saying that it's khmer. but khmer adopted the three elephants before the lao people came and became what it is today.
and of course they use elephants more than khmer.
how can i leave the three elephants alone when there is three headed elephants on angkor wat walls? lols.
oh ok. aero already answer question thanks. dont want to get off topic
Okay... no one said that the 3 headed elephant wasn't linked and widely used by Lao. lolololol
well i realised i'm offtopic, so screw what i say before about three elephants because it wasnt on topic.
anyway, i can smell what udon thani people are cookin. gotta hit it up at their restuarant. free foods and beers. yeah man.
anyway, i can smell what udon thani people are cookin. gotta hit it up at their restuarant. free foods and beers. yeah man.
QUOTE(Sovann @ Nov 14 2006, 04:02 PM) [snapback]2482420[/snapback]
the three headed elephant is not only lao.
khmer people also use it. at angkor wat, there's a picture of the three elephants with preah vishnu on top of it.
plus khmer use elephants during war time of course.
Thai not only steal from us they steal from the lao too. I heard the three headed elephant was created by this khmer and lao artist and one day some Thai saw it and they thought it was pretty so they wanna use it. So they bought it and took it back to thailand. Then they prohibit lao and khmer people to use it. Now its illegal in Thailand for lao and khmer people to use the three headed elephants. You can be beated and jailed just for that! Thai just cant do anything by themselves they have to steal from great people like Khmer and lao. we shouldnt give up to theif.
100% lao here...thai trying to copyright me just because my skin is light.
get tha f outa here man.
"sua thai fai mai laow kao"
get tha f outa here man.
"sua thai fai mai laow kao"
Why is this a serious thread? How old is the person who posted this in Serious talk anyways?
--Big deal!!! Share the wealth! So what if Thai people come accross and buy it for themselves. They like to wear the Sin just as much as we do.
Most of them were probably getting sick and tired of wearing the dyed printed manufactured variety! That kind is no fun! I know, because I have a lot of them and I hate how the colors bleed off over time too!
I don't have too many of the original ones, but I prefer them over the factory ones and aparently so do the Thais!
Share, don't be too hurt by them. The Thais probably just really like the creativity Lao women put into making them.
--Big deal!!! Share the wealth! So what if Thai people come accross and buy it for themselves. They like to wear the Sin just as much as we do.
Most of them were probably getting sick and tired of wearing the dyed printed manufactured variety! That kind is no fun! I know, because I have a lot of them and I hate how the colors bleed off over time too!
I don't have too many of the original ones, but I prefer them over the factory ones and aparently so do the Thais!
Share, don't be too hurt by them. The Thais probably just really like the creativity Lao women put into making them.
QUOTE(Point_Dexter @ Jan 29 2006, 03:47 AM) [snapback]1500926[/snapback]
The Thais were never Hindus.
Any Hindu influence in Thai culture did not come first hand from India. It cam second hand from the former overlords.
The Khmers Have that kind of Fabric and style too, and WE KNOW IT CAME FROM LAOS. Its even document in Khmer Texts.
Any Hindu influence in Thai culture did not come first hand from India. It cam second hand from the former overlords.
The Khmers Have that kind of Fabric and style too, and WE KNOW IT CAME FROM LAOS. Its even document in Khmer Texts.
Point Dexter is quite correct! Thai people were never ever Hindu, when they were under the rule of the Khmer Empire they were exposed to Hindu culture.
Thai copy everything from Khmer! Even Thai script is derived from Khmer script. The Thai Royal Language, known as Rachasap, is based on the Khmer language. The Thai tattoo's are still written in Khmer script, not Thai. Even the ancient ruins in Thailand belong to Cambodia. All their knowledge comes from the Khmer Empire, when the Thai sacked Angkor, they took with them the Khmer Brahmins in order to learnn the secrets of the Khmer empire.
Thai people are not famous for anything they've created/invented by themselves except for "Thai" prostituion, "Thai drugs" and "Thai" corruption. Everything else they have is stolen/borrowed from other cultures.
QUOTE(SofaKingAwesome @ Jul 3 2006, 04:29 PM) [snapback]2013416[/snapback]
Hey I got a question...How come Thais are using elephants on their flags now, I thought that was our animal
All i know is that the elephant trainers of Thailand are from Surin province, a former Khmer province. Even today 90% of Surin people are Khmer. You can see the Khmer empire use of elephants on the walls of Angkor Wat
QUOTE(soldier @ Jun 13 2007, 06:31 AM) [snapback]3001651[/snapback]
All i know is that the elephant trainers of Thailand are from Surin province, a former Khmer province. Even today 90% of Surin people are Khmer. You can see the Khmer empire use of elephants on the walls of Angkor Wat
I wonder if their king was the elephantking. Since they used alot of elephant , they should have an elephantking .QUOTE(soldier @ Jun 13 2007, 09:28 PM) [snapback]3001649[/snapback]
Point Dexter is quite correct! Thai people were never ever Hindu, when they were under the rule of the Khmer Empire they were exposed to Hindu culture.
Thai copy everything from Khmer! Even Thai script is derived from Khmer script. The Thai Royal Language, known as Rachasap, is based on the Khmer language. The Thai tattoo's are still written in Khmer script, not Thai. Even the ancient ruins in Thailand belong to Cambodia. All their knowledge comes from the Khmer Empire, when the Thai sacked Angkor, they took with them the Khmer Brahmins in order to learnn the secrets of the Khmer empire.
Thai people are not famous for anything they've created/invented by themselves except for "Thai" prostituion, "Thai drugs" and "Thai" corruption. Everything else they have is stolen/borrowed from other cultures.
Thai copy everything from Khmer! Even Thai script is derived from Khmer script. The Thai Royal Language, known as Rachasap, is based on the Khmer language. The Thai tattoo's are still written in Khmer script, not Thai. Even the ancient ruins in Thailand belong to Cambodia. All their knowledge comes from the Khmer Empire, when the Thai sacked Angkor, they took with them the Khmer Brahmins in order to learnn the secrets of the Khmer empire.
Thai people are not famous for anything they've created/invented by themselves except for "Thai" prostituion, "Thai drugs" and "Thai" corruption. Everything else they have is stolen/borrowed from other cultures.
yeah,and cambodia invented and is famous for their khmer rouge and toul sleng.
QUOTE(Cao Cao @ Jun 30 2006, 11:57 AM) [snapback]2005427[/snapback]
Dude I think this is the wrong thread to talk about politics, this thread is dedicated to the Fabrics. And yes, the silk was first used in China coming from the silk worms and it was one of China's major trading sources.
And Laos is not a dictatorship, if it did it would have been runned by the same person until his death. Now, N. Korea and Cuba that is a dictatorship. And please don't bash at other people's government when Thailand itself has even more corruption then Laos.
And Laos is not a dictatorship, if it did it would have been runned by the same person until his death. Now, N. Korea and Cuba that is a dictatorship. And please don't bash at other people's government when Thailand itself has even more corruption then Laos.
come to think of it, everybody copy everybody, but to claim it as yours....hmmmmmm? how low is that???
AMEN!!!! every forum I go into, lao and thai bicker like cats and dogs.
We are truly sisters and brothers because that is exactly how sisters and brothers argue.
lao and thai need to stop the childish bickering......I'm guessing we are all adults here, so
refrain from using languages that hurt one another. Its old and gets no where but 360 degree
headaches. The world does not only revolve around thai and laos, there are 100 something more
countries and ethnicities out there. Its good to be proud of who you are and where you come from,
such as I am proud to be Lao. But it is not good to dehumanize or make a mockery of other people, because like me, they are proud of their heritage too. We don't have to love one another, but at least be nice to each other. We will all DIE someday.
So no one is better, ALL EQUAL.
[quote name='Sirikittong' date='Jun 30 2006, 08:33 AM' post='2004874']
lol. out of business? Try busy because Im taking Microbiology and Crystal Physics over the summer.
But since you guys are talking about this subject, Lan Xan did make a good point about the cultural beauty of the Chinese, and the borrowing the Japanese implemented on Chinese Imperial systems, their writing systems, court etiquette to religion. But one LARGE error that Lan Xan made was the comparison of Laos and Thailand to the same relationship between China and Japan. His comparison was not only wrong, but futile in his attempt to try to incite Thai posters and readers. First of all, Laos NEVER exported culture to Thailand, nor has LAOS exported anything to Thailand besides Lao refugees and Lao illegal immigrants, which are coming into Thailand by the THOUSANDS every year.
lao don't need to import anything to thailand because whats the point. the thais already welcome themselves of some of theLao products without even asking first. Thai steal the lao woman by misleading them to go work in thailand...promising them good jobs and earning good money....but its actually a lie for them to go be like Thai prostitutes. Once the lao woman cross over, they kidnapp the lao woman making them hostages, throw away their passports and forcing them to become the white man's sex slaves.
I like to see the Thai steal from the Vietnamese....But I don't think the thais are brave enough to mess with the viets. CHEERS...BEER LAO!!
lol. out of business? Try busy because Im taking Microbiology and Crystal Physics over the summer.
But since you guys are talking about this subject, Lan Xan did make a good point about the cultural beauty of the Chinese, and the borrowing the Japanese implemented on Chinese Imperial systems, their writing systems, court etiquette to religion. But one LARGE error that Lan Xan made was the comparison of Laos and Thailand to the same relationship between China and Japan. His comparison was not only wrong, but futile in his attempt to try to incite Thai posters and readers. First of all, Laos NEVER exported culture to Thailand, nor has LAOS exported anything to Thailand besides Lao refugees and Lao illegal immigrants, which are coming into Thailand by the THOUSANDS every year.
lao don't need to import anything to thailand because whats the point. the thais already welcome themselves of some of theLao products without even asking first. Thai steal the lao woman by misleading them to go work in thailand...promising them good jobs and earning good money....but its actually a lie for them to go be like Thai prostitutes. Once the lao woman cross over, they kidnapp the lao woman making them hostages, throw away their passports and forcing them to become the white man's sex slaves.
I like to see the Thai steal from the Vietnamese....But I don't think the thais are brave enough to mess with the viets. CHEERS...BEER LAO!!
QUOTE(Point_Dexter @ Apr 29 2006, 08:34 AM) [snapback]1802292[/snapback]
To the general public the fabric is known as Thai Silk, and it has been marketed that way since the 18th century.
18th century? Thailand didn't exist until 1939 so there was no such thing as "Thai silk" in the 18th century.
Anyway, despite Laos being a newcomer in promoting herself to western countries, it's still amazing to me that if you googled the term "Lao silk", you'd get more than a million hits.
Silk and cotton weaving is an ancient art from the former kingdoms of the Lao, but we're now being recognized by western countries for having beautiful textiles.
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