Polygamy

I think this is a topic that generates more misconceptions in the minds of the majority of non muslims about Islam than any other.I hope i can clear it up a lil bit. 1st of all the quran is the only religious scripture in the world, that contains the phrase "marry only one" There is no other religious book in the world that instructs men to have only one wife! In pre-islamic times men could marry let me say 2,3,100,1000 wifes!!! (King Solomon(PBUH) had 700 wifes & Krishna(PBUH) had according to Hindu scriptures 16,000 wifes) There was no upper limit for Polygamy.Islam put an upper limit of four wifes, but only on the condition that he deals justly with them.

the quran says in chapter 4(Al-Nisa) Verse No. 3

[4:3]And if you fear that you will not be just in dealing with the orphans, then marry of other women as may be agreeable to you, two, or three, or four; and if you fear you will not be able to do justice, then marry only one or marry what your right hands possess. Thus it is more likely that you will not do injustice.

But in the same chapter(A-Nisa Verse No. 129) the quran says :

[4:129]And you will not be able to be fair regarding the women even if you make every effort; so do not sway too greatly and leave her as one hanging in a void. And if you reconcile and do right, then God is Forgiving, Merciful.

So the Holy quran discourages polygamy but allows it under very strict conditions, for example, additional marriages to the mothers of orphans, if it is in the best interest of the orphans.Or during wars, where more men are killed compared to women.But the biggest problem is that many people including Muslims are under the misconception that it is compulsory i.e. required by the rules for a Muslim man to have more than one wife.They misinterpret the rules to benefit themselves.Another thing to mention why Polygamy is still allowed, is the word female population, it outnumbers the male population.Now if even every man(including gays) got married to one woman, there would be still a number of Million females who wouldn't be able to get husbands.We all know that most women wouldn't like to share their husband with other women.Which husband would like to share his wife with other man ? But in Islam when the situation deems it really neccessary, a women in due to her faith could bear a small personal loss to prevent a greater loss of letting another woman becoming public properties(Nauzobillah sorry for using this term).In Western societies, it is nowadays common for many men to have a mistress or extramarital affairs, in which the woman leads a unprotected life(I know that there are many single mothers out there who are very powerful and can rais up their children alone, but still most of them have problems raising up their children without a father or a father figure). However the same society can't accept a man having more than one wife, in which the women leads a protected life.But again the holy quran discourages polygamy.It is not a must for a man to marry more than ONE woman, it is only allowed under very strict conditions...you'll not be able to be fair regarding the women even if you make every effort!

What I said about budda, you should know I have the same words about your claim that krishna is also a Prophet. What has been said about that topic has been said & if you don't remember then flick back to the pages.



The Qur'aan is interpreted according to how the Prophet explained it, or the Companions. And that knowledge passed on to us through the trustworthy chains of Knowledge. It is not for anyone to just pick up the Qur'aan & think the Qur'aan means this or that. It is knowledge which is taken from the sound chain so that no one goes astray.

The Verse that you mentioned actually refers to a man being unable to love each woman the same. This is not forbidden because it is out of his hand as mentioned in that Verse.

What the man has to be fair about is in the obligatory spending. For example food every day for each one, clothing suitable for each season (summer & winter) for every one, housing for each one, and some other things.



It is not a MUST for a man to marry at all. Marriage is a good thing for the one who needs it. It is not an obligation!

good good,thats what you think I have my own brain and can think for myself


OK so show us the interpretation of the Prophet(PBUH).

It seems like there are so many interpretations of islamic teachings, u got the Qu'ran, the hadiths, the imams, the sheikhs, the priests, the old and new scholars, the samsparkys and puns187, it's a good sign that this religion is evolving!

pun, it seems to me like you the one one getting things from your own imagination.

You were unable to mention any scholar like Imaam Shaafi^i , etc. who actually said what you said.

As for what you asked me about.

in shaa' Allaah i will come with more detail from a Hadeeth, saying of a Companion, or student of the Companions, etc.

It's just a matter of time in shaa' Allaah.

As for tangawizi, the Qu'ran and the hadiths are not different interpretations - they don't contradict. Neither do the sayings of the Companions or the famous mujtahid scholars.

To be on the right path you need to stick to them.

Havn't you heard the saying of the Prophet about his nation dividing into so many groups - all will go to hell & 1 to Paradise.

Why do you think so?

Obviously because they went so astray that they were only claiming that they were Muslim but they had strayed off the correct teachings.

first off Salaam to all my brothers and sisters of the clan. 2ndly i can't BELIEVE pun allowed me to forget about joining this clan. YOU SLIPPIN DUDE YOU SUPPOSED TO HAVE MY BACK REMEMBER lol I meant to join this clan 9 pages ago. And since i have now finally finished reading 11 pages worth of insight i have a few comments.....



this is the biggest fallacy i have read in these 11 pages. the Quran itself states.



therefore the Quran IS made for anyone to just pick up and read and understand it completely. where the problem comes in at is that people often do not want to put their OWN mental abilities to work and instead would rather rely on someone elses opinion as to what the Correct Interpretation™ of the Sura is.

also i keep noticing that everyone is posting all these passages about what this 'scholar' said and that 'scholar' said but no one has ONCE given any indication as to what makes a 'scholar' a 'scholar' or what credentials he is supposed to have to be considered as such. What about A. Guillaume and his book, "The Life of Prophet Muhammad" who wrote that Muhammad was told not to be the aggressor until he has gained a force strong enough an then he was 'commanded by Allah' to begin murdering and prosecuting Jews, Christians, and anyone who was not muslim.

Source

Is he considered a 'scholar' to you?? if not then why?? he has over 20 years of "Islamic" study and knowledge so surely he's qualifed to tell the correct interpretation of the Quran right?? See the only scholars you find acceptable are the ones that comply with what you believe. So anyone that does not is not a 'reputable scholar'. What about the scholars in the ME who say that the terrorism is justified thru the Quran and Hadith because 'that's the way Muhammad did it'. are they 'reputable scholars'???

Anything that you propose by your scholars MUST be verified THRU THE QURAN and ONLY the Quran. as stated in Sura 17:36



So simply believing your scholars because they have 'more experience' then you is a grave mistake.

Allaah gave Adam the knowledge of all the languages.

makes absolutely no sense...

It is not as they say that the first humans were cave people who communicated by actions and that fire was somehow discovered and bla bla bla - they say that because they want to say that they think we came from animals.

scientific studies have shown otherwise so unless you can prove that homo sapien superior existed before homo sapiens i would have to disagree with you.

If you want information on the logical refutation of such theories I can expand in shaa' Allaah.

please do because i want to hear this

They also did not resemble animals. They were not hairy!! The description of Prophet Adam is mentioned in Islamic references. He was much taller than humans now and Eve was created to suit his height. The people in Paradise will be in his height.

Well unless you can provide the Sura's which support this then i will have to go along with scientific knowledge that early humans WERE hairy.

I don't see in your reply the name of any famous Arab linguist who said that.

why are you so stuck on scholar's and linguists

And you can't deny the fact that it is mentioned in Islaam that Jinn are a type of creation that are made from fire - their father is satan.

Very true so therefore the definition of the word Jinn holds true for both you and Pun. However since it does apply to both most people use the term Djinn to describe demons and such.

It is mentioned by Prophet MuHammad that those who call themselves Muslim will be divided into more than 70 groups - only 1 will go to Paradise out of them - the mainstream.

Show something to support which sect of Islam is the 'mainstream'

Why?
Because the others went off the mainstream and stopped following the teachings of the Prophet, Companions, Mujtahid scholars and the trustworthy passers of knowledge.

and what makes a 'trustworthy passer of knowledge' if the Quran is so easily understood and written to be easily understood why do you need all these people to tell you what it says???

Muslims also refer to the traditions conveyed by prophet Muhammad called Sunnah which is also revelation.

The only Hadith that is to be followed is in the Quran not the Bukhari. Anything not written in the Quran is to be discarded and that is what is causing the break-up of Islam INTO sects. As the Quran stated would happen





So as you have stated out of the 73 prophesied sects of Islam the 1 'sect' that will enter heaven is the one that has broken away from 'sects' and follows the teaching of Allah as passed down for the Last and final Prophet of Islam the Prophet Muhammad(pbuh) that is why i do not belong to a sect and i follow the Quran and the Quran only as i was instructed by the Quran to do so. I don't need linguists and scholars and Imams or any of that because the Quran was written to be clearly understood.

The Muslims also refer to the unanimous agreement of the top Muslim scholars on religious issues. Ruling on new issues is established based on proofs given by Qur'an, Sunnah and consensus following a particular method for deducing judgments. Only individuals who are highly qualified may deduce judgments in Islam.

See once again needing someone to explain to you what is already clearly written and easily understood.

Had it been as you said then the Prophet would have just simply given the Qur'aan to the Companions and said nothing more about it.

However this was not the case. The Prophet taught the Companions the belief then taught them the Qur'aan. so that when they learnt the Qur'aan they understood it. -- proof for this - your gonna need to wait till I get home.

Who cares whether or not you think it makes sense. I rely on the Religious proofs and I know the proof that when Prophet Adam was created from the clay and the Angel was ordered to blow the soul into him, he sneezed and said "alHamdulillaah" -- proof coming later after I get home.



My belief is as the Qur'aan says and as the Prophet says. Adam was created from clay. His soul was blown into him by an Angel. He spoke and said "alHamdulillaah" - proof coming shortly.

As for the logical refutation of evolution, even scientists say it is just a theory. They have no base to work from because they disbelieve in Prophets so they try to guess. They tried to guess that apes and humans have a common ancestor. They can not prove it - the idea that a bent spine can change into a human spine is rejected which is why they are all hoping to find "the missing link" which a British scientist tried to fake a few decades ago. Many people have written about the faults in the evolution theory.



proof coming in shaa' Allaah. But don't forget that Hadeeth is also a trustworthy reference otherwise we would not know how to make the 5 Obligatory Prayers.



ummm because it's not like I'm a language expert who has written a dictionary. As if I'm going to take the word of some person on a forum who I don't even know if they try to tell me what they think a certain word could possibly mean. Just like people take the word of their oxford dictionary etc for english words, I take the word of a famous linguist who wrote a dictionary for Arabic.



The mainstream is not a sect. It is everyone who followed the teachings of the Qur'aan & Hadeeth as taken from the sound chain of Knowledge. This is a large amount of people and by far the majority. The proof is that on the Day of Judgement, the Muslims of all nations will be in 120 rows. 80 of those rows will be the Muslims of Prophet MuHammad's nation. Imagine that, all the Muslims from Prophet Adam's time to the time before Prophet MuHammad's revelation, they are all 40 rows and Prophet MuHammad's Muslim nation is double. Reference coming soon in shaa' Allaah.



Didn't you know that there are many Hadeeths explaining Ayahs of the Qur'aan?



We wouldn't have known how to Pray the Obligatory Prayers that are mentioned in the Qur'aan had it not been for the Prophet teaching us. That is Hadeeth.
And didn't you hear the Verse in the Qur'aan which mentions that the Prophet does not talk about Religion from his whims, rather it is Revelation. Verse Number and Surah coming soon.

Just a note to dismantle your argument even further: Was it not you that mentioned that some terrorists claim that the Qur'aan backs up their teachings?
They understood the Qur'aan the wrong way because they didn't stick to the chain of Knowledge.



Firstly, the scholars I'm referring to are not new. For example, Imaam Abu Haneefa died 150 years after Hijrah and many scholars similar to him lived within the first 300 years after Hijrah.

Secondly, that scholar must have acquired knowledge from the sound and trustworthy chain back to Prophet MuHammad. Just like how the Knowledge of the Hadeeth is acquired. And since I'm referring to scholars who lived within the first 300 Hijriyy years or close to that, I'm not asking the impossible - all you need to do is check the biography - who that scholar learnt from etc.

Thirdly, such scholars who acquired their Knowledge from the sound chain do not have rulings which contradict the Qur'aan or Hadeeth. Hence any ruling they have mentioned can be proven. Just ask me to show you where.

The Qur'aan and Hadeeth do not contradict each other. They are both a type of Revelation and they are not to be rejected. Don't think that the Companions were stupid. Just like they collected the Qur'aan and kept it for us and preserved the ways of recitation of it by passing that knowledge from generation to generation, the Knowledge of Hadeeth was also preserved.

and welcome to tha Clan ATL Im not the only outcast in this clan anymore
See I wrote about the Polygamy topic bc of a non-muslim member of our clan who is also a very good friend of mine ...Samsparky ruined it all she probaly thinks that we are crazy or something...I mean we as muslims as ummah can't live without having arguments with each other how can we live peacefully with non-muslims then...

@sweet well it took me close to an hour to write this, did you at least read it ???

subHaanallaah, I'm not here for the sake of arguing.

I'm just doing what the Prophet said to do. He advises us that if we see something wrong then we should fix it.

You need proof for that?

Who cares whether or not you think it makes sense. I rely on the Religious proofs and I know the proof that when Prophet Adam was created from the clay and the Angel was ordered to blow the soul into him, he sneezed and said "alHamdulillaah" -- proof coming later after I get home.

So instead of learning the translation of AlHamdulillaah which means by Allah's mercy. you see that and you automatically assume that the Prophet Adam (pbuh) spoke Arabic?? Even though the Arabic language that the Quran was written in did not actually come into being until around C.E. 2 and 2 of the first Semitic languages pre-dating Arabic was actually Akkadian and Canaanite. But you would automatically assume that a language that was not even invented was being used by the first prophet instead of a language pre-dating it or better yet a language created for the Prophet alone?? Ok i'll wait for the proof on that one

My belief is as the Qur'aan says and as the Prophet says. Adam was created from clay. His soul was blown into him by an Angel. He spoke and said "alHamdulillaah" - proof coming shortly.

it also says that the Prophet Isa (pbuh) and the Prophet Adam were created in the same way (3:59) and it still doesn't explain how you would think that the Prophet Adam spoke every language including a language that wasn't even in existance at the time of the Prophet Adam (pbuh)

As for the logical refutation of evolution, even scientists say it is just a theory. They have no base to work from because they disbelieve in Prophets so they try to guess. They tried to guess that apes and humans have a common ancestor. They can not prove it - the idea that a bent spine can change into a human spine is rejected which is why they are all hoping to find "the missing link" which a British scientist tried to fake a few decades ago. Many people have written about the faults in the evolution theory.

I never said man came from apes. i'm saying as the Quran states that man was created thru a series of steps and stages.



meaning that man was already evolving before the Prophet Adam (pbuh) was created. After man reached a point where he could finally begin to understand the teachings of the Prophets and the words of Allah the Prophet Adam (pbuh) was created to lead them. the Prophet Adam was the first human as we know this stage of human but since there were previous stages of human existence as quoted in the Quran an that we know thru scientific knowledge it is a fallacy to assume as the Christians do that Adam was the very first human.

proof coming in shaa' Allaah. But don't forget that Hadeeth is also a trustworthy reference otherwise we would not know how to make the 5 Obligatory Prayers.

I suggest you read Sura 5:6...



So why do i need the Hadeeth written 200 years after the death of the prophet to tell me something that's already in the Quran??

Yes some parts of the Hadeeth are trustworthy and useful. but out of the 9 volumes of the Bukhari Hadeeth only 30% can actually be verified thru the Quran. that means that the other 70% does not comply or is in direct contradiction to the teachings of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh).

ummm because it's not like I'm a language expert who has written a dictionary. As if I'm going to take the word of some person on a forum who I don't even know if they try to tell me what they think a certain word could possibly mean. Just like people take the word of their oxford dictionary etc for english words, I take the word of a famous linguist who wrote a dictionary for Arabic.

Yes and that's good but you only got part of what the word means as pertaining to a certain subject. namely demons and Shaytan but you did not know the complete meaning of the word which means more then just demons.

Source

and if you check out the source you will see all your favorite linguists there

The mainstream is not a sect. It is everyone who followed the teachings of the Qur'aan & Hadeeth as taken from the sound chain of Knowledge. This is a large amount of people and by far the majority. The proof is that on the Day of Judgement, the Muslims of all nations will be in 120 rows. 80 of those rows will be the Muslims of Prophet MuHammad's nation. Imagine that, all the Muslims from Prophet Adam's time to the time before Prophet MuHammad's revelation, they are all 40 rows and Prophet MuHammad's Muslim nation is double. Reference coming soon in shaa' Allaah.

But you just said earlier that out of the 73 prophesied sects of Islam that only 1 sect would enter heaven and that was the 'mainstream'. now your saying that 'mainstream' is actually not a sect at all. So please clarify because i'm getting confused. and once again you want to quote the Bukhari which talks about the 120 rows at the Day of Judgement. the same Bukhari which states that in Paradise each martyr will be 80 ft tall surrounded by 72 virgins right?? the same verse from the same Bukhari that terrorists use to justify their terroristic acts as they are becoming martyr's. Neither of which can be verified thru the Quran. Now i'm not saying that the Bukhari is to be completely disregarded ut you have to verify some parts of it and what you have stated about the day of Judgement cannot be verified therefore it cannot be believed.

Didn't you know that there are many Hadeeths explaining Ayahs of the Qur'aan?

of course they are part of the Authorative Hadeeth or Hadeeth that has been verified which is what i'm saying to you.

We wouldn't have known how to Pray the Obligatory Prayers that are mentioned in the Qur'aan had it not been for the Prophet teaching us. That is Hadeeth.

i know what Hadeeth is and as i pointed out earlier that how to pray is clearly spelled out for you in Sura 5:6 which is used to VERIFY the hadeeth of the Bukhari. but since Sura 5:6 is plainly written and easily understood as i said earlier the Bukhari is not needed.

And didn't you hear the Verse in the Qur'aan which mentions that the Prophet does not talk about Religion from his whims, rather it is Revelation. Verse Number and Surah coming soon.

yes there are many Sura's which show that the Prophet was given Revelation but i fail to see how this applies to the Bukhari being used when the Quran specifically states that it is not needed. Source1Source2

Just a note to dismantle your argument even further:

yea your dismantling my argument yet have not provided one Sura or anything else from the Quran to back up anything you've said. And all of your 'dismantling' is coming from a book that i've already shown you USING the Quran is not even supposed to be used in Islam

Was it not you that mentioned that some terrorists claim that the Qur'aan backs up their teachings? They understood the Qur'aan the wrong way because they didn't stick to the chain of Knowledge.

Uh....no they used the teaching of the Bukhari and when they couldn't verify it thru the Quran they used small parts of the Quran to justify the teachings of the Bukhari. which is why we have so many terrorists quoting the Bukhari and the only thing they can use to jusitify it is the first part of Sura 2:193 while disregarding the second part.

The Qur'aan and Hadeeth do not contradict each other.

Volume 9, Book 83, Number 17:
Narrated 'Abdullah:

Allah's Apostle said, "The blood of a Muslim who confesses that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that I am His Apostle, cannot be shed except in three cases: In Qisas for murder, a married person who commits illegal sexual intercourse and the one who reverts from Islam (apostate) and leaves the Muslims."

Sura 4:137
“Those who believe, then disbelieve, again believe and again disbelieve, then increase in disbelief, Allah will never forgive them nor guide them on the (right) way”

Sura 16:106
“He who disbelieves in Allah after having believed — not he who is compelled while his heart is at rest on account of faith, but he who opens his breast for disbelief — on these is the wrath of Allah, and they shall have a grievous punishment”

Sura 18:29
“Say: The truth is from your Lord; then whosoever wants to, let him believe; and whosoever wants to, let him disbelieve”

Sounds like a contradiction to me. The Bukhari says that all people that leave Islam should be killed yet the Quran as passed down from the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) says that any person has a right to leave Islam but that Allah will punish that person severely. I don't see anywhere in the Quran of the Prophet saying that an apostate should be killed. So unless you can find one then i have to assume that the Bukhari is once again wrong and in direct contradiction to the Quran.

So the Bukhari doesn't contradict the Quran huh?? Are you sure about that because i can show you many MANY more. in fact it has already been proven that out of the 9 volumes of the Bukhari only 30% of that is acutally verifiable thru the Quran. that means 70% of it is complete nonsense and competely goes against the teachings of Islam.

They are both a type of Revelation and they are not to be rejected.

Are you trying to tell me that you honestly believe the Bukhari was revealed 200 years after the Prophets death??

Don't think that the Companions were stupid. Just like they collected the Qur'aan and kept it for us and preserved the ways of recitation of it by passing that knowledge from generation to generation, the Knowledge of Hadeeth was also preserved.

And some of that 'passed down knowledge' is in direct contradiction and violation of the Quran. So if you are going to listen to you companions and Imams i suggest you verify what they tell you instead of believing it at face value as you do with the 120 rows and 80 columns deal

My point was to show you that he spoke right after he was created. Meaning that God created the knowledge in him. And who told you that the languages were invented by people? Clearly it is mentioned in the Qur'aan that Allaah gave Prophet Adam knowledge of the names of all things.

Sorat al-baqara ayah 31:

وَعَلَّمَ آدَمَ الأَسْمَاء كُلَّهَا
"wa ^allama 'aadamal 'asmaa'a kullahaa".

This Ayah means: [..... and Allah created in Adam the knowledge of the names of everything.]


And just to add a note, Allaah ordered that all things that happened since the beginning of the creations and that will happen until Judgement Day be written on the guarded tablet and that was before humans lived on the earth. The languages of all Divine Books (the 104) are written in the Guarded tablet. - proof coming soon.



Didn't you know that the similarity between Prophet Adam and Prophet Jesus is that Prophet Adam was created without a mother or a father and Prophet Jesus was created from a mother without a father.

QUOTE(ATL.com @ May 10 2006, 07:52 AM) [snapback]1835405[/snapback]

You gave 1 Verse:

وَقَدْ خَلَقَكُمْ أَطْوَاراً

Don't you know that the zygote goes through stages before the soul is blown into it? What makes your interpretation valid over mine?

Previous stages of human existence is not quoted in the Qur'aan.

To understand the Qur'aan correctly you need to learn it how the Prophet taught it.



يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ إِذَا قُمْتُمْ إِلَى الصَّلاةِ فاغْسِلُواْ وُجُوهَكُمْ وَأَيْدِيَكُمْ إِلَى الْمَرَافِقِ وَامْسَحُواْ بِرُؤُوسِكُمْ وَأَرْجُلَكُمْ إِلَى الْكَعْبَينِ وَإِن كُنتُمْ جُنُباً فَاطَّهَّرُواْ وَإِن كُنتُم مَّرْضَى أَوْ عَلَى سَفَرٍ أَوْ جَاء أَحَدٌ مَّنكُم مِّنَ الْغَائِطِ أَوْ لاَمَسْتُمُ النِّسَاء فَلَمْ تَجِدُواْ مَاء فَتَيَمَّمُواْ صَعِيداً طَيِّباً فَامْسَحُواْ بِوُجُوهِكُمْ وَأَيْدِيكُم مِّنْهُ مَا يُرِيدُ اللّهُ لِيَجْعَلَ عَلَيْكُم مِّنْ حَرَجٍ وَلَـكِن يُرِيدُ لِيُطَهَّرَكُمْ وَلِيُتِمَّ نِعْمَتَهُ عَلَيْكُمْ لَعَلَّكُمْ تَشْكُرُونَ

That Verse is about Purification for the Prayer. I asked for the actual structure of the Prayer which you will not find in the Qur'aan.

The Prophet's Hadeeth was preserved through the sound chains from trustworthy person to trustworthy person to teach us the format of the Prayer and the ways of reciting the Qur'aan.



Excuse me! Just because a ruling is not mentioned in the Qur'aan, such as the format of the Prayer, that does not mean that what is mentioned about it in the Hadeeth is a lie!! As I said, the Companions were not stupid, they loved Islaam & preserved it for us.



In Bukhaari there is not verses. Verses are in the Qur'aan. Bukhaariyy is one collection of Hadeeths of the Prophet. Terrorists are not limited to using the Hadeeth to support them, they also misinterpret Verses in the Qur'aan by using their "common knowledge of interpretation" and not sticking to what the great scholars and linguists said about the meanings of such Verses that they refer to. I will give you an example, when I get home in shaa' Allaah. But I stress and repeat that you can not reject the Hadeeths just because they are not mentioned in the Qur'aan because what the Prophet said about Religion is also a Revelation and it is precious and IT WAS PRESERVED as the Qur'aan was.

But for Hadeeth there are levels of classification - such as weak, Hasan & SaHeeh (which are both reliable), mutawaatir (which means it was obtained through tens of chains of narrators at each step of narration), etc.



Who said so? A. Muhammad the unreknowned linguist trying to teach us about the grammar. If you want to make a grammatical point don't just get me some person from the internet who we don't even know has studied Arabic grammar or not.


Is that so? then why would I be using the Verses of the Qur'aan in my posts if this book you have read that you are claiming I'm using discourages it.



Actually I have rarely heard terrorists quote Bukhaariyy. Terrorists such as sayyid qutb actually misinterpret Verses in the Qur'aan. There is 3 in particular and I will show you when I get home.



None of the other Verses contradict the Ruling, and neither does this one, but clarification is needed for you to understand. Blasphemy happens by the Destining of God as does good. But never in the Qur'aan does it tell the people that they have the right to blaspheme. In fact it calls the blasphemers as unjust slaves and that is in verses that are connected with the verses I will provide later, In the Qur'aan in Surat Al-Zomar ayah 7 Allaah says:
ولا يرضى لعباده الكفر
which means Allaah does not Order His slaves with blasphemy.

And from amongst the Prophet's names is "almaaHee" which means he came to get rid of blasphemy.

You pasted half a Verse and so you took the wrong meaning. I will paste the full Verse:

وَقُلِ الْحَقُّ مِن رَّبِّكُمْ فَمَن شَاء فَلْيُؤْمِن وَمَن شَاء فَلْيَكْفُرْ إِنَّا أَعْتَدْنَا لِلظَّالِمِينَ نَاراً أَحَاطَ بِهِمْ سُرَادِقُهَا وَإِن يَسْتَغِيثُوا يُغَاثُوا بِمَاء كَالْمُهْلِ يَشْوِي الْوُجُوهَ بِئْسَ الشَّرَابُ وَسَاءتْ مُرْتَفَقاً

In that Verse is used a threat. The slaves have their will which is under the Will of Allaah (as evidenced from Surat at-Takweer, 29) and in the Verse above it is mentioned that the ones who do unjust (by committing blasphemy - the worst sin), Hell is prepared for them.

In Surat Luqmaan, 13, Allaah informs us of LuQmaan’s advice to his son:

وَإِذْ قَالَ لُقْمَانُ لِابْنِهِ وَهُوَ يَعِظُهُ يَا بُنَيَّ لَا تُشْرِكْ بِاللَّهِ إِنَّ الشِّرْكَ لَظُلْمٌ عَظِيمٌ

It means: [Luqmaan said to his son “O my son! Do not associate partners with Allaah for it is extreme injustice.]

To end off I will say that the Prophet's sayings about Religion are REVELATION. They were preserved. They do not contradict the Qur'aan. Also, not everything that is in the Hadeeth is in the Qur'aan, e.g. the format of the 5 obligatory Prayers. The Prophet taught us it and it was preserved and it is essential for a Muslim to follow it.

Taken from “The Straight Route- A refutation of sayyid qutb and his follower faySal mawlawiyy”:

Introduction

The Salaf & Khalaf agreed that Islamic knowledge is not acquired by reading books, but by learning from a trustworthy, knowledgeable person who took his knowledge from one like him and so on back to the Companions.

{knowledge is not taken except from the mouths of the ^ulamaa’}

{Whoever takes the Hadeeth from books is called SuHufiyy (one who turns pages), & whoever takes the Qur’aan from the muS-Haf (the written manuscript of the Qur’aan) is called muS-Hafiyy (i.e. one who just reads it) and not a qualified reciter}

These statements were made by scholars who did take the Knowledge in this way such as the Haafiz Abu Bakr al-KhaTeeb al-Baghdaadiyy.

Their statements are inferred from the saying of the Prophet which means that:

{Whomever Allaah willed a lot of good things for, Allaah bestows upon him the Fiqh in the Religion; knowledge & understanding of Islaam is obtained by learning it.}

Related by at-Tabaraaniyy.

Among those people (each of which is a suHufiyy), is a man called sayyid qutb, who never kneeled before the ^ulamaa’ to learn, never read under them, and never smelled the fragrance of knowledge. At the outset he was a Marxist journalist. Then he joined the lines of the faction called “the Muslim brothers” in which he was given a high position among them. He embarked on writing; thereby he slipped & went astray.

He accuses of kufr everyone who rules by other than the Shar^ even if it were a small matter without any detail because he interprets the Verse 47 in Suratul Maa’idah literally, being ignorant of, or stickling the fact that the Salaf & those after them gave a ta’weel for this Verse. (ta’weel is assigning a meaning which is away from the apparent meaning of the text).

وَمَن لَّمْ يَحْكُم بِمَا أَنزَلَ اللّهُ فَأُوْلَـئِكَ هُمُ الْفَاسِقُونَ

The ta’weel was confirmed about Ibn ^Abbaas (cousin of the Prophet and explainer of the Qur’aan), and el-Baraa’ Ibn ^Aazib.

Al-Qurtubiyy in his book “Al-Jaami^ li AHkaam-il-Qur’aan”, vol 6 pp 190-191, explaining the Verse, that {all of them were revealed concerning the non-Muslims. This was confirmed in “SaHeeH Muslim” through the Hadeeth of Baraa’. Most scholars have the same explanation.

It is said that the Verse has ellipsis (the omission of a word or words necessary for the complete syntactical construction of a sentence nut not necessary for understanding it, e.g. saying “stop laughing” instead of “you stop laughing”.)

Whoever does not rule by what Allaah revealed, rejecting the Qur’aan & renouncing the saying of the Messenger of Allaah is a blasphemer. This was said by Ibn ^Abbaas & Mujaahid. However, whoever did that ruling believing that he was committing a sin, is a sinner and not a blasphemer.

My point was to show you that he spoke right after he was created. Meaning that God created the knowledge in him. And who told you that the languages were invented by people? Clearly it is mentioned in the Qur'aan that Allaah gave Prophet Adam knowledge of the names of all things.

That's not what you said earlier. You said that he was given knowledge of all languages. Yet Arabic was not around during the time of the Prophet Adam (pbuh). However the Quran was written in Arabic so it's only natural that him saying alHamdulillaah which means by Allah's mercy he would not have said it in Arabic because Arabic was not around.

This Ayah means: [..... and Allah created in Adam the knowledge of the names of everything.]

Ok...what does that have to do with anything??? in that Sura the angels didn't want Allah to create the Prophet Adam because they thought he would be corrupt and when Allah created Adam he imparted in him the name of all things then brought him before the angels so that he may recite them. When the angel saw that the Prophet Adam didn't lie they praised Allah for his wisdom in creating him. What does that have to do with anything????

And just to add a note, Allaah ordered that all things that happened since the beginning of the creations and that will happen until Judgement Day be written on the guarded tablet and that was before humans lived on the earth. The languages of all Divine Books (the 104) are written in the Guarded tablet. - proof coming soon.

I already know about the Guarded Tablet dude. It's held and guarded by Allah and if YOU remember the spoken text of the Guarded tablet is the Quran. So i fail to see how this applies to anything we are talking about. and once again you say, 'proof coming soon'. But what are you proving???

Don't you know that the zygote goes through stages before the soul is blown into it? What makes your interpretation valid over mine?

easy because my interpretation follows scientific knowledge of how a human being went from homo habilis to homo sapien. your interpretation says that man just 'appeared' out of nowhere. You are saying that when we are first born we have no soul until a certain amount of time passes. so unless you can prove when the soul enters the body then i have no choice but to say your interpretation is wrong. All your doing is given atheists and critics more fuel for the fire to show how Islam is nothing more then Christianity with a new name.

Previous stages of human existence is not quoted in the Qur'aan.

That because you rely on others to tell you what is clearly shown in the Quran. As you already know, the Quran says that Allah created both all animals and mankind from water (24:45/25:54), and that is where evolution started according to theory. In other places is said that man is created from the ground of the earth (23:12, and earth is where all we eat is coming from, that way also producing sperm for us and animals, and everything else in growth and what we are, in fact it can not mean anything else, as 37:11 is speaking about all humans created from clay in general level, not just about Adam, and Adam is not neither excluded from creation according to the Quran by “nutfah”, semen, too), so either there is contradiction (which is not possible because we know the Quran is without contradiction) or man was created from all (water, clay, semen). Well, many say that Allah "shaped" man from both water and clay with His "hands", but can we take it so literally (as many Christians do but in Quran and hadiths we can not)? Would that not happen even if Allah started our evolution "shaping" from water through other animals to two-legged animals, then to earlier human beings, then to modern human through (genetically engineered and changed, leap of evolution) sperm of this earlier human species (Neanderthals?), into molt and shape of nowadays humans (steps and stages as evidenced in Sura 71:14).

Didn't you know that the similarity between Prophet Adam and Prophet Jesus is that Prophet Adam was created without a mother or a father and Prophet Jesus was created from a mother without a father.

3:59 "The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him: "Be". And he was.

that is not a similitude so sorry but once again your interpretation is incorrect. If Jesus (and his seed/embryo) was created into the womb of a woman (Mary) by saying "Be", so in what womb of what human species was Adam created? The Quran does not state that Adam did not have a father and mother. It merely says that Allah created him in the same fashion that the Prophet Jesus (pbuh) was created. Meaning without a father...THAT is a similitude. It could be that this "from ground of the earth" meant that semen drop that grows from what someone got from food (Allah made him to eat by "Be", and so created, and in 86:6-7 said that semen is developed between backbone and ribs, from food in stomach), then grew as (body of) Adam. “Similitude” can only mean that, as Allah has created everything else also by word “Be”, so only reason for mentioning it can only be evolution really, in fact 38:72 says that when Allah created Adam He “breathed” His spirit into him (notice that according to 2:34 immediate command to bow down after that “breathing” in 38:72 happened only after Adam was told name of things, so maybe his spirit was created before he came to earth in human body, explaining how according to the Bible the Prophet Jesus (pbuh) said he was before Abraham was on Earth) , which can be seen as one thing making the difference between modern humans and earlier humans/animals, maybe it is mostly the capability to believe in Allah that was given to the first modern human coming from the womb of an earlier human (leap of evolution).

To understand the Qur'aan correctly you need to learn it how the Prophet taught it.

how the Prophet taught it is right there in the Quran spelled out plain an simple. But instead of using your own mind you are relying on someone else's hand-me-downs

That Verse is about Purification for the Prayer. I asked for the actual structure of the Prayer which you will not find in the Qur'aan.

Because the 'actual structure' is not needed. We do the structure for the prayers out of RESPECT for the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) because that is the way he did it so that is the way we do it. But it's out of respect not MANDATE. it's not mandatory.



The Prophet's Hadeeth was preserved through the sound chains from trustworthy person to trustworthy person to teach us the format of the Prayer and the ways of reciting the Qur'aan.

Ok...I'm not saying they weren't i'm saying most of the Bukahari is not justifiable. The Hadeeth are guidelines not scriptures so to base them on the same level as the Quran is not right since the majority of the Bukhari hadeeth is wrong.

Excuse me! Just because a ruling is not mentioned in the Qur'aan, such as the format of the Prayer, that does not mean that what is mentioned about it in the Hadeeth is a lie!! As I said, the Companions were not stupid, they loved Islaam & preserved it for us.

I didn't say they were a lie i said they could not be verified. To verify the format of prayer is all well and good out of respect for the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) but it is not mandatory.

In Bukhaari there is not verses. Verses are in the Qur'aan. Bukhaariyy is one collection of Hadeeths of the Prophet.

So now you want to try to get technical

Terrorists are not limited to using the Hadeeth to support them, they also misinterpret Verses in the Qur'aan by using their "common knowledge of interpretation" and not sticking to what the great scholars and linguists said about the meanings of such Verses that they refer to.

No they are not they are using THEIR scholars who are telling them that that is what the Quran and the Bukhari says. According to their scholars a women is required to be clothed from head to toe. Where in the Quran does it say that??? Just because your scholars are not theirs is irrelevant. Half of your scholars DIED hundreds of years ago.

I will give you an example, when I get home in shaa' Allaah. But I stress and repeat that you can not reject the Hadeeths just because they are not mentioned in the Qur'aan because what the Prophet said about Religion is also a Revelation and it is precious and IT WAS PRESERVED as the Qur'aan was.

still dismantling my arguments with the 'when i get home i'll show you proof' defense huh?? How is it you seem to have all this time to find all of my Quran quotes and post some of your own but you can't seem to find the time to find the proof of all your claims. you can't seem to find the time to find these 600 A.D. linguists showing how the Bukhari is mandatory

But for Hadeeth there are levels of classification - such as weak, Hasan & SaHeeh (which are both reliable), mutawaatir (which means it was obtained through tens of chains of narrators at each step of narration), etc.

What does this have to do with the fact that the Bukhari has contradictions in it???

Who said so? A. Muhammad the unreknowned linguist trying to teach us about the grammar. If you want to make a grammatical point don't just get me some person from the internet who we don't even know has studied Arabic grammar or not.

You haven't given one quote from all your linguists showing that the Bukhari Hadeeth is a mandatory book to be followed. but yet you continually ask everyone else to do so. How about your follow your own advice.

Is that so? then why would I be using the Verses of the Qur'aan in my posts if this book you have read that you are claiming I'm using discourages it.

you haven't quoted anything. The 1st quote you made in your last reply had nothing to do with the topic. the next 2 were just you reposting MY quotes in Arabic. And the last 3, once again, had nothing to do with the topic. I showed you where the Bukhari says that anyone who converts from Islam is to be killed then showed you that the Quran says that a person is allowed to convert if he chooses, that religion can not be forced on someone, and that if the Quran says that Allah will punish a convert why does the Bukhari say kill them. YOU on the other hand posted 3 quotes showing Allah doesn't like blasphemy. Blasphemy is not Apostasy, they are 2 totally different things. so what was the point of your quotes???

Actually I have rarely heard terrorists quote Bukhaariyy. Terrorists such as sayyid qutb actually misinterpret Verses in the Qur'aan. There is 3 in particular and I will show you when I get home.

None of the other Verses contradict the Ruling, and neither does this one, but clarification is needed for you to understand. Blasphemy happens by the Destining of God as does good.

No, YOU don't understand i'm not talking about blasphemy i'm talking about apostasy

blas·phe·my ( P ) Pronunciation Key (blsf-m)
n. pl. blas·phe·mies

a. A contemptuous or profane act, utterance, or writing concerning God or a sacred entity.
b. The act of claiming for oneself the attributes and rights of God.

a·pos·ta·sy ( P ) Pronunciation Key (-pst-s)
n. pl. a·pos·ta·sies

a. Abandonment of one's religious faith, a political party, one's principles, or a cause.

To end off I will say that the Prophet's sayings about Religion are REVELATION. They were preserved. They do not contradict the Qur'aan. Also, not everything that is in the Hadeeth is in the Qur'aan, e.g. the format of the 5 obligatory Prayers. The Prophet taught us it and it was preserved and it is essential for a Muslim to follow it.

Essential does not mean mandatory. The Hadeeth was not a revelation it is the saying and teachings of the Prophet. The only revelations were written down in the Quran. Some of them are valid and some of them are not. I suggest you do your research.

laa Hawla walaa quwwata il-laa billaah

So alhamdulillaah you agree that Prophet Adam spoke after he was created.

Sorat al-baqara ayah 31:

وَعَلَّمَ آدَمَ الأَسْمَاء كُلَّهَا
"wa ^allama 'aadamal 'asmaa'a kullahaa".

This Ayah means: [..... and Allah created in Adam the knowledge of the names of everything.]

That was to show you that Prophet Adam knew what things were called, i.e. LANGUAGE.

The languages of all Divine Books (the 104) are written in the Guarded tablet. - proof:

The Prophet said what means: {Allaah Existed Eternally & nothing else existed....He ordered the High Pen to write on the Guarded Tablet what happened since the beginning of the creations and that will happen until Judgement Day, then He created the skies and the earths.} Related by Bukhaariyy.

So before the skies & earths were created, all what was going to happen on this earth was written on the Guarded Tablet. And among the things that happened is the Revelations of the Divine Books - one of which is the Qur'aan in the Arabic language. So the Arabic language was in existence before the skies & earths were created. I am yet to bring you proof that Prophet Adam was given the knowledge of all the languages - but don't worry I will in shaa' Allaah.

NEXT POINT:

The Angels do not object to Allaah & do not doubt God's wisdom.

Surat at-TaHreem, Ayah 6:

لا يَعْصُونَ اللَّهَ مَا أَمَرَهُمْ وَيَفْعَلُونَ مَا يُؤْمَرُونَ
Which means: [They do not disobey Allah in what He orders them (to do), and they do exactly what they were ordered.]

NEXT POINT:

You said: "easy because my interpretation follows scientific knowledge of how a human being went from homo habilis to homo sapien. your interpretation says that man just 'appeared' out of nowhere."

ok then, I tell you that its not possible for a bent spine to change to a human one and you tell me you don't believe we came from apes. Did I say that scientists say we came from apes? Actually they say we came from something in between apes and humans - which is why they are still so desperate to find the missing link that they claim exists. My "interpretation" is as the Prophet says and as the Qur'aan says - that we were all created from 1 person & from that person was created its partner.

Clearly that refers to Prophet Adam.

NEXT POINT:

God has the Power to bring things from non-existence into existence. That is an Attribute of Godhood & only God is Attributed with it.

Surat FaaTir, Verse 3: [No one is the Creator except Allaah.]

NEXT POINT:

You said: "You are saying that when we are first born we have no soul until a certain amount of time passes. so unless you can prove when the soul enters the body then i have no choice but to say your interpretation is wrong."

I'm saying that???? The soul is blown into the foetus when it is in the mother's womb. It is blown in by the Angel in charge of that. Do you want proof for that?

NEXT POINT:

You said: "All your doing is given atheists and critics more fuel for the fire to show how Islam is nothing more then Christianity with a new name"

Wrong. christianity is a Religion that came as a result of straying from Prophet Jesus's teachings.

In the Qur'aan in Surat al-FaatiHa, the christians are referred to as 'ad-Daal-leen' which means the ones who strayed. They began saying that Jesus is the son of God and hence they became astray. However they do still have some concepts like Prophet Adam being the first human correct from what Prophet Jesus taught them. We know that because Prophet Jesus taught them the same as Prophet MuHammad and the only difference were some rules for example about the format of Praying. But they changed much of the teachings after Prophet Jesus was lifted to the sky.

NEXT POINT:

subHaanallaah, not only living things are created from water. Even non-living things are created from water. How do we know? Because when we know that all living things are created from water, we know that consequently it follows that every non-living thing is created from water. why? Because which is more complex? The living things or the non-living? Surely the living. Hence, if all the living things are created from water, all non-living things are also created from water.

Moreover, it is mentioned in the Qur'aan that we are created FROM water not IN water. Whereas scientific theory says that there was some kind of a mixture of chemicals like nitrogen, etc, bla bla bla and lightening & I don't know what and they only were able to prove that such conditions could produce amino acids. That's it!! Then they went on to postulate that somehow these amino acids got together with some other things to form anaerobic cells (not even animals - more like bacteria). And as usual they went on to postulate far and wide and try to say that somehow these cells became into more complex forms and eventually became the animals and humans etc.

Absolute nonsense. No basis for it in the Qur'aan whatsoever especially since it contradicts the belief of Muslims.

Prophet MuHammad said what means: {Every Prophet Allaah sent had a nice face and a nice voice.} (Related by Imaam AHmad).

Hence, Prophet Adam did in no way resemble an animal - especially not an ape.

Another point is: Jinn and Angels are also created from water - as all living things are. Angels are also created from light & jinn from the pure flame of fire. Are you going to make up some theory of evolution for them too?

NEXT POINT:

Prophet Adam was created in Paradise from the different soils of the earth. His body was created before his soul was blown in, then the Angel blew the soul into Prophet Adam's body.

NEXT POINT:

The Verse in the Qur'aan about the ease with which God creates things is not to be taken literally. The meaning is not that God speaks with letters and sounds and spends the whole day saying be be be. It's blasphemy to believe that. Had God's Speech been letters and sounds He would have been the slowest Judge - but we know that Allah is the fastest Judge. - do you want proof for that?

So, the Qur'aan's meaning is taken through the chains of knowledge back to the Prophet & Companions.

NEXT POINT:

God is not a spirit - He isn't attributed with spirit - that is a creation of His and God does not resemble the creations. The soul of Prophet Jesus is attributed to God meaning that He is its Creator & it is a respected soul - NOT that it is a piece of God or that God is pieces or even a body. And when it says that God blew the soul of Adam into him, it means God ordered the Angel to blow the soul into him. God is not attributed with body parts. See that's where many people slip and fall when they read the Qur'aan on their own without a teacher who learnt it from the sound chain of Knowledge. If you interpret every single Verse according to your initial inclination towards the apparent meaning, I definitely have Verses to show you that must be interpreted using ta'weel (dismissal of the apparent meaning). In other words sometimes it's a metaphor or figure of speech - how would you even know all this stuff if u didnt learn it. But maybe people like you prefer to stay ignorant and call things metaphors only when they feel like it.

NEXT POINT:

How many times do i need to repeaaaaaaaaaaaat to you.

Prophet MuHammad didn't just give the Companions the Qur'aan and say good bye. Prophet MuHammad used to explain it to them.

Ibn Maajah narrated from Jundub ibn ^Abdillaah that he said what means:

{We were with the Prophet when we were young, we learnt the belief before we learnt the Qur'aan, then we learnt the Qur'aan and hence increased in belief in it.}

This was also classified as SaHeeH by Haafiz alBooseeriyy in "MisbaaH alZujaajah".

So you see, the Prophet didn't just give them the Qur'aan, he also gave them the Hadeeth.

NEXT POINT:

you said: "the structure of the Prayer is not mandatory".

That does not make sense at all. If someone according to you wanted only to do the madatory things, then his prayer would have no structure??? What kind of a Prayer is that?

Clearly in the Qur'aan it is mentioned that the ones who do not Pray on time are in danger of torture. (Surat al-Maa^oon, 4-5).

Hence praying is an obligation. And since there is no such thing as a structureless Prayer, then the structure of the Prayer is also an obligation. And how would the people know when the times of Prayer are exactly so that they do not delay them and become in danger of torture as mentioned in the Verses above??

They gotta learn it from the Prophet's sayings and doings.

It's obligatory so they don't get tortured in Hellfire.

And I think you failed to see this in the Verse you posted:

وَأَقَامَ الصَّلاةَ

Salaat is Prayers if you didn't know.

NEXT POINT:

Listen, if you admit that the chains to the sayings of the Prophet were preserved then any insult you make to those sayings is an insult to the Prophet.

Look at Surat an-Najm, 3-4.

What the Prophet says about Religion is from Revelation - not from himself.

Stop calling the Prophet's words lies.

NEXT POINT:

In the Qur'aan there is an Ayah of Hijaab - I'm suprised you havn't heard of it.

It was Revealed when women who were not covering their neck and chest properly - they were showing the skin there. So that Verse orders them to cover their neck and chest by putting the material of the Hijaab over or in the opening of their clothes from the neck area. You want me to get the Verse?

NEXT POINT:

I actually did post my example after I got home - didn't you read it?

Had you read it you would have realised that sayyid qutb (terrorist) was no student of any scholar - he was a book reader and a page turner. He read the Qur'aan by himself, misunderstood it, and became a terrorist.

People need a teacher to keep them from going astray and if that teacher is Prophet MuHammad, a student of Prophet MuHammad, or a student of the student of Prophet MuHammad then you are surely on the straight path. AlHamdulillaah my scholars are present in every era because they don't stop passing the knowledge from one to the other.

NEXT POINT:

If a saying of the Prophet related by al-Bukhaariyy is classed as mutawaatir (can you remember what that means?) then no one can deny that the Prophet said it. Hence, it is an obligation to follow it. Similar to SaHeeH & Hasan Hadeeth. But weak Hadeeth is different. If in a Weak Hadeeth, it is said that the Prophet told us to do something THEN it is optional to do it.

NEXT POINT:

apostasy is blaspheming after having been a believer. Hence, apostasy is a type of blasphemy. Hence, the Verses about blasphemy that I posted apply.

The second thing is that didn't you know that some Punishments are mentioned in the Qur'aan to be carried out under Islamic Law, eventhough the punishment in the Hereafter is also mentioned for such sins.

And don't forget what I said:

Blasphemy happens by the Destining of God as does good. But never in the Qur'aan does it tell the people that they have the right to blaspheme. In fact it calls the blasphemers as unjust slaves.

In the Qur'aan in Surat Al-Zomar ayah 7 Allaah says:
ولا يرضى لعباده الكفر
which means Allaah does not Order His slaves with blasphemy.

And from amongst the Prophet's names is "almaaHee" which means he came to get rid of blasphemy.

You pasted half a Verse and so you took the wrong meaning. I will paste the full Verse:

وَقُلِ الْحَقُّ مِن رَّبِّكُمْ فَمَن شَاء فَلْيُؤْمِن وَمَن شَاء فَلْيَكْفُرْ إِنَّا أَعْتَدْنَا لِلظَّالِمِينَ نَاراً أَحَاطَ بِهِمْ سُرَادِقُهَا وَإِن يَسْتَغِيثُوا يُغَاثُوا بِمَاء كَالْمُهْلِ يَشْوِي الْوُجُوهَ بِئْسَ الشَّرَابُ وَسَاءتْ مُرْتَفَقاً

In that Verse is used a threat. The slaves have their will which is under the Will of Allaah (as evidenced from Surat at-Takweer, 29) and in the Verse above it is mentioned that the ones who do unjust (by committing blasphemy - the worst sin), Hell is prepared for them.

In Surat Luqmaan, 13, Allaah informs us of LuQmaan’s advice to his son:

وَإِذْ قَالَ لُقْمَانُ لِابْنِهِ وَهُوَ يَعِظُهُ يَا بُنَيَّ لَا تُشْرِكْ بِاللَّهِ إِنَّ الشِّرْكَ لَظُلْمٌ عَظِيمٌ

It means: [Luqmaan said to his son “O my son! Do not associate partners with Allaah for it is extreme injustice.]

LAST POINT:

Essential means obligatory, required, etc. get your thesaurus out.

SubHanallah

@ ATL... i wonder why student ranging from primary till university needs lectures and teachers to help them out with their subjects?.. why isnt it not enough for the students to just go and read text books and learn the stuff on their own and analysis the information on their own without any help from teachers or learnt people of that field?.. why is it that medical students needs experinced and learnt doctors to teach them medical stuff? why isnt it not enough for the medical students to just go and read the medical book and do what they 'think' is right?

concerning religion which is the most crucial part of a muslim's life.. isnt it important for us to ask people who r learnt, knowledgable and trust worthy in Islam?.. the reason why u have all these new and unfamiliar ideas about Adam( peace be upon him) and other matter in Islam. is that u analysis the Quran and other aspect of the religion on ur own....u r not suppose to do that.. u can not analysis the Quran based on ur whimps and desires and what u 'THINK' is right or wrong...just like the medical students if they were left to analysis the medical books on their own without help from trusted and learnt doctors then these students will definatly have different or wrong answers since they r basing their answers on what they ' THINK' is right and not what is 'really' right.

and in Islam.. we have to obey the Prophet its a must its not optional.. and Islam isnt about picking and chooisng what we want and leaving out the things which we do not know the wisdom behind ... as Muslim we have Submitted and surrended ourself to Allah... so whatever Allah and His Messengers say we hear and we obey.

and bro,.. dnt talk about Islam based on ur whimps and wat u 'think' is right... coz Allah is going to ask u later about the things u uttered and u will be held accountable for it.....and plz watch wat u say about we evolving from apes and what have u... dats wat happens when u try and interpret the Quran from ur own thoughts and ideas without clearly understanding the true menaing of the verses in the Quran.

and i have seen SAMSPARKY saying ' proof coming soon or i will show u when i get home' often

this is becoz she does NOT want to say anything wrong concerning Islam.. coz Insha Allah she is well aware of the fact that it is vital when one talks about Islam is always based on facts and not what she THINKS or WANTS to say...dats why i noticed that if she doesnt know something she doenst make up stuff rather she admits that she doesnt know the answer at that moment but would go back to it once she has founded proof from authentic hadith and Quran.

and Allah knows best... and may Allah forgive me for my faults.. Ameen

SubHanallah

@ ATL... i wonder why student ranging from primary till university needs lectures and teachers to help them out with their subjects?.. why isnt it not enough for the students to just go and read text books and learn the stuff on their own and analysis the information on their own without any help from teachers or learnt people of that field?.. why is it that medical students needs experinced and learnt doctors to teach them medical stuff? why isnt it not enough for the medical students to just go and read the medical book and do what they 'think' is right?

When did i ever say that you shouldn't rely on teachers. all i said was VERIFY what you are told and don't just believe. THAT'S ALL!! you need to read before you jump down my throat!!

concerning religion which is the most crucial part of a muslim's life.. isnt it important for us to ask people who r learnt, knowledgable and trust worthy in Islam?.. the reason why u have all these new and unfamiliar ideas about Adam( peace be upon him) and other matter in Islam. is that u analysis the Quran and other aspect of the religion on ur own....u r not suppose to do that.. u can not analysis the Quran based on ur whimps and desires and what u 'THINK' is right or wrong...just like the medical students if they were left to analysis the medical books on their own without help from trusted and learnt doctors then these students will definatly have different or wrong answers since they r basing their answers on what they ' THINK' is right and not what is 'really' right.

Once again read what i just said earlier...i do have teachers. in fact i have quite a few. So i guess you are another one who doesn't believe in evolution??

and in Islam.. we have to obey the Prophet its a must its not optional.. and Islam isnt about picking and chooisng what we want and leaving out the things which we do not know the wisdom behind ... as Muslim we have Submitted and surrended ourself to Allah... so whatever Allah and His Messengers say we hear and we obey.

once AGAIN, when did i ever say we shouldn't???

and bro,.. dnt talk about Islam based on ur whimps and wat u 'think' is right... coz Allah is going to ask u later about the things u uttered and u will be held accountable for it.....and plz watch wat u say about we evolving from apes and what have u... dats wat happens when u try and interpret the Quran from ur own thoughts and ideas without clearly understanding the true menaing of the verses in the Quran.

i never said we evolved from apes, i said humans evolved...THAT'S ALL. The Quran does not state we evolved from apes it says we evolved. AND i got that interpretation from one of my teachers. it's one of the scientific accuracies of the Quran that proves it's authentic. but of course ya'll are saying we were just created so hey what do i know.

and i have seen SAMSPARKY saying ' proof coming soon or i will show u when i get home' often

this is becoz she does NOT want to say anything wrong concerning Islam.. coz Insha Allah she is well aware of the fact that it is vital when one talks about Islam is always based on facts and not what she THINKS or WANTS to say...dats why i noticed that if she doesnt know something she doenst make up stuff rather she admits that she doesnt know the answer at that moment but would go back to it once she has founded proof from authentic hadith and Quran.

and after 4 days she still has not found anything to back up what she has said but continues to say, 'proof coming soon'. which is why i brought it to her attention....READ DUDE!!! have you actually READ her previous post. The Quran states that Allah created all humans and animals from water. THAT'S WHAT I SAID. so what does she post.

Moreover, it is mentioned in the Qur'aan that we are created FROM water not IN water

Who said they were created IN water?? i didn't so why the correction. why the tirade about scientific theory of evolution from amino acids to people?? or how about this nice little piece of non-sense

not only living things are created from water. Even non-living things are created from water

So since you want to come to her rescue maybe you can find proof of that in the Quran or the Hadeeth. Show me where iron is made out of water. or gold, or rocks or sand. Come on dude. or how about this lovely piece of knowledge

Another point is: Jinn and Angels are also created from water

I'm sure either you or her can find the evidence in the Quran that supports that right?? Even though the Quran states that the Jinn were created from fire and Angels from light.

So in closing how about you actually READ what i said an then READ her replies which have absolutely NOTHING to do with anything i posted then you can post your comments about things i have said. Never ONCE did i insult the Companions, never ONCE did i insult the Prophet, never ONCE did i say we shouldn't follow Hadeeth ALL I SAID WAS VERIFY THE INFORMATION YOU ARE GIVEN!!!! which she obviously has not done.





and Allah knows best... and may Allah forgive me for my faults.. Ameen

Ameen

atl, you keep saying stuff then saying you didn't say it - so don't worry gula jawa it happened to me too.

NEXT POINT:

The verifications that people must make is whether or not the Prophet truly said a certain thing. This verification is made through study of the science of Hadeeth. e.g. weak Hadeeths, mutawaatir Hadeeths etc.

In those Hadeeths is often interpretaions of Verses.

So if different people are coming with different things, then somewhere along the line, one of that person's teachers went off on their own and didn't stick to the chain of knowledge - then consequently passed on their own thing onto their students.

I know all my teachers teachers up to the chain of the 6 books - and the 6 books have their own well-known chains. So alHamdulillaah I verified my sources as coming from the Prophet's passing down of Knowledge.

......to be continued in shaa' Allaah

@ATL no need to argue about the creation of human beings and Adam(PBUH), I did it 9 pages ago and backed up my intertpretaion with Ayas from the Holy quran,Im still waiting for the Ayas, which should back up her interpretation...but well.Áll she came up was that Eve (Peace be upon her) gave birth to twins, and then two more twins...and then the twins gave birth to twins and so on.

to pun:

surat an-Nisaa', ayah 1 tells us that God created us from a single person and from that person his wife.

Pun said:

“Adam(PBUH) was not the 1st man on earth,according to Islam!!! Quran shows us that human beings were in existence before Hadhrat Adam(PBUH)!”

He claims that these are jinn, however:

You have no proof at all that the word jinn in the Qur’aan refers to human beings rather that the actual jinn made of fire – the father of whom is satan.

He said: “Adam was not in Paradise!!!”

No proof that the word jannah in verses which refer to Prophet Adam do not mean Paradise.

He keeps on posting verses and then making his own interpretation that no one has ever thought of or heard of.

That doesn’t count as proof.

I will repeat my proof again:

surat an-Nisaa', ayah 1 tells us that God created us from a single person and from that person his wife.

continuation of reply to atl:

1)

You claim that the Qur'aan says we evolved. I don't believe in the faulty scientific theory.

Evolve can mean change - as the baby develops in its mother's womb.

The accuracy of the Qur'aan is not measured by what scientists discover or fail to discover. It is based on the authentic chains and on the events that is has foretold of.

2)

I think you are failing to realise that when I do get home each day alHamdulillaah I put in the proof for the ones I have and that I think are most essential to drive the point home.

If you are feeling a lack of proof just ask and I'll be happy to copy and paste.

Everything was created from water.

Proof:

A Hadeeth related by Ibn Hibbaan means: <<Everything was created from water. >>

So Verse 30 of Suratul Ambiyaa’ actually means that Allaah created every living (and non-living thing) from water.

The reason:

1 is the Hadeeth above.

2 is because We know that every living thing is created from water from Verse 30 of Suratul Ambiyaa’.

Including Angels & Jinn and animals and humans because they are all living.

Living things are more complex than non-living things. So if living things are created from water, it follows that non-living things must also be created from water.

Note that this is not backed by thought alone:

A Hadeeth related by Ibn Hibbaan means: <<Everything was created from water. >>

(testing if repetition works )

Chapter 71(Nooh) Verse 15
And He has created you in different forms and different conditions.






7: 20. But satan made evil suggestions to them so that he might make known to them what was hidden from them of their shame and said, `Your Lord has only forbidden you this tree, lest you become angels or lest you become of the immortals.'

So my dear sister samsparky does Satan have some control in Paradise. He seduced Adam and Eve.If it was Paradise then Satan can still seduce the souls in Heaven...you got the point ?



I already told you what i think about this Verse



Btw Im still waiting for an answer...you maybe remember the twins theory of your scholars.

Ah wait A Newsflash for you:

Similarities between mouse and human genes range from about 70% to 90%...

That is a close relationship, isn't it ??? And don't forget to read about the Gorillas and apes too.


Jinns(devils) are made out of fire how can they be maid out of WATER ???

pun said: "Chapter 71(Nooh) Verse 15, And He has created you in different forms and different conditions"

I say: humans are in different forms and conditions. Nothing got to do with evolution.

pun said: "read Sura Al-A`raf ayat 12 :And We did create you and then We gave you shape: then said We to the angels, 'Submit to Adam""

I say: that's not a proof of evolution. Prophet Adam was given shape out of clay, and the Angels were ordered to salute him. In Arabic, it is valid to adress 1 person using a plural term and that is to show the greatness of the addressed. You want a proof for that?

Also, in Arabic thumma ("then" according to you) can also mean "and" and I've definitely got proof for that. You want it?

Paradise is the reward of the Believers - it is in body and soul - just as the torture in Hellfire is in body & soul.

The proof that the torture in Hell is in body and soul is that the blasphemer's skin will be replaced each time so he can feel the pain. Want more proof? More detail?

pun said: "The quran says that Hadhrat Adam(PBUH) and his ppl went out of the garden (which again, according to the Quran was a region of the earth and is not to be confused with Paradise"

I say: no proof

satan has a will which is under the will of God. Just like all of us. (Surat at-takweer, 29).

In the Hereafter, satan will be in hell being tortured & no where near Paradise and its people.

want proof?

NEXT POINT:

يَا أَيُّهَا النَّاسُ اتَّقُواْ رَبَّكُمُ الَّذِي خَلَقَكُم مِّن نَّفْسٍ وَاحِدَةٍ وَخَلَقَ مِنْهَا زَوْجَهَا وَبَثَّ مِنْهُمَا رِجَالاً كَثِيراً وَنِسَاء
surat an-Nisaa', ayah 1 tells us that God created us from a single person and from that person his wife and from them many men and women.

Adam & Eve weren't created from a single soul. Adam was created first. Then Eve was created from one of his ribs. want proof?

NEXT POINT:

Every creation that is alive has a soul. Animals & humans have souls. Angels have souls. That is why the Angel of death comes to take the soul - like hello. want proof for that too?

NEXT POINT:

Similarities between animals - one of the reasons is that all living things are created from water.

Surat al-Ambiyaa', 30:
waja^alna mina alma-i koulla chay-in hayy

EVERYTHING LIVING WAS CREATED FROM WATER !!!!!!!!!

So, we also know humans were created from soil so it means soil & water, Angels from light - so light & water. etc.

Just because you can't imagine a jinn made of fire - being created from water at the same time, it doesn't mean it didn't happen. I bet you can't even imagine how satan (created from fire) would be tortured in it. Well think about this: If I throw a handful of soil onto you, I can cause you great pain. But we know all humans are created from it.

So don't be hasty.

Animals have souls ? you got this from your scholars too ???
So you think that animals will be judged for their "Good/Bad deeds" too ??? they will be rewarded
today science has proved that Plants have got life, they are also "alive" do they have a soul too ??? Im extremly sorry for my laughing...Pls give me a proof, that animals and all other living creatures got a soul!!!

And yes I know that God Almighty didn't create Eve separately from Adam(PBUH) but created her from his rib as is said in the Holy Quran
[4:2] And from it He created its mate

that is to say, that God created Eve(PBUH) as Adam's mate from the being of Adam(PBUH) so that Adam's relationship to her should be natural and not artificial!

btw don't ask me if you should give me proof or not,just give us the proof dammit...

Animals and all living things have souls - that is why when they die, the Angel of death takes their soul.

The criterion for the life of a creation is its soul being in its body.

However, the criterion for the accountability of something which is alive is the "^aql" - it's usually referred to as the understanding or something like that. It differentiates us from animals. We are accountable but animals aren't.

plants are not alive - they grow but they are not considered as alive like animals are. plants don't have a soul.

I keep asking you if you want the proof to check that you really want it. Because you know it takes me time to search and I want to know whether or not you need that particular proof or not.

OK so what will happen to their souls ? will they go to Heaven ? I mean they aren't accountable for their actions,they should! Proofs pls...

*blows self up*

*calls an ambulance*

ok, animals will definitely be assembled on Judgement Day. Proof:

Surat at-Takweer, Verse 5

وَإِذَا الْوُحُوشُ حُشِرَتْ

Surat at-Takweer is about Judgement Day.

al-Haakim related from the route of Abdullaah ibn ^Umar that the Prophet said what means:

{Those who want to imagine the day of Judgement, I advise them to read Surat at-Takweer.}

This particular Verse refers to the animals being assembled after being resurrected.

They will be resurrected and the animal that had horns and headbutted one without horns in this life will be headbutted by that other animal on Judgement Day. Then they will both turn into dust. (I just need some time to get the reference for that - sorry).

But that is why on Judgement day the kaafir will wish he also turned into dust so that he may escape torture.

(Surat an-Naba', Verse 40) إِنَّا أَنذَرْنَاكُمْ عَذَاباً قَرِيباً يَوْمَ يَنظُرُ الْمَرْءُ مَا قَدَّمَتْ يَدَاهُ وَيَقُولُ الْكَافِرُ يَا لَيْتَنِي كُنتُ تُرَاباً

Suarah Al'Takwir (81)

[81:4]"And when the mountains are made to move."

This Verse is a prophecy, a fullfilled prophecy, it is about the invention of dynamite, the holy Quran prophecied the blowing up and moving of the mountains! It has nothing to do with animal souls!

[81:5]"And when the she-camels, ten months pregnant are abandoned."

again a prophecy, as we'll know that people, especially those who live in deserts, have now abandoned camels and other animals for travelling. But this prophecy of invention and emergence of new transport systems is ongoing as you can see tha newer and faster modes of transportation are emerging all the time. This Verse has nothing to do with animal souls!

[81:6]And when the wild beasts are gathered together."

yeah guess what ? again a prophecy, ts about ZOOs wild beasts are captured, tamed and put together in closed/open parks.Its a fulfilled prophecy, again nothing to do with animal souls!

[81:7]"and when the rivers are made to flow into each other."

This is a very phenomenal prophecy and an excellent proof of the truthfulness of the Holy Quran.It was beyond imagination of any one living in Prophet Muhammad's(PBUH) time, that the oceans will be linked togheter, today we can see the linking of oceans, like the Panama and Suez canal. No animal soul!

I can go on if you want, this Surah is full with prophecies but i can't see where it says that animals got souls.

subHaanallaah,

al-Haakim related from the route of Abdullaah ibn ^Umar that the Prophet said what means:

{Those who want to imagine the day of Judgement, I advise them to read Surat at-Takweer.}

So I interpret Surat at-Takweer how the Prophet explained it. The Prophet said it refers to events that will take place on Judgement Day as shown by the Hadeeth above.

As for Verse 4 in that Surah, it refers to when on Judgement Day, the mountains that are standing are turned into a state level with the ground. This happens to indicate the severity of consequence on that day.

Proof:

Ibn ^Abbaas, cousin of the Prophet said about Verse 88, Surat an-Naml, that it refers to what happens on Judgement Day:

وَتَرَى الْجِبَالَ تَحْسَبُهَا جَامِدَةً وَهِيَ تَمُرُّ مَرَّ السَّحَابِ

Which refers to the mountains that will become like dust on Judgement Day.

Verse 5 mentions the female camel that is pregnant & at a particular stage where it is very valuable to its owners. The owners usually look after it a lot in this time but because of the Greatness of Judgement Day, they will even be too busy to think about it.

I currently don't have a Companion's saying about this interpretation - but then again neither do you. What I have is that the Prophet said that Surat at-Takweer is about what happens on Judgement Day.

As for the proof I wanted to get before, here it is:

Sahih Moslim:

[ 2582 ] حدثنا يحيى بن أيوب وقتيبة وابن حجر قالوا : حدثنا إسماعيل يعنون بن جعفر عن العلاء عن أبيه عن أبي هريرة أن رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم قال لتؤدن الحقوق إلى أهلها يوم القيامة حتى يقاد للشاة الجلحاء من الشاة القرناء

Sunn Altrmizi:

[ 2420 ] حدثنا قتيبة حدثنا عبد العزيز بن محمد عن العلاء بن عبد الرحمن عن أبيه عن أبي هريرة أن رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم قال لتؤدن الحقوق إلى أهلها حتى يقاد للشاة الجلحاء من الشاة القرناء وفي الباب عن أبي ذر وعبد الله بن أنيس قال أبو عيسى وحديث أبي هريرة حديث حسن صحيح

In short, the Prophet said what means: {The people will get their right on Judgement Day, to the extent that the animal without horns in this life who got headbutted by an animal with horns, will be given horns to headbutt that animal that headbutted it.}

Most folks have no misconceptions about the rules on Polygramy in the Qu'ran. The issue is that the social conditions which existed in the time of the Prophet (pbuh) have changed. Nowadays, if you live in a peaceful and prosperous nation, your mothers, sisters, aunts and wives probably have their own careers and financial independence.

In the eyes of these women, polygamy is neither an ideal nor fair. It belittles their position as a woman with equal status in society.

Of course, if your womenfolk lived in dire straits, war-torn and chaotic nation, with no hope of a career nor financial independence, they may as well hope that a rich and powerful warlord will take care of their needs and those of their offsprings.

Basically, legalised polygamy is obsolete in a prosperous and peaceful society where men and women are granted opportunities for financial independence. If resources are shared abundantly between men and women, there is no need for religious explanation to explain why legalised polygamy should still exist and still be a fair deal to the women..

my two cent's worth



How do you fix it is the question.

Do you rely on dogmas to crush your opponents? Or do you express and share your differences in such a way so that both sides may come away with more respect and a sense of wonder and realization that there are myraid paths that all lead to the same end?


We don't need proofs from u or any Gods or religious leaders .. instead, we just want a sense of solidarity in our respective ceaseless search for salvation, paradise, self-realization , enlightenment, etc. whatever u wanna call as your ultimate destination.

Allaah our Creator Knows more about us than we know about ourselves.

The Rules He Orders us to follow are fair and just.


We know that all Prophets, from Prophet Adam to Prophet MuHammad taught the same things relating to belief - but from one Messenger to the next some rules did change BY REVELATION to the next Messenger.

Prophet MuHammad is the final Prophet.

The rules he taught us apply until the Day of Judgment.

Had it been otherwise, then learning the Knowledge of the Religion would not have been ranked so high in importance. Rather each person would have gone off on their own and made their own rules up.

Who is anyone to say that their "common sense" is correct and the Rules of the Religion are wrong?

What is that person's opinion worth if it goes against the words of the Prophet who does not give rulings from his desires but gives them from Revelation.

(Surat an-Najm, 3-4)

وَمَا يَنطِقُ عَنِ الْهَوَى

إِنْ هُوَ إِلَّا وَحْيٌ يُوحَى

Sighz sammy, i wish we can engage in a normal conversation instead of parroting lines ad nauseum

take care, and have a nice weekend!

It is an honour to recite the Verses of the Qur'aan & the sayings of the Prophet.

walHamdulillaah.

And I would have said that the weekend is over

well I was bored, so i took this online religion test http://quizfarm.com/test.php?q_id=10907 donno how accurate it is...take this test sam, ok ?

this is my result...

Islam:98%
Buddhism:71%
Judaism:50%
Paganism:42% what...blah
Satanism:21%
Christianity:21%
Hinduism:17%
agnosticism:13%
atheism:0%

You scored as Islam.

Your beliefs are most similar to those of Islam. Do more research on Islam and possibly consider taking the shahadah and officially becoming a Muslim, if you aren't already. Despite the actions of some - who go against the teachings of Islam - Islam is a religion of peace; the word "islam" means "peace through submission to God." "Muslim" means "one who submits to God." Islam is the third of the three Abrahamic faiths, and it shares much with Judaism in Christianity; its differences are the acceptance of Muhammad as the last and final prophet, and the oneness of God - in other words, that Jesus, though he was a revered prophet, was not in fact God, and only one God exists. Apparently the Taliban could not read (though their name means "students"), because the Qur'an states that men and women are equal as believers, and that all believers should be educated and seek knowledge. Modesty in dress and behavior is required in Islam for both men and women to preserve the values of society and move the emphasis from superificial appearance to intelligence, knowledge, and God.

Islam 100%
Judaism 58%
Buddhism 54%
Christianity 33%
Paganism 25%
Satanism 17%
Hinduism 13%
agnosticism 0%
atheism 0%

Just a note:

Prophet Ibraaheem (Abraham) was Muslim as all Prophets were. They all had the Islamic creed. The only difference was in some Rules such as those concerning Prayers.

Just in case anyone got confused by the term "Abrahamic faiths".

And I will take the test as a test of the makers of the test


subHaanallaah I can't do the quiz because of some questions.

The statements some of them - the beginning is correct and the other part is not.

And some of them have the wrong concepts such as about destiny.

The concept contradicts the Verse - Surat at-Takweer, 29 which means: {You do not will anything except by the Will of Allaah.}

Meaning that the slave has a will but that will is under the Eternal Will of Allaah.

Imaam Ali said what means: [Destiny is a matter between 2 matters - not jabr (without a will) and not tafweed (having a will that is not under the Will of God).]

Digging deep is not going to get you anywhere closer to this matter as it is like imagining the point in time before Allaah created both light and darkness.

(it is mentioned in the Qur'aan that both light & darkness are creations (Surat al-Anbiyaa', 33)and that only God is without a beginning (Surat al-Hadeed, 3). But our mind can not picture the time when both light & darkness did not exist because our mind is limited to what it is used to.)

More details can be found amongst the following posts:
http://talkaboutislam.com/forums/index.php/topic,4770.0.html

ahm...whatever you say...

Assalamualaikum.

It seems even after my long hibernation, an Islamic society is created in AF. Sounds good.

Alas, after reading the long posts, I only see sparring practices between samsparky & pun187.

Arent't this thread supposed to teach others especially other Muslims & non-muslim forummers the real meaning of Islam?

What creed should we apply for this approach, the Ahlus-Sunnah-Wal-Jamaah (Sunni) or Shiah (Shiite) or other 'sects' such as Ahmadiyya?

The 'holier-than-thou' attitude can only led us to become taqabbur, may Allah spare us.

As a new member to the clan, I strongly suggest we used the Sunnah approach, whose practically made-up more than 4/5 of Muslim population of the world today.

Shiite opinions can be tolerated but other 'sects' such as Qadian or Ahmadiyya cannot be taken seriously.

Wassalam.

Assalamualaikum forummers,

Below are top site for Islamic references from the web for both Muslims & non-Muslims. Some even have their own forum boards to discuss Islam in details.

Ummah Website


Islam 101

Islam Online

IslamiCity.com

For non-Muslims, below are introductory sites regarding Islam:

Islam in Wikipedia

BBC: Religions & Ethics - Islam


Last but not least, my own favourite Islam-based website:

The True Religion


Below is an article I founda on the abovementioned website & shed light to Islamic contribution to the world in various fields.

Well done, Proto! About time...

wa 3alaikom assalaam

Just a note - Ahlus-Sunnah-Wal-Jamaah actually refers to all people who followed the ways of Islaam according to the chains of knowledge - this can also include some who call themselves shia and it can also disinclude some who call themselves sunni.

Also an important link:

http://www.aicp.org/IslamicInformation/Eng...UFICLAIMERS.htm

You have some nice inventions info

maa shaa' Allaah

But - I think instead of the word sphere about the earth, it's better to use round - because that's the reality, the earth is actually more like a football shape.

Don't believe me? ask the physicists

My shaykh told me that before my physics teacher did alHamdulillaah.

6 Characteristics of Islam

1. al-Rabbaniyah -> Recognition of God

2. al-Syumul -> Perfect or complete

3. al-Wasatiyyah -> Moderation

4. al-Waqieyyah -> Reality

5. al-Thabat wa al-Murunah -> Fixity and flexibility

6. al-Ijabiyyah -> 2 ways interaction

Beneficial Information: The Will of Allaah is the attribute by which Allaah specifies the intellectual possibilities (the creations) with their attributes.

NOTE: Allah’s eternal kalam (meaning His Attribute), is WITHOUT instruments, letters, languages, sounds, a beginning or an end and it is not imagined.

The Book revealed to Prophet MuHammad, which might also be referred to as kalaamullaah, is in the Arabic language and is made of letters and words.

The Speech (Kalaam) of Allaah which is His Attribute is eternal, i.e., it has no beginning, just like all the other attributes of Allaah.

It does not have a beginning or an ending.

It is not created and is not a letter, sound, or language.

It is not letters which occur sequentially.

The Speech of Allaah is not similar to the speech of the creation.

The eternal Speech (Kalaam) of Allaah can be referred to as ‘the Qur’aan’.

The word ‘the Qur’aan’ can also refer to the terms revealed to Prophet MuHammad صلى الله عليه وسلم that are in the Book of the Qur’aan. These Arabic terms are created.



Because these terms are expressions referring to the eternal Speech of Allaah, they are also called ‘the Qur’aan’ even though, beyond doubt, these terms are created.

To make it more clear, if someone wrote the word ‘Allaah’ on a chalkboard and was asked what it was he wrote, he would answer, ‘Allaah’. His response does not mean those letters he wrote, i.e., the A, L, L, Aa, and H are God (Allaah). Rather he means that this term is an expression referring to God – Allaah, Who does not resemble anything. Likewise, the terms revealed to Prophet MuHammad صلى الله عليه وسلم are expressions referring to the Speech of Allaah, His Attribute.

Both the Attribute and the revealed expressions are referred to as the ‘Speech of Allaah’ and both are referred to as ‘the Qur’aan’.



It is NOT permissible for one to believe that the Speech of Allaah, which is the Attribute of Allaah, the Speech which Prophet Musa عليه السلام understood, is a language—Arabic or otherwise. Such a belief is a misguidance, because it entails likening Allaah to the creatures (creations).

Allaah is absolutely unlike all the creations in His Reality, in His Attributes, and in His Actions, e.g. Creating.

“Whatever you imagine in your mind, Allaah is different from it.”

"مَهْمَا تَصَوَّرْتَ بِبَالِكَ فَاللهُ بِخِلاَفِ ذَلِكَ"

Proof that the word “Qur’aan” or “Kalaam of Allaah” can be used to mean the Revealed Expressions:







Allaah, subHaanahu wa ta^aalaa, is greatly clear of all the non-befitting attributes that the blasphemers attribute to Him.

subHaanahu means tanzeeh, i.e., we declare that Allaah is clear of all non-befitting attributes.

Ta^aalaa also means tanzeeh and is a reconfirmation of the same meaning.

Allaah is greatly clear of all the non-befitting attributes that the blasphemers attribute to Him.

ISLAM HADHARI - HADHARATUL ISLAMIYYAH - CIVILISATIONAL ISLAM

[i]THE CONCEPT OF ISLAM HADHARI [/i]

A concept that comes from Malaysian Prime Minister, Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi that currently being put to practice in Malaysia & becomes the backbone of OIC's new set of standard & principles to be implemented as model Islamic way of the future.
Content

Islam Hadhari is an approach that emphasizes development, consistent with the tenets of Islam and focused on enhancing the quality of life. It aims to achieve this via the mastery of knowledge and the development of the individual and the nation; the implementation of a dynamic economic, trading and financial system; an integrated and balanced development that creates a knowledgeable and pious people who hold to noble values and are honest, trustworthy, and prepared to take on global challengers.

Islam Hadhari is not a new religion. It is not a new teaching nor is it a new mazhab (denomination). Islam Hadhari is an effort to bring the Ummah back to basics, back to the Fundamentals, as prescribed in the Quran and the Hadith that form the foundation of Islamic civilization. If Islam Hadhari is interpreted sincerely and understood clearly, it will not cause Muslims to deviate from the true path.

As a government that is responsible for ensuring Muslims are able to meet current challenges without deviating from their faith, the doors of ijtihad must remain open, so that interpreatations are suited to the developmental needs of the prevailing time and conditions. Policies must be balanced and broad-based development that encompasses the infrastructure and the economy; human resource development via a comprehensive education programme; the inculcation of noble values through spiritual development and assimilation of Islamic values.



Islam Hadhari aims to achieve ten main principles:

-Faith and piety in Allah
-A just and trustworthy government
-A free and independent People
-Mastery of knowledge
-Balanced and comprehensive economic development
-A good quality of life
-Protection of the rights of minority groups and women
-Cultural and moral integrity
-Safeguarding the environment
-Strong defenses


These principles have been formulated to ensure that the implementation and approach does not cause anxiety among any group in our multiracial and multireligious country. These principles have been devised to empower Muslims to face the global challenges of today.

Islam Hadhari is complete and comprehensive, with an emphasis on the development of the economy and civilization, capable of building the Ummah’s competitiveness. The glorious heritage of Islamic civilization in all aspects must be used as reference and become the source of inspiration for society to prosper.

A change in mindset among the Ummah requires action that is encompassing, drastic and systematic, irregardless of sector or partisan loyalty. It requires society to change their tasawwur (worldview). Consistent with this, the concept of life as service to God and the concept of work as worship, humans as caliphs and the obligation to seek strength in every aspect of life must be accentuated, in particular, the objective of maqasid al Syariah which seeks to safeguard, dignify and empower religion, intellect, life, property and progeny.

A consistent effort to ensure lasting success must be prepared. Any thinking that confuses and is inconsistent with Islamic beliefs must be rejected in order to allow the Ummah resilience and thought to be built. A change in attitude and culture requires ijtihad and jihad (struggle). The concept of jihad must be given a broader interpretation, covering all aspects of life, including the pursuit of knowledge, the mastery of science and technology and economic activity. This improvement in quality (itqan) must become part of our culture. Ijtihad that can build the Ummah in the modern day must be acknowledged.

Society must be given Islamic understanding that enables the appreciation and provides the ability to inherit a vision of a global civilization, in order to be more successful global players. As a strategy to improve competitiveness, the spirit of brotherhood and sisterhood (ukhuwah Islamiah) must be inculcated and expanded to create a strong social network. Society must appreciate self- sufficiency and reduce dependence on others. Negative traits and values must be changed to accommodate the values of the tasawwur.

The Ummah must be a society that embraces knowledge, skills and expertise in order to build capacity. Islam makes it compulsory for Muslims to embrace knowledge in all fields. The misconception that there exists a difference between socalled secular knowledge and religious knowledge must be corrected. Islam demands the mastery of science and technology and the enhancement of skills and expertise. Many verses in the Quran that touch on the need to master science and technology should be studied. All Muslim students should be aware of Islam’s contribution to science and technology that brought about the birth of the Renaissance in Europe. Initiatives to produce more Muslim scientists who are capable of making new discoveries must be intensified.

Life on this Earth ia a journey that requires us to discharge our responsibilities to society in an honest, transparent and trustworthy manner. Mankid will not fully benefit from this life if their attitude and worldview is not as it should be; because Allah created Man to be leaders on Earth . It is therefore imperative for mankind to arm itself with knowledge and with skills, to enable them to succeed.

It is important for the Ummah to be guided in understanding and practicing Islam as a comprehensive way of life as a means to building a civilization. A wholesome way of life will create the balance between our responsibilities in this world and the Hereafter. Islam is not merely a ritual, because ritualism is meant solely for the Hereafter. The Government has never practiced secularism that rejects the Hereafter and focuses solely on worldly matters. Islam must be lived as a system that integrates the worldly life and preparations for the Day of judgment.



“But seek, with that (wealth) which Allah has bestowed upon you, the home of the Hereafter; and forget not your portion of lawful enjoyment in this world; and do good as Allah has been good to you, and seek not mishief in the land. Verily, Allah likes not the Mufsidun (those who commit great crimes and sins, oppressors, tyrants, mischief makers, corrupters.)” (Al Qasas : 77)

One question to protoculture,

Do you know what a mujtahid is?

a person whose ijtihaad is valid right?

But I mean the prerequisites by which a person would be considered as a mujtahid.

Do you know them?

"A person who applied ijtihad was called a mujtahid, and traditionally had to be a scholar of Islamic law or alim." (Taken from Wikipedia)

- That is the most Muslims viewed a mujtahid, particularly should be alim Ulama' (religious scholars). However, a real mujtahid meanings nowadays should also include Umara' (political leaders, head of Govt., ministers) that also well-versed in Islam & at the same time developing his/her nation / ummah towards development & prosperity.



More or less, yes.



By rights, refer to the above 1st post. The main criteria, that person MUST have sound knowledge of Islamic jurispudence, as mujtahids will always make important legal decision for the betterment of the Ummah. Liberal Muslims nowadays argued that ANY Muslims can become mujtahids, however without proper knowledge of Islamic jurispudence, any decision taken by such a persons can be argued & literally discarded.

One of the real mujtahid in 20th century was an Egyptian Ulama', Hassan Al-Banna. He was known for even preaching Islamic virtues even at coffeshops, city streets or gambling dens. Masha Allah, how many ulamas would even do that nowadays.