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Asia Finest Discussion Forum > Asian Culture > Indonesian Chat > Indonesian Serious Talk
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Actualight
Surat Bukti Kewarganegaraan RI (SBKRI)
This is not talking about discrimination topic but something about a contradiction law.
Allow me to ask about this?
How an Indonesian prove that he / she is an Indonesian?
By face, by birthplace, by skin color, by KTP, by birth certificate, by lenght of time his or his ancestor stay....By SKBRI?
Who has SKBRI? The Arab, Indian, Melayu, Chinese, Jawa, Sunda, Batak, Papua....
I heard only Chinese has SKBRI. And my conclusion is, only the Chinese are real Indonesian because they are the only one that has SKBRI. After all only a written paper can be shown to prove something.
Not done yet...
Allow me to ask this again...
Who issue the SKBRI?
Please continue....
Nusantara
QUOTE(Actualight @ Apr 16 2006, 12:23 PM) [snapback]1757034[/snapback]

Surat Bukti Kewarganegaraan RI (SBKRI)
This is not talking about discrimination topic but something about a contradiction law.
Allow me to ask about this?
How an Indonesian prove that he / she is an Indonesian?
By face, by birthplace, by skin color, by KTP, by birth certificate, by lenght of time his or his ancestor stay....By SKBRI?
Who has SKBRI? The Arab, Indian, Melayu, Chinese, Jawa, Sunda, Batak, Papua....
I heard only Chinese has SKBRI. And my conclusion is, only the Chinese are real Indonesian because they are the only one that has SKBRI. After all only a written paper can be shown to prove something.
Not done yet...
Allow me to ask this again...
Who issue the SKBRI?
Please continue....


Indonesia prove his Indonesian by birth certificate, and parent ID i guess. because when you apply for KTP they are asking your birth certificate and family card.

I thought SBKRI already abolished since Habibie becoming president. Btw since there are no more Soeharto in power who forced Chinese using Indonesian name. Chinese Indonesian should change back their name into Chinese name, so Indonesian will start tolerate learning diversity and acknowledge the difference.

Actualight
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 18 2006, 10:09 AM) [snapback]1762387[/snapback]

Indonesia prove his Indonesian by birth certificate, and parent ID i guess. because when you apply for KTP they are asking your birth certificate and family card.

I thought SBKRI already abolished since Habibie becoming president. Btw since there are no more Soeharto in power who forced Chinese using Indonesian name. Chinese Indonesian should change back their name into Chinese name, so Indonesian will start tolerate learning diversity and acknowledge the difference.


Thank you for your answer.
If a law imposed, Chinese MUST change back to their Chinese name.
It will be a big Harvest season again for the people who used to issue SKBRI.
May be not them anymore but their descendant.

However, Chinese are prouder to use Indonesian name. You think so?


QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 18 2006, 10:09 AM) [snapback]1762387[/snapback]

Indonesia prove his Indonesian by birth certificate, and parent ID i guess. because when you apply for KTP they are asking your birth certificate and family card.

I thought SBKRI already abolished since Habibie becoming president. Btw since there are no more Soeharto in power who forced Chinese using Indonesian name. Chinese Indonesian should change back their name into Chinese name, so Indonesian will start tolerate learning diversity and acknowledge the difference.


NUSANTARA,
I think Jawa , sunda , batak don't have family card, do they?
rasibiduk
QUOTE(Actualight @ Apr 18 2006, 10:17 AM) [snapback]1763850[/snapback]

Thank you for your answer.
If a law imposed, Chinese MUST change back to their Chinese name.
It will be a big Harvest season again for the people who used to issue SKBRI.
May be not them anymore but their descendant.

However, Chinese are prouder to use Indonesian name. You think so?
NUSANTARA,
I think Jawa , sunda , batak don't have family card, do they?


I thought everyone must show Kartu Keluarga to apply for KTP..
Nusantara
QUOTE(Actualight @ Apr 18 2006, 10:17 AM) [snapback]1763850[/snapback]

Thank you for your answer.
If a law imposed, Chinese MUST change back to their Chinese name.


I totally agree with you for chinese must change back to their chinese name.

btw, every family in Indonesia have family card.
purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 18 2006, 09:24 PM) [snapback]1765572[/snapback]

I totally agree with you for chinese must change back to their chinese name.



Let people choose their own names freely! Nobody has the right to force names on others!
Mangafan2
ID might help you out
Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 19 2006, 03:22 AM) [snapback]1766291[/snapback]

Let people choose their own names freely! Nobody has the right to force names on others!


Soeharto encouraged chinese using Indonesian name, since no one force any chinese to use Indonesian name anymore chinese now freely can use back their own name.
Actualight
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 18 2006, 10:09 AM) [snapback]1762387[/snapback]

Indonesia prove his Indonesian by birth certificate, and parent ID i guess. because when you apply for KTP they are asking your birth certificate and family card.

I thought SBKRI already abolished since Habibie becoming president. Btw since there are no more Soeharto in power who forced Chinese using Indonesian name. Chinese Indonesian should change back their name into Chinese name, so Indonesian will start tolerate learning diversity and acknowledge the difference.


Kompas. Page 24. Thrusday, 20 April 2006.
SKBRI is still being enforced in Surabaya.
Nusantara
QUOTE(Actualight @ Apr 20 2006, 09:34 PM) [snapback]1771918[/snapback]

Kompas. Page 24. Thrusday, 20 April 2006.
SKBRI is still being enforced in Surabaya.


Is SKBRI It mean you have to use Indonesian name?

So Chinese in Java not live merry happily together with Indos in Kampung. Purnomor told me so.
purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 20 2006, 08:29 PM) [snapback]1771739[/snapback]

Soeharto encouraged chinese using Indonesian name, since no one force any chinese to use Indonesian name anymore chinese now freely can use back their own name.


Unfortunately many Chinese do not have any Chinese name. Whether they want to "go back" to use their Chinese name or keep their Indonesian name is none of your business.
Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 20 2006, 10:54 PM) [snapback]1772061[/snapback]

Unfortunately many Chinese do not have any Chinese name. Whether they want to "go back" to use their Chinese name or keep their Indonesian name is none of your business.


Didn't you say you are 100% chinese? How you say you are 100% if you are still using others name and even others name for the last name? Care to explain? Ohh its none my business??

purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 20 2006, 11:00 PM) [snapback]1772073[/snapback]

Didn't you say you are 100% chinese? How you say you are 100% if you are still using others name and even others name for the last name? Care to explain? Ohh its none my business??


I use the name my parents gave me. You have a problem with that?
Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 20 2006, 11:05 PM) [snapback]1772087[/snapback]

I use the name my parents gave me. You have a problem with that?


Destiny of your life in your hand not in someone else hand
You do know why chinese in Kalimantan and Riau more respected by mostly still using their name, they use Indonesian name sometimes but majority still chinese. Because people realize that is the difference and respect the differentness.

You are not chameleon right? changing colors, use javanese when it is good for you and saying you are chinese at other time when it is benefit for you. Trust me, That's not goof for you.

No I don't have problem with your name, if you like it, why not?
LaoShare
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 20 2006, 09:19 PM) [snapback]1772109[/snapback]

You are not chameleon right?


Chinese in Indonesia changed their name for survival.
Respect was the lasting in their mind.

If I decide to live in Indonesia, I would really consider "chameleon challenge".

Why not?
I would bake myself silly if that is the only way to avoid anti-Chinese-riots.

The benefits are endless. beerchug.gif

Thank you for bringing it up!
purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 20 2006, 11:19 PM) [snapback]1772109[/snapback]


You do know why chinese in Kalimantan and Riau more respected by mostly still using their name, they use Indonesian name sometimes but majority still chinese. Because people realize that is the difference and respect the differentness.


Another of your silly fantasy, there are heaps of Chindos living in Java using Chinese names, while majority of Chindos living in Sumatera/Kalimantan use Indonesian names.

QUOTE
You are not chameleon right? changing colors, use javanese when it is good for you and saying you are chinese at other time when it is benefit for you. Trust me, That's not goof for you.

No I don't have problem with your name, if you like it, why not?


Chindos took Indonesian names because there was a law in 1967 that obliged us to take Indonesian names. If you think following a law is a "chameleon" act, you've gotta be crazy.
Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 21 2006, 12:43 AM) [snapback]1772303[/snapback]

Another of your silly fantasy, there are heaps of Chindos living in Java using Chinese names, while majority of Chindos living in Sumatera/Kalimantan use Indonesian names.

Chindos took Indonesian names because there was a law in 1967 that obliged us to take Indonesian names. If you think following a law is a "chameleon" act, you've gotta be crazy.


You just contradicting yourself look at your first paragraph and second paragraph.

Can you explain why Kwik Kian Gie, Alvian Lie using their chinese last name if the law obliged them to do so why they were not change their name? Didnt you say previously that your parent gave that name to you? Now why you bring about 1967 law? Didn't Habibie and the Megawati abolished about discriminiation against chinese? Now 100% chinese can freely use their chinese name.

Btw chindo are confusing term it could be related to mix, For pure chinese like you better use chinese Indonesian to make it clear.

No chinese in Riau and West Kalimantan still using 3 word chinese name, their parents even barely speak Bahasa. Where were you born? where do you live telling silly fantasy?
Nusantara
QUOTE(LaoShare @ Apr 21 2006, 12:09 AM) [snapback]1772230[/snapback]

Chinese in Indonesia changed their name for survival.
Respect was the lasting in their mind.

If I decide to live in Indonesia, I would really consider "chameleon challenge".

Why not?
I would bake myself silly if that is the only way to avoid anti-Chinese-riots.

The benefits are endless. beerchug.gif

Thank you for bringing it up!


The funny thing is chinese mosly use javanese name and use javanese language in Java, But the most sad thing is riot keep happening there every 10 years or so. The relation between the chinese and locals overthere just really amusing sometimes they are in nice each other at front, after they are fed up being nice each other the chinese will be arrogant and abuse the local since they are averagely richer than locals javanese and after the locals fed up being abused by chinese the local retaliate and beaten and riot them just to remind them when they are too arogant who's the boss.

About using Indo name, we can see the example in java is not make you more secure either but vice versa, chinese in medan, Riau and West Kalimantan still use chinese name even speak with their own language freely. But very-very rare race-riot happened in Riau and West kalimantan.

In Malaysia, chinese use their own name speak their own language, they live merry happily together.

In malaysia chinese will tell everyone they are 100% chinese since they still practicing chinese custom, use chinese language and chinese name.
I am still failed to understand chinese Indonesian who say he is 100% chinese but use javanese name, use javanese or bahas Indonesia for daily conversation not chinese and barely practice chinese custom.

Now please tell me your opinion.

purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 21 2006, 02:32 AM) [snapback]1772608[/snapback]

You just contradicting yourself look at your first paragraph and second paragraph.

Can you explain why Kwik Kian Gie, Alvian Lie using their chinese last name if the law obliged them to do so why they were not change their name? Didnt you say previously that your parent gave that name to you? Now why you bring about 1967 law? Didn't Habibie and the Megawati abolished about discriminiation against chinese? Now 100% chinese can freely use their chinese name.

Btw chindo are confusing term it could be related to mix, For pure chinese like you better use chinese Indonesian to make it clear.

No chinese in Riau and West Kalimantan still using 3 word chinese name, their parents even barely speak Bahasa. Where were you born? where do you live telling silly fantasy?


You are confused since you don't know squat about Chinese-Indonesians.

Kwik Kian Gie and Alvin Lie (both from Central Java) refused to comply with the law, unlike most Chinese-Indonesians.

The 1967 law has been abolished, and Chinese are free to have whatever name they want. It is clear, however, that most are comfortable with their Indonesian names since I never heard Chinese-Indonesians shedding their Indonesian names.

I call myself Chindo/Chinese-Indonesians as I please, you get over it.

I was born in Palembang, almost all Chinese-Indonesians there adopted Indonesian names. I know heaps of Chinese from West Kalimantan, heaps of them moving to Jakarta each year. They all have Indonesian names. Same case in Sumatera, most have Indonesian names. You shouldn't talk about stuff you clearly know nothing about. It's not good, I'm telling you.
e_vaholic
KTP??
Nasionalism feeling??
Use local product??
purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 21 2006, 02:48 AM) [snapback]1772657[/snapback]

The funny thing is chinese mosly use javanese name and use javanese language in Java, But the most sad thing is riot keep happening there every 10 years or so. The relation between the chinese and locals overthere just really amusing sometimes they are in nice each other at front, after they are fed up being nice each other the chinese will be arrogant and abuse the local since they are averagely richer than locals javanese and after the locals fed up being abused by chinese the local retaliate and beaten and riot them just to remind them when they are too arogant who's the boss.

About using Indo name, we can see the example in java is not make you more secure either but vice versa, chinese in medan, Riau and West Kalimantan still use chinese name even speak with their own language freely. But very-very rare race-riot happened in Riau and West kalimantan.

In Malaysia, chinese use their own name speak their own language, they live merry happily together.

In malaysia chinese will tell everyone they are 100% chinese since they still practicing chinese custom, use chinese language and chinese name.
I am still failed to understand chinese Indonesian who say he is 100% chinese but use javanese name, use javanese or bahas Indonesia for daily conversation not chinese and barely practice chinese custom.

Now please tell me your opinion.


LOL, nonsense. There are heaps of Chindos in Java who maintain Chinese names, while most Chinese in other islands use Indonesian names to comply with 1967 law.

Under Suharto, there are heaps of anti-Chinese riots outside Java, such as in Aceh 1965, West Kalimantan 1967-1969, Medan 1994, Makassar 1997. My friend from Makassar experinced the 1997 riot being trapped in his shop while rioters threw rocks through the windows.
Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 21 2006, 03:01 AM) [snapback]1772695[/snapback]

You are confused since you don't know squat about Chinese-Indonesians.

Kwik Kian Gie and Alvin Lie (both from Central Java) refused to comply with the law, unlike most Chinese-Indonesians.

The 1967 law has been abolished, and Chinese are free to have whatever name they want. It is clear, however, that most are comfortable with their Indonesian names since I never heard Chinese-Indonesians shedding their Indonesian names.

I call myself Chindo/Chinese-Indonesians as I please, you get over it.

I was born in Palembang, almost all Chinese-Indonesians there adopted Indonesian names. I know heaps of Chinese from West Kalimantan, heaps of them moving to Jakarta each year. They all have Indonesian names. Same case in Sumatera, most have Indonesian names. You shouldn't talk about stuff you clearly know nothing about. It's not good, I'm telling you.


In Kalimantan only a "heap" mostly still using 3 word chinese name same like in Riau. Look man, they are using chinese language for daily conversation till now unlike chinese in Java using javanese. many parents of those chinese barely speak bahasa.

I think it is ok for them to tell me they are 100% chinese, because they are using chinese name, speak chinese and practice chinese custome. ok good for them.

But now..
I am still fail to understand someone using javanese name, do not use chinese in daily conversation mostly even use javanese and do not practice chinese custom but tell to people he is 100% chinese.

I understand now why those javanese mad at you. You are not respecting them.
purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 21 2006, 03:18 AM) [snapback]1772747[/snapback]

In Kalimantan only a "heap" mostly still using 3 word chinese name same like in Riau. Look man, they are using chinese language for daily conversation till now unlike chinese in Java using javanese. many parents of those chinese barely speak bahasa.


LOL, have you been to Kalimantan? Older people from other islands didn't go to school so they don't know Bahasa Indonesia. Younger generation may speak Chinese to their parents/grandparents, but speak Indonesian to their peers.

QUOTE

But now..
I am still fail to understand someone using javanese name, do not use chinese in daily conversation mostly even use javanese and do not practice chinese custom but tell to people he is 100% chinese.

I understand now why those javanese mad at you. You are not respecting them.


LOL, what is wrong with Chinese-Indonesians speaking Javanese and using Javanese name? People are free to speak whatever language and practice whatever custom they want. Who the fvk are you to disagree?
Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 21 2006, 03:33 AM) [snapback]1772787[/snapback]

LOL, have you been to Kalimantan? Older people from other islands didn't go to school so they don't know Bahasa Indonesia. Younger generation may speak Chinese to their parents/grandparents, but speak Indonesian to their peers.

LOL, what is wrong with Chinese-Indonesians speaking Javanese and using Javanese name? People are free to speak whatever language and practice whatever custom they want. Who the fvk are you to disagree?


yes I have post previously in one of the thread in this forum while back ago, I have been to West Kalimantan, almost many-many cities in Sumatra, Java, Bali and Lombok.

Dont you get it? chinese live in Java using javanese name, using javanese language and hijacking javanese culture and custom but still telling other he is 100% chinese.

Now don't you wonder why many riots happened in Java?
purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 21 2006, 03:44 AM) [snapback]1772810[/snapback]

yes I have post previously in one of the thread in this forum while back ago, I have been to West Kalimantan, almost many-many cities in Sumatra, Java, Bali and Lombok.


LOL your lack of knowledge suggests otherwise. In previous forum you mentioned you don't even know much about Tangerang, much less the other islands. embarassedlaugh.gif

QUOTE

Dont you get it? chinese live in Java using javanese name, using javanese language and hijacking javanese culture and custom but still telling other he is 100% chinese.

Now don't you wonder why many riots happened in Java?


LOL, that does not even make sense. Race riots happened a lot outside Java under Suharto thanks to New Order's deliberate provocation of anti-Chinese sentiments, nothing to do with "names" since Chindos use Indonesian names to comply with 1967 law. Which part of this you still fail to understand?

Again, what is wrong with Chinese-Indonesians calling themselves ethnic-Chinese if they ARE ethnic-Chinese by blood? What is your problem if they speak Javanese and follow Javanese customs?

Malays use Arabic names and hijack many Arabic customs, yet you call yourselves "Malay". Will the Arabs be angry at this "hijacking"? No wonder Chinese in Riau choose other Indonesian/Western names instead of Malay (Arabic) names, since such Islamic names do not fit to Chindo's non-Islamic faiths.
LaoShare
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 21 2006, 12:48 AM) [snapback]1772657[/snapback]

The funny thing is chinese mosly use javanese name and use javanese language in Java, But the most sad thing is riot keep happening there every 10 years or so. The relation between the chinese and locals overthere just really amusing sometimes they are in nice each other at front, after they are fed up being nice each other the chinese will be arrogant and abuse the local since they are averagely richer than locals javanese and after the locals fed up being abused by chinese the local retaliate and beaten and riot them just to remind them when they are too arogant who's the boss.


That is very true.

However:
I don't think name matter that much.
I think mutual respect is the key to racial harmony.


Because of each individual race own insecurity or inferiority, we all tend to promote each own brand of racial superiority BS. Most common methods are inviting our long gone ancestors to brag about our own culture.

Most Chinese are money crazy and no holidays, while their Malay neighbor’s life philosophy seem so relax and easy. They will get along well if time is good, however when the price of rice is getting too high, temper rise.

The relationship between Pak Suharto's families and his Chinese gangs are the same BS.
I always suspect that Jakarta Riot was the result of that Pak Suharto were using his son-in-law to tame his Chinese gangs (China opening up.) and things got out of hand.


QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 21 2006, 12:48 AM) [snapback]1772657[/snapback]

About using Indo name, we can see the example in java is not make you more secure either but vice versa, chinese in medan, Riau and West Kalimantan still use chinese name even speak with their own language freely. But very-very rare race-riot happened in Riau and West kalimantan.

In Malaysia, chinese use their own name speak their own language, they live merry happily together.




I do have some problem with this one.

Look back into Chinese history that how some white Christian missionaries try to adapt to the locals by names, clothing’s, languages, dialects, foods, etc.

(Cannot hide their big giant noses or cheesy smell.) biggrin.gif

Maybe you should take off your western clothing and go naked from the waist up. Westerners will really respect you and send you back to timbaktwo. biggrin.gif


QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 21 2006, 12:48 AM) [snapback]1772657[/snapback]


In malaysia chinese will tell everyone they are 100% chinese since they still practicing chinese custom, use chinese language and chinese name.
I am still failed to understand chinese Indonesian who say he is 100% chinese but use javanese name, use javanese or bahas Indonesia for daily conversation not chinese and barely practice chinese custom.

Now please tell me your opinion.


100% of what?

Show me a 100% Chinese or a 100% Indonesian and I will sell you an ocean view house in Las Vegas. biggrin.gif
Majapahitans
You must love at least one: PETE or JENGKOL, and have strange craving for SAMBAL TERASI and KERUPUK during lunch..... genius.gif
Then you ARE truly Indonesian. biggrin.gif
e_vaholic
bau dong kalo gitu...
han2
QUOTE(e_vaholic @ Apr 21 2006, 07:33 PM) [snapback]1775507[/snapback]

bau dong kalo gitu...


That's OK, cuma mulut dan WCnya nanti yang bau. biggrin.gif

Tapi rasanya enak lho. beerchug.gif
e_vaholic
i don't eat pete and jengkol..
dulu pernah sih nyobain jengkol....once in a life time!!!!!!
my parents love them!
apa enaknya sih?
han2
QUOTE(e_vaholic @ Apr 21 2006, 07:55 PM) [snapback]1775586[/snapback]

i don't eat pete and jengkol..
dulu pernah sih nyobain jengkol....once in a life time!!!!!!
my parents love them!
apa enaknya sih?


It's pretty hard to explain -- I guess it's just an acquired taste.

Sebagai contoh, nenek saya (God rest her soul) suka sekali dengan duren, tapi saya sendiri ngak begitu suka dengan duren.

Dan saya suka pete dan jengkol, tapi saya lebih suka pete daripada jengkol: Sayangnya di sini susah untuk dapati pete seger -- hampir semuanya kalengan.

Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 21 2006, 04:01 AM) [snapback]1772844[/snapback]

LOL your lack of knowledge suggests otherwise. In previous forum you mentioned you don't even know much about Tangerang, much less the other islands. embarassedlaugh.gif
LOL, that does not even make sense. Race riots happened a lot outside Java under Suharto thanks to New Order's deliberate provocation of anti-Chinese sentiments, nothing to do with "names" since Chindos use Indonesian names to comply with 1967 law. Which part of this you still fail to understand?

Again, what is wrong with Chinese-Indonesians calling themselves ethnic-Chinese if they ARE ethnic-Chinese by blood? What is your problem if they speak Javanese and follow Javanese customs?

Malays use Arabic names and hijack many Arabic customs, yet you call yourselves "Malay". Will the Arabs be angry at this "hijacking"? No wonder Chinese in Riau choose other Indonesian/Western names instead of Malay (Arabic) names, since such Islamic names do not fit to Chindo's non-Islamic faiths.


I do not live in Tangerang so my knowledge about tangerang relatively less knowledgeable where the place where I am living. You should understand about relativity and Tangerang is not that far from Depok.

Are All Malay use Mohammad in front of their name? Can you show me what is arabic names by the way, can't you?

Who are you telling me how's chinese situation living in Riau? Chinese in Riau mostly still using their chinese name. The more you accumulate your posting the more you look like commedian. You keep blabbing without any sources as usual. Chinese in Riau who Indonesianised their name choose Javanese name, same case like you!
Very funny things is most anti chinese riot happened in Java, where the chinese use javanese name and speak javanese language. Chinese use javaense name, use their language and some practiced javanese custom but saying they are 100% chinese to other people but in front javanese they saying they are chindo, just like chameleon. laugh.gif . No wonder javanese mad at you.

QUOTE(LaoShare @ Apr 21 2006, 08:56 AM) [snapback]1773275[/snapback]

Show me a 100% Chinese I will sell you an ocean view house in Las Vegas. biggrin.gif


Purnomor he said 100% chinese. Last time I checked in map there are no Ocean in Las Vegas.
LaoShare
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 22 2006, 06:36 PM) [snapback]1778177[/snapback]

Purnomor he said 100% chinese. Last time I checked in map there are no Ocean in Las Vegas.


Purnomor he said 100% chinese, how about you?

Aa.... aa... awas awas djawabnja, entar utang bank Las Vegas sape habis habisan lu! biggrin.gif
ansudjono
by being able to speak Indonesian languange, brave enough to say that your nationality is Indonesia, id...and like rawon..:P
han2
QUOTE(ansudjono @ Apr 23 2006, 06:33 AM) [snapback]1779692[/snapback]

by being able to speak Indonesian languange, brave enough to say that your nationality is Indonesia, id...and like rawon..:P


Hmm..., and gudeg, sambel pete, sayur asem, etc. biggthumpup.gif
purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 22 2006, 08:36 PM) [snapback]1778177[/snapback]

I do not live in Tangerang so my knowledge about tangerang relatively less knowledgeable where the place where I am living. You should understand about relativity and Tangerang is not that far from Depok.

Are All Malay use Mohammad in front of their name? Can you show me what is arabic names by the way, can't you?


The Malays living in Malaysia/Brunei uses fully Arabic or Persian names. The Malays in Indonesia often use Western or Javanese names. I read in newspapers many Acehnese also use Javanese names like Sudirman.

QUOTE

Who are you telling me how's chinese situation living in Riau? Chinese in Riau mostly still using their chinese name. The more you accumulate your posting the more you look like commedian. You keep blabbing without any sources as usual. Chinese in Riau who Indonesianised their name choose Javanese name, same case like you!


I think most Chinese in Riau use Indonesian name to comply with 1967 law.

QUOTE

Very funny things is most anti chinese riot happened in Java, where the chinese use javanese name and speak javanese language. Chinese use javaense name, use their language and some practiced javanese custom but saying they are 100% chinese to other people but in front javanese they saying they are chindo, just like chameleon. laugh.gif . No wonder javanese mad at you.


LOL, that doesn't even make sense. You are just bashing Javanese and Chinese again. You've got issues. sure.gif

Actually, race riots happened as much outside Java during Suharto's rule due to his regime's anti-Chinese provocations.

Not only in Java, Chindos who live in Makassar speak Buginese/Makassarese, those who live in Manado speak Minahasan, those who live in West Java speak Sundanese, those who live in Padang speak Minang, etc. That's called natural acculturisation aka creolisation, perfectly natural adapatation to your environment. If you live in Australia long enough, your kids would eventually speak English. If Chindos in Riau don't want to speak Malay, that is a freak case, maybe due to influence from Malaysian Chinese.

QUOTE

Purnomor he said 100% chinese. Last time I checked in map there are no Ocean in Las Vegas.


I AM by blood 93.75% ethnic-Chinese and 6.25% ethnic-Arab. I know my ancestry well. At the same time, I am an Indonesian, because Indonesian is a nationality, not race. You can be ethnic-Chinese, Arab, Indian, Eurasian, Malay, Javanese, Madurese, etc etc but you are still an Indonesian. Indonesia is a multicultural and multiracial country. Even primary school kids understand this, as our national motto is "Unity in Diversity". But it seems the idea that race doesn't matter is incomprehensible to your bigoted mind obssessed with genes.

Sad, actually. Had you not become a racist freak, forummers here might like you. But now, you are just annoying freak.
Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 23 2006, 07:37 PM) [snapback]1781510[/snapback]

The Malays living in Malaysia/Brunei uses fully Arabic or Persian names. The Malays in Indonesia often use Western or Javanese names. I read in newspapers many Acehnese also use Javanese names like Sudirman.
I think most Chinese in Riau use Indonesian name to comply with 1967 law.
LOL, that doesn't even make sense. You are just bashing Javanese and Chinese again. You've got issues. sure.gif

Actually, race riots happened as much outside Java during Suharto's rule due to his regime's anti-Chinese provocations.

Not only in Java, Chindos who live in Makassar speak Buginese/Makassarese, those who live in Manado speak Minahasan, those who live in West Java speak Sundanese, those who live in Padang speak Minang, etc. That's called natural acculturisation aka creolisation, perfectly natural adapatation to your environment. If you live in Australia long enough, your kids would eventually speak English. If Chindos in Riau don't want to speak Malay, that is a freak case, maybe due to influence from Malaysian Chinese.
I AM by blood 93.75% ethnic-Chinese and 6.25% ethnic-Arab. I know my ancestry well. At the same time, I am an Indonesian, because Indonesian is a nationality, not race. You can be ethnic-Chinese, Arab, Indian, Eurasian, Malay, Javanese, Madurese, etc etc but you are still an Indonesian. Indonesia is a multicultural and multiracial country. Even primary school kids understand this, as our national motto is "Unity in Diversity". But it seems the idea that race doesn't matter is incomprehensible to your bigoted mind obssessed with genes.

Sad, actually. Had you not become a racist freak, forummers here might like you. But now, you are just annoying freak.


What's wrong with you previously you mentioned all Malay use Arabic name now you mention often use Javanese or Western name, if you don't know a jack just drop it. You keep changing to anything.

Do not deny it most riot happened in Java everyone knows it, there are many news about it. Yes there are also riot in Medan, Makassar and someother place but mostly in Java. I would like you to see as how ironic is it.

I see... now you are 93.75% ethnic chinese, previously you said 100%, HAHAHA... purnomor what happened?

purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 23 2006, 08:05 PM) [snapback]1781609[/snapback]

What's wrong with you previously you mentioned all Malay use Arabic name now you mention often use Javanese or Western name, if you don't know a jack just drop it. You keep changing to anything.


LOL, when did I say ALL Malays use Arabic name?

QUOTE

Do not deny it most riot happened in Java everyone knows it, there are many news about it. Yes there are also riot in Medan, Makassar and someother place but mostly in Java. I would like you to see as how ironic is it.


There were as much race riots outside Java as in Java, do not deny it.

QUOTE

I see... now you are 93.75% ethnic chinese, previously you said 100%, HAHAHA... purnomor what happened?


93.75% is basically 100%, dummy biggrin.gif
Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 23 2006, 08:36 PM) [snapback]1781699[/snapback]

LOL, when did I say ALL Malays use Arabic name?
There were as much race riots outside Java as in Java, do not deny it.
93.75% is basically 100%, dummy biggrin.gif


I see, so there are many anti-chinese riot all over this archipelago. Thanks for clarify. Do you have the source link?
I am wondering why this race riot keep only happened to chinese? why there were no race riot against Arab or India? Why so? India is very very rare inter-marriage with Indos except Muslim India. But why no riot against India? Arab in Java also tend to marry among themselves we can still see Arab square in many big cities in Java. Why no riot to Arab too? Arab in Sumatra is unseperable with local natives more they are mixing around.
purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 25 2006, 02:21 AM) [snapback]1786577[/snapback]

I see, so there are many anti-chinese riot all over this archipelago. Thanks for clarify. Do you have the source link?
I am wondering why this race riot keep only happened to chinese? why there were no race riot against Arab or India? Why so? India is very very rare inter-marriage with Indos except Muslim India. But why no riot against India? Arab in Java also tend to marry among themselves we can still see Arab square in many big cities in Java. Why no riot to Arab too? Arab in Sumatra is unseperable with local natives more they are mixing around.


Man, you're slow. embarassedlaugh.gif

Indian-Indonesians are tiny in overall numbers, they form insignificant proportion of total population and have little impact. Hence, nobody really pays much attention to them. Ethnic-Arabs are proportionally smaller than ethnic-Chinese, additionally they are considered original Muslims, hence they get special treatment by Indonesia's Muslim-majority population, especially those who claim descent from Prophet Muhammad SAW. And yes, ethnic-Arabs in Java intermarried a lot with the native population.

Anti-Chinese rioting happened a lot under New Order due to provocations from Suharto's regime. On one hand, he used select group of Chinese cronies to motorise economic growth and provide kickbacks to his family, on the other hand he used the entire Chinese-Indonesian community as scapegoat whenever there were discontent on his rule. Unfortunately, many Indonesians were easily manipulated by Suharto during his rule. More unfortunately, you are among the few dummies who still fell to Suharto's manipulatons long after he fell from power. sure.gif

Indonesians are now smarter, hence there are never any single anti-Chinese rioting after Suharto's fall eight years ago. Chinese-Indonesians can practice their culture and become politicians, artists, and whatever else they want to be without any problem/objections from natives. Too bad though, in every population there are always defective bad apple like you.
Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 25 2006, 03:31 AM) [snapback]1786701[/snapback]

Man, you're slow. embarassedlaugh.gif

Indian-Indonesians are tiny in overall numbers, they form insignificant proportion of total population and have little impact. Hence, nobody really pays much attention to them. Ethnic-Arabs are proportionally smaller than ethnic-Chinese, additionally they are considered original Muslims, hence they get special treatment by Indonesia's Muslim-majority population, especially those who claim descent from Prophet Muhammad SAW. And yes, ethnic-Arabs in Java intermarried a lot with the native population.

Anti-Chinese rioting happened a lot under New Order due to provocations from Suharto's regime. On one hand, he used select group of Chinese cronies to motorise economic growth and provide kickbacks to his family, on the other hand he used the entire Chinese-Indonesian community as scapegoat whenever there were discontent on his rule. Unfortunately, many Indonesians were easily manipulated by Suharto during his rule. More unfortunately, you are among the few dummies who still fell to Suharto's manipulatons long after he fell from power. sure.gif

Indonesians are now smarter, hence there are never any single anti-Chinese rioting after Suharto's fall eight years ago. Chinese-Indonesians can practice their culture and become politicians, artists, and whatever else they want to be without any problem/objections from natives. Too bad though, in every population there are always defective bad apple like you.


Indian area not tiny minority in Medan, they are bulk of Hindu Tamil Indian in that city, why very rare we heard race riot against them? instead mostly race riot against chinese in that city.

You don't want just saying babbling out of your brainless head right? You can not just blame Soeharto the root cause of the riot. Riot were not only happenned during Soeharto regime, there were many riots against chinese before soeharto regime. It is not merely caused by Soeharto cronysm style, It is you people living in rodent situations. or it is because chinese genetics

you think chinese can be what they want to be now? why someone mentioned in other thread just recently Surabaya still requesting you to have SKBRI? Chinese should know where their own place.

I think Indos and chinese will be difficult to get along, Indos do not like chinese in other word chinese are not welcome. As you mentioned previously there are many diffrentness than similarities between Indos & your people:
1. chinese culturally different than indos
2. chinese religiously different with majority Indos,
3. chinese genetically eventhough some percentage close but relatively different with Indos,
4. chinese who use javanese and speak javanese only hijacking javanese for their own benefit in reality they never get well with Indos.
5. chinese indonesian living in seperate neighborhood with Indos, chinese stay in ghetto chinatown meanwhile Indos living in suburb.

IMO that differentness make chinese become target unlike Arab or India or European. Those later three can wander freely by foot wherever they want from place to place without feeling afraid.
rasibiduk
Nusantara, you are unbelievably racist it's scary.
purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 25 2006, 08:37 PM) [snapback]1789075[/snapback]

Indian area not tiny minority in Medan, they are bulk of Hindu Tamil Indian in that city, why very rare we heard race riot against them? instead mostly race riot against chinese in that city.


LOL, ethnic-Indians are small minority in Medan, moron.

QUOTE

You don't want just saying babbling out of your brainless head right? You can not just blame Soeharto the root cause of the riot. Riot were not only happenned during Soeharto regime, there were many riots against chinese before soeharto regime. It is not merely caused by Soeharto cronysm style, It is you people living in rodent situations. or it is because chinese genetics


LOL, you brain is getting more idiot with every post. Correct your history, rodent. There were almost no race riots under Sukarno, while there are no riots after Suharto.

QUOTE

you think chinese can be what they want to be now? why someone mentioned in other thread just recently Surabaya still requesting you to have SKBRI? Chinese should know where their own place.


SKBRI (Letter of Acceptence of Indonesian Citizenship) is already unneccessary since 1996, however some ethnic-Chinese still use it because they don't have birth certificate and SKBRI is a valid complement of the birth certificate. Chinese-Indonesians born prior to 1960s or during colonial rule are poorly documented in many case SKBRI is their first legal documentation.

And yes, Chinese-Indonesians can be whatever they want from cabinet minister to actress/artist. Deal with it.

QUOTE

I think Indos and chinese will be difficult to get along, Indos do not like chinese in other word chinese are not welcome. As you mentioned previously there are many diffrentness than similarities between Indos & your people:
1. chinese culturally different than indos
2. chinese religiously different with majority Indos,
3. chinese genetically eventhough some percentage close but relatively different with Indos,
4. chinese who use javanese and speak javanese only hijacking javanese for their own benefit in reality they never get well with Indos.
5. chinese indonesian living in seperate neighborhood with Indos, chinese stay in ghetto chinatown meanwhile Indos living in suburb.

IMO that differentness make chinese become target unlike Arab or India or European. Those later three can wander freely by foot wherever they want from place to place without feeling afraid.


LOL, another of your racist fantasy. You are just trying to bash Javanese and Chinese peoples that you hate so much. Actually Chinese-Indonesians live mostly in integrated neighbourhood and can go wherever they want. There is always an ethnic-Chinese community in every Indonesian town from Sabang to Merauke.

Don't insult Indonesians by equalising them with a retard like you. You are just an inferior travesty of a buffoon, a disgrace for Indonesians. Your disgusting hate-mongering racist crap made a bad name on Indonesian forummers here. No wonder, you are just a freak wannabe-Malaysian totally infected by their Malay-supremacy fantasies.

Next time, just call yourself a Malaysian. Never consider yourself as representing Indonesia, as you clearly do not understand Indonesia's national identity as a "unity in diversity". We Indonesian forummers are ashamed to be associated with a brute racist like you.

I think you are angry that Chinese-Indonesians are far more integrated into Indonesia than the Chinese in Malaysia. Now, you try to create anti-Chinese hatred amongst Indonesians to make it as if Indonesians are inferior than Malaysians.

If you love Malaysia so much, it is best you move to Malaysia as TKI, the departure of a useless rodent like you will be good riddance for Indonesia.

QUOTE(rasibiduk @ Apr 26 2006, 02:19 AM) [snapback]1789860[/snapback]

Nusantara, you are unbelievably racist it's scary.


Indeed, he is a wannabe-Malaysian who keep provoking dislike against Indonesians amongst the other forummers. We should disown this Malaysian idiot before he made more damage to our name.
Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 26 2006, 06:07 AM) [snapback]1790350[/snapback]

LOL, ethnic-Indians are small minority in Medan, moron.
LOL, you brain is getting more idiot with every post. Correct your history, rodent. There were almost no race riots under Sukarno, while there are no riots after Suharto.
SKBRI (Letter of Acceptence of Indonesian Citizenship) is already unneccessary since 1996, however some ethnic-Chinese still use it because they don't have birth certificate and SKBRI is a valid complement of the birth certificate. Chinese-Indonesians born prior to 1960s or during colonial rule are poorly documented in many case SKBRI is their first legal documentation.

And yes, Chinese-Indonesians can be whatever they want from cabinet minister to actress/artist. Deal with it.
LOL, another of your racist fantasy. You are just trying to bash Javanese and Chinese peoples that you hate so much. Actually Chinese-Indonesians live mostly in integrated neighbourhood and can go wherever they want. There is always an ethnic-Chinese community in every Indonesian town from Sabang to Merauke.

Don't insult Indonesians by equalising them with a retard like you. You are just an inferior travesty of a buffoon, a disgrace for Indonesians. Your disgusting hate-mongering racist crap made a bad name on Indonesian forummers here. No wonder, you are just a freak wannabe-Malaysian totally infected by their Malay-supremacy fantasies.

Next time, just call yourself a Malaysian. Never consider yourself as representing Indonesia, as you clearly do not understand Indonesia's national identity as a "unity in diversity". We Indonesian forummers are ashamed to be associated with a brute racist like you.

I think you are angry that Chinese-Indonesians are far more integrated into Indonesia than the Chinese in Malaysia. Now, you try to create anti-Chinese hatred amongst Indonesians to make it as if Indonesians are inferior than Malaysians.

If you love Malaysia so much, it is best you move to Malaysia as TKI, the departure of a useless rodent like you will be good riddance for Indonesia.
Indeed, he is a wannabe-Malaysian who keep provoking dislike against Indonesians amongst the other forummers. We should disown this Malaysian idiot before he made more damage to our name.


Whether Indian is small minority or bigger minority It does not change the reality, they rarely ever be target of race riot, unlike your people keep in target every 10 years or so. Don't you wonder why?

Don't just blame Soeharto about your incompetency, anti-chinese riot happened many times before Soeharto and also happened everywhere. Don't you wonder why?

Anti-Chinese riot:
A.D. 1603 - Manila, Philippines
24,000 massacred by Spaniards when Ming Mandarins
visited the islands sparking fears of Chinese dominance.

A.D. 1662 - Manila, Philippines
30,000 put to sea and expelled from the Philippines.
Those caught outside the Parian (Manila's Chinese
ghetto) were beheaded immediately.

A.D. 1639-1640 - Manila, Philippines
20,000 die in anti-Chinese violence

A.D. 1686 - Manila, Philippines
Anti-Chinese violence

A.D. 1740 - Batavia, Indonesia (Batavian Fury)
10,000 Chinese slaughtered by Dutch when the Chinese
objected to forced removals to Sri Lanka as slave
labour.

A.D. 1763 - Manila, Philippines
Anti- Chinese violence

A.D. 1792 - Cholon, Vietnam (Ho Chi Minh City)
10,000 Chinese massacred in the Tay Son movement's
retaking of Cholon from Nguyen Anh who in 1780 had
proclaimed himself the new Nguyen ruler. According to
Nguyen records, Nhac of Tay Son lost one of his closest
aides, killed by Nguyen troops who happened to be ethnic
Chinese. In revenge, Nhac ordered the killing of ethnic
Chinese in the city including the women and children. It
has been speculated that this act was also to destroy the
ethnic Chinese commercial monopoly.

A.D. 1823 - South Borneo
10,000-20,000 Chinese massacred when Chinese "kongsi"
resisted the withdrawal and reselling of mining
concession to the Dutch by local Sultans due to
monetary jealousy and rivalry.

ca. A.D. 1824-1851 Reign of Rama III - Thailand
A band of Chinese insurgents capture and loot the city
of Chachengsao, causing the majority of the Siamese
population to flee the city. The government successfully
dispatched troops to put down the affair. After a few
confrontations one of the rebel leaders changed sides
and led his troops to capture the other rebel leaders. The
rest of the rebels soon fled the city and were surrounded
by the government troops. The town folk returned and
initiated a massacre. Some Chinese tried to flee by
becoming monks, but were not spared and many hanged
themselves to avoid the slaughter. Deaths numbered in
the thousands.

A.D. 1857 - Sarawak, North Borneo
2,000-5,000 Chinese massacred by Raja Brooke when a
Hakka gold-mining "kongsi" failed to murder him. Liu
Shanbang led 600-armed miners from Bau Lama to attack
Kuching on the 18th of February 1857. He succeeded in
the attack but James Brooke escaped unhurt. Liu became
the de facto 'Rajah' of Sarawak for 5 days from the 19th
to the 23rd of February after which Liu and his men
retreated to Bau when Tuan Muda Charles Brooke with
his Dayak force from 2nd Division (Sri Aman) retaliated.
Liu Shanbang was killed at Jugan, Siniawan on or about
the 24th of February. His men and their families were
mostly killed or suffocated to death by the Rajah's men at
Mau San and Ghost Cave areas with some managing to
escape to Indonesia.

A.D. 1871 - Los Angeles, California, USA
19 Chinese die when white Los Angeles citizens go bezerk
after the accidental killing of a white man by a Chinese
laborer.

A.D. 1877 - Chico, California, USA
Anti-Chinese violence.

A.D. 1885 - Rock Springs, Wyoming, USA
Anti-Chinese violence.

A.D. 1887 - Snake River, Oregon, USA
31 Chinese miners massacred in a 2-day orgy of violence.

A.D. 1890s - San Francisco & Seattle, USA
Thousands of Chinese were assaulted in "pigtail cutting
parties" by unemployed white vigilantes frightened by
the Yellow Peril frenzy.

A.D. 1942 - Singapore (Operation Sook Ching)
70,699 Chinese tortured and/or killed by Japanese
Kempeitai in Colonel Tsuji Masanobu's "Sook Ching" or
Purification/Ethnic Cleansing in reprisals for overseas
Chinese support of mainland China against the Japanese
invasion.

A.D. 1942 - Malaya (Operation Sook Ching)
40,000 Chinese killed by Japanese Kempetai in the
continuation of the Singapore Sook Ching.

A.D. 1946 - Malaya
The withdrawal of Japanese troops created a power
vacuum in Malaya. The predominately Chinese MPAJA
representing the victorious Allied forces with the approval
of the British, streamed out of the jungles to assume
control of towns and villages to impose law and order
prior to the British arrival. However, brutal reprisals and
witchhunts of Japanese collaborators and police personnel,
many of which were from the Japanese favoured Malay
population polarised the conflict along racial lines. Malays
retaliated with a fiery brand of Malay mysticism, Islam and
martial arts, forming the Red Band under Kiyai (Tok Guru)
Salleh and the Sabilillah. The Japanese, angered by the
MPAJA guerrilla activities during the occupation, joined the
Malays in the Batu Pahat area of Johor state to clear the
area of Chinese elements. The fighing spread thoughout
Malaya with the worst fighting occuring in Northern Johor
and central Perak states. Thousands died in the fighting
with large areas cleared of Chinese settlers who were
forced to flee to the larger cities.

A.D. 1965-1966 - Indonesia
500,000 killed in anti-communist violence, many were
local Chinese suspected of communist activities, others
were those who joined the PKI (Parti Kommunis Indonesia)
ignorant of the ideology but attracted by it's stance for
defending worker rights, while many others were innocent
victims caught in the frenzied bloodletting of racial
jealousy and animosity.

A.D. 1969 - Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
1500-2000 Chinese dead from racial rioting sparked by
Chinese electoral victories in Selangor and Kuala Lumpur
which prevented the formation of a Malay dominated state
goverment in Selangor and the 2/3 majority in Parliment
required to push through constitutional amendments
without a referendum.

A.D. 1998 - Jakarta, Indonesia
Thousands of Chinese businesses and homes were burnt,
looted and smashed when rampaging youths, chafting
under the 1997 Asian Financial Crisis, blamed the Chinese
for their sufferings and rioted in the streets of Jakarta.
Untold numbers of Chinese were killed, Chinese girls were
gang-raped and houses plundered. The Indonesian police,
unable or unwilling to stop the violence, prompted residents
of housing estates to band together to erect barricades,
arm themselves and to employ armed guards to patrol the
streets.



I wonder why? Is it chinese gene?

SKBRI is applied if you want to get passport for every chinese. It does not have anything to do having birth certificate or not. It is just showing you trying so hard thinking you can be what you want. You delusional with Indonesia situation since you live abroad.

http://choirulmahfud.blogspot.com/2006/04/...i-etnis-di.html

No, Chinese are not integrated well among Indonesians, chinese stay in ghettoised place among themselves and if they live among native they build their house with high fence and very rare interact with surrounded neighbors. Just look at the house in Jakarta. Don't make people laughing at your phantacy. Wake up see reality.

And chinese Indonesian loathes and hate native to their gut so much, do not deny it. You just pretender everyone knows it.

Look how this Singaporean tourist viewed toward indonesia. He put it rightly the situation of chinese and indo in Jakarta, he was also explaining how chinese made their fortune by exploiting and leeching Indonesians by taking advantagae high corruption level of indonesian beaurocrat:

QUOTE(pokkagreentea @ Oct 10 2005, 02:52 PM) [snapback]1114423[/snapback]

Hi

I am from Singapore, and I am of Chinese descent. I happened to see this thread while surfing the Internet. Let me just tell you my experiences in Jakarta.

I was in Jakarta in November last year on a business trip, and also to attend a Chinese-Indonesian friend's sister's wedding. It was my first trip to Jakarta. I have been to Bali previously, and it was a very nice and friendly place.

I got into a Silver Bird taxi at the airport to send me to my hotel. The taxi driver was native Indonesian, and was very friendly and could speak English. I had a nice conversation with him. So I was thinking: Hey this place is ok. Except for the street scenes, which are full of native Indonesians selling food by the street, and generally the poor poeple living in the slums, which are almost everywhere in Jakarta.

At the hotel, I checked into my room at the counter. The lady at the hotel reception was also native Indonesian, and she was very nice and polite as well.

After that, I met some friends also from Singapore, and went to Plaza Indonesia for coffee. Along the way in the taxi, I began to feel more and more disturbed by the number of poor native Indonesians on the streets and in the slums. To tell you the truth, I felt very sorry for them.

At the Plaza Indonesia, I realized the difference. Outside the shopping centre was all the poor native Indonesians. Inside, was all the rich Chinese shopping and buying the branded clothes and jewellery and stuff. The security guards, though, were native Indonesian. The cleaners and workers were also native Indonesian.

That night, I went to my Chinese-Indonesian friend's sister's wedding in the Grand Hyatt. Again, I saw the contrast. The hotel guests and people who attended the wedding were local Chinese and some white foreigners. The guys who opened the doors, the waiters, the workers, they were native Indonesian. As usual, this was a posh Chinese-Indonesian wedding, and they definitely spent a lot of money on the wedding, as the food was high-quality and the decor was posh. The wedding's guests are also rich Chinese-Indonesians, some of whom I knew from my school days in the US.

The next few nights, I was brought to some of Jakarta's best nightclubs and pubs. The people spending money like crazy in those places were Chinese-Indonesians and whites. The native Indonesians? Well, they are all workers there. Some of the native Indonesians were also customers, but they just sat around smoking cigarettes and watching people. My friends told me some of them are drug dealers or pimps.

At the end of my trip, I fully understood why the native Indonesians hate the Chinese-Indonesians so much.

If you are a poor native Indonesian, looking in from the outside at all these rich Chinese-Indonesian spending their money and living a life of luxury, you would hate the Chinese too. Do you know how great the contrast is between the Chinese-Indonesian lifestyle vs. the native Indonesian lifestyle? Let's just say: the amount of money the Chinese spend on a single restaurant meal can easily feed a family of 4 native Indonesians for a month!

In conclusion, looking at how some Chinese-Indonesians flaunt their wealth in front of the poor native Indonesians, I fully understand the hatred of the native Indonesians.

That's not all. In fact I know how the Chinese-Indonesians became so rich. A lot of them made their money by exploiting the native Indonesians, making use of them at low cost, taking their land at low cost. Just look at those wealthy Chinese who literally RAPED Kalimantan of natural resources, making use of the natives as cheap labour. In fact, I have relatives who are Chinese-Indonesians. Their business is dealing in motorcycles to native Indonesians. But when their native Indonesian customers cannot pay the installment for the motorcycles, they take the motorcycle back, refurbish it a little, and sell it to the native Indonesians again at full price. I think that is a sin.

ps:- one night, while travelling back to the hotel in a taxi with my friends, we were stopped by a native Indonesian police man. The police man threatened to arrest us because we didn't have our original passports with us, only photocopies. But he said if we gave him a large sum of money, he'll let us go. In the end, we gave the police man some money on the spot. My friend, who works for an American MNC in Indonesia, bargained the price down. That was my only bad experience with native Indonesians.


Still thinking Indos and Indonesian born chinese getting along well? Only someone with deranged brain pretending so hard.

QUOTE(rasibiduk @ Apr 26 2006, 02:19 AM) [snapback]1789860[/snapback]

Nusantara, you are unbelievably racist it's scary.


There were big riots in bandung during Soeharto regime and There were also big anti-chinese riot in your place Bandung in 1963 during Soekarno regime. You just google it.
Hillarious some Indonesian like becoming brown angel and just pretending no problems, later on when they got fed up and could not find the answer they rioting them.
purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 26 2006, 02:40 PM) [snapback]1791634[/snapback]

Whether Indian is small minority or bigger minority It does not change the reality, they rarely ever be target of race riot, unlike your people keep in target every 10 years or so. Don't you wonder why?


LOL, you look dumb with this statement since you've answered ur own question before. Ethnic-Indians are tiny minority in Indonesia, nobody cares about them. Where Indians formed large minority, there are lots of trouble, such as anti-Indian riots in South Africa and Fiji, or the expulsion of Indians from Burma after that country's independence.

QUOTE

Don't just blame Soeharto about your incompetency, anti-chinese riot happened many times before Soeharto and also happened everywhere. Don't you wonder why?


LOL, what do you know about ethnic-Chinese? Obviously none. Chinese-Indonesians hardly faced any riots during Sukarno period since he was aligning Indonesia with communist China (except 1963 Bandung riots which was provoked by right-wing military elements keen to wreck that alignment).

QUOTE

Anti-Chinese riot:
A.D. 1603 - Manila, Philippines
24,000 massacred by Spaniards when Ming Mandarins
visited the islands sparking fears of Chinese dominance.

A.D. 1662 - Manila, Philippines
30,000 put to sea and expelled from the Philippines.
Those caught outside the Parian (Manila's Chinese
ghetto) were beheaded immediately.

A.D. 1639-1640 - Manila, Philippines
20,000 die in anti-Chinese violence

A.D. 1686 - Manila, Philippines
Anti-Chinese violence

A.D. 1740 - Batavia, Indonesia (Batavian Fury)
10,000 Chinese slaughtered by Dutch when the Chinese
objected to forced removals to Sri Lanka as slave
labour.

A.D. 1763 - Manila, Philippines
Anti- Chinese violence

A.D. 1792 - Cholon, Vietnam (Ho Chi Minh City)
10,000 Chinese massacred in the Tay Son movement's
retaking of Cholon from Nguyen Anh who in 1780 had
proclaimed himself the new Nguyen ruler. According to
Nguyen records, Nhac of Tay Son lost one of his closest
aides, killed by Nguyen troops who happened to be ethnic
Chinese. In revenge, Nhac ordered the killing of ethnic
Chinese in the city including the women and children. It
has been speculated that this act was also to destroy the
ethnic Chinese commercial monopoly.

A.D. 1823 - South Borneo
10,000-20,000 Chinese massacred when Chinese "kongsi"
resisted the withdrawal and reselling of mining
concession to the Dutch by local Sultans due to
monetary jealousy and rivalry.

ca. A.D. 1824-1851 Reign of Rama III - Thailand
A band of Chinese insurgents capture and loot the city
of Chachengsao, causing the majority of the Siamese
population to flee the city. The government successfully
dispatched troops to put down the affair. After a few
confrontations one of the rebel leaders changed sides
and led his troops to capture the other rebel leaders. The
rest of the rebels soon fled the city and were surrounded
by the government troops. The town folk returned and
initiated a massacre. Some Chinese tried to flee by
becoming monks, but were not spared and many hanged
themselves to avoid the slaughter. Deaths numbered in
the thousands.

A.D. 1857 - Sarawak, North Borneo
2,000-5,000 Chinese massacred by Raja Brooke when a
Hakka gold-mining "kongsi" failed to murder him. Liu
Shanbang led 600-armed miners from Bau Lama to attack
Kuching on the 18th of February 1857. He succeeded in
the attack but James Brooke escaped unhurt. Liu became
the de facto 'Rajah' of Sarawak for 5 days from the 19th
to the 23rd of February after which Liu and his men
retreated to Bau when Tuan Muda Charles Brooke with
his Dayak force from 2nd Division (Sri Aman) retaliated.
Liu Shanbang was killed at Jugan, Siniawan on or about
the 24th of February. His men and their families were
mostly killed or suffocated to death by the Rajah's men at
Mau San and Ghost Cave areas with some managing to
escape to Indonesia.

A.D. 1871 - Los Angeles, California, USA
19 Chinese die when white Los Angeles citizens go bezerk
after the accidental killing of a white man by a Chinese
laborer.

A.D. 1877 - Chico, California, USA
Anti-Chinese violence.

A.D. 1885 - Rock Springs, Wyoming, USA
Anti-Chinese violence.

A.D. 1887 - Snake River, Oregon, USA
31 Chinese miners massacred in a 2-day orgy of violence.

A.D. 1890s - San Francisco & Seattle, USA
Thousands of Chinese were assaulted in "pigtail cutting
parties" by unemployed white vigilantes frightened by
the Yellow Peril frenzy.

A.D. 1942 - Singapore (Operation Sook Ching)
70,699 Chinese tortured and/or killed by Japanese
Kempeitai in Colonel Tsuji Masanobu's "Sook Ching" or
Purification/Ethnic Cleansing in reprisals for overseas
Chinese support of mainland China against the Japanese
invasion.

A.D. 1942 - Malaya (Operation Sook Ching)
40,000 Chinese killed by Japanese Kempetai in the
continuation of the Singapore Sook Ching.

A.D. 1946 - Malaya
The withdrawal of Japanese troops created a power
vacuum in Malaya. The predominately Chinese MPAJA
representing the victorious Allied forces with the approval
of the British, streamed out of the jungles to assume
control of towns and villages to impose law and order
prior to the British arrival. However, brutal reprisals and
witchhunts of Japanese collaborators and police personnel,
many of which were from the Japanese favoured Malay
population polarised the conflict along racial lines. Malays
retaliated with a fiery brand of Malay mysticism, Islam and
martial arts, forming the Red Band under Kiyai (Tok Guru)
Salleh and the Sabilillah. The Japanese, angered by the
MPAJA guerrilla activities during the occupation, joined the
Malays in the Batu Pahat area of Johor state to clear the
area of Chinese elements. The fighing spread thoughout
Malaya with the worst fighting occuring in Northern Johor
and central Perak states. Thousands died in the fighting
with large areas cleared of Chinese settlers who were
forced to flee to the larger cities.

A.D. 1965-1966 - Indonesia
500,000 killed in anti-communist violence, many were
local Chinese suspected of communist activities, others
were those who joined the PKI (Parti Kommunis Indonesia)
ignorant of the ideology but attracted by it's stance for
defending worker rights, while many others were innocent
victims caught in the frenzied bloodletting of racial
jealousy and animosity.

A.D. 1969 - Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
1500-2000 Chinese dead from racial rioting sparked by
Chinese electoral victories in Selangor and Kuala Lumpur
which prevented the formation of a Malay dominated state
goverment in Selangor and the 2/3 majority in Parliment
required to push through constitutional amendments
without a referendum.

A.D. 1998 - Jakarta, Indonesia
Thousands of Chinese businesses and homes were burnt,
looted and smashed when rampaging youths, chafting
under the 1997 Asian Financial Crisis, blamed the Chinese
for their sufferings and rioted in the streets of Jakarta.
Untold numbers of Chinese were killed, Chinese girls were
gang-raped and houses plundered. The Indonesian police,
unable or unwilling to stop the violence, prompted residents
of housing estates to band together to erect barricades,
arm themselves and to employ armed guards to patrol the
streets.

I wonder why? Is it chinese gene?


LOL, human history is full of violence between different ethnicities, religions, or nations. Every race from Jews to blacks to Chinese have their history of being attacked or assaulted. Just like the weakling Malays keep being dominated by outsiders throughout history.


QUOTE

SKBRI is applied if you want to get passport for every chinese. It does not have anything to do having birth certificate or not. It is just showing you trying so hard thinking you can be what you want. You delusional with Indonesia situation since you live abroad.


LOL, bollocks. You obviously don't know squat about SKBRI. No Indonesian born after 1960s who have birth certificate have any SKBRI. Neither I nor my cousins have SKBRI, yet I can get and extend my passport just with copy of birth certificate and KTP. Prior to 1966, most Chinese-Indonesians were stateless without clear citizenship. With SKBRI, they received Indonesian citizenship. SKBRI was a good progression for Chinese-Indonesians as it gave them citizenship, it is not a burden as how can getting citizenship be a burden?

QUOTE

No, Chinese are not integrated well among Indonesians, chinese stay in ghettoised place among themselves and if they live among native they build their house with high fence and very rare interact with surrounded neighbors. Just look at the house in Jakarta. Don't make people laughing at your phantacy. Wake up see reality.


LOL, bullcrap. You just cannot accept the fact that Chindos completely integrated with native Indonesians unlike in your racially-segregated Malaysia. All houses in Jakarta mostly have high walls regardless of which ethnicity the owner is, to protect from thieves. And yes Chinese-Indonesians live in integrated neighbourhoods and interact well with their native neighbours, just like the Cina Benteng in Tangerang. My neighbour is that actress Ulfa Dwiyanti. Example of ghettoised Chinese community is in that racist state Malaysia biggthumpup.gif

QUOTE

Still thinking Indos and Indonesian born chinese getting along well? Only someone with deranged brain pretending so hard.


LOL, still hoping that natives and Chindos hate each other? Don't make such hilarious joke. Face the reality.

If you hate Chinese so much and don't like them, move to Malaysia. But, of course, the Malaysian Chinese still dominate the economy despite being discriminated against by NEP. Jeez, I guess you have no choice you'll always have to deal with Chinese people anywhere you go.
IPB Image

QUOTE

There were big riots in bandung during Soeharto regime and There were also big anti-chinese riot in your place Bandung in 1963 during Soekarno regime. You just google it.
Hillarious some Indonesian like becoming brown angel and just pretending no problems, later on when they got fed up and could not find the answer they rioting them.


Just because there were violence in his city 43 years ago, then you tell him he must hate Chinese? Don't insult Indonesian forummers here, they are dumb uneducated idiot like you. They are true Indonesians who understand Indonesia's national philosophy, "Unity in Diversity". Your "Malay uber alles" idea means you don't have right to consider yourself as Indonesian.
Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 27 2006, 12:03 AM) [snapback]1793433[/snapback]

LOL, you look dumb with this statement since you've answered ur own question before. Ethnic-Indians are tiny minority in Indonesia, nobody cares about them. Where Indians formed large minority, there are lots of trouble, such as anti-Indian riots in South Africa and Fiji, or the expulsion of Indians from Burma after that country's independence.
LOL, what do you know about ethnic-Chinese? Obviously none. Chinese-Indonesians hardly faced any riots during Sukarno period since he was aligning Indonesia with communist China (except 1963 Bandung riots which was provoked by right-wing military elements keen to wreck that alignment).
LOL, human history is full of violence between different ethnicities, religions, or nations. Every race from Jews to blacks to Chinese have their history of being attacked or assaulted. Just like the weakling Malays keep being dominated by outsiders throughout history.
LOL, bollocks. You obviously don't know squat about SKBRI. No Indonesian born after 1960s who have birth certificate have any SKBRI. Neither I nor my cousins have SKBRI, yet I can get and extend my passport just with copy of birth certificate and KTP. Prior to 1966, most Chinese-Indonesians were stateless without clear citizenship. With SKBRI, they received Indonesian citizenship. SKBRI was a good progression for Chinese-Indonesians as it gave them citizenship, it is not a burden as how can getting citizenship be a burden?
LOL, bullcrap. You just cannot accept the fact that Chindos completely integrated with native Indonesians unlike in your racially-segregated Malaysia. All houses in Jakarta mostly have high walls regardless of which ethnicity the owner is, to protect from thieves. And yes Chinese-Indonesians live in integrated neighbourhoods and interact well with their native neighbours, just like the Cina Benteng in Tangerang. My neighbour is that actress Ulfa Dwiyanti. Example of ghettoised Chinese community is in that racist state Malaysia biggthumpup.gif
LOL, still hoping that natives and Chindos hate each other? Don't make such hilarious joke. Face the reality.

If you hate Chinese so much and don't like them, move to Malaysia. But, of course, the Malaysian Chinese still dominate the economy despite being discriminated against by NEP. Jeez, I guess you have no choice you'll always have to deal with Chinese people anywhere you go.
IPB Image
Just because there were violence in his city 43 years ago, then you tell him he must hate Chinese? Don't insult Indonesian forummers here, they are dumb uneducated idiot like you. They are true Indonesians who understand Indonesia's national philosophy, "Unity in Diversity". Your "Malay uber alles" idea means you don't have right to consider yourself as Indonesian.


We were comparing about Indian and chinese in Indonesia, We were not talking about Burma, Fiji, South Africa. Do they experience anti riot? unlike your weakling people exeperienced a lot right just in Indonesia.
Didn't you blame Soeharto was the cause all anti-Chinese riot case? Look at these riots and root cause, do you think Soeharto was there?

In 1959: 100,000 Chinese were kicked out of Indonesia in a period of persecution

1 January 1960: which forced Indonesian Chinese to close their businesses and relocate in urban areas.

1963: Anti chinese riot in bandung.

A.D. 1965-1966 - Indonesia
500,000 killed in anti-communist violence, many were
local Chinese suspected of communist activities, others
were those who joined the PKI (Parti Kommunis Indonesia)
ignorant of the ideology but attracted by it's stance for
defending worker rights, while many others were innocent
victims caught in the frenzied bloodletting of racial
jealousy and animosity.


It's all your gene of the root of cause. You blamed it someone else. beerchug.gif

SKBRI still needed for bureaucrats processing regardless you have KTP, birth certificate, or whatever you have, you still need SKBRI in Surabaya just accept the fact. I have my salute to Surabaya city people. Indos should be very careful with this chameleon type of people. biggthumpup.gif

You just dreaming in your own phantacy thinking chinese Indonesian and Indo integrate well, even the tourist from Singapore above could describe well the situation. Just ask any forummer here. If they shy to give you answer just ask Londoh here who stay quite long enough in Indonesia. I bet you don't want to hear his answer to reveal your phantacy. laugh.gif
I guess your life is so much hard in Australia, Your girlish and retard mongol-look face keep being bullied there so the situation in Indonesia which actually not get along well you think already heaven -HAHAHAHA

You don't want to compare situation in Malaysia and in Indonesia, in Malaysia people who still wondering at night freely is chinese. There are many chinese footstall open until midnight and no thugh bother them. Unlike in Jakarta You can not even dare to use public transporation, And you have to pay money regularly to thugs if you open up business. Malaysian reading your comment here believe you must be either have defect or retard brain.

You trying to put your incompetency and telling riots happened 43 years ago in Bandung... yeah right:

Jan 5, 1998 Bandung, West Java
Riots with over 10,000 people. 90 stores owned by Ethnic Chinese and 10 cars were vandalized or destroyed. Thousands of sidewalk vendors, petty traders, and others went on the rampage after about twenty members of the National Discipline Movement (Gerakan Disiplin Nasional), a kind of civil guard under the armed forces, tried to stop them from trading. They said they were permitted to trade until 6:00 p.m., especially since it was the Muslim fasting month, and they needed money for the coming holidays. The mob turned over a police car, smashed the glass, and slashed the tires, then sacked shops along a five-kilometer stretch of road in the area of Cicadas. Hundreds of shops were destroyed, including the Matahari Department Store. Anger against the security forces quickly turned into anti-Chinese sentiment, and several shopowners, to protect themselves, put up signs saying "Muslim-owned" to protect themselves. The mob then clashed with more than 1,000police and soldiers and only dispersed after a huge downpour of rain at about 6:00 p.m.


Feb 16, 1998 Bandung, West Java
Twelve people were detained as ringleaders of rioting that broke out in three subdistricts of Bandung, namely Pangalengan, Cicalengka and Cimindi. The district head of Bandung claimed rioters had been trucked in, having been paid Rp.5,000 each to take part, and said their mission was to disrupt the political climate for the upcoming session of the People's Consultative Assembly that will give President Soeharto a seventh term. Violence broke out among people stranded by a transport strike outside Pangalengan. They were reportedly joined by people running through the crowd yelling, "Burn, burn!" and it was after this that attacks on Chinese shops began.


Who is the weakling race here? being pawned miserabily. bawling.gif
purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 27 2006, 01:44 AM) [snapback]1793680[/snapback]

We were comparing about Indian and chinese in Indonesia, We were not talking about Burma, Fiji, South Africa. Do they experience anti riot? unlike your weakling people exeperienced a lot right just in Indonesia.
Didn't you blame Soeharto was the cause all anti-Chinese riot case? Look at these riots and root cause, do you think Soeharto was there?


LOL, you are just desperately recycling a dead argument.

QUOTE

SKBRI still needed for bureaucrats processing regardless you have KTP, birth certificate, or whatever you have, you still need SKBRI in Surabaya just accept the fact. I have my salute to Surabaya city people. Indos should be very careful with this chameleon type of people.


LOL, your babbling is becoming more nonsensical. I guess you are now trapped, no exit strategy but keep saying nonsense in the hope of saving your lost face.

QUOTE

You just dreaming in your own phantacy thinking chinese Indonesian and Indo integrate well, even the tourist from Singapore above could describe well the situation.


LOL, that "Singapore story" was just an anecdote from some unknown person online. Such anecdotal stories worth a handful of dust. Only desperate idiot need to resort to worthless anecdotal stories to prove their fairy tales. biggthumpup.gif

QUOTE

You don't want to compare situation in Malaysia and in Indonesia, in Malaysia people who still wondering at night freely is chinese. There are many chinese footstall open until midnight and no thugh bother them. Unlike in Jakarta You can not even dare to use public transporation, And you have to pay money regularly to thugs if you open up business. Malaysian reading your comment here believe you must be either have defect or retard brain.


LOL, have you been to Pecenongan Street, Kelapa Gading, Gajah Mada Street, BSD City, Fatmawati Street which every night is full of Chinese hawkers selling delicious pork dishes? I guess you are too scared of being robbed by Batak thugs you keep talking about if you go out in public transport at night.

QUOTE

You trying to put your incompetency and telling riots happened 43 years ago in Bandung... yeah right:
Who is the weakling race here? being pawned miserabily. bawling.gif


Unfortunately there were anti-Chinese riots under Suharto in February 1998 all over Indonesia, culminating in May riots in Jakarta. You are just strengthening my argument while your disgusting glee over these riots is further destroying whatever character you have left.
Nusantara
QUOTE(purnomor @ Apr 27 2006, 02:18 AM) [snapback]1793757[/snapback]

LOL, you are just desperately recycling a dead argument.
LOL, your babbling is becoming more nonsensical. I guess you are now trapped, no exit strategy but keep saying nonsense in the hope of saving your lost face.
LOL, that "Singapore story" was just an anecdote from some unknown person online. Such anecdotal stories worth a handful of dust. Only desperate idiot need to resort to worthless anecdotal stories to prove their fairy tales. biggthumpup.gif
LOL, have you been to Pecenongan Street, Kelapa Gading, Gajah Mada Street, BSD City, Fatmawati Street which every night is full of Chinese hawkers selling delicious pork dishes? I guess you are too scared of being robbed by Batak thugs you keep talking about if you go out in public transport at night.
Unfortunately there were anti-Chinese riots under Suharto in February 1998 all over Indonesia, culminating in May riots in Jakarta. You are just strengthening my argument while your disgusting glee over these riots is further destroying whatever character you have left.


Look at your answer only LOL.

You PAWNED miserabily... yes in real life too. rotflmao.gif
purnomor
QUOTE(Nusantara @ Apr 27 2006, 02:25 AM) [snapback]1793770[/snapback]


You PAWNED miserabily... yes in real life too. rotflmao.gif


Indeed, I PAWNED you miserably.. yes in real life too. rotflmao.gif

It is good you admit your defeat, that's the only sensible post you made for a long time.
GluTTony
Quit the FVCK Talking/Debating about Chinese-Indonesians!!
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